[Closed] Peaks: Leaving every gate wide open. (Rant)

Selfish idiots!

they know a fat bastard is on his way

Strava doesn't take into account shut gates. 😉

Passed them last week, they had left them all

How do you know it's not the landowner/manager doing it? Is there any livestock wandering around?

Scotsroutes theres no cattle grids at the road ends and I doubt the farmer wants to be roaming for fun to round up missing sheep?

Plus 1.5-2miles/4 gates?

😆 Rob

All gates in correct formation by 11am, so good job. First time I've cleared from the bottom of Roman road to the bottom of Potato Alley yesterday(but I had mates in front on the gates)

There are too many gates in the peak. I appreciate that livestock has to be kept in place but half the gates could be removed and no one would miss out. I used to ride with a guy who thought that there should be "gates open" days in the peak. In the winter when all the stock is in that would be great.

At least as a step in the right direction they could at least all agree to use one simple gate closure that you can open without getting off the bike. At the moment there's about fifty different locks and some are unfathomable.

And hora, get off your high horse about vehicles in the peak. If the national park keeps closing their legitimate routes what do you expect them to do?

I used to respect 4x4 use in the Peaks. I think the final straw for me was seeing pathetic grafitti aimed at Jim Dixon...or was it the rammed new stainless steel gate?

The park authority doesn't show them any respect, I don't see why they shouldn't reciprocate.

One of them owns the power. What worries me is will any 4x4's start being tits towards other users as a result? I.e the need to blame someone? I hope not. It'll be zombie apocalypse with riders allover a fleeing 4x4 😉

Vehicles in the Peak - motorbikes are ok (if a bit noisy and smelly) but admittedly I can rant all day about 4x4s using the same trails as walkers, horses, and mountain bikers. Every time I've come across them, they're in large groups blocking the width of the trail so you have to squeeze yourself flat into a ditch so they can get past, and I can't see why they shouldn't have somewhere else to do it.
Hmm I'd better shut up or I'll get a mountain of STWs shouting at me like last time I ranted about 4x4s...

I always thought it was a mistake to change the Countryside Code to "leave gates as you find them" from "always shut gates". Now when I find an open gate it's impossible to know whether it is legitimately open or not. Might these have been for some reason?

My inclination is to close it on the basis that a closed gate is potentially likely to cause less inconvenience than an incorrectly open one. But if a repeatedly closed gate is causing inconvenience to a landowner then surely it's not beyond the wit of man to hang a temporary sign on it requesting it be left open.

There are too many gates in the peak. I appreciate that livestock has to be kept in place but half the gates could be removed and no one would miss out. I used to ride with a guy who thought that there should be "gates open" days in the peak. In the winter when all the stock is in that would be great.

[quote=Orange Crush ]I always thought it was a mistake to change the Countryside Code to "leave gates as you find them" from "always shut gates". Now when I find an open gate it's impossible to know whether it is legitimately open or not. Might these have been for some reason?
+1.

There are perfectly legitimate reasons for leaving gates in the open position.

Are the Peaks sheep not hefted?

Install cattle grids everywhere and get rid of the main gates IMO.

I can rant all day about [s]4x4s[/s]mountainbikers using the same trails as walkers, horses,[s] and mountain bikers.[/s] Every time I've come across them, they're in large groups blocking the width of the trail so you have to squeeze yourself flat into a ditch so they can get past, and I can't see why they shouldn't have somewhere else to do it.

Its great we all laugh about cheeky trails and then moan at others for not following the rules

4x4 , whatever i think of them, are just like us. They want to be there and if they are legally restricted some will do it anyway. Some ignore the laws , some do this responsibly some irresponsibly just like MTB'ers
We had a thread on here about riding a SSSI and the consensus was it was fine. Our community is no better as it is drawn from humans, some of these rate respect for the environment below their fun however many wheels they have.

I am fairly sure gates are not put there just to annoy MTB ers by farmers pissing on their land

HORA, how much work and cost for your convenience, tit

Junkyard, you have leapt to the assumption that I ride on footpaths! A lot of people on STW leap to assumptions about me. Ok, i have occasionally ridden on a footpath but only late at night in the dark when there are no walkers about; therefore I don't obstruct walkers or present a danger to them. My specific rant was about 4x4s blocking the trails to all orher users. Also, I don't think it's safe. I've had 4x4s and motorbikes riding right behind me down Charity Lane- so close that if I fell off I'd be under their wheels.

MunroBiker.... Can you bob us an email i want to tap into some of your Scotcheggland knowledge.... Nothing in your profile!!

Si

It was not aimed at you, or any other individual but at the community.
Sorry if it reads as a dig at you or anyone else on this thread as that was not the intention.
Do you think walkers are not saying the same about us?
Near misses with us etc
Do you think we all ride responsibly etc.
We [ as in the group of MTB'ers) can be accused of the same
FWIW I do also ride footpaths and would like to say I do so responsibly but it still against the rules and no doubt angers some walkers - i know I have been told off before and no doubt will again - I often get it on BW never mind footpaths which i rarely ride.

The only positive comment I can make on this thread is that there are a lot of hysterical old women on here that need to settle down and get back to their knitting.

Not your problem.... Assume they are supposed to be open and enjoy a stop free ride!
Farmers are W***ers! If they cant keep their ramshackle gates in good order they shouldn't expect people to struggle closing them. end of!

Fair enough Junkyard! I take your point, I was being a bit grumpy. Having seen the fuss some walkers make when they see MTB-ers on bridleways, I do generally avoid footpaths. I've yet to see any walkers out at 10 pm on a cold rainy night though!

By the way "Charity Lane" is in Macclesfield Forest, to anyone who's interested 🙂

Wind your neck in hora, it must of been horrible for you to find that gate open.

Farmers are W***ers! If they cant keep their ramshackle gates in good order they shouldn't expect people to struggle closing them. end of!

I think until you thoroughly understand Rights of Way maintenance, liability and responsibility I would avoid such narrow minded comments... But then again this is STW...

and farmers are w.....s how?!

Well this is all a bit sad. As far as I can there are a load of selfish, uncaring, nimby Thatcherites on this thread that want all the pies but no responsibility.

Banks I imagine farmers love the extra work locating cattle and sheep. Plus the twits who damage fencing etc. I dont think its alwaus weather related damage.

Oh and 'wind my neck in'. Wow. Keep the gates shut. Or are you a reactionary fighting minor perceived oppression?

I'd love a farming side of the story.

Well this is all a bit sad. As far as I can there are a load of selfish, uncaring, nimby Thatcherites on this thread that want all the pies but no responsibility.

Yeah some really disappointing attitudes on display here, I always assume mountain bikers must be nice people but that illusion is being shattered.

Farmers are Wers

Wow, amazing. It's the bikers that are coming across as the Wers to me in this thread.

I'll try asking again..

1/ Was there actually any livestock around?
2/ Are the sheep hefted?

The land-manager might have wanted the gates left open.

[quote=bigjim ]
Yeah some really disappointing attitudes on display here, I always assume mountain bikers must be nice people but that illusion is being shattered.
> Farmers are Wers
Wow, amazing. It's the bikers that are coming across as the Wers to me in this thread.
Mountain bikers display the same mix of personality traits as any other sub-section of society, hence you get the good guys and the absolute dicks.

If farmers want gates open they tend to chain them open

Not in my experience. Might be different where you live/ride though.

@scotsroutes sheep where normally you dont come across them.

No sign of any farmers quad bikes
Historically around here I've noticed:
If the farmer wants a gate open he puts stone against said gate. Or chain. Or theres an open trailer or you spot him on a quad/covered quad bike.

No its a selfish childish **** driving something through ONE WAY. Didnt take rocketscience as you always spot/hear a farmer when he/they are about.

I think the "farmer" comment was a bit tongue in cheek, not to be taken entirely seriously.

"Not in my experience"

This is the Peaks not Scotland.

Ocassionally you do come across sheep at the side of the road along Snake Pass.

Gates are a PITA. Never seen one in the Surrey hills etc but then you dont see loads of sheep or cows..

Ones that always make me laugh for years were the gates up Chapel Gate.There was so much space under the gates and by the side of the gate where there was holes in the fence any sheep could go anywhere.Cant say i have ever seen those gates ever left open not ridden the Roman road on my enduro bike for years hate gates bad enough on a MTB.Forest of Dean/Wilts/ etc hardy anygates WONDERFULL 😆

Sorry to disappoint but it was the 'leave the gates open' bit which was tongue in cheek and not the 'All farmers are w***kers! I honestly despise the whinging scruffy obnoxious t**ts with every ounce of my being!
Custodians of the countryside my arse! Exploiters of the countryside more like, if they love the countryside so much why are so many farms utter junkyards and why does every ramshackle barbed wire fence have their silage plastic flapping in the breeze?

Tidying up doesn't pay the bills Flossie. It's not a beauty contest, living off the land. It's hard work.
But I'll tell all my relatives to tidy up a bit in cases some self important townie pops by to have a look. Wouldn't want it to be untidy now would we. 🙄

So that'd make it ok to leave litter then?

Thing is, the Peak District is a national park and surely it's everyone's responsibility to do their bit, by closing gates, not leaving litter, picking up dog muck, and not festooning every bloody tree and fence with black polythene.

Who was talking about leaving litter?
Your post referred to visible signs of a working farm. On a tenanted farm like the one I grew up on the landlord (council, crown, whoever) would have powers to end the tenancy if the tenant farmer did not keep the buildings etc to a good standard. Much like in a residential tenancy I guess. Except urban dwellers don't have strangers traipsing through their back yard and then complaining that it's a bit untidy.
Leaving litter would be potentially dangerous to livestock so no-one whose livelihood depended on the health of said livestock is likely to do it.
In my experience most litter in the countryside is left by day visitors, not people who live there.

Leave all gates as you find them, end of discussion. (in my opinion)

I think that is a classic statement Custodians of the countryside my arse.Excellent.They are out there to make money end of story.See more wildlife in the town than you see in the countryside.Because they have screwed up the land for profit.Just look at how many bees you see in your garden not the countryside.

More of the normal ignorant STW twunts then. Go look up the cross compliance requirements and other hoops imposed on all UK farming businesses in terms of both gaec and smrs a breach of which is liable to financial penalty.

I had the best ever summer's cycling (on the road) in my thirty years of riding during the foot and mouth 'crisis'. The trampled fields became meadows of flowers, it was noticeably and oddly quieter without the sounds of domesticated farm animals. There were more birds, more butterfly's.... I could go on.
Oh, and adding soda to animal feed to make the sheep and cattle foam at the mouth, was just jumped on by the inspectors who couldn't take any chances and the government then pandered to the farmers by giving them more than market value for each one which needed to be slaughtered! Don't tell me they genuinely give a crap about their animals, other than the profit walking around on four legs.
Ok so the tidy ones are tenants, the ones I'm thinking of can't be and as for 'too busy trying to make money to tidy up' imagine if that happened in any other industry?

So Nipper,

Are you under the illusion that any other industry be it the building, medical, engineering etc etc are not subject to ridiculous amounts regulation and hoops to jump through???
Regulations which stop corners being cut and ultimately keep us as consumers safer?
I would utterly guarantee that if it wasn't for the regulations imposed and enforced on the farmers, the majority would happily put the well being of their animals and the environment way behind that of greedily making as much profit as humanly possible.

If I couldnt ride my bike I'd still love the peaks and not spoil etc. Recently I met a 81yr old walker on WLT and his eyes were full of passion for our hills. Why fight or spoil? I'd gladly walk etc these hills. Just to be here. Hence I dont like the hate from any angle. If you stopped me riding here. I'd be here in some form. We are blessed to have this place for free.

Awwww Hora,

Thanks for that!
The Peak District (my home) is a truly beautiful place! Yes I do always leave nothing to show my passing but Maxxis tyre tracks or foot prints. I get as upset by visitors untidiness as residents.

no, not to the same degree as the farming industry. Do you actually know any farmers - do you know what the income for a farmer farming lfa land is? I do and most of them are working for well below what would be minmum wage. I have my graziers assosiation meeting at the end of this month, would you like to come along and explain to members where they are going wrong?

We are very lucky to have the Peak District and perhaps because it is so well-loved by different groups that feelings run a bit high.

Leave gates as you find them.
Many reasons for leaving them open.
Our tenants often leave corral gates open to make herding in easier, people frequently close these, penning stock into areas of limited pasture, no water and to be repeatedly spooked by the next group coming through.
Several gates at a time will be left open when gathering from the open hill and may be for several days whilst getting all stock in.
Some are on disputed FMD heft fences, they should be gone, but one awkward commoner is holding up its removal.
Those of us working the ground don't like having to (leave the warmth of the cab) open/shut gates so leave them open where possible.

That is enough reasons for one post.

I know alot of Farmers in the Cotswolds with Range rovers/bloody expensive horses and much more.They spend more on shooting a year than i earn.Look around 😉

[quote=timber ]Leave gates as you find them.
Many reasons for leaving them open.
Our tenants often leave corral gates open to make herding in easier, people frequently close these, penning stock into areas of limited pasture, no water and to be repeatedly spooked by the next group coming through.
Several gates at a time will be left open when gathering from the open hill and may be for several days whilst getting all stock in.
Some are on disputed FMD heft fences, they should be gone, but one awkward commoner is holding up its removal.
Those of us working the ground don't like having to (leave the warmth of the cab) open/shut gates so leave them open where possible.
That is enough reasons for one post.
Thank you timber, but I suspect that your appeal for common sense is falling on deaf ears as long as there is someone to "hate".

[quote=hora ]If I couldnt ride my bike I'd still love the peaks and not spoil etc. Recently I met a 81yr old walker on WLT and his eyes were full of passion for our hills. Why fight or spoil? I'd gladly walk etc these hills. Just to be here. Hence I dont like the hate from any angle. Err - wasn't it you that started this thread by calling other folks ****s and dickheads?

"Leave gates as you find them" - when you find an open gate, how are you supposed to know whether the farmer deliberately left it open or whether it was a walker/biker etc who couldn't be bothered to close it?

[quote=vickypea ]"Leave gates as you find them" - when you find [s]an open[/s]a closed gate, how are you supposed to know whether the farmer deliberately left it [s]open [/s]closed or whether it was a walker/biker etc who [s]couldn't be bothered to close[/s]closed it?

I live close to a lot of farmland, and a significant proportion of the gates have notices asking you to close them because of livestock grazing. So it would not be too unreasonable to assume that, in the absence of a note on a gate in farmland containing livestock, that the farmer would prefer it too be closed?
Surely a farmer would be more inconvenienced by escaped livestock from an open gate than having to get out of his tractor to open a gate that was closed?

dobiejessmo - not all farming is the same, upland farming is pretty marginal, more and more upland farms are being abandoned, affecting the management of the hills for conservation and wildlife. Most upland farmers have a second job that is the greater income and the only thing they get to shoot is foxes become some city dwellers voted against social community fox control, but that is another argument.

Come off it nipper!
The only reason they aren't earning a proper wage is because they are too thick to do anything else! They were left the farm in the family will (ie they were born into farming) and if they had half a brain cell they'd get another better paying job (as I did when my industry went down the pan!) or learn some better business acumen and make more money.... There are plenty, who's s**tty farms I cycle through (on bridleways) who are clearly making it pay. Diversification.... Remember that?
Don't blame it on the regulations which are keeping us safe!
Remember that farmer who took a trailer load of sheep to the RSPCA as a publicity stunt? Said he couldn't afford to keep them? He could afford the brand new shogun and livestock trailer he was driving at the time!

Flossie, your ignorance is quite astounding. Offensive and hateful. Sleep well.

Hells bells, I wonder why none of them have thought of that before 😯 -most will have looked at diversification at one point- not everyone has that oppotunity or access to the capital required. The family farm is mostly a generational thing and is not simply an assett to be given up lightly but I guess that's a difficult concept for you to grasp. Another ignorant keyboard warrior. I take it that's a no for our graziers meeting.