[Closed] Lapierre Zesty 314 OR Orange 5 pro?

Orange 5, others will argue but IT IS the best all rounder and should last longer no matter how common they've become.

appreciate your advice mate,suppose it don't get such high ratings for nothing! Just isnt as nice looking as the lapierres, I see Orange have not changed anything from the 09 model

They are both very good bikes. Personally i really like the [b]looks[/b] of the lapierre, never ridden one but the spec seems ok. The most important thing is the ride...thats where the Orange is a definite favorite!
I have ridden the orange and they feel fantastic, i think they look nice and ride fantastically (won trail bike of the year for the last 2 years). One of the main things about the Orange is that it's made in the UK, which to me is a big deal when your looking at spending that much money.
The spec on the orange also seems better with hope brakes/hubs and the bolt through forks.

The orange gets my vote! As everyone says, a test ride will give you the best idea. If thats not an option go with the Orange, you won't be disappointed!

Hugh

I sell both. have ridden both.

i own a zesty.

the only other 5 inch bike i would buy is a 575.

the orange doesnt appear on my list at all really.

Hugh do you own an orange five? nice post mate 🙂

Markd, whats your zesty like to ride mate, such a tough decision this is, looking to buy in october 🙂

Orange Five.... Just picked up mine and its amazing. It picks up speed like nothing I've ever ridden. Got an SE with V2's and 36's up front.
Absolute dream, you wont be disappointed!

I like the Orange. I don't like the looks of the Yeti. But I was more put off by the hideous Flash website Yeti have. Yuck! 'Our rides' - took me a moment to realize they meant the bikes they make rather than where they rode them.

get a picture up charlie, is it an 09, what did you pay for it mate?

well i am biased. its amazing. got a coil in the rear too. 😀

Tested the Zesty 514 and the Orange 5 Pro. Bought the Orange 5 Pro. Make sure you haggle over the price with your lbs. Mine would not lower the price but after a couple of visits to the shop they did throw in the performance pack, Hope pack, Hope headset and coloured floating rotors for the price of the stock Pro. That is a lot of kit if you look on the Orange website for no extra cost.Really pleased with the bike.

dandan, i don't own one myself but my riding buddy's do! I might have gone for one if i could have afforded it but i went for the commencal as it was a frame i wanted to try for some time and have always liked!
Personally i love my commencal and now wouldn't change it for anything but there not everyones cup of tea!

Out of the two bikes you have listed you can't really fault the orange, from what i have seen they are built to withstand UK riding conditions and built to last! Ok the Lapierre is lovely to look at and from what everyone says it rides well but it's not an Orange, you paying similar money for a Taiwanese made frame with a lower spec if you were to go for the Lapierre.

As i said a test ride is the best way to decide if thats possible, for me it wasn't but i looked over the geometry charts, reviews etc and went for it.

I know it's another minor detail but i suspect the orange will hold it's value better too.

Hugh

Hugh

Dandan, try and get some trials... You mentioned trail centres and scotland, the Hub at Glentress has 5s, ST4s, Zestys of various flavours and at least one Spicy on the test fleet.

I had a go on a Zesty 514, and it was bloody brilliant. I don't like full suss much, personally, but it came closer to converting me than anything I've ever ridden, fantastic machine.

and what pray tell is wrong with being made in Taiwan?

hugh_b said, "you paying similar money for a Taiwanese made frame with a lower spec if you were to go for the Lapierre."

How true is that though? 5 Pro is £2500, same as a Zesty 514, and the spec is very similiar- except that the Zesty comes with better wheels (XT 778 with 15mm front axle, compared to the 5's pretty stingy 317s on Hope 2). It's a £120 upgrade to get up to 819s which are almost comparable with the XTs. The x comes with a Raceface crank as well, nothing against their cranks but the BBs aren't too hot, Zesty comes with XT which realistically is what you'd choose given any choice.

Wanted a Zesty but short legs (32" for 5'11") didn't work too well with LaPierre's high top tube. Got a Cube Fritzz. Unbelievable. So glad I did and it's really light for the travel (don't tell anyone though!).

laughingontheinside ...... what is the name of your lbs that did you that deal?

thanks for all the fantastic information, looks lie the five is the fave

I'd say they're pretty close on how well they ride so for me it would come down to looks and the Orange got hit big time with the fugly stick.

two of my mates now have lapierres (spelling is crap)anyway, they both love them and dont discount the spicy I'm amazed at how well it rides in tight singletrack its super agile. My other mate has the froggy and even it rides great in our local woods and we've also been up to fort bill and its done the downhill there, they really are great bikes.

Although I still love the fact that the oranges are made here. I'm a short arse though and the top tubes are very long, the only one that fits is the 14" and that looks horrible

I'm currently looking for a new bike around the £2k mark & have the Stumpjumper, Zesty and Fuel EX8 in my shortlist.
I was gonna also try & ride an Orange 5 (a mate of mine used to have a Sub 5 that was nice), but the spec on the 5 seems quite steep compared to the other bikes. From memory, the basic 5 is more expensive than the Zesty 314 but the components aren't as good.

Dandan, two different bikes. They'll handle differently. I definitely recommend test riding them both before deciding. Even if it involved a day of driving between shops.

I own a Orange5 frame

All the best. A GREAT Dilemma though.

Cheers everyone 🙂

This is my situation, I need some advice lol, I started riding in january of this year, and straight away fell in love with mountain biking, its on my mind all day everyday.. So anyway in march of this year I went out and bought a brand new 09 stumpjumper fsr comp and I loved it, I went to the peaks the other week and did some really narly rocky down hill stuff and the stumpy (120mm travel) didnt seem to enjoy the rough stuff as much as my mates 140mm bikes, so since then I have convinced myself that I need to buy a 2010 140mm travel bike.

Just because I can afford it (just about, would have to sell my stumpy) ... does it mean that I should sell this virtually brand new bike, to get one of the above?

Sorry for boring you all but this is my dilema.. what do you think guys?

dandan - to be honest, a 140mm bike will be better down something like the peaks but maybe look at a beefier front tyre (if not running one already) and just working on your technique a bit.

I've got a Five and it's a truly magical machine but no bike is a silver bullet and the stumpy is still fairly competent. I think it's the case with most 140mm bikes, to really get the most out of them you need to be fit, strong and fast - the Five will look after cautious riders well enough but it really comes alive when you just try and ride the tits off it! (Of course you might be up to this, I don't know, just don't like seeing riders drop the cash and get nothing back for it, when all that was needed was just more time in the saddle)

Btw, I always cringe at the made in the uk argument for the Orange. Mainly cause there's no real proof that they're any better for it. What is important is Orange's evolutionary approach to bike design and the fact that they absolutely only sell something if they like it, ride it and if it survives*.

(*I'm not sure this applies to the G2/G3s)

Garry good post mate .. cheers

the lapierre is a fun bike, i had a really enjoyable demo on it. went for a 5 though, just such a solid little ripper, esp with a 36 fork up front.
as far as changes from the 09 model go, they have just slightly reworked the angles and tubing for the 09 frame and will of course be speccing 2010 suspension and components.
also fwiw id rather have a set of hope hubs on mavic rims than a set of shimano wheels, regardless of which cost more. aside from the ease of servicing and flexiblity with front and rear axles, hopes customer service and warranty is absolutely second to none. shimano are appaling with warranty issues, though spares are still easy to find.

dandan- Me and my bro recently demo'd orange 5 pro's at afan and we both fell in love. Sublime handling, in my opinion, great looking, and a simple single pivot(less to go wrong). Once i have convinced my wife that £2800 ( performance pack, hope headset coz i heard the standard fsa aint up to much and maxle rear end) is cheap for such a well made bike i shall be running to my lbs to put in an order. My bro, on the other hand is not so convinced by the premium price of said bike and has tracked down a trek ex8 at pedal on for aroud £1500 plus loads of bonus points to spend on goodies. By the way anyone looking for an 08 Focus Northen Lite hardtail? Need to sell it to fund the orange five.

No worries! By all means get some Demos though - it'll be the only way to scratch the itch - you'll either be happy with the stumpy or £2500+ worse off!

(PS, bet you'll buy the Orange ;))

I can't compare them as I have not ridden the 5, although I have recently bought the 160. I tested the Spicy and wouldn't worry about it being too much for the UK. I found it was fine on the climbs and great fun on the descent.

Dandan have a think about the Gary Fisher Roscoe. They are pretty well specced with the Fox double chamber shock, QR15 forks etc. I also rode a Yeti 575 with a set of float 36s on it and it flew downhill. Not cheap though and I would be a wee bit concerned about the carbon stays...

dandan. You have a 09 stumpjumper fsr comp?

I'd invest in longer forks. Thats a bloody good bike to sell soo quickly. I imagine you would have bought it new/full price?

What forks are on there at the moment?

Im NOT a good rider but rode my old Chameleon hardtail down Walna Scar with long travel forks. I know a mate who is currently riding the coast to coast on a hardtail- start/across the Lakes.

I think if you tried longer forks you may be happy. Changing the whole bike for the sake of 2cm's on the rear- potentially upto a grand in cost extra? Try the forks first and a slightly larger rear tyre.

I am off to Glentress for 2 nights on sunday, can you demo fives up there? what is the cost to demo one... just spent an hour cleaning/polishing the stumpy has to be worth £1000 to 🙂 somebody

Ps. In addition to the forks, I'd look at stem length and bar width. This is coming from a reformed-gearqueer as well!

Forks- Change the Fox Float 120 to Pikes or 140 Revelations. You'd notice a big difference.

Can 120 floats be extended to 140? My 140s are now down to 100 and on my singlespeed, but I've always been confused as to whether or not the ones that are 120 out of the factory are the same fork?

I have put a shorter stem on it, feels better... fox float 32 120mm fork on it now i think, may get a pike 🙂

Agree on trying to beef up your stumpy a bit more first.

But if you want a new bike now you may have to take the Orange, since the Lapierres could well be out of stock for some time.

(I'd get a Reign once the 2009 sales start if it was my money though).

"I am off to Glentress for 2 nights on sunday, can you demo fives up there? what is the cost to demo one..."

I think it's £40. But check with the Hub, they'll be able to tell you for sure.

I had a go on somebody's orange 5 at aston hill and loved the ride, but it sounded like somebody hitting a dustbin lid with a wooden spoon every time it hit a bump. The owner said it was caused by the box shaped swing arm.

Is this true or was his one just buggered?

They do sound a bit like throwing a bucket of spanners down the side of a mountain - that said, there's usually so much wind whistling in my ears from speed that I don't tend to hear it 😉

I did follow a mate who also has one and I was on a different bike at the time and remember thinking, holy shit does mine sound like that!?

dandan, honestly try the forks first and possibly a bigger back tyre. I had a stumpy frame- sold it waaaay too quickly and TBH for mere mortals like us alot of the mid-travel frames could be seperated by fag-wrappers unless you are technically gifted.

I have a 2.2 inch tyre up front, 2 inch tyre at the back, s works the captain tyres.. I have changed my 105mm stem to a 75mm stem and the steering is much more responsive, do you think a 2.2 inch rear tyre and a beefier fork is the way forward?

anybody reccommend a fork and cheepest place to buy it?

thanks lads 🙂

It's a lot of money for 20mm of travel which probably won't make that much difference. I rode the peaks for years on a fully rigid bike and learnt a lot. Since moved onto a 4" bike and now a 5" bike. There isn't a huge difference between the 4" and 5" bike, if anything it was probably more fun on the 4" as there are very few trails which warrant that extra inch of travel and the bigger bike is just that little bit heavier.

Personally, I'd keep the Stumpjumper for longer and learn some more skills on it. Then, when you do fancy a new bike, you'll probably have a better idea as to what you want and you'll have developed your own riding style a bit more. You'll also know a bit more knowledge about things like what difference tyres make etc. and what is actually down to the frame.

Your Stumpy is a better bike than either. just get a decent shock for it!

traildog good advice mate... GW I doubt its a better bike than them two really mate! 🙂

why?

it's got a sorted FSR suspension design with a flawless waranty and good geometry (for it's intended use)..

dandan. Yep. Try a non-specialized (sorry not a fan) tyre on the back.

On the fork-front. Im not very good at descending but a bigger fork allows me to plow through more and soak up alot more.

I'd stick something like a 2.35 Blue Groove Stick-e up front - I reckon that'd do more for you than 20mm more travel on the front.

The captains are rubbish tyres btw.

I've got 140mm on the front but if I put my 2.1 High Roller race tyres on and try and do something gnarly, the travel is useless, my 100mm hardtail with big rubber descents better than my Orange with skinny rubber...

If I had the cash (go look, there are some clearance bargains though UK shops at the mo) I'd buy:

Maxle through-axle Revelation 140mm travel. They have the Pikes lowers. You'd probably get 240? for your current forks.

Do it!!!

Dandan, you've already got a brilliant bike.

if it / you doesn't like the rough rocky bits, try some nice big tyres, and run them a bit softer.

(something like a 2.3 minion/highroller/advantage, or Nevegals - other bice big soft comfy tyres are available).

let a bit of wind out of the shocks (front and back)- a lot of people are terrified of 'bottoming out' - you paid for your 120mm travel, use it all! and often!

(does your rear shock have pro-pedal? - use it, it's bloody great for getting you back up the hills on soft shocks)

you say you're new to biking, try flat pedals for a bit more confidence, and ride the fast rocky bits with dropped heels to get more grip/control.

with the £2000 you'll save not buying a new bike, go on lots of biking holidays - spain/alps/Scotland/Wales, and something nice for your mum.

edit - for a bit more 'fun' on the downhill bits, try a shorter stem, something around 50-70mm...?

Pro pedal won't be helpful in descending - it causes the bike to sit up in it's rear travel (and make the front end feel steeper) and kills small bump response...

I think he meant to run the shock nice and soft on the downs and then use pro-pedal to compensate on the ups and flats?

correct.

Gary was a bit keen with his 'you missed a bit' response...

X

thanks so much for all your advice, means a lot!

I went to the peaks with real experienced riders (like yourselves), and they noticed i was not getting anywere near my full travel from my suspension, I weigh 11 stone 7 lbs and they said my forks were rigid lol, I had 100 psi in my forks and 200 psi in my rear shock, they reduced it to 80psi in the forks and 160 in the rear shock and it felt so much better, although I still aint getting full travel from my suspension, (one of the guys said I wont quite get the full travel from my forks).

Do them air pressures sound about right now?

I am thinking of getting new tyres for my trip to scotland now.. shall I put new tyres on front and back?

Anybody got any links to a decent tyre at a good price?

thanks,Danan.

I'm your weight and I run another 10psi less again in my floats...

Sorry ahwiles, I missed the link between your two comments 🙂

Not sure about the rear pressure... on my Five (single pivot) rule of thumb is your body weight in lbs in psi, so 150lbs = 150psi and then tweak from there...

Of course then there's your rebound settings to check - too fast and it could try and buck you off, too slow and it'll pack down and go rigid...

As you can see, there's a lot to check before it's new bike time 🙂

annanotherthing!

use lots of rebound damping - too little rebound damping will let your bike bounce all over the place, it'll feel a bit nervous.

as an experiment, wind the damping all the way out, and take it for a ride. then wind it all the way in, and ride it.

play with your knobs! - see what feels good...

as a guide, set it so the forks/shock make a nice smooth 'schooop' on their way back up from the car-park-test.

(dammit Gary, you're quick! :D)

lol so much to consider, 1 psi per pound of body weight on ther rear shock... what about the fork?

just seen this tyre.. how about putting this up front and putting my current captain 2.2 on the rear wheel, or just buy 2? 🙂

http://www.wiggle.co.uk/p/cycle/7/Kenda_Tomac_Nevegal_Freeride_Tyre/5360028559/

You don't want the freeride 2.35 though...

There's a regular 2.35...

http://www.wiggle.co.uk/p/cycle/7/Kenda_Tomac_Nevegal_Tyre/5360028560/

Fork I run at 70psi...

Ignore the 1psi per body weight thing - that depends on the leverage ratios so is bike specific. You are best to run off sag, which should be about 25%-30% when you just sit on the bike.
If you have money to throw at the problem, the best thing to do would be to send your fork and shock off somewhere like TFTuned and get it tuned to your weight - will make a big difference IMHO. Always good to get a shock serviced and tuned up every so often anyway.

traildog - cheers for that, I may do that mate.

the kenda tomac nevegal get great reviews, would you say to run thease tyres front and back, are they a much better tyre than my s works captains?

Ignore the 1psi per body weight thing

Yeah, I did suspect that this might be something that only works on single pivot non-linkage bikes, or even just the Five...

Get a 2.1 DTC version for the back - they come up massive anyway and the DTC compound is harder in the middle so drags less and lasts longer. The Sticke version (which I linked) should be front only as it won't last two seconds on the rear and will suck all your energy.

www.nextdaytyres.com seem to be cheapest for mail order tyres at the mo. Maxxis Minion DH, Maxxis High Roller and Kenda Nevegal all very highly regarded here as all-round trail tyres. The Minion comes in different tread durometers (ie. stiffness/stickiness), and also a dual ply (ie. double thickness) for extra puncture resistance. I love Minions, have 2.3" "supertacky" dual plys on my downhill/jump/play bike, which weigh about a kilo apiece and drag so much on hard surfaces its like riding with a flat, but give total confidence when it counts. I have 2.3" single-ply 60 durometer minions on my other bike which weigh about 800grms a tyre on my other all-day bike.

Neven ridden nevegals but those that do rave about them as much as I do the minions.

I agree with other respondents you can fine tune your FSR to suit you, and as your riding develops the bike will be good enough to help you improve. Fatter tyres, shorter stem, bigger discs if you get all gnarly downhilltastic, skinny/light tyres, longer stem if you get all-day-epic beardy.

Just ordered my new tyres, Kenda Tomac Nevegal 2.35 up front with the 2.1 DTC version on the rear. Hopefully this will beef my stumpy up a bit more! 😀

I convinced myself I needed a new, full suss bike, as I was slower up and down than my buddies on my hardtail. However, after various bits of advice on here and elsewhere I:
1) Got fitter
2) Went on a skills course
3) Upgraded tyres,forks and got a wider bar

I now still want a new bike, but I am as fast or faster than my riding mates, and have a much clearer idea of what I want my new bike to do better than my old one, and have realised how much difference numbers (1) and (2) above have made to my enjoyment of riding.

I think your current bike should be great, especially with the tweaks advised on here. On the tyres front, my 2.25 Maxxis advantages (come up huge) have made a massive difference to my bike's handling, recommended).

I think it's easy to get sucked in to the bike media short travel/long travel/all mountain/ trail etc bollox, and start questioning if your bike is the weak link in your riding. I know I have been!

Wider bars are next on my list!

Tom when you say that your tyres "come up huge" ... do you mean they are really wide when inflated .. sorry for the dumb question, just dont know what you mean 🙂

tyres that 'come up huge' are bigger when inflated than the stated size on the side.

a 2.1" from company X can be bigger than a 2.3" from Y.

i've just inflated a 2.1" continental. and it's more like a 1.8" - it's tiny!

i'd strongly suggest looking at your stem - anything more than 70mm long could get seriously weird on a long bike like a specialized - even more so when set up with wide handlebars. there's a good chance one of your riding buddies has a differnt / shorter stem you could try - it's a quick job to swap a stem.

Hi, I replaced my 105mm stem, for a nice Easton 75mm stem, feels much better

What a nice thread! 😀

Brilliant thread! 😀 Learnt so much, and have ordered new tyres 😆

As a further comment to Markd's earlier post, I have a 575 and my gf has a Zesty 514. I find the Zesty much more fun and capable on the descents, whereas the 575 excels on the climbs.

I was just thinking what a great thread this is too.

Someone comes on and asks a question....he doesn't get slated or criticised, but gets some great advice & is actually listening to it!

Good work, STW massive!!....I was going to say earlier that it's probably worth spending more time with your current bike & tinkering with it but didn't get round to it....

The suggestion above about rebound damping was spot on. Too little and the bike will kick back (front & rear) and feel skittish. Try a short lap on some local rides and try extremes of rebound as suggested.
Also don't be afraid to fiddle with tyre pressures too.

With the money you've saved, get yourself on a decent skills course. I did one at Llandegla in Jan and it was excellent. Didn't turn me into a downhill god, but has definitely sharpened my skills and made me more confident. It has helped me to get the best from my rides.

stumpy, I agree mate, its brilliant to have so many good people willing to help out and no body has took the piss, so greatful for it.. I have decided that I will be keeping my stumpy now, looking forward to getting my new tyres on, along with my shorter stem I think it should handle better on the rocky/techy decents, I am considering wider bars and also thinking about getting a new fork but not going to rush into it, only had this bike 6 months so need to get to know it more and improve my skill, I am fit and strong but lack confidence and balance. I think this bike of mine is more than enough for me untill the 2011 bikes come out maybe LOL.

Askills course sounds like a brilliant idea, Landegla is my local trail centre (less than an hour drive), any idea of costs? might do one next week.

Look up the Athertons website. I think they run courses.

It's worth doing it with some mates, if you have some that are a similar standard to yourself. It's more fun that way.

I think the one at Llandegla is £90 or thereabouts. Google it and you'll find plenty of info on their website.
Like I said, it's not going to turn you into an extreme downhill racer, but you go back to basics and learn about body position, cornering, berms, bunny hops (proper ones) small jumps etc.

5 of us did it and all found it worthwhile.

As you say too....it's probably best not to change too much in one go. Make a change, see how it affects things and then change something else. I've had my bike since 2002 & am just beginning to think that I need something more up to date.

Thanks stumpy I will make some enquiries mate, Wow you have had your bike for 7 years ay.. any pictures? such a nice thought that you have been happy with your bike for 7 years mate, heres me been riding 5 mins and im wanting a new bike when I already have a decent one, I need to start being a bit more like yourself! 🙂

Oh tyre pressures is a good one to look at. For your weight you should be on about 30 psi - I took a newbie out (a roadie normally) the other night and found he was struggling due to 100 psi he'd crammed into his spesh fast tracks - I'm suprised he hadn't blown the tyres off the rim.

Dandan. £90 is alot of money. For £45 I could teach you. Basically watch what I do, then do the opposite.

lol! hora

Gary.. 30 psi.. I will do that, Cheers

dandan.....pics of my bike......erm. There are some on here somehwere....

Oooh, actually, there's one that someone took of me at Thetford on Sunday, here:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/davefranciosy/3827183355/in/set-72157621933116975/

Doesn't look that steep, but look at the angle of the trees! It was quite a steep bombhole.
I should probably clarify, that when I say seven yrs....it's got new-ish forks, brakes, crankset, different bars & stem etc. So it's a bit like Trigger's broom! Original bits are frame, rear shock & wheels which I guess are the main bits. Only replaced everything else as it's worn out (apart from bars & stem) though.