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Well I've done precisely ONE outdoor ride since the lockdown, in fact it was nearly two weeks since the previous one. That ride was from home, we're rural, and was all of 20km and got no further than 6km from home.
I've done a total of 320km outside this year, that's about ten days worth of a normal year. A normal ride would be 80km or so off-road and 120km on-road. I'm not about to suddenly do that.
The government has quite deliberately, not explicitly banned driving to exercise (see Guardian article quoted above). The government recognise that mental health is as important as physical, and exercise is critical to mental health. If someone is driving 2 miles up the road to a quiet, non honeypot spot to exercise or walk the dogs, there is negligible risk but a significant benefit to that persons mental health.
Why are some here so determined to self flaggelate, and attack others who take sensible precautions within the bounds of advice, whilst still maintaining some sanity.
Honestly this whole thing has just brought out the worst in some people's nature, spouting vitreol at strangers. Is this really what 5 days of lock down has brought us down to.
If only we had the benifit of other countries to witness where we are heading.
trail_rat
I agree with the point you were making but it does not mean the car is the solution
Actually, I think in my particular case it could be. It avoids all human contact and the traffic risk is minimal with it being a short journey on a minor road that has very little traffic. However, I am well aware that this will not be the case for the majority of people and that is who you have to legislate for. In my first post I did say that since the first outing I have now chosen to follow the rules(vague as they are) as I believe it is the right thing to do in regard to setting examples to others who's journeys may involve greater distance, more traffic risk and are unlikely to find themselves in such a deserted area where there will be increased risk of them transmitting and spreading the virus. For the majority though, including myself. Excercising locally from the front door is inevitably going to involve more human interaction which will carry increased risk of virus transmition and possibly spreading despite social distancing.
I need the government to tell me when I can go for a wee wee.
If only we had the benifit of other countries to witness where we are heading.
There’s suddenly been a surge of number of runners in my local area, 2/3x more now that a few weeks back. Nothing like a limit on leaving the house to make people want to leave the house more…
Or maybe they used to run on treadmills in their local gym which is now closed...
Trail rat & Klunk and others. If you really want to avoid us becoming like Italy. Do not go grocery shopping in person, order online, once, and get 6 weeks worth of shopping in.
One trip to Aldi or the corner shop is a thousand times more risky in terms of communicating a virus than a 1000 LOCAL trips in the car.
I don't own a car ?
order online, once, and get 6 weeks worth of shopping in.
and not possible.
Spot on Jordan. Deploying common sense within the bounds of govermental advice. Maximising your potential for good mental health and without risking harm to others.
I hope no one shames themselves by challenging your intent.
Also, and this probably applies to the general public more than STW people, you don’t HAVE to go for a run/walk/cycle every day, there’s nothing wrong with staying inside/in your garden. In fact:
Where it gets tough is with kids: we are very lucky to have a garden & some great local areas to walk & ride , our 7&9 year old lads have played a lot of garden footy this week, & we do a daily family cycle or walk round the lake.
3 year old twins are easier to deal with, but the older boys need tiring out.
If you stick a pedometer on them, between walking to school, play time, PE, after school clubs, they probably do more activity than most on here!
Our neighbours with 3 teenage boys have set up a home gym in the garage, complete with punching bag.
Must be incredibly hard on those who can't do that, with kids in flats/without gardens & local parks shut, certainly all the play areas round here are signed off.
Or maybe they used to run on treadmills in their local gym which is now closed…
Yeah that's also a probable cause. Doesn't bother me, was just an observation.
The thing we all have to remember is that everyone in the UK should be thinking whether that trip out of the house is needed. Whether that's to work, to go shopping, for exercise, or to go for 'a nice walk in the country'. And regardless of what's been said on this thread, if we get more stricter measures put in place, it won't be because a few people have driven 2 miles to be able to walk their dog without it needing to take a shit on the pavement. Whether that 2 mile drive was needed, only the person making it will know.
If more measures get put in place, it will be the idiot general public who still think going to the beach/queueing for 2 hours to get into tesco/meeting up with doris for a coffee and a chat is still "OK".
This weekend will be the tipping point, lets see how many 20 road cyclist pelotons are out, or how many people parking up at peaslake to go for a KOM on the now empty trails, or how many idiots decide to walk up snowdon again...
I'll file that stat under made up statistics.
Local shops for local people mostly.
Other than those that jump in the car and go to the next town for their quinoa because their local shop is out.
This weekend will be the tipping point, lets see how many 20 road cyclist pelotons are out, or how many people parking up at peaslake to go for a KOM on the now empty trails, or how many idiots decide to walk up snowdon again…
But it's ok. These places will be empty and thus no transmission vector for the user's because most folk are applying sense
It illustrates the point that people are focusing on the their own interpretation of government advice rather than what it actually says and the real risks.
One trip to Aldi or the corner shop is a thousand times more risky in terms of communicating a virus than a 1000 LOCAL trips in the car.
Please show your workings.
Ticked all the boxes. From the door, under an hour, didn’t get close to anyone, touch anything but my bars.
OK guilty, that statistic was plucked from the ether. But the point stands. Doing things that are permitted under the government advice (shopping) are much more risky that those which are not explicitly covered (driving to exercise). Use your common sense people and don't vilify those who do the same.
Nothing like a limit on leaving the house to make people want to leave the house more…
Certainly feels like that in our village, very few diversions for our toddler now except the local duck pond, which is now heaving with other walkers and joggers!
Doesn't help that one of the other local 'estates' has now banned access, citing safety of their workers, and in apparent cahoots with Edinburgh City Council. The fact that a lot of their estate signage is already tantamount to a breach of Scottish Access law (they use the rearing of pheasants as a 'wildlife conservation' argument to keep people to the tarmac...) makes me suspect opportunism. Good way to condensd all the proles onto the one cycle path skirting the estate!
I’m not being selfish
To be clear nwither am I, I've only used my car for the weekly shop in the last week or so...oh and an emergency food drop for two isolating relatives. But I had to drive into London for that and it made me realise for some a simple ride from the door or walk or run must be fraught with risk, given the concentration of people so its a bit, cant think of right word the word, harsh maybe to criticise those who want to find a bit of space too.
You'd do better pouring your righteous opprobrium on smokers and the fat who, as a result of their lifestyle choices, place huge strain on the NHS not just now but all the time. Just sayin,' like.
trail_rat
Local shops for local people mostly
Unfortunately not around here. My local town 5 miles away, the shops are struggling to supply everyone. So, if I continue to limit myself to one shop visit per week then I need to go to the "local" Tesco in Catterick 10 miles away, if I am to get everything I need for the week in one shopping trip. I usually shop from Tesco anyway as I dislike shopping and can get everything there I need. For the same reason I also usually shop online and have it delivered. Delivery slots are now fully booked up for a few weeks ahead and Tesco have sent an email asking me to shop in store if possible and leave delivery slots for the vulnerable.
Fair enough, but now, if I want to continue to limit myself to one shoppping trip per week following the guidelines then I have to go to Tesco in person. Now, my "local" tesco services an area probably 50 miles radius. Taking in otherwise geographically isolated valleys and dales in North Yorkshire and some larger towns further afield as far as Co. Durham not to mention the army base it is situated in. I will be going and I will be wearing a mask and gloves but it kind of puts things in a different perspective to the odd trail ride...Oh, and I will be driving to get there.
Damn! I swore I wouldn't get involved in this thread but here I am. Time to bow out I think.
UK cyclists warned to follow guidelines or 'lose privilege'
Cyclists in the UK have been warned not to continue riding in groups this weekend - or face having the right to get on their bikes taken away from them.
Pictures showed people across parts of the UK, including many cyclists, visiting parks and open spaces in large numbers last weekend.
"People on bikes were not the only culprits in last weekend's mass dash to the outdoors but, despite strong guidance from ourselves and others, too many chose to ignore the prime minister's instructions on social distancing, continuing to ride in groups and meet in cafes for a mid-ride chat," says British Cycling chief executive Julie Harrington.
"This isn't just irresponsible, it is putting people's lives at risk.
"A repeat of that this weekend risks further Government measures to take away the privilege of riding a bike for all of us and now more than ever, it is not one we can afford to lose."
Cyclists meaning road gravel yeah?
I'll just say one more thing. I do believe a full lockdown is the only way we are going to really slow this thing down and I think it will be the logical next step. Iwill obey it. I will miss riding outdoors. I will cope. I hope others can to.
I have a 4 year old who loves walking and scrambling on rocks. We usually drive a couple of miles to walk on the moors - on paths that are deserted. He can’t walk 2 miles each way just to get there so we’re limited to walking on roads near the house where we pass loads of oldies.
Getting in the car would 100% reduce our chance of passing anything on. We haven’t done for the reasons posted but it feels silly. The irony is that I live right on the edge of the peak and can ride my Mtb there quite happily but with a 4 yo it seems limiting. I can only imagine how it would fee for people living in inner cities or those with poor mobility.
In the yocality here most folk heading out for a road ride after 2000hrs.
In the yocality here most folk heading out for a road ride after 2000hrs.
Yep. My one piece of (outside the house) exercise today was walking the dog in our remote rural village after dark. Only out for 20 mins, cyclists bombing around in the dark was double figures. Never seen a single one before.
It's not just about transmission is it (although I assume all these people who say they drive somewhere and go for a walk/ride without seeing anyone or touching anything have to put fuel in the car at some point).
Breakdown guy called into the radio this week, had 20 jobs that day, he asked all of them what their essential journey was - only one was a key worker/essential.
Deputy Chief Constable Sara Glen, said it was not illegal to drive somewhere for a walk.
Didn't think so and it explains the complete vagueness of the Government's statements. That doesn't mean it's necessarily responsible to travel to your favourite riding hotspot and hopefully people don't the piss so that further liberties are not taken away.
Sorry if been covered but if a key worker cycles to work and back are they still allowed to go out a run after?
Sorry if been covered but if a key worker cycles to work and back are they still allowed to go out a run after?
Technically you could probably justify it, but is it really necessary during a global pandemic? Do you need more exercise than the commute gives you?
Sorry if been covered but if a key worker cycles to work and back are they still allowed to go out a run after?
I despair with the level of me me me on here. stay at home is the advice, stop looking for loopholes or ROI rules will apply very soon https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/0327/1126911-ireland-restrictions-covid19/
Taoiseach Leo Varadkar has said that from midnight tonight and for a two-week period, until Easter Sunday, everybody must stay at home, in all circumstances:
Except
- To travel to and from work for the purposes of work only where the work is an essential health, social care or other essential service or cannot be done from home (a list of these will be provided)
- To shop for food or household goods or collect a meal
- To attend medical appointments or collect medicines and other health products
- For vital family reasons, such as providing care to children, elderly or vulnerable people
- To take brief individual personal exercise within 2km of your own home
Think I'll be getting a ride in tomorrow before cycling is forbidden.
It's a shame so many are hard of thinking
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Simple enough message..
Yet confusing...
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/mar/27/police-acknowledge-confusion-over-uk-lockdown-rules
For some time we've been told no unnecessary travel, then essential travel only. I love MTB but it can wait while we are in this pandemic.
For the hard of thinking:
- if you're certain it's ok to drive and then walk/exercise/cycle, go ahead and accept the consequences.... for you and the possible impact on the wider population.
- if you're unsure whether or not it's ok, err on the side of caution and don't.
It won't take much more half-witted behaviour to result in an enforced lockdown
The stuff I have read online this evening boggles my mind. If you're asking the question about travelling to ride then likely in the back of your mind you know the answer. Don't do it! I really don't get why people find this so complicated. If you can't miss a few weeks riding so a virus that has pretty much wiped Italy out can stop spreading then you're an absolute fool. If you think you're special and "oh its only me it wont matter" well don't moan next week when cycling is banned full stop. Also one more thing if they ban cycling think about that dr or nurse who needs their bike to get to work because they don't want to get public transport and get sick.
Seriously folks, you can argue about the minutiae and the loopholes but really, it’s not difficult.
Don’t make unnecessary journeys to exercise. I know the best trails are an hour away but right now, that’s not important.
Run/walk/cycle/whatever from your door. Or get on the turbo in the spare room.
Stay local, stay distant, stay safe.
And if we do this, we might, but only might, get away without a proper lockdown.
But if you’re a prat, we’ll get what we deserve. And you won’t get a bike ride in the hills for 3 months.
I went out on my bike at 20:00 down the TPT and it was dead. This will be my routine for the next few weeks. I refuse to get caught up with the bank holiday type cyclists who are inflicting themselves on the local area.
I understand and respect the different viewpoints on this. But that's all they are in the absence of absolute instruction, even the police don't agree on it; some say it's OK to take a short drive to get away from the crowds, others say you can't.
I live on a housing estate with ca 10,000 inhabitants, it's a mile walk to get to the edge of the houses and a green space and to do that I walk past large numbers of houses and other people, many of whom are also on the same green space as me. Or, I can get in the car and drive 2.5 miles to a massive open space where I can walk the dog and not come within 50m of anyone else, no gates to infect, etc. No amount of common sense says to me that the former is safer. If there's a clear instruction not to, I'll obey it but until then I'll use my own risk based judgement.
If you can’t miss a few weeks riding so a virus that has pretty much wiped Italy out
Oh please..... no-one's making out this isn't serious but 'wiped Italy out'? Each death is a tragedy in it's own right, but when you illustrate your points with such hyperbole they lose their effect.
Another question while at it, to those that say we should stay in and ride turbos because taking any risk of crashing a real bike, or an unnecessary car journey creates is a risk too much.
I assume you're all sticking to Z2 work then? I mean, to be bouncing your heart rate off the rev limiter chasing a virtual KOM or taking part in a Zwift race would be hypocritical and unnecessarily risky wouldn't it?
then I’ll use my own risk based judgement.
How good is your judgement of the risk? Do you actually understand it?
2.5mi is, to be fair, sod all, you could walk that with no need to be in the car at all [which would rather kill two birds wouldn't it, you could simply not get in the car and walk to the same place thus getting your exercise and solving the issue of travel] but that aside to address the more general issue:
Your estate has a fixed population of 10k. Of that 10k some will be immune, most will catch it, some will be asymptomatic, a number will need treatment, a small number will need intensive treatment and a smaller number will die. Around 1%, your local hospital can deal with those numbers.
The virus is very infectious, if you have it the likelihood is so does at least 1 other person in that 10k so no matter how many of that 10k you - 0 or all of them) infect the same 100 to 400 people end up dead. The numbers don't change.
If you, or anyone else (because you think 2.5mi, John next door thinks the same but in the opposite direction, Alice down stairs thinks 10mi and so on) infects the next housing estate of 10k is not 100 its 200 dead and 1000 needing icu which actually means 800 dead because you're now into numbers your hospital can't cope with.
The next estate passes it to the next and so on.
It's not you.
It's not 1 person passing it to one person, it's one person passing it to thousands through what they thought were benign actions.
You've a ten thousandth* of a percentage chance of passing it to someone by wandering around a field where you didn't happen to pass someone though other people do go through the day but, once they have it likelihood is so do 10k more people on their estate, or the whole population of Birmingham or what ever so yeah you've about a 1:1mil chance of killing an extra 400 people by going a bit further vs staying local and definitely not killing any extra and your risk assessment is its fine.
Your risk assessment is, frankly, rubbish if it says the riskier course of action for zero gain is better.
*possibly more, possibly less, I've no clue but then again, nor do you.
I get what you're saying that if my 10,000 community only mixes with the same 10K community then at worst there's only 10K people who can get it but you know that isn't practical. People are still travelling to work, shops, and so on, and in any case this is already so widespread that the idea of keeping it from spreading to other communities is now irrelevant because they already have if for themselves anyway.
The idea of preventing transfer is great if it can be accomplished but that boat sailed weeks ago.
Poorly designed estate.
Change your outdoor times to avoid others.
If you have a garden, use it.
Rule 1 always applies; don't be a dick.
If you, or anyone else (because you think 2.5mi, John next door thinks the same but in the opposite direction, Alice down stairs thinks 10mi and so on) infects the next housing estate of 10k is not 100 its 200 dead and 1000 needing icu which actually means 800 dead because you’re now into numbers your hospital can’t cope with.
Great example but high unlikely. The second estate of 10K already has it. That 10K estate will have been mixing with loads of people outside of the estate over the last 3 months.
By everybody staying indoors nobody else within the estate will get it who hasn't already got it/had it. Driving or walking through that estate where everybody is sat indoors will not spread it to a single extra person.
I assume you’re all sticking to Z2 work then? I mean, to be bouncing your heart rate off the rev limiter chasing a virtual KOM or taking part in a Zwift race would be hypocritical and unnecessarily risky wouldn’t it?
I was thinking that as I was pushingvquite hard on zwift....i might back off a bit.
Poorly designed estate
Not a lot I can do to change that.
Change your outdoor times to avoid others.
I do, but still doesn't avoid the others and the need to access the open space down one of two footpaths. I can reduce exposure to others but by going a short distance in my car I'm able to avoid others completely.
If you have a garden, use it.
We do. We've cut the dog down in # and duration of walks and try to burn her out playing fetch in the garden as well, and if we were banned completely we'd have to make do. That's the one aspect where if pushed I'd consider if a walk in the outdoors to decompress and get away from these four walls is really necessary.
Rule 1 always applies; don’t be a dick
I agree. I don't think I am being a dick....but if you do then the accusation is about going out at all and as admitted in (3) I can question if that is truly necessary. Not about my choice once I've decided to go out.
FFS.
Just exercise from your house, avoid any narrow lanes and you can keep distance. You are not a special case.
By using your car you are lifting the potential of spreading the virus/interaction with others. Breakdowns/accident/refueling!
Just got back from my usual Saturday ride.
Number of cars about seemed same as usual (presumably they were all making essential journeys)
Number of cars parked on dog walking areas seemed same as usual (non essential journey)
Number of cyclists was way higher. I typically seen no cyclists at all at 7 in the morning but today saw 10, all solo apart from 2 riding along together so assume they were living in same house.
The cars that passed me still passed too close so no chance of social distancing having any positive consequences there...
On the principle of locked down kids exercise, Zwift do child accounts, my boy is loving a bit of Zwift currently. They don’t have to “train” although he did do a ramp test and gained an ftp of 91w, but he lives the “game” aspect of riding his bike for a bit.
https://support.zwift.com/contact/consent-contact-form-H1N_ZWCmV
Now, I can’t be bothered to read through 26 pages but is the consensus that for me a 1 hour solo ride to the forest, a few trails and home again is ok?
I think the words of Harry Day apply here:
"Rules are for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men"
but is the consensus that for me a 1 hour solo ride to the forest, a few trails and home again is ok?
For now, I’d say yes. It’s what I’m doing.
I was thinking that as I was pushingvquite hard on zwift….i might back off a bit.
The UCI sent out a release thing yesterday which included some quite interesting stuff on training intensity and the virus that's aimed primarily at pro riders, but has a wider relevance too. Hang on...
https://mailchi.mp/uci/uci-newsletter-special-edition-coronavirus-2-march-2020-ja61fseeyi
This is the relevant bit:
Physical training while minimising the susceptibility to infection
The effectiveness of the immune system against viruses is significantly affected after high intensity training sessions, in comparison to a normal training programme.
The training programme should be revised downwards, with a reduction in the workload of approximately 10-15%. As the workload depends on the intensity and duration of the exercises, the main emphasis will be on reducing the duration of the sessions, keeping the same intensity (above all without increasing it). For more specific, intense and relatively short sessions (HIIT - High Intensity Interval Training), the intensity of each exercise will be reduced by 10-15%.
In this period of emergency services overload in hospitals, and the risk of infection in healthcare facilities, prevention of the risk of crash is fundamental. Therefore in countries where confinement is not compulsory or for riders who are not self-isolated, training at home is highly recommended.
Appropriate nutrition to maintain an effective immune system
The composition of the diet and timing of food intake may also help provide protection against infections. The most effective nutritional strategies to maintain robust immune function during physical training are to ingest carbohydrate during exercise, protein after training sessions, and avoid deficiencies of essential micronutrients.
Carbohydrate ingestion (~30-60 g/h) during prolonged training sessions reduces the impact of metabolic stress on several aspects of immune function. During periods at risk of infection, training sessions performed in a fasting or with low-glycogen stores and without carbohydrate ingestion during exercise should be avoided.
Regular protein ingestion in meals throughout the day (~1.2-1.6 g/kg.day) and adequate protein intake soon after training sessions (~20-30 g) is required to attenuate some aspects of post-exercise immune depression and maintain normal immune function.
Given the potential role of vitamin D in regulating immune responses, monitoring the vitamin D status is important for athletes.
Consider including a variety of fruits and vegetables in your regular diet. Red fruits and vegetables (tomatoes, strawberries, cherries, pink grapefruit, etc.), greens (broccoli, cabbage, etc.), purple and blue fruits and vegetables (grapes, blackcurrants, plums, eggplants, etc.), yellow fruits and vegetables (apricots, pineapple, mango, grapefruit, peppers, etc.) are excellent vectors of antioxidant micronutrients such as vitamins A, C and E.
Does sportswear help spread the virus?
The risk of transmitting the new coronavirus from surfaces like clothing is a matter of debate. There is no direct measure of the stability of the new coronavirus on clothing. However, it seems that enveloped viruses, like the new coronavirus, are less stable on porous surfaces like cloth than on non-porous surfaces like plastic, paper and metals.
However, it is advisable to disinfect the clothes used during training, wash them in hot water and use a tumble dryer at high temperature.
Prevent the risk of viral myocarditis
Elite athletes may have an increased risk for viral infection and subsequent myocarditis. In athletes affected by myocarditis, the systemic inflammatory response is associated with an increased risk of sudden cardiac death.
The first step in preventing the risk of viral myocarditis in athlete is to abstain from intense training sessions in the event of fever, or within 8 days following a flu (fever, chills, myalgia, rhinitis, etc.). In the event of any suspected clinical sign of Covid-19 (i.e. fever, fatigue, dry cough), rest is absolutely imperative, and any intense physical exercise is strictly discouraged.
In other news, the way social distancing works isn't binary. It assumes human fallibility. Bashing other people over relatively minor risks just increases stress. We need to be looking after each other and being a little more kind.
the idea of keeping it from spreading to other communities is now irrelevant because they already have if for themselves anyway.
By that logic lets just sack of the lockdown treat every day like a bank holiday and open all the pubs again. How about not making it worse. Limit the spread.
Don't be a dick about it can also be applied to those that are given some rules and take them to the most extreme. The kind of people that should never be given a yellow tabard.
Exercise on your own or with someone from your house hold once per day.
Only make essential journeys.
Both are open to interpretation and left deliberately so.
The ideas is to flaten the curve, not totally stop the spread. If you think this is just three weeks isolation, Think again. No way its going to be relaxed before easter weekend!
Everyone needs to understand they are going to get this at some point. If not now, probably in 18 months time.
Reducing movement, reduces speed of spread. This helps NHS with overload issues.
If you lock people down too tightly then what seens novel at the moment will seriously effect people in the long run. People will start to rebel as time goes by. That's why its left to be open to interpretation to a certain extent. If you come down too militant then it will become harder to enforce. Its in peoples nature to rebel, the Gov and its advisors seem to understand this.
All those people at home doing diy and gardening is going to cause a massive strain on A & E due to DIY and Gardening injuries.
The current view by government is that people should exercise locally but dosent define local. It also says driving to exercise should be avoided when unnecessariry, once again deliberately not saying you cant.
Say change your exercise times to avoid doing it when most people are around is aa silly thing to say. You are talking to one person, if they change their time then 100's of others are still doing it at the same time.
Exercise is essential for mental wellbeing, not spreading this virus is essential. If you live in a densely populated area find somewhere quiet to exercise. If you need to drive a short distance to do that in your local area, then do it. Gov are not saying you cant.
By the way i live on the edge of a small town and can ride along the old railway track into the hills for an 1-2 hour ride. Not driven since this started as i can exercise safely without risk of exposure to the virus. But i know some people are not as lucky as me.
The idea of preventing transfer is great if it can be accomplished but that boat sailed weeks ago.
Jeez. So let's all go back to normal and watch the health services self-implode and say our goodbyes to our vulnerable wives, parents, children, grandparents then, shall we? My wife, mum, step-dad and dad are all in vulnerable group.
The radio is full of it this morning. The message is 100% clear.
Rubbish.
There is still a need to avoid transmission, whether within areas or outside of areas. By social distancing. Your argument was against spreading to new areas (transfer); my argument is to minimise the risk of transmission by staying away from others. Pretending we can minimise the spread because this is limited to certain pockets is pointless now.
If you lock people down too tightly then what seens novel at the moment will seriously effect people in the long run. People will start to rebel as time goes by. That’s why its left to be open to interpretation to a certain extent. If you come down too militant then it will become harder to enforce. Its in peoples nature to rebel, the Gov and its advisors seem to understand this.
The modelling factors this is. It doesn't assume absolute compliance because we're human. It doesn't aim to completely stop the spread of the virus, it can't. It aims to slow it and prevent our health service from being overwhelmed. Short of living in an absolutist police state like STW, there will never be absolute compliance. but the good news is that there doesn't need to be.
The other side of this is that chewing lumps off each other for notional transgressions that in the big picture will have a microscopic impact just ends up making people more frightened and more stressed. We should be looking after each other, not going full-on chimp whenever someone says something that we have an issue with.
Like I said a while back, I don't think anyone on here is advocating bad stuff like group rides or travelling to national parks or skipping around holding hands with strangers or going to football matches, holding corona cocktail parties etc, but people are reacting as if that's what's being suggested.
Pretending we can minimise the spread because this is limited to certain pockets is pointless now.
Please ignore @theotherjonv and listen to the experts everybody.
But i know some people are not as lucky as me.
That sort of insight appears rare on stw!
I pity the ****ers stuck in the middle of a city in a bedsit. The stw advice of exercising in the garden or set up a turbo in the spare room/garage is great if you have those things.
I wont criticise those driving a few miles to find some space.
Edit: Actually **** it cba arguing with people who have it so engrained that it's a contravention of their human rights.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/coronavirus-guidance-on-access-to-green-spaces
Unfortunately, I'm expecting a steady flow of traffic through the village again like last weekend. Families deciding to jump in the car and drive to White Horse Hill for a day out. NT have shut the car parks now, hopefully that will put people off.
Yep me too. I'm out.
Why do the ones wanting instruction need instruction ...surley you know with common sense what is best...very very scary that you cant work it out
If you where not told stealing is wrong would you then steal etc....
Going to villages is simple, they might not have any cv present..you might..so dont take it there...
If they dont leave and you dont go it wont spread...or am i the daft one
People are still travelling to work, shops, and so on, and in any case this is already so widespread that the idea of keeping it from spreading to other communities is now irrelevant because they already have if for themselves anyway.
That's pretty shortsighted. Travelling will re-introduce the virus to places where it has been and is being irradicated.
Imagine if you had the virus but quarantined at home. Maybe one other family member gets it but another doesn't. After a couple of weeks would you want footfall from all over the country through your kitchen? Would that not put the non-immune family member at risk?
See Viral loading also...
We should be looking after each other, not going full-on chimp whenever someone says something that we have an issue with.
Like I said a while back, I don’t think anyone on here is advocating bad stuff like group rides or travelling to national parks or skipping around holding hands with strangers or going to football matches, holding corona cocktail parties etc, but people are reacting as if that’s what’s being suggested
Careful now, common sense can not be applied in any CoronaVirus discussion.
These discussions do tend to bring out the fringe lunatics, who are excelling themselves, even by STW’s standards.
If they dont leave and you dont go it wont spread…or am i the daft one
No. You’ve got it bang on.
Don’t be a spreader.
Spot on Hob Nob, I know some people haven't got any but just use your common sense.
I saw a really good post (possibly earlier in this thread) that said deep down people know if what they are doing is wrong or not so just go with that feeling, you know if you're taking the piss or not 😉
Just don't come on here asking other people if what you are doing is ok as there are a load of poisonous nobheads that'll grind you down if you're not careful!
Just got back from a 20 mile loop around the FofD without going more than a few miles from my house - amazingly quiet in the woods, just one or two regulars walking their dogs.
Surely we haven’t learnt to behave ourselves? Don’t let me down Britain - I expect the worst!
These discussions do tend to bring out the fringe lunatics, who are excelling themselves, even by STW’s standards.
Does feel that way, even forumites who I've known on here for years. Turns out Yoda was right - fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering.
The ones managing to get outside to exercise without being a dick seem to be in a much better state than those shouting them down.
Sorry if been covered but if a key worker cycles to work and back are they still allowed to go out a run after?
Technically yes but if you use common sense it's better to not do so on commuting days.
I cycle to work as much as possible, this week I've limited myself to that on working days. Reason being that with everyone else going out for their daily exercise seems to head out either early or late so rather than add to the space issue I'll extend my commute home an extra mile or two on the quiet roads in the city, leave the open spaces for the poor sods who've been stuck indoors all day. Days off I can head out during the quiet times, basically when everyone's at the supermarket.
Same rules I've used for the gym for the last few years: avoid the peak times.
I'm not re-reading 25 pages to check, but I don't think anyone has mentioned Purity Spirals, which is what seems to be going with some posters here.
A purity spiral occurs when a community becomes fixated on implementing a single value that has no upper limit, and no single agreed interpretation. The result is a moral feeding frenzy.
No matter what you do somebody will always denounce you, tell you you're not doing enough. They'll interpret something in a particular way and tell others they are evil if they don't agree.
This article is about knitting - yes knitting - but it's interesting as it shows what happens when people try to be purer than everyone else.
https://unherd.com/2020/01/cast-out-how-knitting-fell-into-a-purity-spiral/
Go on, read it - you've nothing better to do at the moment 🙂
That put me right off knitting 🙁
fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering.
Man, if only you'd have set that to a rap.
Then you only leave space to discriminate
And to discriminate only generates hate
And when you hate then you're bound to get irate, yeah
Madness is what you demonstrate
And that's exactly how anger works and operates
Man, you gotta have love just to set it straight
Take control of your mind and meditate
Let your soul gravitate to the love, y'all
, y'all
Never heard of Purity Spirals, but have heard Knit and Natter groups referred to as Stitch and Bitch 😄🤣
The banner on the forum from STW Towers captures it best.
No Car, No Gnar, Not Far.
Some comments here won't look very clever when death rates are over 500 a day.
Some comments here won’t look very clever when death rates are over 500 a day.
And that'll be one of them.