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Evening all 😀
I own a 2014 Alpine 160, looking at picking up a new Monarch RC3 Plus for my bike so was heading for the Debonair. After speaking to Orange they inform me that due to the larger can size on the debonair this isn't suited to my bike as it's single pivot.
They recommend using the standard Monarch RC3 Plus as with the Debonair 'the large air can shock can't keep it progressive throughout the travel'.
Just wondering if anyone else had had this experience?
Does it make sense to others?
Thanks
TomO
Were you not planning on sending it off for tuning? If so they will set the shock up for the bike and rider, so orange may be correct in saying that a standard MM tune will be unsuitable for the single pivot, this doesnt mean that it cant be made to work. I had my debonair on my mega tuned by jtech and it feels much better than my mates mega with factory supplied monarch plus.
If I remember correctly, the alpine has a slightly falling rate design (less effort is needed to compress the shock as it gets further into its travel). To use magazine speak, this means it will blow through its travel with high volume shocks. Orange are saying that large volume air cans don't suit their design. I'd listen to orange rather than buying something inherently wrong & then trying to tune it to your wishes.
Oranges generally don't have extremely progressive wheel rates. They are flat or falling.
Large volume air cans don't give any ramp up, resulting in a system that blows through it's travel.
So it needs a smaller air can to give some spring rate progression.
This isn't a feature of all singlepivots. But is a fact of the layout of the singlepivot on an orange. The relationship between wheel, main pivot and shock mounts.
Sticking a volume reducer into my RP23 vastly improved my Alpine 160 so I'd say Orange are right.
I've managed to reduce the pressure for the same sag, giving more small bump compliance and the large bump feel seems better too. The bike just feels lighter and livelier, and I could kid myself that the pro pedal works a bit better too (possibly because the shock is at the right point in its travel).
However I wish they'd been equally correct a couple of years ago when they shipped the Alpine 160 frame with a high volume RP23 and no volume reducer. Maybe they didn't know at the time.
That's lucky... I was going to get a debonair for my 5! As they aren't in stock I went for the more expensive CCDB air CS.
A guy on here has fitted a debonair to his five... Might be worth seeing what he says about it.
http://www.pinkbike.com/forum/listcomments/?threadid=1129&pagenum=212
Thanks for all the responses that makes perfect sense. Thanks for putting it in laymans terms for me helps a lot 😀
I think I'll take the advice and just buy the standard plus. If it is something that oranges struggle with I'd rather not have to tune it to make it acceptable.
Thanks for all the replies
TomO
Debonair as standard on the new RS Alpine and available as an upgrade on the others. And you can tune it with volume spacers to make it more progressive.
Not sure why Orange would say it wont work as they spec that shock on most 2015 Fives and Alpines.
Goldigger - Member
That's lucky... I was going to get a debonair for my 5! As they aren't in stock I went for the more expensive CCDB air CS.A guy on here has fitted a debonair to his five... Might be worth seeing what he says about it.
http://www.pinkbike.com/forum/listcomments/?threadid=1129&pagenum=212
/p>POSTED 1 HOUR AGO # REPORT-POST
Thats me, i replied on Pinkbike, i think there is probably some confusion at Orange.......
The shocks on the '15 Fives and Alpines are not Debonairs.
They have the Fast Black coating on the shaft which RockShox debuted at about the same time as they introduced Debonair but they are standard volume shocks.
I had my frame 3 weeks ago from them and i'm sure it says debonair on it.
Can you even get a 2015/fast black Monarch Plus RC3 that isnt a debonair?
Can you even get a 2015/fast black Monarch Plus RC3 that isnt a debonair?
You certainly can.
Sure? Ive not seen any listed for sale or RS dont mention this on the website, i thought they all came with debonair on the 2015 RC3's.
I replaced a fox RP23 with a monarch plus RC3 2014 on my orange 5. MM tune. For me it's transformed the bike. Doesn't bottom out anymore (suppose I could've shimmed the RP23), feels a lot more responsive. I'm happy with it & married with new Pikes up front (replaced fox floats) the bike feels reborn.
Sure? Ive not seen any listed for sale or RS dont mention this on the website, i thought they all came with debonair on the 2015 RC3's.
Air can options are standard, HV or Debonair.
Phil- I believe Sim works for Orange so suspect he is correct. Probably OEM stuff.
I just read the RS wesbite again, "DebonAir, High Volume Solo Air, Standard Solo Air/Air pressure via Schrader Valve"
Makes more sense now what Orange are saying now as the debonair is a HV can basically.
The debonair is basically a XV can for both positive and negative air chambers, that's all.
Sorry to bump a old thread but my mate has just taken delivery of a new 5 with a Debonair on it.
Smaller volume.
Its definitely got the Debonair can on it not the standard one so I can only assume its filled full of volume spacers.
Yes will be, obviously couldn't resist it but needed to adapt.
Debonair, as has already been pointed out, is a larger can for positive AND negative chambers. So a debonair with the positive side full of spacers 'should' yield an improvement in small bump response but be similar to standard can with no spacers.