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I think a custom bike is a bit of a "forever more" bike. Anyone who's been MTBing a while will realise that things are still changing (and to some degree improving the bikes).
Road bike standards are relatively unchanged over the past several years - certainly if I'd bought a custom road frame and forks, I would still be able to get top notch kit to hang off it. A 20 year old MTB probably wouldn't even have disc mounts.
Also, there's the fact that by its nature an MTB is a bit disposasble (as are road race bikes too, I suppose, but you don't see many people racing custom frames) - at some point you're going to break things, quite possibly including the frame, even if it's really well put together then when you throw it at a big pointy rock it's going to get bent.
And there's not much competition on custom MTBs (a few hardtail manufacturers, but very niche) whereas custom road is pretty mainstream, which makes it easier for new entries to the market - even if their share is tiny.
If I had the money and had to choose, I'd probably take a custom frame rather than a Santa Cruz. But then again, I don't have the money.
many on here riding Orange/Whyte/On-one/Bird etc are not staying away from British niche
But I would say many have bought them over us or European brand specificly because they are British, at lease when I have owned those brands in the past I didn't buy them because of that. It was because they were good bikes at a good price point.
1. Ugly, 2. Expensive, 3. Unknown
On the Olsen I agree, not so much on the Robot.
I have always compared bike to cars for mates that don't get the cost. It's affordable Ferrari's, where santa-cruz are the Ferrari's of the mtb world.
You don't think the frame @
- Purchases in UK & EU+ 20% VAT = £3,895
£4000 for a frame is expensive ?
Sure, it's less than a supercar... it's less than a house too...
But that's putting it at £6000 for a bicycle.... that's expensive.
Road bike standards are relatively unchanged over the past several years – certainly if I’d bought a custom road frame and forks, I would still be able to get top notch kit to hang off it. A 20 year old MTB probably wouldn’t even have disc mounts.
Only if you'd stuck with calipers and qr.
3 different axle standards and 2 for discs in the last couple of years, isn't it?
I'd be well pissed off if I'd bought a custom non flatmount disc road bike.
You don’t think the frame @
- Purchases in UK & EU+ 20% VAT = £3,895
£4000 for a frame is expensive ?
Sure, it’s less than a supercar… it’s less than a house too…
But that’s putting it at £6000 for a bicycle…. that’s expensive.
Not if you compare it to other sports / hobbies. Some people spend that sort of cash collecting stamps, some will spend 10,000s on golf etc.
We're not comparing it to other sports, we're comparing it to other bicycles available with similar functionality.
Pinkbike rode a custom one of the Robots that was a £8700 build and came in at 13.7kg LOL.
Seriously ? That's what you get for £8000+
My bike arrived heavily laden with SRAM components: a RockShox Lyrik fork and Monarch Debonair Plus shock (they also provided a Fox Float X2 shock), 125mm Stealth Reverb dropper post, XO1 11-speed drivetrain, Guide Ultimate brakes, Roam 60 carbon wheelset and finished it with a Renthal cockpit. The complete R160 weighed a smidge under 29lbs / 12.76kg when it arrived. After I added Superstar flat pedals, a pair of Huck Norris tire inserts and added more tubeless sealant, it's fighting weight was spot on 30.00lbs / 13.59 kgs. My custom R160 bike would set you back £8500, or around $10750 USD.
I'm SO not sold... When you consider what else you can buy for the same sort of money... Why exactly would i/anyone buy the Robot bike ?
The Robot bike that he (pinkbike) rode was custom geo, only Nicolai at the time were producing anything like what he wanted, that's what he paid for, not weight saving.
Perfect bikes
Well built - Well Specified - Good Value : Choose two
I'd say perfection lies near the centre of the triangle - and the frames under discussion are down at a pointy end. Concerns such as exclusivity, fit and customer service might sway some people in that direction - but they won't be going in droves
We’re not comparing it to other sports, we’re comparing it to other bicycles available with similar functionality.
True, but they are going after the same market segment.
I have a On-One Fatty, singlespeed it would probably have cost about £500 to build, you've got a Parkwood, if we played golf we would probably turn up to the council course in trainers with a secondhand set of bats between us.
Santa Cruz, S-Works, Parlee, Cervelo, etc are aiming at the guys who cycle as a hobby but if they played golf would be members at Wentworth (or TBH given the cost of golf memberships, even just their local club).
My original point to Brant was that the reason you don't see many Robot bikes on the trails is simply because they are expensive and most of us can't afford one so most of us still ride around on frames not too dissimilar to the old 456's. That doesn't mean they are too expensive and they're not good value though (just like his trousers).
Not if you compare it to other sports / hobbies. Some people spend that sort of cash collecting stamps, some will spend 10,000s on golf etc.
The trouble is you need to consider people's actual income and the quite broad demographics of those already into or just taking up MTBing.
Yes there will always be products to tease Billy stockbroker's wallet open, but for a lot of people spending £1k on something that isn't totally essential is still a stretch let alone £2k and up...
After reading this forum for a bit, reading the mag (and others) You'd be forgiven for thinking a "basic" MTB costs something like £2.5k and venturing to your local woods on something cheaper would be met with sneers and derision...
Of course that's not the actual case, but a narrative is being constructed these day. (either intentionally or by accident) that will help to drive "normal people" away from even trying the sport. It's not golf or a whole lifetime spent collecting stamps, it's a bicycle that will probably be "out of date" within 24 months
Is £4000 a lot to spend on a bike frame? Yes, of course it is, how can anyone try and argue it's not? In fact a large part of the attraction has to be that it is expensive and let's be honest having people admire your possessions precisely because they are a bit pricey is gratifying for some of us.
But let's not pretend you're really getting that much more of a product for the spend. Making the TT 10mm longer and the seat tube 1* more upright than half the current stock models is all well and good but next year's specialized/giant/whyte or whatever will probably pull the same trick for a less stupid price. Unless you're going to go full Porter with a whacky shaped geometron, why pay "custom" money for something barely that different...
Road bike standards are relatively unchanged over the past several years – certainly if I’d bought a custom road frame and forks, I would still be able to get top notch kit to hang off it
Only if you’d stuck with calipers and qr.
So, a proper summer road bike then? Going custom for a winter bike (why else would you want discs?) is daft anyway 😉
Only if you’d stuck with calipers and qr.
True, but I would've if I had a nice custom frame and fork as it would still be a nice custom frame and fork. And I have with my fast road bike anyway.
Sod it, canny be arsed arguing with the pre-conceived ideas of judgemental fuds.
I suppose it depends what your idea of a perfect bike is.
Full suspension doesn't have any appeal whatsoever for me.
My "perfect" bike is a rigid hardtail, either singlespeed or hubgear (not to most people's taste, I agree), but these days with the rush to "modern trail geometry", new rigid hardtails with slack HAs are very unappealing (to me).
And there's no way I'd drop what I see as motorbike money on a bicycle, much as I love them.
Ironically, the closest to perfect bikes I have were designed by Brant. Scandal and TD-1.
I suppose it depends what your idea of a perfect bike is.Full suspension doesn’t have any appeal whatsoever for me.
...
And there’s no way I’d drop what I see as motorbike money on a bicycle, much as I love them.
+ a bazillion. One person's 'perfect' bike is another person's "how ****ing much? You can buy a car/motorbike/pay two years' rent with that!"
I'm the same my dream build would be a custom geometry, alloy or ti, pinion, gates, hardtail, fat bike with two wheelsets (one fat, one plus) and a spare ridgid fork for winter. So many niches.
So just sub 4k for a only a hardtail frame (with drivetrain).
I guess I don't baulk at the seemingly high cost of bikes any more after 30years of mtb - im on under the minimum wage (self employed) but if I really really wanted too I could probably afford my bike Ferrari. It's one reason I love bikes - 'affordable' Ferrari's.
On cost, it's all relative. Yes, bikes are outrageously expensive for what they are, but still good value compared to plenty other things.
Couple of mates are into rallying.
£10 - £25000 on a car. £600 each driver and navigator for an event. Tyres, petrol , broken bits, etc.
1hr proper driving in the days rally over five stages.
These guys are offshore grunts, so on good money but nothing stratospheric.
My brother rides a £12k KTM Superduke which probably goes out once a week from Easter to October.
Suddenly £5k on a MTB you use twice a week for a few years is easy enough to justify...
A question to anyone who has had a bike built with custom geo. How do you know where to begin with the numbers?
I understand what they mean, but I'd have no idea how they work together. I really couldn't trust myself to spend a decent amount on a frame with custom numbers.
Has anyone ever got a custom frame and disliked it?
A question to anyone who has had a bike built with custom geo. How do you know where to begin with the numbers?
I understand what they mean, but I’d have no idea how they work together. I really couldn’t trust myself to spend a decent amount on a frame with custom numbers.
Start with something you really like (karate monkey) and work from there;
I think if I ever get to have a custom frame, it's be something like a CX/Gravel thing and I'd be asking more knowledgeable people than myself for advice.
The way I see it, I'd have less chance of fudging something rigid 🙂
Robot ,- I've tried squinting but nope its still beyond ugly. There is no angle which it looks good ..... Perhaps maybe with your back to it looking at its reflection in a convex chrome hubcab ,?