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Hi all, longtime lurker, first post in 10 years (!) Apologies for the noob question.
I'm a roadie who's recently taken up CX more seriously. But my skills in CX are lacking to the point where it's often quicker for me to get off and run down steep or muddy descents -- though that's still a lot slower than the people who are beating me. So my plan for this summer was to get a MTB to improve confidence in descending for CX racing, and maybe try some XC racing next year if the MTB bug really bites. Basically this means the Surrey hills and Swinley or similar in the SE.
Pretty sure I want a hardtail 27.5 I guess around 15" frame (at 157cm height I think a 29er will be too big). But I'm stuck between going for a more racey XC geometry (69-70 HT) which is similar to my CX bike, and something more slack (66ish?) and also how much fork travel I'd want -- not less than 100 but not more than 130?
The slacker bike presumably would help more with what I want to improve, but would I then get back on my rigid 33mm-shod CX bike and overcook everything? I do enjoy climbing and simply riding singletrack so need to make sure I get something that won't suck the life out of that. Going faster/better downhill is only part of it.
Very hard at the moment to test or even hire bikes as you can guess. So all I have to go on is on reviews, forum posts, geometry tables, etc. My current MTB is a rigid Giant 26er about 20 years old, so that's not much help.
Planning to buy secondhand if possible. I have a running list of possible candidates in bike models so I know when one comes up to grab it. I'm just stuck on whether I want an XC or trail bike. Or is there something in the middle? Thanks in advance.
I'd get an XC bike. If you fancy a bit of XC racing you'll be better off for it. It does sound like your main driver isn't getting a do it all MTB but specifically getting better at techy stuff on the CX. I think the XC will help you carry those over more easily, and it'll climb well and go through singletrack as fast as you dare.
I really think you should try some XC races if you really want to improve. You'll get your a*se handed to you if you can't ride down stuff and that'll motivate you. Or not 😀
I would say that if you want to get better at cx technicality, then ride your cx bike at the place you mention.
But if you want a mtb, then go for an XC style bike with more trad geo rather than a trail orientated bike, it will be worlds apart from your cx bike anyway. Suspension fork and fat tyres make such a difference.
I'd also say XC. 'Trail' bikes are for people who want to enjoy the 'adrenaline sport' or 'fun' side of MTBing, however mildly, and are made for such. If you're into road and CX then you'll probably find such bikes a real drag.
There are trail-ey XC bikes, they usually have head angles around 68 degrees or so. But you can still thrash the nuts of a full-on XC bike and be quick whilst you are at it - and it'll be closer to what you're used to and probably give more benefit in your CX racing I'd imagine.
Even an XC bike is going to be slow on the very easy stuff, and heavy, compared to a CX race bike - so get that in your mind now to avoid disappointment.
IF you can get a 29er in your size (the brands have different ideas on this, some make the small bikes 27.5) I say do it, there's not much arse-tyre interface going to happen on a xc hardtail, as opposed to big travel full suspension bikes where you may struggle with fit, and the manufacturer may struggle to fit the suspension in the available space.
I would say that if you want to get better at cx technicality, then ride your cx bike at the place you mention.
Agree. If you 'spoil' yourself on an MTB the CX bike will always feel less capable/require more skill. Practice on the bike you will be using.
I think it will help a lot - riding a cross bike down a muddy slope at 95% HR is all about confidence and being smooth, it's not like a discrete technique (cornering, say) where there's a right way and a wrong way. So general competence on MTB descents goes a long way.
Not sure there's any such thing as a 29er being too big nowadays? They look a bit odd on small frames (IMHO) but quite a few female pro XCers are around your height. You'd certainly need to test ride to check standover etc, which I guess can be harder to arrange buying secondhand.
I'd say XC bike too. An aggressive trail bike is going to feel nothing at all like your CX bike, and if anything it's going to compensate for the lack of skill rather than encourage you to refine it. That's not to say it's not going to be helpful, but as a roadie I think A): You will probably appreciate an XC bike more overall, and B): It's a smaller transition between the two. It's still a world away from a CX bike and should give you plenty of confidence on descents, just without over-egging the pudding.
I've ridden my CX/gravel bike at Swinley a few times although there's certainly a few of the trails there that I wouldn't take it on! It's brilliant on the rolling singletrack though.
However I don't do pure CX racing, the only races that bike has done is the Three Peaks which is a lot closer to pure MTB so the bike is correspondingly too overbuilt to be a pure CXer.
I'd try both - give the CX a blast around Swinley and see how you get on but as a confidence booster to learn / develop skills off-road, a lightweight XC hardtail would be perfect.
Have you considered coaching on the downhill aspect, just changing to a mtb may not be the magic pill you’ll need. Perhaps going from a 33 at the front to a 40, if it will fit, may help with increased grip.
As crazy-legs above said swinley is pretty much cx-able, as is lots around peaslake, box, etc with some cheeky descents which aren’t out and out dangerous
Ride your cross bike XC. It’s what people did before mountain bikes. Since you are a roadie, what size and set up is your cross bike? Can you get back off the saddle? Are the bars low so you’re always on the hoods not the drops? My cross bike is set up slightly smaller than my road bike. I spend a lot of time out of the saddle and almost always on the drops covering the brakes.
Bike control is bike control. Sure, in cross the bike will be moving underneath you, but your position will be more upright on an mtb and the bike handling will quite different.
As a beginner, take your cross bike to a trail centre and ride the blue routes. I find that the cross bike makes things much more technical. A FS mtb is the opposite and means you need fewer skills. I ride Swinley (including Red 25) on the cross bike. Drop-offs are errr challenging, but this includes some pretty technical stuff. I double punctured on a jump once so must have been trying! It also levels up the fitness differences with my sons who blast the trails on an FS.
Edit. If you are serious about Swinley, then five laps of the green beginners route will provide plenty of skills honing prior to the steeper stuff. Don’t worry about what others are riding.
Came back from a CX ride (on the new CAADX) to a whole load of replies -- thanks all!
XC bike was what I was leaning towards as well, thinking that if I started to love the downhill/adrenaline side of MTBing then n+1 down the road is always an option (full suss or whatever). I'll aim for 68 degrees minimum headtube for this first bike.
Coaching is in the cards, once I get a bike. My skills aren't totally dire but just need to get 15+ years of roadie out of my head and feel comfortable with the bike moving underneath me, trusting it to deal with what's on the ground, etc. I think a day of one-to-one will do me wonders!
Yes I have ridden trails at Swinley, Ranmore Common, even a bit of Leith Hill on my CX bike but it's just hard work and leaves me battered on narrow tires, drop bars, poor brakes, etc. especially the rocky rooty stuff. I do fancy a bit of MTB racing so no need to martyr myself to the CX bike on terrain I'd nearly never find in a CX race. Yes I'm usually in the drops in a CX race. My saddle-bar drop is nearly nothing, even on a 41cm CX bike!
Also I just fancy a change, I've gone pretty much as far as I can go with road and TT and at my age road rash takes a lot longer to heal. CX is something I did before but only took seriously recently, I've found a reasonable amount of success in it over a season and a half and still think I can do better. MTBing suits my abilities (fitness, climbing) whilst presenting a new challenge... so I do want to give it a go just for something new. Road is just getting too busy/dangerous/boring these days where I live.
Had discounted a 29er but now will look again! That may considerably widen my prospects of finding something decent as small 27.5 bikes with a good spec are quite rare at the moment.
27.5+ maybe if not a 29er? And how much travel do I really want, is 100mm enough? I'm 55kg.
Carbon 29er and welcome to XC racing. And yes the OP has gone a long way on the road. And made me suffer on a turbo too 😉