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Just wondering what the limits of either of these two 'folders' would be.
Is one better than the other? I know the Birdy has 18" wheels rather than the 20" of the Moulton TSR, but maybe one rides and handles better than the other. I assume forest tracks would be no problem, and the limiting factor might be the small wheels on loose surfaces. In terms of roots/rocks/loose stuff, what could they ride across? Or, are they really not up to anything other than road riding, and will off-road riding damage them (ie wear out bushes and linkages etc.)?
What's the maximum tyre size you can fit in a Moulton TSR (with V-brakes and no mudguards)?
It's of no help whatsoever, but I once woke after a drinking session having just moved to The Peak District.
On a beer mat I found scrawled "Beast on a Brompton!!"
We never tried it, for the best really.
APF
Neither are designed for off road use. I'm sure both would be fine on a smooth-ish bridleway but you'd be mad to treat the as a cross bike.
TSR isn't even seperable is it?
Airnimal Joey or Rhino are probably a better bet - http://airnimal.eu/products/products-overview/#.Wqql4pPFIsk
I rode Swinley regularly on my 20" wheeled Airnimal Rhino, until it was stolen. It was always a bit of a pain to fold. Probably faster than my cross bike.
How does the Rhino fold? Do you have to take the front wheel out, or is there a quicker fold than that? I seem to remember that some of the Airnimals are bulky and awkward when folded, but the Rhino might be fine for lugging in the boot if it quickly folded in half.
The Rhino was always very expensive, but nowadays other bikes seem to be similarly priced.
My mate has chunky fat tyres on his Moulton and considers it a gravel bike.
The wheels should be strong enough.
I've punted various Dahons around the trails in my area without any problem. They are more sketchy to ride on gravel than a full size bike wheel though, but still fun. Basically ride within the limitations of the bike.
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what about a pashley APB - they are rated for off-road use.
As above Airnimal Joey is great off-road. The older one has less tyre clearance at the back but you can still get a 2 inch mtb tyre in Exotic carbon forks at the front. Comes to a stop really quickly in bog though....
pashley APB became the Moulton TSR so back to the original question.
Rhino fold is front wheel out (and loose), seat pillar down and rear swingarm under and into the slot of the front wheel. Never had any issues with the Alfine hub but it was not a light bike, and you could feel the weight of the hub.
Tyre choice was the most limiting factor. But it was a nice ride and more capable than most people realise. I upgraded to a SS 29er, and then to a Genesis IOID with Alfine, that is also single speed.
pashley APB became the Moulton TSR so back to the original question.
<span style="font-size: 0.8rem;">The point is that the Moulton is designed with suitable clearances and wayyy back in the day, was a viable mountain/rough stuff bike. If I recall correctly you can fit 1.6inch tyres with mudguards or 2inch without.</span>
I've only ridden one offroad once or twice and I would go for almost anything other than small wheels.
I wonder how important the folding is to the OP. I have a bike for trains, busses, taxis and the like. For this a brompton was the only choice as folding trumps all. I've ridden it on forest tracks in the dry and it's ok. Better than not riding. Given you're looking at moultons and other collapsible rather than folding bikes, have you looked at something like:
https://ritcheylogic.com/break-away-ascent-frameset
Birdy folds pretty much as well as a brompton (I can get mine folded in 15 seconds), and rides a whole lot nicer. Mine has XT throughout, so easy to maintain. There's not much tyre choice, though, and I wouldn't try anything more technical than gravel roads.
cyclesouthwest
I’ve only ridden one offroad once or twice and I would go for almost anything other than small wheels.
That's my experience. They are fun but the small wheel is a very limiting factor.
I did have a Dahon which had rudimentary suspension and 2" tyres, and had a lot of fun on it, but I'd pick my rigid mtb for any serious stuff. It needs much more concentration to ride, even on gravel.
I think for small wheels to work properly offroad, they would need sophisticated suspension, and at least 3" tyres - by which time you may as well have a "proper" mtb.
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Birdy folds pretty much as well as a brompton
i really like Birdys and I’ve always hankered after one. Based on the short test rides I’ve had they do ride really well.
But the fold is nowhere near a Brompton. In fact nothing else is (Jon whytes folder was pretty good) in terms of speed, size and ease of moving once folded.
DO new Birdys fold worse? Mine's 15 years old, and I know they've changed the frame. FWIW my old one folds to about 4 inches longer than my wife's Brompton, about 5 seconds longer to fold, and is lighter...
From what I can tell, the newer Birdy's seem to fold a little better than the older ones. I've only seen the older one in the flesh, and that was a long time ago, but when folded it seemed quite long, and it splayed out at the back end - I'm not sure that it stayed 'locked together' when folded. Also, when demonstrated to me, it seemed like it could be a messy business, with the chain coming into contact with your arm. However, looking at the video on the Birdy site, the new one seems to fold prettty easily, and into a more compact/manageable package. I think the main downside to the fold is having to select the smallest rear sprocket, and align the pedals. However, it's difficult to say if there's much difference without seeing it in person. Folded bikes always seem much larger in the flesh! I remember being surprised at how bulky an Airnimal was, and even a Brompton is pretty chunky.
A folder I never got round to trying was the Xootr Swift. It had a decent wheelbase of 41".
It had a fast fold and was reputedly rigid. Seemed popular with folk who liked to ride hard.
http://www.foldingbike20.com/xootr-swift-folding-bike-review/
FWIW my old one folds to about 4 inches longer than my wife’s Brompton, about 5 seconds longer to fold, and is lighter
I just watched the video. I think the birdy is pretty quick and easy but you still have to grab the dirty tyre to pull the front round. Part of the joy of the Brompton is that you can fold it without touching any dirty parts, and though it's heavy you can usually push or pull it along and only have to carry it up/down steps.
Shit they've got expensive though. There used to be a Birdy model that came in under the £1k bike to work limit. cheapest is now over £2k (but hub gear, disc brakes, supernova lights - ok - that's a damn good spec, not such a bad price).