[Closed] Near miss with hikers - unlucky or irresponsible?

Please just reflect on your actions and on why many of us believe this is skirting the edges if not going over the reasonable way you need to ride to enjoy our mountains.

Read the access guidance.

I don't like to be judgy, and video can be difficult to assess, but I have ridden that trail and personally think you were going a bit fast.

The walkers were clearly alarmed by your riding so whether or not you thought it was ok as you were able to stop in time... You were at best discourteous.

In your own words

We did infact have a friendly chat and apologised to the walkers for scaring them.

So you accept with clear hindsight you both needed to apologise and that you scared them.

I’ve just got round to watching the video. I was expecting some high speed drama not the sort of instance I expect every single one of us has done at some point or other. Yes it’s not ideal to startle walkers and for sure I personally practice polite cycling (nice phrase that), but just occasionally you make a slight judgement error and go a bit fast in the thrill of the moment.
I’m sure Ben will go round this corner at super slow speeds from now on with all this damning judgement rattling round his head.

Just watched it. That didn’t look like a controlled stop to me. More slamming on in order to stop in time. Very hard to judge on a video though.

Top thread.

Especially the daily mail Brexit sovereign troll, bravo!.

🤣😂

Not exactly in control if you're nearly doing an endo to stop and having a chat with them afterwards does not make it ok that's just being polite and admitting your error.

I expect every single one of us has done at some point or other

You expect wrong I've never had to stop like that, I'd expect more from a guide who has apparently descended millions of meters.

The stop was clearly on the ragged edge of control, legs flailing and a front wheel skid / stoppie. Bit daft to claim otherwise.
It's hardly the end of the world, but certainly towards the dickish end of the spectrum on that particular trail, what with it being at one end of hugely popular hiking route.

What I don't understand is why on earth Mctrailrider would leave it in the video for the whole internet to see? Please MCT if you happen to read this thread, pull the video, edit it out and then put it back up.
Leaving that in section currently serves no useful purpose other than ammo for those who hate bikes and would love to see us disappear from shared trails. Make no mistake, there are those who really hate bikes and will use stuff like that to illustrate how dangerous they are.

Or leave it there to be honest and provoke this sort of debate in the wider community.

Haters are gonna hate, but the rest of us lean from these discussions.

Or leave it there to be honest and provoke this sort of debate in the wider community.

+1

Good thread despite the inevitable bickering and smartarsery.

serves no useful purpose other than ammo for those who hate bikes and would love to see us disappear from shared trails. Make no mistake, there are those who really hate bikes and will use stuff like that to illustrate how dangerous they are.

you know, in all the years I've been doing outdoor sports (about 30 years now, bloody hell!), climbing, bit of kayak, mostly mountain biking, there's always been a section of the population of whatever particular sport it is, who are determined that we are just on the precipice of existential threat, just one more incident and that's it, banned forever from all the trails/rocks/ rivers  Well, It hasn't happened yet, and in all likelihood will never happen, it's probably OK to chill a bit...

In my time I've had run ins with walkers and dog owners, watched horse riders clash with runners, walkers, dog owners, watched two ramblers almost come to blows, watched a cyclist unwittingly knock over a child and cause a full on punch up, and so on and so on and so on. It probably happens day in day out up and down the country every day.  It's just folk dealing with other folk. There are plenty of us on the island, and occasionally we'll probably get in each other's way

It might be that for a while afterwards that walker might have thought ill of those particular mountain bikers, it might be that he's forgotten all about it. it might be that he's grateful every one was alright and every body was polite and got on with their day. Who knows, and frankly, who cares. The actions of one group of riders do not reflect on the actions of anyone else, and in general; people don't think that because they've had an incident with "a" mountain biker they are going to hate every mountain biker they see from now on. They just don't. It's about time we all stopped thinking like that. And TBH the ones that do think like that are idiots, that everyone recognises are idiots, and pays them no attention. (see Mike Vanderman et al)

It's very easy to point and criticise from the sidelines. Just not particularly helpful, or insightful.

Not having ridden it and video being hard to judge I’d still say it doesn’t look that dramatic. I’ve ridden in the Alps with him and he looked very in control in the video. Doing an endo to stop is pretty normal for him I’ve watched him do it round countless switchbacks. I’ve nearly collided with walkers on corners or they’ve nearly collided with me, it’s shared access so this will happen on occasion. His trips are great by the way if you want to travel through the Alps.

Bang on nickc.

I’m not an active user here – .... We’ll be going round in circles from now on.

He sussed this place out pretty quick.

While incidents between different trail users do happen due to unforeseen circumstances that's not what's happened here.

If it had been at a trail centre then I'd have agreed with you. He's a professional guide, with clients, on a (shared) trail he knows, with a blind corner he knows about. It's his responsibility to slow down (and inform his clients) such that no incident is likely. Things being "OK" simply doesn't cut it.

Why give the idiots ammunition when with a bit of sense (I'd say common sense but that would be a misuse of "common") it could have been avoided?

for me, as someone that totally loves the freedom of biking in scotland offers, this video made me wince a bit. like everyone that bikes up here, I've had anti-bike comments from walkers and i suppose ultimately this video gives them fuel for their 'us and them' argument. the runners comments and the hikers near miss are both bound to happen the more you explore.

i suppose the common sense part is that i always try to avoid busy walker paths (or ride then early or late in the day) to minimise rush hour traffic.

i really enjoy bens videos and i suppose another factor is riding a proper trail monster of a bike following the guy that own the company makes them, will make it very hard to just roll along the trail. i always imagine myself dong the same on my rigid bike and the assumed difference speed between biking and walking isn't nearly as much of an issue.

I’ve nearly collided with walkers on corners or they’ve nearly collided with me, it’s shared access so this will happen on occasion.

not if you are riding withing the scottish access code.

not if you are riding withing the scottish access code.

Or indeed walking, we each of us have a responsibility to act reasonably to each other, as riders should be alert for walkers, the opposite is also true. Mountain Bikers have every right to use shared paths and walkers should expect to meet them. But as I said, this is just one incident (it just happens to have been filmed) pointing out what you think folk should have done differently is mostly irrelevant.

Well luckily for him most of his trips are the Alps so he can avoid the midges, miserable locals, awful food and stumpy mountains.

nickc - unfortunatly that is not so. there is a hierarchy and walkers have right of way.

Awful food? I hope that is a joke...great variety of food here when you look beyond a deep fat fryer...

tj, I didn't say anything about hierarchy, I just pointed out that walkers should expect to meet mountain bikers. Bikers have been part of the outdoor scene for 30+ years I mean, you can't think that because walkers have greater rights they shouldn't be alert to what they might meet on the trail?

Yes - but they shouldn't have to expect to be dodging them on blind corners.

pointing out what you think folk should have done differently is mostly irrelevant.

Again you are missing the point. It's entirely relevant as it highlights behaviour that we shouldn't be doing. It's called learning from others' mistakes.

No, incorrect. That's exactly what they should be thinking they may have to do. That's the point of "being alert"

Just as mountain bikers should be thinking "hmm, blind corner, better take it steady" walkers should be thinking "hmm, blind corner, what'll I do if some mountain bikers come barrelling through"  Everybody has the responsibility to pay attention to everyone else.

I doubt volenti non fit injuria applies, but it's the same principle.

If it had been another bike coming the other way, could he have stopped before hitting it?

So you agree he was going too fast for that part of the trail? At least that's progress.

pointing out what you think folk should have done differently is mostly irrelevant.

Is it mostly irrelevant to point out that only one set of folk could have reasonably done something different?

walkers should be thinking “hmm, blind corner, what’ll I do if some mountain bikers come barrelling through”

Is there some crafty way of walking through a blind section of singletrack trail whilst keeping out of the way of things you can't see that are approaching at maybe 20mph? What should we do differently when walking? Should we buy periscopes for walking past hedges, should we stand off the trail waiting for possible barreling bike riders until it gets dark and we can see whether headlights are approaching or not, or should we just turn for home when we spot a blind bend ahead?

Or should people not approach blind bends at speed?

I doubt volenti non fit injuria applies, but it’s the same principle.

It's really not. It's just people walking in the hills.

Yep awful food is a bit unfair. I’ve had some incredible meals in Scotland from scallops straight out the sea to freshly slaughtered lamb on Mull. I’ll stand by the rest.

tbf the locals probably just thought you were a bit of a ****

Greybeard

Subscriber

If it had been another bike coming the other way, could he have stopped before hitting it?

well yes, as that bike would've been going far slower and would have stopped right away

4. If I thought I was in the wrong – I would be embarrassed and apologise. Did those walkers get startled – no doubt – but if you have honestly never startled a walker while out riding, then you obviously don’t ride shared trails as much as I do. I came to a complete stop in time – I didn’t have to evade the walkers… just braked and stopped in time.

Not what you would call a controlled stop though was it? Absolutely maximum braking to the point you nearly binned it and bloody close to the walkers.

[img] [/img]

Don't get me wrong - we all make mistakes, and I've done the exact same thing before. I don't understand though why you don't believe yourself to be in the wrong. I certainly did after I'd done it. If the walkers had been a step or two further forward..?

To be fair, there's more context to that quote above. Ben's original post said:

1. We did infact have a friendly chat and apologised to the walkers for scaring them.
4. If I thought I was in the wrong – I would be embarrassed and apologise. Did those walkers get startled – no doubt

Ergo, "I scared them and I thought I was in the wrong." Seems we all mostly agree, then 🙂

The arguments for the defence seem to take two forms:
1. no collision therefore no problem
2. they're responsible because they were there

The parallels with shitty sociopathic drivers are pretty remarkable.

At least that’s progress.

yep, a bit of passive aggressive will help.

I've no opinion either way, I wasn't there. I see he pulls an endo, which is presumably why a lot of you think he might have been going too fast, but he may have done it on purpose for style points. I've come round a 90 deg bend on a pack-horse trails at literally no miles and hour and startled a horse rider, so there's no right and wrong to these events to take away "a lesson" .  that's the point to "Be Alert" literally anything could happen.

A few years ago, on this site, a mate of mine threw up a picture of him doing some urban stuff, and in one picture there was a ped walking up the flight of stairs that he was jumping down, and he was flamed on here for riding inconsiderately, despite coming on the thread to explain what actually happened. It went on for pages and pages. I don't suppose for a minute some folk won't just take the opportunity to point out perceived errors made by others (as they themselves are perfect, Obvs), and will only ever see an event framed an in a particular way.

Just saw this. Yes, irresponsible.

Simply not hitting a walker is not good enough. Near misses are antisocial, and upsetting. As we all know when the tables are turned on the road. They slash safety margins. If you can only just stop given perfect conditions and a fully working brake, the margin for error is much smaller. A cyclist can't demand nice safe passes on the road and then go out and do stuff like this on the trails. The two behaviours aren't compatible.

Then there's the PR side of it. We already have a huge image problem on and off road, so we need to try and offset that, not making it worse. Sometimes that means dialling down the fun - sorry, but that's how it is. Exactly as boy racers have to dial down their own personal thrill seeking on the public roads.

There's a top class downhill near me that I am pretty sure I could KOM on if I went all-out. But I don't, because it's a popular walking trail with blind bends. So I just take it easy and deal with the crushing disappointment. Mind you, the fact I'm near the top must mean everyone else is also backing off...

That's not to say I haven't gone too fast in the past on that trail. I've scared people, and I learned from it.

he may have done it on purpose for style points.

LOL

A line which would be delivered perfectly by Michael Palin playing a slippery shopkeeper.

I assume you're just trolling?

nickc

...there’s always been a section of the population of whatever particular sport it is, who are determined that we are just on the precipice of existential threat, just one more incident and that’s it, banned forever...

It has happened.

I used to ride my motorbike on trails, then along came the MX heroes on their noisy 2-strokes wheelying and chucking up rooster tails and generally buggering up the trails. Can't ride my motorbike on those trails anymore.

Basically piss off enough people and you lose.

TJ has got it right, obey the access code and protect our rights.

Trailpark style riding belongs in trail parks, not on public paths.

no harm done, probably should have slowed a bit for the corner, but meh. slight oversight, i don't think we should castigate them, they'll know themselves.

swavis

Subscriber
Too fast and always expect the unexpected. It is after all primarily a walkers trail.

It's primarily a shared trail.

they’ll know themselves

Apparently not, though.

It’s primarily a shared trail.

Yeah, so it's up to anyone bringing the speed and the danger to keep it in check.

It's 1 incident in how many hours of mctrail rider videos?

So I'd suggest there's a bit of an over reaction going on here.

The fact they haven't edited it out, is to their credit.

TJ has got it right, obey the access code and protect our rights.

This is true, but also highlights the problem with open access. It's great if your riding is basically "rambling on a bicycle" and thats ok for those who enjoy that kind of thing. But for many mtb'ing is an adrenaline sport/pastime, or at least partly. There will always be those who push things and conflict is inevitable, an access code is something that can be used against all mtbing. IMHO having some places that people can walk without having to worry about being clattered by a Mtb is a good thing. Maybe have routes designated, primarily walking but cyclists have access and primarily cycling that walkers have access to. Horse riders can sort there own thing out.

Watched that video as I'm normally a fan of the McT videos, and my reaction to the first "incident" with the grumpy walker was shock at the dismissiveness of McT in his comments about the walker. Then the main near miss happened...

The worst part for me is the attitude of most of those commenting on youtube, McTs reaction to the few negative comments on there, and now Ben Jones- all dismissive of any wrongdoing on their part and total failure to grasp that their actions directly contribute to the attitudes held by the walker in incident 1.

I'm sure the guide is glad no-one from here would book his services and turn up on their cx,gravel etc bikes that seem to be the norm for this forum then insist on riding at 10mph or less everywhere.

then insist on riding at 10mph or less everywhere

But thats the thing, you win the right to cycle on footpaths how fast do you ride on them ? Certainly not fast enough to cause alarm or be any sort of danger. That leaves your cycling rambling.

As someone who walks, climbs, runs and rides bikes a fair bit, I think sometimes mountain bikers underestimate how alarming it can be for walkers to have bikes going past at what feels to them, to be high speed. Or to have someone pull a emergency stop to avoid hitting them. My personal rule is to always to go slower than I might think is necessary and give walkers lots of space, particular if I'm approaching them from behind or round a blind bend or crest. If you're someone who finds walkers constantly startled by your approach or throwing themselves dramatically to the side, you're probably going at a speed which is slightly too fast.

I also find the Timber Bell really good for use on mixed-use trails. If you've not seen one, it's basically like a small bear or cow bell but with an/off switch that means you can silence it rather than driving your mates insane. It's distinctive, continuous and doesn't have the slightly entitled sort of feel that 'ping' bells sometimes do.

They're not perfect, mud gets up them and muffles the sound slightly and the first generation ones gradually wear until the friction lock on the bell fails, but as a way of letting walkers and horses know you're around, they work pretty well. Good on blind bends where even at low speeds you can still startle people too.

taxi25
Maybe have routes designated, primarily walking but cyclists have access and primarily cycling that walkers have access to. Horse riders can sort there own thing out.

Moaaarrrr Rullessss! 😆

No thanks!

taxi25

...It’s great if your riding is basically “rambling on a bicycle” and thats ok for those who enjoy that kind of thing. But for many mtb’ing is an adrenaline sport/pastime, or at least partly....

Surely it's utterly selfish to ride like that on public paths where there is the risk of collateral damage to other users who are not expecting your gnarrsomeness to come hurtling round the blind corner? And in light of the recent compensation case, if you're not adequately insured, you could be broke for life.

That's like thinking it's the cyclist's fault when Harry Petrolhead who regards driving as an adrenaline sport/pastime comes hurtling around the blind corner and cleans up the cyclist.

Trail parks are the places for that, just like there's race tracks for the petrol heads.

mtnboarder

failure to grasp that their actions directly contribute to the attitudes held by the walker in incident 1.

Some leap that. Perhaps she was just a sour faced git?

I’m sure the guide is glad no-one from here would book his services and turn up on their cx,gravel etc bikes that seem to be the norm for this forum then insist on riding at 10mph or less everywhere.

As someone who regularly goes on guided mtb trips, I have to say that I'd certainly think twice about booking with this company now. Partly due to the attitude shown in the video & in the apparent lack of awareness shown in their responses, but also, having paid for guiding I'd be pretty disappointed to be taken on a well known, busy walking path* in the middle of the day.

*I'm not saying that it isn't a shared path, just that it's predominantly known as a busy walking route.

It’s great if your riding is basically “rambling on a bicycle” and thats ok for those who enjoy that kind of thing. But for many mtb’ing is an adrenaline sport/pastime, or at least partly.

I dont think it is so binary.
Its riding sensible for the conditions. So if you have decent sight lines and no one is in sight then go for it. However if you have a bunch of walkers then slow down to pass and if its a blind corner then assume someone will be there and slow down.
It can be irritating since people do seem to have a talent of appearing just as the decent downhill sections start but thats life.

lucky7500

just that it’s predominantly known as a busy walking route.

none of the trails were particular busy in the video.

Surely it’s utterly selfish to ride like that on public paths where there is the risk of collateral damage to other users who are not expecting your gnarrsomeness to come hurtling round the blind corner? 

It is, but people are still going to ride like that. Open access just makes it more noticeable by bringing it on to what are still predominantly footpaths.

i don’t think we should castigate them

The issue isn't that they nearly hit the walkers. The issue is that they think what they did was just fine, no issue, and they'll continue to ride like that.

But for many mtb’ing is an adrenaline sport/pastime, or at least partly.

Yep, and there are places for that. Busy walking trails in the Cairngorms isn't one. If you want to ride hell for leather choose cheeky bike trails with no walkers or a bike park. Or at least somewhere you have good visibility and can see if there's anything coming.

I prefer to descend as slowly as possible whenever there are other trail users.

Brakes have come so far from the shimano 300lx of yore (complete with five-finger plastic levers) that I can take my time on the techs descents.

Just how slowly can YOU pass other trail users?

About 30s down that trail the sight lines are much more open and you can properly ride it, it’s a bad choice in the wrong place. Nothing more frothy than that really.

predominantly footpaths

Thankfully, a nonsense statement.

He has now edited it out, strange;it was fine yesterday.

He has now edited it out, strange;it was fine yesterday

For whatever reason, this is a good move. If I was fighting to improve MTB access in Wales or England and saw that video I'd be throwing my hands up in despair.

If I was fighting to improve MTB access in Wales or England and saw that video I’d be throwing my hands up in despair.

That would just be a reactionary response in lieu of any actual stats to back up that perception. So not really something worth putting any stock in to.

Anyone got the mtb/walker collision stats for scotland handy btw?

Because perceptions don't matter.

I'd say stats trump them.... Or are you suggesting we pander to every greetin faced tit on the hill?

I also dunno if it escaped most peoples attention, but the guys involved in the "incident" weren't that bothered...

That would just be a reactionary response in lieu of any actual stats to back up that perception.

I'd say it's more about the risk that it becomes low-hanging fruit for "mountain biker narrowly avoids crashing into group of hillwalkers" media nonsense.

Anyone got the mtb/walker collision stats for scotland handy btw?

Do you think the sort of people who do things like trying to get bikes banned from places do so on the basis of recorded stats, or on the basis of anecdote and hyperbole?

I also dunno if it escaped most peoples attention, but the guys involved in the “incident” weren’t that bothered…

But as noted before, that's purely luck. Other people would be bothered. I probably would be, especially if I were with my kids. If you've ever pissed someone off, did you just say "well, the last guy I did that to didn't seem pissed off, so you've no right to be"?

I watch quite a lot of mountain biking videos on YouTube, there is a bit of a clickbait competition going on with people like Sam Pilgrim riding through urban areas in very borderline fashion. I wonder if that's why the near miss/crash was included in this video to spice it up a bit.

Bez

Do you think the sort of people who do things like trying to get bikes banned from places do so on the basis of recorded stats, or on the basis of anecdote and hyperbole?

So stats don't matter? Anyone got them btw?

Or we just going to continue this conversation based on 1 incident?

I'd like to see if there is an actual issue before I got my nickers all flustered about this..

Who said stats don’t matter? The point is that these conversations, outside of activity-specific forums, involve mostly anecdote. And while stats are useful, (a) there are no stats for how many people are pissed off by nearly being hit by mountain bikers, and (b) why bother defending something that clearly just risks creating more unhelpful anecdotes—either by people who don’t ride bikes over-reacting to this one, or by people who do ride bikes thinking it’s ok to ride like this as long as you don’t actually cause an injury and then going and doing this to people who are bothered by it.

Well, I'll let youse get yourself in a tizzy about anecdotes... Not a game I'm interesting in playing, come back to me when you've got something tangible to talk about...

Not a fan of Ben Jones attitude.He WAS on my short list for next years MTB trip ( to be honest he was at the top) and there would have been 3 of us going so this has cost him at least £4000.Probably go with one of Spanish trips instead.

are you suggesting we pander to every greetin faced tit on the hill?

I haven't seen anyone suggesting that, don't see why you're being so trolly about it.

The problem with greetin faced tits, is that community councils are rammed with greetin faced tits all over the place. I just think giving them easy opportunities to greet about us biking is hardly helpful to MTB as a whole.

Me trolling? I'm not the one getting on some poor guys back for a nothing incident! 😆

seosamh77

It far from the worst I have seen but this is a professional guide who is using scots access laws to ride but not meeting his responsibilities under them

I have forgotten. are you scots based?

Scots law on access is uniquie in the world. Right to roam is a qualifed right. Unlike in other places where yo have an absolute right to ride in some places and no right in others, here we have a qualified right to ride everywhere but that qualification is behaving responsibly

What I hope will come out of this is that the chap in question reflects on his actions and rides more responsibly in future.

😆

Dear All,
Let me clarify for those who are not "a fan" of my attitude as presented here in my frustrated writing. I'm pleased to note no-one here who's actually met me or has been guided by me has a bad word to say - the opposite in fact.

I 100% believe that walkers should be shown respect on the trail and I certainly don't advocate any behaviour that causes conflict with or endangers other trail users. Anyone who's ridden with me will, I hope, clarify this. So this argument is simply about whether or not I inadvertently breached my own "rules" by riding too quickly.

At the time I felt my speed was appropriate.
This feeling isn't from looking at a video filmed on a gorpo which are notorious for messing with perspective of speed/gradient etc - but my perspective from actually riding the trail.
I always ride at a speed where I am able to stop within sight lines and on this trial on the blindest corner of the entire trail - with walkers in the most unlucky place you could imagine - I was able to stop within my sight line. The fact that I endo'ed may have looked uncontrolled... but please reserve your judgement on my control of front wheel traction until you've ridden with me.

Seriously - what other criteria do you use to judge how fast it's acceptable to ride? I'm not being facitous here.
I tell all my clients that this is what they should aim for - to be able to stop within your sight line on any trail... I will not be changing this advice unless someone has a better memorable "rule"? If I thought I was outside of this parameter I would be apologising unreservedly for riding like a dick and endangering other trail users - but clearly - I was not.

I get it - startling walkers is not cool. I shouldn't have to state that I don't aim to frighten or panic walkers and do my utmost to treat other trail users with respect and not endanger them in any way. The easiest way to prevent conflict is to leave your bike at home. But I personally like to keep riding and do my best to strike a balance whereby I both ride at a speed that is enjoyable for my clients and maintain the ability to stop if something or someone unexpected is around the corner. If we can have a good chat and bit of banter with other trail users (in Scotland 95% of the time you can) this is a great bonus.

That's my attitude - and my clients appreciate it and come back year after year. Most importantly we've never had a collision with a walker or anyone else in well over a million (non hyperbolic) vertical metres of guided descending.

'I get it – startling walkers is not cool. I shouldn’t have to state that I don’t aim to frighten or panic walkers and do my utmost to treat other trail users with respect and not endanger them in any way.'

But as a paid guide on shared trails that is what you did in this instance, why can't you just reflect on that and ease up a touch more next time? No harm done and we all live and learn sort of thing.

But as a paid guide on shared trails that is what you did in this instance, why can’t you just reflect on that and ease up a touch more next time? No harm done and we all live and learn sort of thing.

Thats all I ask. Reflect upon it and ease off a bit. Please.

"Seriously – what other criteria do you use to judge how fast it’s acceptable to ride?"

Its quite simple, slow enough that you don't startle some other trail user, whether they are capable or forgiveness or not. You may be confident that you can stop in time (and it appears that you are), but they have no idea about how many million miles of guiding you've done in the past....

" If your recreation is one which is likely
to cause a hazard (for example cycling fast or driving a cart or
carriage with horses or dogs) you should take particular care
not to cause risk to others. If you are on shared-use routes you
must show care and consideration for others, deferring to
those who are most vulnerable."
"On narrow routes, cycling may
cause problems for other people, such as walkers and horse riders. If this
occurs, dismount and walk until the path becomes suitable again. Do not
endanger walkers and horse riders: give other users advance warning of
your presence and give way to them on a narrow path."
Scottish Outdoor Access Code, 2005

Some of it may have to do with the fact ( on his Facebook page if anyone wants to check it out) That he probably doesn't care about how much he annoys people as he is no longer running trips in Scotland and so has had his use and money out it.As for no one who has met him having a bad word to say I have just spoken to someone who HAS been on one of his trips and " OK in small doses but a bit full of himself" was the nicest thing they could think of!

Character assassination by over-reacting anonymous keyboard warriors on a public internet forum makes this the most Singletrackworld forum thread of all time.

I'm calling bs on your statement
Not so long Ago you was booking a holiday with him .now after this your not .now you've somehow carried out a background check and found he's an arse .
Absolutely bs
Guy nearly made a mistake big deal
Tj if your so passionate can you turn your frustrations to the car drivers of this world.once we've sorted out the thousands of unnecessary rd deaths each year I give you permission to get back to completely going over the top .
Tj if your bloods boiling go check out the pillock pilgrim or embns recent urban ride it's a lot worse than what Ben nearly did .

I honestly think this has been totally blown out of proportion

Brakes have come so far from the shimano 300lx of yore (complete with five-finger plastic levers)

I remember those! Special Norfolk edition, right?

If you actually read what I wrote no way is it blown out of proportion at all noris my blood boiling - I am just a bit saddened by his attitude. I even commended him for stopping to apologise

It far from the worst I have seen but this is a professional guide who is using scots access laws to ride but not meeting his responsibilities under them

Thats all I ask. Reflect upon it and ease off a bit. Please.

Others have been more scathing and it is clear that this is not responsible riding by the access code we should all abide by.