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^ I stand corrected. Seem to remember stock geo gravel frames with similar tube and general work costs that were under the Mason's RRP, though nothing's got cheaper recently has it.
as others said a Curtis is a lot less, fully bespoke but you're going to have to wait a while which might not suit some
If you got an 853 Curtis built to this spec (all the mounting points etc) it would cost you just as much. Close anyway. They charge you £25 per a pair of bosses. I don’t know what they’d charge for the internal routing (not something I’d want, but no doubt extra cost to do right).
own cost-finding work for UK/EU frame manufacturing ideas got me to the same conclusions – if the brand didn’t do the manufacturing it’s better have....
This is what 'worries me' for lack of a better word. If UK built stuff is going the way of swiss watches, or chocolate then we are in deep. If nothing else the pandemic has made us look at where and how things are made. That and the environment. If UK made has cachet and the price to go with it, and that becomes the prevailing belief, there is little hope to change it.
Isn't Shane part of the Liberty Group now? They own, iirc other bike brands plus steel manufacturing, metal recycling and all sorts. If they can't squeeze the manufacturing costs down, no-one can.
Orange make some frames here iirc?
Shand part of the Liberty Group now
A shug frame/fork is £2095 before you are any nice colour options.
Mason raw is £2395
So while expensive, I wouldn't say it was overpriced compared to other premium UK built frames.
The interesting thing for me is the cost/value equation of UK built hardtails Versus UK built full suspension.
The Cotic jeht is UK built(well the front triangle) & painted by the same guys at five land and at £2099 seems easier to justify.
If UK made has cachet and the price to go with it, and that becomes the prevailing belief, there is little hope to change it.
You need to build the cachet of some sort because the price will be high compared to Asia because of simple economics. Cost of living, everything, is high here and why should a bike fabricator work for a low wage? Marketing doesn't come into the general price level here. A brand needs to be credible and well-presented to carry it off so marketing spend will add a bit to the price like it does for any brand but at this stage it's still going to be a high/top end frame. Sports Direct won't be able to sell a Muddy Fox with a made in the UK frame but Cotic, Mason or Shand can build here.
The more frames that are made in the UK, the more resources there will be to do it and volume will lower costs. If you want to pay less for a product you'll buy a frame from Taiwan and it'll be good, Taiwan is really good at this. So good. I love being out there as well as wish we had that infrastructure here - I guess I'm pro what Five Land, Brompton, Shand, Stanton and those who work with them do for that reason, I'd like to see a bike industry in the UK that is more than product planner sheets and desk work. The challenge is that we need to get prices down somehow, no-one expects the riders to pay more to support some ideals. They might pay more to support a brand or fabricator where a friend works and they have a connection. Some riders will pay more for the feel-good of a high end product from local manufacturing. That'll get some volume going, it's a start.
If they can’t squeeze the manufacturing costs down, no-one can.
There's posters on here who know a lot more about this side of things than I do. I'm not sure if the owners of Shand make a lot of practical difference, they still buy tubes from Reynolds and have staff to pay. Liberty Group could make CrMo bike tubing and maybe take £25 out of the materials cost? I'm guessing. May not be worth the set up costs for high end frame volumes. What could help is that a large parent Co allows a fabricator to run on lower profits but -I'm no economist- I'm not sure that would be a good thing for this industry. Accept the end cost with reasonable, competitive margins and figure out how to sell them. As a number of brands are doing, and I wish them success.