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Its all a bit like Blockbusters.
But this time its not videos vs. the internet.
Its shopping on the high-street vs. the internet.
Internet will win. Click for a price comparison, click to buy, turns up next day.
Internet will win. Click for a price comparison, click to buy, turns up next day.
First of all with bike stuff read any of the threads about ordering only to get the getting restocking email as they order it from the importer who turns out not to have any either....
Of the things I've recently got from Evans...
Gels/Powders etc - Order online and collect
Shoes - PITA to order online and tie up 3-4x the cost for a week while I decide which fits - walked out with shoes after 15mins - along with a pump and couple of other bits I needed as they had them at a fair price
Track Pump - wanted to lay my hands on them first
Got lid and some other bits from over the road at decathalon at the same time
Got a lock and some other little bits from them too.
Probably would have got a bike from them but it was at the year end time so stock was patchy in the sizes I wanted.
The high street can and will adapt, people will get burned with online and remember how good it was to be able to ask a question in store or take in the old one to compare too
Buy less, buy quality, buy local if possible. As with food, clothing etc. Communities need independent businesses and community trumps politics, social media and everything else.
What Boxelder says. Price isn’t everything.
They just want / need the cash for investment
They need cash to pay their bills. They have not been put on stop, pro forma etc for no reason.
Evans opening the Havant store 2 miles from me has reduced my CRC etc shopping massively. I pretty much always do click & collect from Evans now unless the price is too disparate. It’s very convenient and far less faff than the Post Office with regards to opening times etc.
Their clothing & spares stock seems to be about right for me, I’ve not really looked too much at the bike offerings as I don’t really ‘do’ complete builds.
It would be interesting to see what happens if Halfords buy them. As far back as 18-19 years ago when I was managing stores for them they were trying desperately to crack the ‘high end’ market who won’t buy from them, been doing it in & off for years so I could see a reshuffle, some of the cheaper Evans stuff dissapearing where it conflicts too much which Halfords core range & the higher end (over CTW voucher value) stuff staying with Evans.
So customers want convenience, unsurprisingly. I dont live in town and there is no parking in town, so the internet wins for me.
They have not been put on stop, pro forma etc for no reason.
The reason being all the rumours about them having no money, rather than actually defaulting on any payments?
Not a great example…
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2018/09/06/rapha-racing-slashes-jobs-hunt-profitability-walmart-heirs/I do agree that doing more with the shops (especially the urban ones) is key, but only if they generate sales. Bike parking and coffee and cake won’t pay the rent…
Oh believe me I'm well aware of Rapha's woes! Again, the investors are after a quick profit; they've seen a brand that is sitting there fairly static (and with some of the clubhouses losing money) and done the magic snip, snip, snip to remove the "non-profit" bits. Rapha is a funny one though - ultimately once people have bought some cycle clothing they have most of what they need for a few years - I've got Rapha kit that is years old and still in perfect condition - so they don't need to go to the shop or online and buy stuff all the time. You therefore need something else to get the customer to keep coming in, to keep spending. Events, travel, social - done right that *should* tick all the boxes.
Evans is the same, it just needs something other than "oh we sell bikes and clothing and spares" because loads of places do that including the internet...
Haven't seen any more news on this but their stock keeps getting pushed further and further back or some cancelled altogether ... this may be items that maybe production hadn't started so they were able to do so.
I'm after a Pinnacle Arkose 2018 - either a 2 or 3 in small size .... neither of which have been in stock for months ... the 3 was showing delivery for the 4/11 for ages but today has now been pushed back to 02/12 and the 2 which was showing end Nov is now grayed out altogether so I guess they won't be arriving at all.
I'm sure their lack of stock of sale-able items hasn't helped their current situation which I'm guessing may be due to not being able to pay suppliers but if 2018 models aren't due for delivery until beginning of December when everyone else's 2019 models are in the shops would have thought it'll be a tough sell but guess we'll have to wait and see.
Was looking at a Camelbak Mule online earlier but none in stock for another month. Cheaper at Halfords and can pick up tomorrow...
Gossip is halfords confirmed. Might just be gossip though. In edinburgh they are less than 50 metres away from each other (cycle republic)
Well I decided not to cancel my order and rely on card protection and I was in no rush. The Reverb turned up last week rather than the 30th. Picked it up in store where service was way better than the last few times I’d been in there.
Gossip is halfords confirmed. Might just be gossip though.
They may still be interested but the sale process isn't concluded yet and there are other potential buyers. So yes, gossip.
They may still be interested but the sale process isn’t concluded yet and there are other potential buyers. So yes, gossip.
But it's fake news and an old story?
I couple of mates of mine own an e-retail-business. They have grow every year since they started in the mid 00's and tell me that physical-retailers can't compete except for certain very niche stuff.
Every LBC near me has closed down.
With the exception of buying some lights and tyres last year (from Evans), I've bought everything online for last 10 years or so.
I can wrench myself so don't need anyone like Evans to butcher my bike 😀
It would be interesting to see what happens if Halfords buy them. As far back as 18-19 years ago when I was managing stores for them they were trying desperately to crack the ‘high end’ market
Shudder
Halfords used to be a byworld for shitty bikes and bike parts back in the 90's.
Having said that they do sell so good and cheap tools now. I got a 100 piece socket set from there which is very good quality.
Shoes – PITA to order online and tie up 3-4x the cost for a week while I decide which fits – walked out with shoes after 15mins – along with a pump and couple of other bits I needed as they had them at a fair price
Almost all retailers offer free (postage paid) returns now.
My mate sells shoes on his e-shop. It's very common and normal for a customer to order 2 or even 3 different pairs. The keep the one that fits and send the other ones back free.
You gotta get with the 21st century! 😀
I've been waiting for some Shimano RP90 Road Shoes which were due in this week but pushed back to mid Nov due to a delay with the distributer. Made contact today and changed this order to the New Shimano RC7 as they are in stock and are ready for collection next week.
I am however still waiting on a separate order for a Kask Protone which I am wondering will even show up.....
These products are both popular models and generally in stock most places so it's clear there are issues going on in the background.
I can wrench myself so don’t need anyone like Evans to butcher my bike
And that's the real crux of the issue I feel, it seems to be an increasingly rare thing to find a LBS that can offer anything that an online store can't. Mechanicing is the main thing they do that differentiates them and it's a sad fact that most of them are awful at it.
For the level of savings available online, an LBS can't afford to compete with online but can offer a service to the customer that gets them a piece of the pie. Servicing, fitting parts, repairs etc. are where they should be focussing and doing it to a level that gains and retains customers.
In-house fork and shock servicing should be a thing but most places just send them out to a specialist.. I can do that myself, get a better service at a cheaper price.. if i could get my forks serviced to a high standard in-house either while i wait or in a day or 2 then i'd much rather do that.
If I could rely on LBS mechanics to competently fit a headset or pressfit BB then I'd rather pay them to do it than fork out for the tools to do it myself, but my experience over the years is that LBS's are universally useless for anything other than the absolute basics and even then they often screw up to the point that I've given up trying and just do it myself or send parts to a specialist that i trust to do the job properly..
Sad that it's come to this point but it won't get better until LBS owners change and adapt to the new normal.
Bikefit's and (quality)mechanicing are the only places they can differentiate I think...
I don't know what the unique point is of Evans, especially in the high street. They're not super cheap. They have a massive collection of Hybrids and cheap road bikes but little else. Staff in the local Manchester Deansgate shop didn't seem too interested in my questions, I was floating around for ages and they staff were nattering to the mechanics.
Other shops were offering free services and stocking obscure brands, rather than the Trek and other big names which are the same RRP no matter where you go. Asked about some bikes (they dont stock Genesis in the shop anymore) on the website and was told I could "order" them to the shop for £50, refundable if I bought the bike. That's not a lot of use, I'm going to the shop to see if I like a bike, not spend money and walk away not liking it or it was the wrong size (I tend to float between XL and L depending on the frame geometry).
I don't know what the draw is, especially if spending big money and buying a bike.
I’m after a Pinnacle Arkose 2018 – either a 2 or 3 in small size …. neither of which have been in stock for months … the 3 was showing delivery for the 4/11 for ages but today has now been pushed back to 02/12 and the 2 which was showing end Nov is now grayed out altogether so I guess they won’t be arriving at all
Yeah I've seen that myself for a Large Arkose, mind Dec availability.
Sounds like they are trying to keep stock volumes as lean as possible. Maybe they are in trouble?
I'll definitely not pre-order a bike from them now.
I don’t know what the draw is, especially if spending big money and buying a bike.
None at all in my experience, tried to spend £4.5k on a BMC road bike in Evans and not only did they try to sell me a 58cm (I'm 6'5"), I asked about changing bars/stem and possibly crank for the correct length, all the various bits and pieces to get it to fit right and was told they'd happily fit what i wanted, but i would have to pay retail on everything i wanted fitted, plus fitting and I would get all the bits they took off in a bag. When I expressed a wee bit of surprise that they wouldn't entertain part-exchange of the (brand new, remember) parts they took off against the replacement parts, their response was that no bike shop would do that..!!
Suffice it to say I now have a lovely Canyon. Says it all really, Canyon were easier to deal with changing parts for fit than Evans were, happy to ship out different bars/stem if i needed them and return the fitted ones.
The problem with taking stuff off a bike and then selling is a complicated one, parts like chainsets and components are already heavily discounted so discounting a 'new' part basically means you make no money on it or you never end up selling it and its just money caught up in stock. Most people don't want to buy 'new' stuff thats been taken off a bike. Not to mention the issues with items that are oe only as often happens with stems and bars which are harder to price and impossible to sell.
Also it needs to be put into stock and so it needs a code, suddenly you have multiple codes for very similair items and that create confusion and costs time and money. Its not as black and white as you'd imagine. If Canyon take a crank off a bike then I imagine they can fit it to another bike.
Fair point, but it still lost them a sale which was my point, not argueing that it makes life a little more tricky for them but it's one of the reasons why they are in the situation they are in now surely.?
Offering nothing over what I can get cheaper online is what's running LBS's into the ground no.?
#EDIT : And having worked in bike shops in my youth they were always willing to change parts to fit a bike as the customer wanted, parts went into a pot rather than into stock and were either sold during the end of year sale, or used to change parts on the next customers bike for their fit, bike shops need to expect to have to work a wee bit for their customers, it's not a supermarket.
I can wrench myself so don’t need anyone like Evans to butcher my bike
Most people - the vast majority of cyclists in fact - cannot do this or at least not to any great degree of competency. Ironically, the prevalence of weird "standards" and proprietary parts has actually worked in favour of most shops since most customers aren't going to fork out for a bearing press or a Chris King hub tool themselves.
Even for the more basic tasks, most people will take their bike in rather than fix it themselves. I do the odd bit of ride-leading on various events and the number of people with fairly minor mechanicals who will just flag me down, pass the bike to me and say "sort this, I don't know anything about it" is unbelievable.
One woman on the last ride I did had turned her bike upside down and then just got on the phone to the mechanics. She didn't even know how to remove the wheel. Sadly, that's the level that the majority of riders are at. That's why shops like Evans and Halfords survive. It's fairly wealthy but fairly clueless people who go "I need a bike" and they don't ask complicated questions or want bits swapping over or tyres converting to tubeless or Di2 programming with synchro shift, they want a bike that works and more or less fits and that they can ride out of the shop.
it’s not a supermarket.
Evans is to some extent, I know plenty of smaller bike shops that have done parts swaps but only when the margin works for them and when you can do the value calc there and then. Evans probably did loose the sale, but the bike will be on the website and when they drop the price in 2 months time they will probably make more than messing around with you. - Blunt version.
On the mechanics bit exactly what crazy-legs says
Yeah it's true that some people don't know one end of a screw driver from another. As you say many middle classes and especially women just don't get exposed to using hand tools.
And yeah there are some special tools that are unlikely to be worth getting, but even things like headsets can be pressed it by jury rigging a bolt, large washes and nuts.
I'm certainly not the most practised or knowledgable on bikes but info is easy to find on the internet or in the Big Blue Book. I've never had something I couldn't eventually sort myself, except fork service of course, which just posted away in the past. Only had to walk home from a ride once when I was dumb enough to forget a presta valve extension many years ago.
But I'm lucky enough to have been exposed to working on bikes since a kid and got handy with tools working on cars and then servicing downhole tools in the oil business for a few years.
Yeah it’s true that some people don’t know one end of a screw driver from another. As you say many middle classes and especially women just don’t get exposed to using hand tools.
Oh wow 🤣🤣🤣
Despite being able to do just about everything on my bike I still see the value in shops doing service, sometimes the job a professional can do is better, sometimes the cost of paying somebody is worth it for the time you can spend doing something else. Plenty of people I know are happy that they can drop a bike off and pick it up ready to ride.
Im not surprised. Went in today to the Nottingham one as I want some new knee pads. Web says several styles and brands in stock. They actually had 2 pairs in the whole shop. Complete waste of time
One woman on the last ride I did had turned her bike upside down and then just got on the phone to the mechanics. She didn’t even know how to remove the wheel. Sadly, that’s the level that the majority of riders are at.
That's kind of scary. I have had a few years away from cycling but when I used to do group rides in never occurred to me that some of the group would be unable to fix a flat, except one girl who was quite new whose bf was tasked with that stuff.
But then cycling is more middle class and popular now.
But these people will get shock because a geared bike isn't like a modern car you can 99% drive between yearly service with no issue lol.
sometimes the job a professional can do is better, sometimes the cost of paying somebody is worth it for the time you can spend doing something else.
Well that might be true if you were a very busy person whose time was a lot of money, but on the other hand how are they finding time to ride anyway? 😀
Bikes mechanically are a step below cars, there are no real mysteries to them. There is nothing you can't really get to and diagnose and fix. Shifter are complex but invariably get replaced as a unit.
...and you average Evans mech is some 20 year old not some Team Sky professional 😀
But it’s fake news and an old story?
Fair call. It appeared to be when I asked about it. The original £10m re-finance process was ongoing then afaik. Not long after that I went on holiday, while away read the news that Evans was up for sale and decided to generally ignore it for a while, since the only people that know the detail of what's going on are a small team at the top of Evans and PWC.
You would think there is mileage in being a good lbs? My local is always fully booked, I know simple job I could do but I needed my tubeless sorted, I got most of it but everytime I try to refit the tyre I get more sealant on me than in the tyre, 4 week wait.
If they just reduced shop space and open up more workshop space? And actually get a reputation for good repairs on the day maybe it’s good money Or bike storage, I would happily pay £10 a day for secure insured bike storage in bad weather who wants to change a tube after work due to a flat when Evans or another lbs could do this? I say this as I had a double flat in the pouring rain, walked past a Halfords and nope too busy, walked past a hawk cycle nope we don’t have the time, a mobile cycle mechanic who has a small workshop about 2 miles from home sorted it out and it meant I didn’t get my work clothes dirty or trying to change them on a busy road, I can’t be the only one to have this happen.
Put everything else bar essentials online and have a click collect service.
I could be wrong but it could work!
But then cycling is more middle class and popular now.
When was cycling not middle class? It's been there for years
Well that might be true if you were a very busy person whose time was a lot of money, but on the other hand how are they finding time to ride anyway?
By managing their time well so that they are not spending it fiddling with bikes.
At the moment I don't have the space to fiddle with my bike, so if I need something done I can drop it off and it will come back sorted. Perfect solution there. I know it takes a lot of work to get your STW/Scouts Bike Maintenance badge but deciding not to do it all yourself is fairly normal and nothing to really be worried about.
…and you average Evans mech is some 20 year old not some Team Sky professional
Really? They all looked a bit older when I last went it. Nothing wrong with being young and experienced though. I guess the average evans mechanic gets through a heap of more interesting and complex bike fixes than the average pro team mechanic working on 1 kind of bike and a huge box full of free parts.
Yeah I’ve seen that myself for a Large Arkose, mind Dec availability.
Sounds like they are trying to keep stock volumes as lean as possible. Maybe they are in trouble?
Or, maybe we had some parts delays like forks that are on really long leadtimes.
Realised I haven't bugged Jameso for a Jones Pinnacle for a while. One guaranteed staff sale if you make one James. A Jonnacle, you can have that for free.
When was cycling not middle class? It’s been there for years
Well that's a fair point.
My perception was that in 80's and 90's it was mostly kids and working class people riding to work. Yes I know there were recreational riders but it was very rare to see cyclists on expensive bikes in lycra. If you rode a bike to work it was probably 'cos you were poor.
I lived in Australia in mid 00's and opened my eyes to a more healthy and pluralistic cycling culture. Loads of random and different people who would go on group rides at weekends or ride on the excellent cycle paths to work. Nothing grim about it. There would be one fast group ride on Sunday which could have hundreds of riders. Never seen anything like that back in the UK.
Then I moved back to the UK and Team GB/Sky took off and now I see loads of middle classes on bikes in lycra and stuff. Cycling now is somewhat glamorous like a new golf, and I read about friction between motorists and cyclists because the number of cyclists have grown so much the last few years.
a Jones Pinnacle
Ha. Have you ridden a Chromium yet? Different, yet not so different around town, sort of.
Had a few in, they do look nice. Might see what size 26" tyre I could get in back and then put fat front on one......😀
sometimes the job a professional can do is better
This is where I have an issue with the current state of affairs, in places like the Evans' of this world that statement is simply not true in my experience.
Invariably there is one mechanic in the shop with a qualification in order that the shop can claim to have qualified mechanics and he/she is just one person.. the majority of the work is being done by unqualified part-timers and, at best checked over by the qualified mechanic before it's shoved out the door..
It seems that the quality of work done by LBC's is getting worse over the years rather than better IME. After having recently had a few experiences of trying to get work done where I had hoped it would be cheaper to have the shop do it than my buy the specialist tool required it's been a complete ballache.
Gear hangar alignment.. 'it's fine mate, was all straight, that'll be £20' (bollox it was, hangar was bent/needed replaced and dropout was also slightly out/needed straightened.)
Bearing replacement in swingarm.. took a week to do, bearings were pressed in squint in one case and another only pressed halfway in, 2 of the 6 bearings were either knackered before they were fitted or knackered by the time they had finished fitting them.. either way I had to fix their arse up. £50 + cost of bearings.
New headset fitted to a replacement frame... £40 charged, had to chase them 3 times over the course of a fortnight before they got around to doing it despite telling me it would be 'a couple of days'. Got it home to discover that the bearings had been fitted upside down for ^&%s sake..
That is just my own experience of 3 of the major 'chain' shops in Edinburgh.. I hate to think how many people they have put off riding altogether with their incompetence.
Oh and there is the classic one of having to point out to a fellow parent on the school run that the new bike he had just picked up fresh from a well known bike shop (not Halfords) had built his bike up with the forks on back to front..
All in all the only thing i tend to think when walking out of a bike shop these days is 'why did i waste my time even going in there!' then going home and sorting it online for less money and less hassle....
That is just my own experience of 3 of the major ‘chain’ shops in Edinburgh.. I hate to think how many people they have put off riding altogether with their incompetence.
It's a fair point but plenty doing a good job out there with lots of experience. Put that together with having the right tools available it can make for easier and better jobs than the number of STW threads about laying into something with hammers etc.
Some of the questions people are asking doesn't inspire me they will get anywhere close to a good job from the level of understanding or tools available.
I find the LBS/customer relationship is one where you pick the one that works for you and have trust in, that is how we reward the good work and steer people to them.
Well my local Evans is 8 miles away in a straight line. Could take 1 hr drive at the worst time of day.
If I worked 9-5 I'd probably have to drop it off at the weekend and hope to pick it back up next weekend.
That's not very convenient
There was a struggling LBS literally 100 m away from my house which closed last year. One guy owned and ran it with a part time helper. It was tiny and had only a few bikes in stock. I'd go in there and the guy would look miserable. Probably is dream which wouldn't reconcile with financial realities.
A well known LBS in the area closed in the late 90's. I think Halfords opening helped kill it. This was a really old school dark and grimy shop. Had a big suntour sign on the front.
...and there is a fairly high end LBS about 4 miles away from me which would probably be best candidate for me. But I've not been in there in many years.
Well my local Evans is 8 miles away in a straight line. Could take 1 hr drive at the worst time of day.
If I worked 9-5 I’d probably have to drop it off at the weekend and hope to pick it back up next weekend.
That’s not very convenient
Not sure where you are but the 3 closest to me are Deansgate - only really convenient if your working in Manchester and take the bike in but they open 8am-7pm in the week, good for me as it's only one extra stop on the tram to grab some stuff for a weekend. The one at the velodrome does 10-7pm and the one at Trafford park does 10am-8pm week days so I'd say they are making a big effort to catch people who can't normally get into a bike shop. The trafford workshop always looks busy, given how easy it is to get to and the free car parking I'm not surprised.
I'm out in Cheshire. Yeah the Trafford Park one (near Chill Factor) is most accessible for me, cos I don't live near the Metrolink.
Anyway I only have one bike so there is every incentive to fix things myself than leave it with someone else for X number of days.
Anyway I only have one bike so there is every incentive to fix things myself than leave it with someone else for X number of days.
Yeah, at the moment with only one MTB and very little space the idea of booking it in somewhere dropping it off one evening and picking it up the next day appeals a lot more, means it's ready and working for the weekend. Given how many bikes seem to go in and out it's a service that works well.
Halfords probably would be the best buyer we could hope for in many ways. They’re reasonably solvent just for starters and have been known to be interested in the upper end of the cycle market for a long time but unable to break in. For the person commenting that Halfords’s at least do decent tools, the ‘pro’ range has been around since sometime in the mid 90’s And they really do stand by that lifetime guarantee.
I don’t doubt they’re quite aware of the shortcomings of their own staff regarding cycle sales and mechanics so I’d assume they’d leave Evans’ staff mostly alone, possibly improving the workshop side of things. As several posters, reliable and trustworthy workshops are a major service in these internet days, although I’m the category that rarely uses workshop services.
I hope it all goes well!
Invariably there is one mechanic in the shop with a qualification in order that the shop can claim to have qualified mechanics and he/she is just one person.. the majority of the work is being done by unqualified part-timers and, at best checked over by the qualified mechanic before it’s shoved out the door..
Isn't qualifications the issue though? Since qualifications were introduced the mechanics role becomes based on paper rather than experience. Those with masses of experience become devalued as those with the same qualification become elevated to the same level. Cue mass exodus of the good mechanics to set up as independents/workshops only leaving the stores to chase bits of paper. Maybe I am wrong but that seems to me to have been the general trajectory since formal qualifications were introduced. Not saying of course that you won't find good mechanics in LBSes but they're not leaving to set up on their own because the streets are paved with gold in the world of an independent mechanic....
Down here in Somerset there are 5 indie bike mechanics running without retail space.. at least one does office or home pickups/drop offfs too... surely in more populated areas this is happening too?
There is very little on a modern bike thats complicated to do especially if you can refer to a Youtube video as well (or ask on here). The difficulty comes with the cost of the various special tools you might need to buy and also the proliferation of standards that are around these days which can make buying replacement components difficult.
Maybe some kind of tool hire system would work?
Maybe some kind of tool hire system would work?
Would that give me more time, space and somewhere to do the messy jobs?
There is very little on a modern bike thats complicated to do especially if you can refer to a Youtube video as well (or ask on here).
If you assume the only reason people don't work on their own bikes is a fear or lack of understanding your missing the point. From not wanting to, being able to pay somebody, happy to pay somebody or making the time/cost balance thing that says your bike is good to go on a Saturday morning rather than still waiting on the bit to arrive from CRC etc.
I have one of the independent mechanics mentioned above living near me. He has done a few jobs for me but charges as much as most lbs. I thought one of the advantages of such a set up was that not having to spend money on retail infrastructure made prices cheaper.
agree. i used to do almost everything on my bikes, (bar taking apart suspension, and certain tasks related to pressing bearings in....) post parenthood - i'll pay someone to sort out whatever niggling issue i used to spend hours doing as i'm more time poor than cash poor,,
I thought one of the advantages of such a set up was that not having to spend money on retail infrastructure made prices cheaper.
All they need to be is competitive on price and more convenient to be a better option for people, being mobile and driving around you probably have more to manage, more down time to account for and a vehicle to fund (and insure) if you can still make a living then good for them.
The question should really be is the service worth the price quoted?
I'd be very surprised if there was any money in being a mobile mechanic.
From not wanting to, being able to pay somebody, happy to pay somebody or making the time/cost balance thing that says your bike is good to go on a Saturday morning rather than still waiting on the bit to arrive from CRC etc.
I'd probably waste 2 or 3 hrs taking my bike to the LBS, going back home, driving back, paying in the shop, then coming home again.
I could probably strip and bike down to the frame and rebuild it in that time.
I’d probably waste 2 or 3 hrs taking my bike to the LBS, going back home, driving back, paying in the shop, then coming home again.
I could probably strip and bike down to the frame and rebuild it in that time.
Well done, you are missing the you and other people part, for many it's easier. Anyway your post up there says you have a LBS 4 miles away and Evans is max of an hour away from you? Are you overestimating that time and underestimating the time to fix stuff?
Do you understand why other people don't want to spend their time fixing a bike or changing a drivetrain in their kitchen etc. especially as we head into winter?
Do you understand why other people don’t want to spend their time fixing a bike or changing a drivetrain in their kitchen etc. especially as we head into winter?
Yeah I can't I won't lie, some people are super busy or have kids and things.
But some people are super lazy too, and I'd wager that inability to take a wheel off or put a dropped chain back on when out on a ride, correlates strongly with never meching on a bike at home 😀
Know a few people who'd just take the bike into the LBS and spend a fortune for the slightest little thing, frequently. Things that are very easy for anyone to do and takes a couple of minutes.
Fair enough not wanting to be doing work that involves a mess in the kitchen, tools and hours of faff, but stuff like skipping gears that just needs a slight adjustment and could be done trail side, but into the shop it goes. Their money though 😀
It makes me laugh when people say that if they don't know how to do something on their bike there is a you tube video to show them how . I recently watched a you tube video of a man juggling seven skittles but guess what it didn't mean that I was able to do it myself .
but stuff like skipping gears that just needs a slight adjustment and could be done trail side
Probably not the greatest example, getting gears just so can rank up there with finding that annoying creak for PITA never ending jobs.
It makes me laugh when people say that if they don’t know how to do something on their bike there is a you tube video to show them how . I recently watched a you tube video of a man juggling seven skittles but guess what it didn’t mean that I was able to do it myself .
Oh come on. I can't think of anything bike maintenance which requires the same sort of practice as a professional juggler or acrobat lol.
Chasing a thread, yeah maybe not something you should just try right off the bat on your 5 grand frame. Other than that? What? Bike mechs don't weld or braze, let a pro do that.
Pro bike mechanic here with a few observations.
There is very little on a modern bike thats complicated to do especially if you can refer to a Youtube video as well (or ask on here).
True. However the vast majority of bikes which come in are not modern bikes. They are ancient and abused Apollos, Carreras and Raleighs. If I service 100 bikes a month, I reckon maybe 1 in every 150 is a modern bike. Just because you, your mates and those you see at trail centres ride nice bikes, that doesn't mean that's what we get in the shop.
Qualifications.
A flippin' nightmare. Cytech, Velotech, Weldtech etc are not worth the paper in the real world. We advertised for a temporary mechanic to cover long tern sickness. I got a lad in for an interview and told him as part of the interview process I'd like him to service a bike for me. "No need mate, I'm Cytech 3 qualified" was the response. Well he came in, interviewed well then I picked the next bike out of the service rack for him to sort out. It was a 20ish year old Raleigh commuter. Not been ridden for the last 5 years at least, during which time it had been kept outside. The service instruction was "make roadworthy, max budget £50". I gave the lad the bike, told him he should do the work and he should price his time at £20/hr. After an hour we called it a day, he'd spent most of that time trying to get the canti brakes set up. He'd never seen a loose ball bottom bracket, cotter pins or a quill stem. We see more bikes with these on them than disc brakes.
Prices
The average price of a bike sold in the UK was £233 in 2014 and probably hasn't changed much since. Halfords sell 25% of all the bikes sold in the UK, probably more now Toys R Us has gone bang. There are an awful lot of bikes out there sold for less than £150 and guess what! They are the ones which need the most fixing because they are generally crap. How much do you think someone is willing to spend on servicing and repairing? Not much is the answer... And so many people think that bike servicing is easy. Well, often it is, but that doesn't mean it doesn't have a value or can't be done badly or well. A few recent example...
Customer comes in with brake issue. Actually quite a nice bike. Built by her husband who is an engineer. Sorted the brake issue, also corrected the oval chainring which had been mounted 90' out.
Customer bought a bike from us then decided to fit a dropper. Bought a stealth dropper but the frame didn't have a hole for the hose. Customer uses an angle grinder to extend the seatpost slot all the way down the frame to get the hose in. Puts jubilee clips round seat tube to secure it all. Decides he doesn't like the bike so tries to return it to us for a refund. Gets very angry when we refuse.
Roadie with reasonable basic bike. Decides it's too heavy and will save weight by removing the seatclamp. Replaces it with 2 holes and self tappers. Isn't very talented with tools so the saddle is at about 20' from straight. Sensibly decides to get us to sort his gears.
Customer comes in with brake issues after fixing them themselves. Had fitted new v brake pads upside down so the curve of the pads is opposite to the curve of the wheel.
I could go on...
Prices and mechanic availability.
As above bikes are simple so should cost about 50p to fix. A customer comes in with 2 wheels. Can we remove both the cassettes and swap them over. So remove 2 cassettes and fit 2 cassettes. Sure we say, £4. Bloke starts ranting about how it's a 2 minute job and we have the tools so we should do it for free. Because of this mechanics wages are crap. I'm the workshop manager and I'm on under £9/hr. My partners 20 year old daughter is a waitress and her basic hourly rate is more than mine, plus she gets around £200/month in tips. I've only ever once been given a tip and that was for staying on for an extra half hour to fix a guys bike when he walked in at 2 minutes to closing time and needed the bike there and then to take it on holiday. I sorted the brakes and trued the wheels and sent him on his way with a bill for about a tenner. He tipped me £1. I was very happy!
So to stay afloat we reduced our number of mechanics this year after one of them left. Repair times went from around 3 days mid summer last year to maybe a week and a half this year. We lost at the most £500 of business. But we saved the salary (around £15500) plus the national insurance and pension contributions, so maybe £18000, which equates to maybe £28000 of takings.
TL:DR It's very hard to make a living fixing bikes. It's essentially seen as easy work of low value which anyone can do themselves. Until it goes wrong. This means there is no money to invest in training, tools, and spare bodies to react quickly. My skills are seen in the marketplace as being of less value than carrying plates of food. So the experienced people leave and are replaced by children. I'm trying to get out at the moment. I'll probably end up being a Tesco delivery driver working fewer hours for about £4k a year more.
^^Post of the day^^
^^Post of the day^^
Couldn't agree more !!!
Agreed post of the day from boris. I left the industry 18 years ago and it was the same back then, it really hasn't changed. As it happens I finished my cycle industry career at Halfords, that place done it for me. The attitude of some customers was appalling.
Boris for the win. Good (well sad reallt) to hear what reality is.
A flippin’ nightmare. Cytech, Velotech, Weldtech etc are not worth the paper in the real world
This is a situation that's the complete opposite of how it should be and smells of poor training, normally due to trying to squeeze 10 people per trainer.
The Velotech/weldtech quals were set up to try to combat that, and provide a bit of quality, but maybe they're failing too. It relies on thorough auditing of the training centres, which at the end of the day can be challenging.
The charity I used to work for considered tool hire at one point, as a community resource, but didn't move it any further as you need to understand how to best use the tools your borrowing, and that takes time. There was a high risk of damage due to misuse, so we didn't bother.
Mechanicing is seen as something relatively easy. bike clubs and specialist forums like this do foster that too, in the same way a petrolhead club would say an engine swap is a fairly simple job if you've the tools and bodies.
Also, dads and grandads remember repairing bikes back in the day, so it can't have changed too much. There will be a bit of masculine shove to be able to do these things too, in the same way most guys are expected to know how to fit a set of shelves.
This 'easy task that men don't want to give to experts' will also devalue the work being done.
Just went past one LBS and thought I'd nip in to see what they has as was passing, he's stopped selling bikes altogether as there's no money in it and just does servicing now.
He told me another shop that was about 4 x's the size of him in town had closed 2 weeks ago and one other went tail end of last year ...... 3 in one year.
Personally ... whilst the internet has it's uses in some ways I see it as the scourge of society.
Struggling U.K. retail chain Evans Cycles has been rescued, staffers of the 60-store cycles-only chain were told today.
The official announcement of the new owner will be made tomorrow, industry sources said.
Philip Green, maybe?
https://news.sky.com/story/halfords-puts-brakes-on-rescue-bid-for-evans-cycles-11535169
Mike Ashley appears to be the favourite though why that should be so as JD Sports are also still apparently in the race isn't clear.
Sold to Sports direct https://twitter.com/skynewsbreak/status/1057300123712212997?s=21
Interesting times for some of the brands/distributors in there at the moment...
Not Sports Direct!
What chance Donnay branded full susser for £150?
I feel for the staff that will lose their jobs.
Doesn't sound promising.
Urgh...
half of stores to close, I'd expect suppliers to be wanting stock back ASAP if it's not been paid for.