What is with the idea of having a Le Mans style running start to the start of a Mountain Bike race?
I get the idea to spread out the field before first bit of singletrack. But is it just me that thinks it's a daft idea? You wouldn't expect runners to do a short bike ride before competing in the marathon?
I've only ever done one race that did this, the old Enduro 6 at Trentham Gardens, and the first couple of laps my legs felt awful after the run.
I see from the video in the 'Puffer 2023 thread that they have a running start and I was thinking of doing Mountain Mayhem if it goes ahead this year, but I understand that they do the Le Mans start which just puts me off.
For contrast i've done the last couple of Chiller 24 hour races and they start on the bike.
Is there any other races that still do running start?
you should try SSUK starts les mans start with the added benefit all the bikes have been hidden/moved
Probably a few and it is a good way to start spreading out the field...did MegaAvalanche not used to start like that many years ago? Ten Under used to do that as well...I don't see the issue with it myself, but my running ability is much like my biking ability - I get there but I'm fighting for last place!
added benefit all the bikes have been hidden/moved
Or just thrown into a huge pile. Didn't one International race get decided by a go-cart race?
Surely it's just for fun / the spectacle of it - you're making it sound like a 5k or something prior to getting on your bike. Will have zero impact on the actual race, nothing to worry about at all.
But is it just me that thinks it’s a daft idea?
What other solution would you have?
You wouldn’t expect runners to do a short bike ride before competing in the marathon?
But they're generally on a big wide road so no bottleneck to sort out.
I always just walked the run, meant I could just get on with the lap when I got to my bike and not have to worry about loads of people trying to barge me out of the way 🙂
I’ve only ever done one race that did this, the old Enduro 6 at Trentham Gardens, and the first couple of laps my legs felt awful after the run.
It was hardly a run, was it? Maybe 150-200m. If your legs were shagged after that then the next 6 hours can't have been good.
Yeah, the single speed starts. Not only are the bikes moved, put in a pile, you're drunk as well 😁
It's of zero impact if you can run ok.
Not sure of the actual distances to run, I'd
guess about 300 to 600 metres for the one i did (could have been much more or less, was a long time ago), but as a someone who gets a lot of pain from running, it does have an effect on the actual bike race. To the extent that I never went back to do the Enduro 6 race again.
Other solutions could be a longer opening section to spread field out before first singletrack if course allows it.
You'd seriously not enter a 24hr race because you don't like the first 60 seconds?
Possibly would for the 24hr race, but probably wouldn't for something like a 6 or 8 hour race.
Yes, it's only a short time running, but it's painful and takes a while to recover from it.
Dangerously close to triathlon imo. It's a slippery slope for some of those keen XC racers.
We once had a singlespeed team at Mayhem and no one wanted to do the run at the start.
We found the best solution was to get another mate that wasn't in the team to do it for us. 🤣
I did the puffer solo a good few years ago. It was clear I would run out of miles in my legs before I ran out of time. I sauntered the "run" and was last to leave the arena
Given the layout of the puffer I see no other way of spreading the field out and its needed to spread it out. Unless you split the solos, pair and fours out and the trophy hunters for the fun riders and have staggered starts
In a 24 hr race the few minutes that the run takes is irrelevant IMO
you should try SSUK starts les mans start with the added benefit all the bikes have been hidden/moved
Top tip: pre-hide your bike so that the folks who're doing the hiding/moving of bikes think it's already been hidden, but you know EXACTLY where you hid it. Worked for me in Ireland 🤣
Other than those actually racing for a position other than 4th, who runs at the start of singlespeed 'races'? I ran one year, I think my logic was it'd get me to the refreshment stop sooner.
"Yes, it’s only a short time running, but it’s painful and takes a while to recover from it."
You don't have to run it.
When i did 24hr races as a team, our first rider actually ran it properly, but their first lap would only be 40 mins or something so it didn't really matter.
When i did them solo, i walked, as did most soloists.
The ones i did, the run was never more than a few hundred metres, totally trivial in the context of a 24h race.
If you really want to run it, but don't want it to be painful, then maybe practice running.
But is it just me that thinks it’s a daft idea?
Yes! I think its a good spectacle, helps split the field up for safety before the technical bits (you could do the same with a big wide long flat straight on the bike but it would still exhaust the legs of anyone who thought first to get around the first corner was the winner). Possibly gives fit fast people more of a chance to get ahead early than some sort of ranking based on past performances and lets wise old people who are just for fun keep out the mess but use experience to work their way forward.
Dangerously close to triathlon imo.
Only if there's a deep puddle on the way to the start!
Only if there’s a deep puddle on the way to the start!
Race organisers, take note.
sounds like the puffer this year may have a bog snorkelling section
Dangerously close to triathlon imo. It’s a slippery slope for some of those keen XC racers.
And we all know that XC racers don't like slippery slopes.
the puffers a couple hundred meters .....
its further to the fridge at work.
Mayhem i dont recall the run start at all.
10 under wasnt far either
IROC was horrible - fell run loop before the 4 hour bike.
It was hardly a run, was it? Maybe 150-200m. If your legs were shagged after that then the next 6 hours can’t have been good.
You do know that running and cycling are two different sports?
At least there's a chance that cyclists are fit from all the cycling they do. What about Le Mans car racing drivers? They're probably properly unfit from driving everywhere, so the run at the beginning must be even worse for them.
What about Le Mans car racing drivers? They’re probably properly unfit from driving everywhere, so the run at the beginning must be even worse for them.
Yeah, I suppose that's why they scrapped it.
It was hardly a run, was it? Maybe 150-200m. If your legs were shagged after that then the next 6 hours can’t have been good.
You do know that running and cycling are two different sports?
Yeeesssss. I was there, fit enough to do a 6 hour race and I also grumbled about having to run to my bike. But, as I say, it didn't exactly need running shoes or running fitness because it was very short. Few people sprinted to the bikes because there was a 6 hour race about to happen that would sort out the actual placings, not the 40 second amble to the bikes. 😀
I remember that first Enduro 6 distinctly because I was going well and finished a couple of places outside the prizes, which were very generous. I returned the following year with added fitness, a steely attitude and a better riding strategy so that I could finish with a prize. Unfortunately, I failed to notice that there was a new pairs category, and so when they started passing me I didn't know that I was chasing down completely fresh riders. I blew up after about 3 hours and went back to my pit for a long sleep. No prizes were handed my way. 🙁
I “ competed” in the 2012 WORLD 🤔 Chainless Championship in Crested Butte , that had a Le Mans start . Bloke in a white boiler suit started us by throwing a hard hat in the air , when it landed it was every person for themselves . It was difficult concentrating because as you were expected to be in fancy dress I bought a Winnie The Pooh bean bag for $5 from a thrift store gutted the stuffing and wore that and the eye holes didn’t quite line up 😬While this was happening Welcome To The Jungle was blasting out of the PA system ! 😎
I kept thinking “ I’ll wake up in a minute “ ! as I was riding down the course to shouts of “ Go Winnie” from the crowd 😬
I watched a Brompton crit race on the TV a little while back. Not only did they have to run to the bikes, they had to then assemble them. And wear a suit.
Jump to about 2 mins for the best race start going...
Back in the day a mate of mine who just happened to be a very handy fell runner did a couple of mountain mayhems.
He would be leading after the initial run and then cause mayhem as he was so slow on the bike. He did 1 race a Eastnor Castle and 1 at the royal place. He ran round both courses before the races and ran both faster than most could ride round
I love a running start.
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https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Y6vikUnOgz4
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24hr World Champs, 2017, Finale Ligure
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That's me in the blue and green XCRacer kit. Running in riding shoes makes me look quite camp 🤣 However, I did stay ahead of a seven times world champion, it's really only on the bike he has the advantage (I was on a singlespeed but he would have beaten me anyway)
Only entered two race, Bristol Oktoberfest years back. Both times it was a le-mans start. Thought it was a good idea to spread the field out.
Was funny though as the wannabe quick guys dropped their bikes right at the front of the start. I had mine near the back so I got to my bike before them and cycled past them when they were getting on.
Some people took it far to seriously, especially as there was an option of cider half way round if memory serves.
The glentress seven approach always seemed to work as far as spreading out the traffic- first lap is a horrible climb up a fireroad to the top of the singletrack descent, then the hardest part of the course is literally the first bit of offroad you do, so first the climb strings everyone out and then the descent kills the weak. First lap's main descent is still trafickey but it's way more spread out than at other similar events I've done. 10UTB first lap was just shite frankly.
But I do quite like the absolute chaos of a le mans start.
It's disgusting and purely a way to humiliate fat people.
Add in a slippy, steep hill and it's basically abuse.
Mr Sparkle may have a video to illustrate my point.
Only slightly sketchy part of the Puffer start is when it's icy. Great way to banjo yourself before even getting on the bike.
I quite enjoy the Puffer start, run along the verge to find some grip. Then beast up the first climb to clear the traffic 👍
Looking at this I think they're missing a trick with MacAvalanche, should go further up, sprint start then bumboards down to the bikes.
I seem to recall doing the start at Mountain Mayhem for the team and the worst thing about the run was having to do it in disco slippers, as we all wore back then. I still made it ok though. Quite good fun as I remember.
I was there, fit enough to do a 6 hour race and I also grumbled about having to run to my bike.
I was, very much past tense, fit enough to get on the podium in XCO and XCM (and into the final mix in E,1 roadie stuff), running for 100m would have left me hobbling like an old man and wheezing like the asthmatic that i am...
Or i could walk and spend the first two laps getting held up... hardly a good way to sort traffic out!
Or i could walk and spend the first two laps getting held up… hardly a good way to sort traffic out!
Oh I absolutely agree about that.
I remember posing the idea of if they ever reused the LeMans start for HtN to Jase and Andy, with the variation of 'whoever gets to the bikes first gets to choose !'
😀
so the question is do you risk something flash that might not fit you or wrong pedals.. or get your own... or get something crap for a laugh...
It is fun.
Eldest_oab's bike is seen being hidden at the start....
[double post]
I love the SSUK starts:
Serious riders sprint off
Everyone else is passing a hipflask around.
Serious drinkers riding off in the wrong direction to find a pub.
Other than those actually racing for a position other than 4th, who runs at the start of singlespeed ‘races’? I ran one year, I think my logic was it’d get me to the refreshment stop sooner.
This is then scuppered when the organizers don't open the beer on the first lap, what's that all about!
I was, very much past tense, fit enough to get on the podium in XCO and XCM (and into the final mix in E,1 roadie stuff), running for 100m would have left me hobbling like an old man and wheezing like the asthmatic that i am…
Even Froome managed to run uphill for a bit without snapping in two so I'm not buying it. Even I've managed to run as SSUK the one year I was feeling fit, and I was drunk and not naturally built for running!
I was told I had to do the first lap of mayhem because I was the youngest in our team. A logically flawed idea as one of the others was a runner who was appalled by my running when he saw the start I got.
so I’m not buying it
*shrugs* Suit yourself. I've been racing bikes since the 80's and stopped running in 91 or 92 after some injuries that haven't gone away. So i don't run, at all. Because it's painful when i do it, then it hurts for ages afterwards.