… teased on Instagram today. Big reveal next Friday 22nd Nov. Is anyone here “in the know”? There’s a suggestion that a prototype was doing the rounds at Ard Rock.
I need a gravel bike and thought I knew what I wanted, but this could be interesting.
Ooohhhh...
Nope better not, I've a rather nice Colnago CX bike in the stable !
I'm slightly interested...started helping coach at a cycle track and borrowing a gravel bike and it is good fun. Unsure it would tempt me away but I think I could see a second bike added that could be used for stuff. I really like Bird so this is now proving even more of interest. I don't need a new bike, I can't afford a new bike, but I want to know more about the new bike!
Saw the Insta tease earlier.
Very interested to see what they have come up with. I have been resisting buying a new gravel bike but a good offering from Bird could change that...
benpinnick, benpinnick, benpinnick
That should summon him. 🙂
Yeah... you're gonna have to wait until next friday I'm afraid. What I can say is...
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Wait until Friday. Happy weekend everyone 😉
Oooh, you tease!
I’m not in the market for a new gravel bike, I’ve already got a nice all-rounder, but now my interest has been peaked.
Should be doing a trials bike considering who they sponsor!
The bike they were showing at Ard Rock was nice, and sounds like they had some pretty nice spec options lined up. Hopefully some nice colours on offer.
I was chatting to Ben about it last Friday ...
It'll be made out of carbon, or aluminium, or steel, or titanium. Probably not bamboo.
He did say they all (the guys working out of the Consett factory) love riding gravel, and do quite a bit, so I imagine they've a reasonable idea what they're doing ...
Do with think it will be more MTB than road bike? Which side of say, a Sonder Camino do we think it might be?
now my interest has been peaked.
I don't think it has ,;-)
On Friday it might, but not yet.
I guess it'll be something like a Cotic Cascade.
I demoed that but my hands didn't like first time on drop bars, sizing didn't work for flat bar. I didn't care enough about gravel bikes to take a chance or even on something second hand. So now I have a rigid Kona Unit X on 2.2"s, big chainring, full mudguards, high stack handlebar.
I know they've been working on it for quite a while. Given their track record of making great handling bikes for off road I'm optimistic it'll be a ground up design with that in mind rather than what a lot of companies do and take road geometry and add more clearance. Frankly I can't see that happening so I'm excited to see what they come up with
I'm going with aluminium and off road bias, based on their predominant material of choice and MTB background. I'd image it's more effective to market a rowdy gravel bike from an MTB company than a road biased one. Still a very crowded market though. Next question will be how many barnacle mounts will it have...
The gravel market is very saturated, so not sure how Bird will fit in, If I was in the market for a gravel bike i'd go down one of the following paths:
- Main stream brand for known quality, warranty, and resale value
- Niche brand for something bit different, either with some novel suspension or geometry, Lauf come to mind on this one.
- Budget/direct sales brand offering amazing value with high spec
- UK made, maybe even custom built.
As Bird isn't a big brand especially in the curly barred end of the industry, they will either need to offer something a bit different or at a good price IMO. It'll be interesting which direction they take.
Given their track record of making great handling bikes for off road I’m optimistic it’ll be a ground up design with that in mind rather than what a lot of companies do and take road geometry and add more clearance. Frankly I can’t see that happening so I’m excited to see what they come up with
they don't have a road bike to copy like some of the curly barred brands first gravel foray.
they haven't got an out of date XC hardtail to put a drop bar on (cough Scott cough).
so its going to be at least delibartely designed and well thought out.
Bird have great Brand loyalty, so it will definitely gain the attention of anyone who has owned one of their bikes, IMHO
They do demos much of the year, not just tge odd demo event. You can take a bike out all day. Could be a big draw for curious MTBers like me who never tried a drop bar before.
50mm clearance means non-boost.
The silhouette on insta shows a carbon fork with 4x barnacles per leg.
Very neat cable routing which has either been photoshopped or is predominantly internal.
Wild theory; GRX 12sp Di2 1x announcement embargo will lift on Friday and that’s what the Bird will be marketed with. 2+2=5
They do demos much of the year, not just tge odd demo event. You can take a bike out all day. Could be a big draw for curious MTBers like me who never tried a drop bar before.
Especially if you come to Consett where you can do gravel rides up to 70km from our doorstep with barely a couple of km total road distance in that.
The gravel market is very saturated, so not sure how Bird will fit in, If I was in the market for a gravel bike i’d go down one of the following paths:
- Main stream brand for known quality, warranty, and resale value
- Niche brand for something bit different, either with some novel suspension or geometry, Lauf come to mind on this one.
- Budget/direct sales brand offering amazing value with high spec
- UK made, maybe even custom built.
As Bird isn’t a big brand especially in the curly barred end of the industry, they will either need to offer something a bit different or at a good price IMO. It’ll be interesting which direction they take.
I bought an Aether 9 a few years ago and one of the main attractions, aside from the frame getting a great write up, was being able to spec it exactly how I wanted to (well, within the well-considered choices available). This meant I was able to get it to a price point I was happy with, putting more money into parts I wanted to (e.g. Lyrik Ultimates) and less on those where I felt a more budget offering would suffice.
Hopefully this ability to customise will be carried through to the gravel offering.
The query on where bird fit in to the gravel market. There's very few easily available decent frame only options for an aluminium frame (sonder aside). So that alone is one bonus for bird
I agree, I can see a gap for a nice-ish alu frame somewhere between Sonder at one end and Mason at the other. Plenty of decent bikes from the big brands but frame RRPs tend to be near the full bike prices.
Yep, exactly that
I believe gravel is still growing in terms of bike sales - probably gaining riders from road, MTB and newcomers to cycling.
I'm sure Bird can offer a well-designed and well-priced option.
As others have said, alu seems most likely - but steel might be the best choice for comfort and ride feel, as an MTB brand.
The insta silhouette shows a slightly concave hourglass headtube. I don’t think I’ve seen that design in steel before?
Yeah you're right, and I didn't expect they'd go for steel anyway - it's just my material of choice for graveling.
As above, definitely a gap for reasonably priced alu frameset. Steel is becoming quite expensive now, and Alu can have great ride qualities. Guess the in-between sonder-Mason would be Kinesis as their gravel frame is £700-£800, then Fustle at £900 followed by Trek and Specialized alu framesets which are over £1000. Bird needs to be a decent colour though!
Given the alloy hardtail is £650 I think it won't be far under £1000 TBH given it should come with a fork, axles, headset etc. It is difficult to place really because too much and you start to go for a few £100 more I could get this or that. Also Birds don't hold value very well 2nd hand. All that being said, as a Bird owner, I'm interested to see and could possibly swap out my Camino frame I've never properly loved.
All that being said, as a Bird owner, I’m interested to see and could possibly swap out my Camino frame I’ve never properly loved.
Do you really see it being all that different? I love a good gravel ride and have had a few gravel bikes (currently a Camino Ti) but my gut says they are all basically the same. Slacker, more comfy, road bikes with more give and better tyre clearance.
I think there are also a lot of MTB riders like me who are really put off by the roadie aesthetic so would like a gravel bike that reflects that. And on that point alone I suspect the Bird will do well.
From my point of view, i've drunk the gravel bike kool-aid and it's now pretty much worn off. Camino is now used as a light gravel/mainly road bike, and while it's versatile and has the mtb aesthetic - i'm far less into it than I was and don't ride it often. I've found the best gravel bike for me is an xc 29er HT which I now enjoy riding far more on all my local off road...that's another thread though!
Do you really see it being all that different? I love a good gravel ride and have had a few gravel bikes (currently a Camino Ti) but my gut says they are all basically the same. Slacker, more comfy, road bikes with more give and better tyre clearance.
Does bike dynamics really make much difference for gravel and road bikes? I can't imagine it being anywhere near the variety you can get on MTBs with geometry and setup.
Is there even any technical bike handling skill involved, especially for road riding? Everyone learnt how to do it when they were 4.
I'm going for slack head angle, long reach, steep seat tube and a dropper as in the Marin Gestalt XR and Evil Chamois Hagar..
I'm looking forward to seeing what Bird can do.
Ben posted a fantastic transparent post on the FB group about the state of the bike market & Bird.
Really refreshing and I wish them the best of luck!
I've noticed Cotic pushing their Escapade really hard the last couple weeks.
I imagine they're trying to capture some of the market before the Bird release.
I’m looking forward to seeing what Bird can do.
Ben posted a fantastic transparent post on the FB group about the state of the bike market & Bird.
Really refreshing and I wish them the best of luck!I’ve noticed Cotic pushing their Escapade really hard the last couple weeks.
I imagine they’re trying to capture some of the market before the Bird release.
Thanks Cokie. I don't think Cotic will have had anything to do with our release, its just a fact that the market is very depressed at the moment, and if you look at whats selling best in the off-road world, (all relative) its gravel bikes and eBikes. eBikes are complicated, prone to failure (again all relative before someone comes along to tell me theirs is fine) and actually the margins aren't as good as the spectacular pricing would make you think when you factor in the motor costs and warranty/support the likes of us or Cotic would have to put in, vs Gravel which is relatively simple, very reliable, and the margins on even the mid-market brands are absolutely eye-watering.
For us thats the opportunity to get back into a growing/selling market with a bike that will make you question our sanity on the pricing while actually being a decent margin for us. We also like riding gravel, which helps!
yup, I'd imagine Bird to be making something on the more aggressive side, NP digger missed from that list above
@benpinnick you mentioned Ebikes... any further updates on the Bird one? noticed it's gone very quiet since you guys were not very impressed with current reliability of motors
@benpinnick you mentioned Ebikes… any further updates on the Bird one? noticed it’s gone very quiet since you guys were not very impressed with current reliability of motors
We're working on a Bosch powered bike at the moment, but of course the market is very much disrupted by DJI, so even Bosch could be looking old hat next year. Bikes were so much easier before eBikes!
We also like riding gravel, which helps!
Crosses Ben off the Christmas card list 🙂
Hopefully along the Fustle Causeway GR style rather than the road bike with fat tyres route.
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Tidy looking!
Nothing on their website yet (unless I’m being inept)
Come on, it’s a Friday and snow means I’m wfh and I need to be distracted
@superstu I just saw the image here: https://www.bird.bike/news-blogs-and-more/
Ah so that's a custom paintjob. Very tasty though.
On a tangent, is that guy really doing graffiti in white trousers? And spraying so close to his lovely gravel bike?
So looks like its carbon? Funky headtube junction too...
Ooh that looks lovely. Can take a front mech by the looks of it as well. That could replace my road bike and have 2 sets of wheels for tarmac and gravel....
That is lovely!
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Yeah, looks like it can run a front mech from this pic.
Where are you seeing these @ogden ? That link just takes me to a couple of very old articles. Wonder if they were updating the website 'behind the scenes' and it accidentally went live momentarily just as you were looking?
Nothing on their IG yet either ...
If that is the one, then I have to say it looks a lot like many other carbon dropped seat stay frames. That photo doesn't seem to show much clearance for 2x. Not really the kind of thing that appeals to me, and being carbon it'll have a premium, but good luck to them and hopefully it delivers the margins they hope for, mentioned above.
Where are you seeing these @ogden ? That link just brakes me to a couple of very old articles. Wonder if they were updating the website ‘behind the scenes’ and it accidentally went live momentarily just as you were looking?
Possibly; I had the page open still from when I first went to it. These were the only two photos on there. Just assumed it had gone live given it was online.
I just saw the image here: https://www.bird.bike/news-blogs-and-more//blockquote >
Link from there no longer working so I hope this means Bird are updating the website and we’ll see the new bike soon…
Please don't be carbon...please don't be carbon...I'm very keen on this but really don't want carbon (I've an issue with old carbon going to landfill and not really easily recyclable)...aside from that, please external cable routing...keep it nice and simple and easy to work on!
Yep, was really just to show similarity and that it looks to be a fairly generic frame, perhaps with tweaks...
@benpinnick, @benpinnick, @benpinnick
Come on. Put us out of our misery, please. 🙂
Can someone give some context here. Are we expecting Bird to update the website and have a buy now button so I can get some shiny next week?
Or is this just a " look what we're going to do in 2025, but don't even think of buying it just now" type thing?
thegeneralistFree Member
Can someone give some context here. Are we expecting Bird to update the website and have a buy now button so I can get some shiny next week?Or is this just a ” look what we’re going to do in 2025, but don’t even think of buying it just now” type thing?
If it's anything like the Aeris AM launch last year, suspect it will be a launch and opportunity to 'pre-order' for delivery in early 2025.
AERELON ?
Rear end of the top tube
Well it's on their IG feed. Nothing on the website yet...
Edit* oh there it is...
.
Heed tube routing for all us "racing types" to save 2 watts, I'm oot.
I guess they hate us now 🙁
Apart from that, looks ace
there is a link to their website, 2x wide fitment, no mention of a dropper, and it comes with a carbon seatpost so suggests the intention is the racier side of gravel
Is the downtube really square in section or is it the paint job making it look like it is?
I don't need a gravel bike, I do kind of want one though.
And as a mountain biker (who was a roadie a decade ago), this seems to hit all the features I (think I) want.
Custom paint being an extra £700 if I'm reading the article right... what are the "free colours"? I remember Dan once saying that every bike would always come in black as that was the most popular option.
Any images of the cable/hose routing?
Looks really cool!
Can anyone find the geometry chart?
@phil5556, it does look good and the F&F set would have been a top pick for my next build.
Alas I'm not ****in about with hydraulic brake lines through the head tube, red line for me.
SRAM AXS has simplified the gear issue and further cable routing.
Frame/Fork Price is £1345
I expected them to come in with a more value-orientated aluminium frame / carbon fork closer to £600 TBH.
And full bikes for the above frameset price.
Can't see a geo chart on the webpage, but it looks on the racy side - especially with the hidden cable routing.
Feels like they're trying to take on Canyon, Trek, Giant etc, rather than Sonder, Boardman and other value brands?
OK so the elephant in the room... through the headset routing....
3 reasons why. Actually 3 3/4.
1 - You tape the hoses into the bars anyway. There's no such thing as a 'quick swap' or easy brake re-hose on a road bike. SO the only thing we're looking at is headset servicing.
2 - We expect zero bikes to be sold with cables, and only a handful of people who might have run cables, so now its only a couple of hoses we're talking here.
3 - The headset features 440C stainless bearings with a lifetime warranty against corrosion. You won't be needing to change them out very often (if ever for some people), you can clean and re-grease bearings without disassembling the bars, and when you do its really not as much faff as it sounds.
The 1/2 - I have at the moment got some hydraulic hose couplings on test, that allow you to split the hose without needing to bleed the brake - similar to how Formula speed-locks that we've been using for years work. If they work out, they'll be standard on all bikes, but as this time I can't make any promises.
The 1/4 - On a road bike the form and function of this style of routing just works. It looks nice, and works better than standard routing depending what you want to achieve, as now I can run hoses into under bar channels like on the Zipp XPLR carbon bar, lay blips over the hose, clean routing into the frame and still have a nice profiled bar to hold onto thats not distorted by the hose under the tape. On a mountain bike however, cable tourism has no place as unless you go to Dangerholm levels of integration with through bar and stem routing, as it always looks worse and functions worse than 'normal' routing.
I've had my one for getting on for 8 months now, and its really not p****** me off at all. I actually think I couldn't go back to semi-external routing now, but at the same time its had zero impact on my desire to add it to our mountain bikes, which is still at Zero.
Sad to see them go carbon - I would really like to see the industry move away or people find ways of recycling carbon to make it a more environmentally friendly option than it is now.
Feels like they’re trying to take on Canyon, Trek, Giant etc, rather than Sonder, Boardman and other value brands?
Yes and no. Canyon for sure, Scott, Trek, Specialized? Why not, but were not looking at the MTB/Gravel crossover side, not yet anyway which rules out some of those more value brands straight away. This is definitely looking to developing a road side to our business.
Can anyone find the geometry chart?
It will be out in Q1 next year, we're still deciding whether we preferred our first or second offset choice.
Is the downtube really square in section or is it the paint job making it look like it is?
No, its squarer to blend the HT into the rounder back end more, but its not 'square'.
Can someone give some context here. Are we expecting Bird to update the website and have a buy now button so I can get some shiny next week?
No, it will launch in the first quarter of next year as we are not expecting to ship them until Q2 for various reasons. We put it out there because its been a really quiet time for bike launches (incase you hadn't noticed) and we're ready to launch the custom paint service, and this was a nice example of it.
Ooh that looks lovely. Can take a front mech by the looks of it as well. That could replace my road bike and have 2 sets of wheels for tarmac and gravel….
Thats the idea because thats what we've been doing and ultimately we've always sold the bikes we want to ride. We'll even sell you two sets of wheels to go with it. Probably not Zipps though, they're a bit spendy on the aftermarket side! But we can certainly do you some DT 350s on DT rims at a great price with a bike. Keep the Zipps the standard 303 style for the road and the alu wheels for off.
There's a bit more info. in Hannah's article - https://singletrackmag.com/gritcx/2024/11/bird-cycleworks-now-with-custom-paint-and-gravel-options/
paint job is amazing, but for me to looks too much on the road side of the gravel spectrum, though nice to allow for 2x - hope it sells well for them though.
How many Ti bikes are recycled? Al , steel? Honestly now..
That looks absolutely stunning, but it appears to have both things I really don't want (carbon and internal cabling)...which is a real shame as all this week I've been desperate to find out about it as I'm keen on getting a gravel bike. Annoyingly, this isn't going to be it. However, I do think plenty will be sold as it looks a great looking bike and the kit seems to be superb.
Another nice job by Bird...in my opinion.
OK so the elephant in the room… through the headset routing….
Fair enough 🙂
It does look great and headset routing will allow bar bags to fit without interfering with cables.
