[Closed] Knocked off, a&e, what next?

what do I need to do

Give mrs mogs lots of TLC and be greatful she is still alive. She's gonna smart for many a day.

Pursue driving without due care at the least.
Be polite and factual to the driver when you talk to them, unfortunately it's not your job to prosecute them or tell them what an idiot they are.
Don't settle for less that what is appropriate.

I hope Mrs Mogs recovers quickly.

Insurance, forget direct contact just go through their insurance.

Sounds awful I hope mrs mogs recovers quick and gets back on the bike ....

I wouldn't be happy with a non insurance option I'd push(no matter how long) it took to claim via his insurance and for prosecution(I know not much more than a slap of the wrist probably) but you could have lost your dearest 🙁

Wise words, got that taken care of already. Dr reckons she may still feel it for up to a month. Certainly can't believe nothings broken judging by how uncomfortable she feels this morning.
I hope my post didn't come across as just wanting money from the guy. In the grand scheme of things I couldn't care less, my missus and the kids mum is still here, could've been a different day altogether today which doesn't bear thinking about.
At the same time ..... I don't want to be out of pocket and she doesn't want to be without a bike. Can't write that without seeming a bit mercenary about it all.
Hopefully you know what I mean.

If she's had quite a bump and is suffering mumps ulnar aches and pains, I'd be going for insurance involvement. That way if there's any further problem which may require Physio or other treatment the insurance will have to cough up for it rather than you.

Don't go for a non insurance settlement at this stage. I'm not sure even that they have the option to given injuries were incurred and hence by law the police had to attend, they have to notify their insurance of the incident even if they don't claim on it. And the police may yet be looking at a charge, given the description and the apparent intent to leave the scene until the off duty guy got involved.

From your side, glad she's not badly hurt or worse, but unfortunately until the immediate effects wear off, you won't know what the underneath result is - not wanting to sound pessimistic but if for example she needs sessions of physio or the like, if you've settled for the cost of repairing the bike who's going to pay for that? The NHS are great but can only afford to get you back functional, you want to be back to as good as possible.

Get their insurance details, make them aware of the likely costs, but also make sure that they know that until a few days pass and you know the extent of damage to the wife and long term potential that you cannot consider discussing a non insurance settlement.

And also speak to your insurance, you might have cover under your own house or car insurance (assuming you aren't in BC or CTC), or failing that speak to a specialist cycling insurer / lawyer.

Definitely go through insurance. Make it as easy for yourself as possible.

First go to where you bought the bike and get a written quote on how much it will cost to replace it (that is if you don't have the original receipt). For the amount of money you are talking about I think going through the other driver's insurance is going to be the only option. Does your wife work? Surely there is loss of potential earnings to claim for,too.

Insurance every time.

Takes the pain out of it for you and should any longer term injuries emerge (clearly hopefully not) but if she needs physio etc she should be compensated for the costs etc

There is a lengthy thread with advice on lfgss.com. It may be of some help.

http://www.lfgss.com/conversations/131099/

Get well soon Mrs Mog

[i]Definitely go through insurance. Make it as easy for yourself as possible. [/i]

And most important, talk with her about how she could have avoided the accident; ie it may be a 25mph hill, but is it safe for HER to do 25mph down it?

This is the key to staying safe in the future.

No point been dead, right?

Avoid accidents by not being there in the first place and not actually moving fast when you do? Bollocks.

Driver's fault full stop. Only hope the driver tries it with a huge truck next time.

Hopefully your in CTC or Brit cycling - pass it to their lawyers its free service and there very good

This

Insurance, forget direct contact just go through their insurance.

Insurance and Lawyers as everybody else has said (Ignore b r, not her fault!). If you're not with CTC/BC then I understand their lawyers will look at and take on cases too if you approach them, best to go with a cycling sympathetic one imo.

Also photo's and quotes of the bike and photo's of bruising etc as it develops and keep a daily log of her pain and progress, trips to Dr's, get what help she needs physio etc, work implications. Just record everything.

Please do push the police for a prosecution, It could have been much worse! If it's the drivers first such incident they'll get a slap on the wrist points and a fine and hopefully mean they'll take more care. If it's not then the extra points might just result in a dangerous driver off the road for a while...

good luck, hope she heals 100% and quickly.

And most important, talk with her about how she could have avoided the accident; ie it may be a 25mph hill, but is it safe for HER to do 25mph down it?

Less of the victim blaming please. Mrs Mog was doing nothing wrong.

Defiantly go through the insurance though. As above it will cover you if there is further Physio or anything else down the line. Plus, and I don't mean to sound mercenary but, you also need compensated for time off, loss of earnings, inconvenience, extra costs (like commuting by car/bus/train) and anything else. The insurance company will be better to deal with for all that.

Do I need to say just go direct to insurance company? Also talk to the police and try and get some sort of charge brought aganst the driver (if you want).

Police can probably help you with the processes for both insurance and prosecution.

Insurance companies from my experience were generally very helpful.

If you are a member of BC/CTC or if you check you home insurance you may be entitledd to legal advice through them.

"I'm ready for the offer of no insurance involvement and a cash sum"
as others have said don't.

Mrs Mog will need to keep an eye on aches and pain, cracks in bones can be compressed by swelling (as its supposed to) etc etc.

But i hope she is 100% a ok, and back on the bike asap.

I think a few people have over reacted to Br comment above, fault was not mentioned, just avoidence. Every day when we drive ride or just walk we take avoiding action for other people. planning ahead and spotting risk is something we do/should do more of.
I'm sure Mr Mog will be running through the series of events anyway 🙁
Letting her talk it out is probably on the agenda.

I'd start piling up the new bike books, the 2015 hits the shops any time now 😀

[i]Less of the victim blaming please. Mrs Mog was doing nothing wrong.

[/i]

If you actually read my post you will find that at no point was I blaming her; just making the point that irrelevent of right/wrong it was Mrs Mog who had to visit A&E.

Self-preservation is ultimately about looking after yourself; +30 years on 2 wheels including many years of commuting in/around London on a motorcycle taught me that only I could ensure that I didn't end up on the 'slab'.

And please; have you actually read what you posted: 🙄

[i]Avoid accidents by not being there in the first place and not actually moving fast when you do? Bollocks.

Driver's fault full stop. Only hope the driver tries it with a huge truck next time.

[/i]

Hmmm, this sort of incident could occur wherever there's a junction and a careless driver. 25mph ain't silly fast though the OP might be able to comment more on the location and if it's more dangerous than others.

accidents due happen for all sorts of reasons its best not to jump to conclusions. Like all have said the let insurance handle it thats what they do

Lawyer up!
Best wishes to Mrs Mog. My mum had a really bad accident which left her quite severely scarred (she got "degloved".....I hate that word)
The legals took quite a while but she did get compensated. She'd sooner have a normal arm though.
Driver needs to pay for his lack of attention.

Due to the driver trying to leave the scene I'd AVOID making a personal phone call. I would contact a Solicitor asap to recover costs. In addition tearing etc etc- how do you know there wont be any issues/time off work etc from this?

You accept a 'cash settlement' - that'll hamstring you later.

Going back to my first line- obvious injury/pain, obvious damage and the driver wanted to leg it. What does that say about the driver that your dealing with? He wont do the honourable or right thing/play cricket if he didn't do this at the scene.

BTW I stupidly dealt direct with the other parties insurer which included 'no further payment etc etc'. I had issues with my neck for a few years afterwards which weren't immediate/at the time.

Solicitor that specialises in RTC/cyclists - CTC should be able to recommend? You've got a GOOD witness too.

Glad she's ok. My GF had precisely the same accident back in May. She still has aches in her right shoulder now. Insurance options are the best way to go, it will take longer (months) but it is the right way to go. Check out the ctc website for lawyers etc.

I'll chip in as the 57th person to say go through insurance.

Get witness details. Photograph everything. Bike, damaged clothes/helmet, injuries.

Get the bike inspected by a bike shop to prove it's a write off.

BTW, if you claim off the insurance then the NHS can reclaim the cost of Mrs Mog's treatment from the driver/insurer.

I would push for PI compensation on top of the obvious claim for replacing the damaged bike/clothes/helmet, don't feel like a vulture or a scammer for doing it. A nice holiday could be just what you, she, and the kid(s) need after this. (Speaking from experience when I say, with the injuries you've mentioned it will definitely be worth it. Not being run over is still preferable btw, but it's already happened) Anyone saying "wahh, this is why car insurance is so expensive" is looking in the wrong place. S**t drivers are the reason it's so expensive.

Glad she's relatively okay.

Edit: I've been hit twice. The last one (2 years ago) still gives me an achey right knee which is a bit of a bummer as I'm not even 30. The driver's insurance paid for medical checks and physio, and then compensation. If you don't go through the insurance then you might get the bike replaced but you won't get private physio, and you won't have any comeback if she has any long term effects from this.

Also, push with the police for careless/dangerous driving. And then wee in his shoes etc.

Check your home insurance for legal cover.

"wahh, this is why car insurance is so expensive" is looking in the wrong place. S**t drivers are the reason it's so expensive.

Shit/bad drivers who cause accidents should (and do) get higher premiums.

Fraudsters put up premiums [b]not victims[/b].

The driver tried to leave the scene of the accident so hang him out to dry.

GWS Mrs Mog.. oh and good effort from the off duty police chap.

I got taken out in the past by someone who didnt have right of way. They seriously underestimated my speed (around 25mph) and drove into the front of the bike. Yes I suppose I could have avoided it by riding like a granny, but at what point do you draw the line?
Anyway, @ the OP. I would get onto your home insurance people. They often have legal cover included and this is what I used when I got knocked off. I was also given a medical assessment which may help if there are longer term injuries etc.
DONT deal direct with the driver. Your insurance people will likely get a better deal for you.
Id also get the bike down to a decent LBS and get it fully assessed and priced up.
Also consider any out of pocket expenses caused by the accident, damaged clothing, shoes, helmets etc etc.

People have gone over the more official stuff to death already, so I'll just add a "Rest up and get well soon" to Mrs. Mog.

The driver tried to leave the scene of the accident so hang him out to dry.

Yep. Same thing happened to me a few weeks back (cutting on front of me - but I was luckily in a car and managed to brake inches away)

Driving off from any accident is a no-no in the extreme, let alone when actually injuring someone.

Hope she makes a quick and full recovery

Glad she's ok. You'd be doing other cyclists a huge disservice if you don't push for prosecution.

Yes I suppose I could have avoided it by riding like a granny, but at what point do you draw the line?

*For me* the line isn't one defined by speed, or even rights or wrongs, it's about assessing the risk and whether by riding more conservatively / defensively at times, or avoiding particular junctions, I can mitigate the risk better.

But that's the issue, it's down to each of us to decide that for ourselves. In all probability you can ride your whole life 'not like a granny' and never have an problem, but *IF* you do it might be a severe / life limiting problem.

YMMV

Regarding b r's point: we all need to learn from mistakes, and that includes the mistakes that other people make which might hurt us!

From the description the driver was 100% at fault, but it is still good to analyse it and think about how you can avoid getting hurt when someone else does something stupid like that in the future.

This video has being doing the rounds recently including [url= http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/how-to-escape-death-by-motor-car-cyclist-acrobatic-content ]a thread on here[/url] and it sounds a fairly similar situation to what the OP describes:

(Warning: swearing)

Again 100% the drivers fault. Cyclist was wearing bright clothes and holding a good road position.

But a more experienced rider might have anticipated the possibility of the driver doing something stupid and been quicker to react.

(I'm not sure that riding slowly is necessarily the answer by the way, as increased speed differential brings its own dangers with angry drivers tailgating, trying to squeeze past where they shouldn't or making punishment passes)

That one (Youtube above) would have been hard to avoid, but the impact could have been reduced.

As the rider, having just passed a crossing and both vehicles are in sight, I would have been centre of the lane personally.

That last vid, bluddy heck!

Any there was a huge argument on here not so long ago lambasting people for wearing helmet cams.

Healing vibes for the Mrs OP.

Hope Mrs OP recovers well and isn't too shaken up.

As for the driver, to be completely neutral, he may have misjudged the speed of the cyclist and thought there was time to go. All the same, it's a stupid mistake, and his insurance ought to cough up (and handsomely at that). I'm pretty sure he didn't leave the house intending to hit a cyclist.

However, for attempting to leave the scene, he should be bloody well hung out to dry. And I hope he is. We all make mistakes, but trying to run away without consequence is not really forgivable.

I had an almost identical incident.

First make sure you have all details
Witnesses
Police officer/ report number
Take photos of damage etc

Then you will be needing to talk to the drivers insurance company, if you're certain it's no fault you could get the bike to a local shop for a repair/replacement valuation. Don't forget helmet and clothing.

Next you need to consider physio- I dealt with this through a no win no fee, it fixed up a knackard shoulder and ankle that didn't heal after several months. They will also seek to compensate you for the injuries and inconvenience. How far you go is your call.

My settlement ended up being a bike and equipment replacement, all my physio paid and expenses covered and a small amount of injury compensation.

I'm sure the driver now looks properly when pulling out of junctions.

Thanks all - some good advice. I get what b r means and don't take any offence by it, playing things over in your head always makes you wonder what you'd do differently next time. Maybe she'll move out a bit more at junctions, maybe make eye contact with driver, sit up so she's bigger etc....
In terms of speed and road layout, the accident was 100% avoidable. The junction is at the bottom of 2 shallow hills (3%?)and is an open junction. As he was in the middle of the road turning right, he had a clear view up the hill with no obstructions, dry conditions, daylight etc... It's simply an error on his behalf.
I spoke with him this morning and explained I needed his insurance details. He told me I'd get them at 5pm when he finishes work. At 5pm my wife had a call telling her he 'earned a lot of money' so would pay for the damage. Makes me even keener to go through insurers, to be honest. Police also called to check she was OK and said they were closing the case, so I need to get in touch with them to see why? Need a ref number for insurance anyway.
Again, thanks all.

He sounds like a complete tosser.

As many have said, you need to have any long term issues covered, not just a quick fix.

Best wishes, Neil.

OP, glad she's (relatively) ok. There's too many of these incidents at the moment...

A few points you mention are very concerning:

The driver tried to leave the scene of the accident

At 5pm my wife had a call telling her he 'earned a lot of money' so would pay for the damage.

Sounds like he may have previous and is trying to stop it appearing on his record (or he's uninsured and wants to hide this)

Police also called to check she was OK and said they were closing the case, so I need to get in touch with them to see why

With a Police witness to a driver trying to leave the scene of a collision this is pretty shocking.

As a few mention above I would formalise this as much as possible - insurance co and press for charges...

Good luck

Wot brooess said.
plus he said he would give you his insurance details at 5pm then didn't.
On top of trying to leave the scene..... DON'T TRUST HIM.

go back to the police, they should have his details, and they really should be pursing this.

Yep, I'd happily tell the police that he's refusing to give you his details (because he is).

Insurance. I forsee promises of money. First installment and no more magically forthcoming/calls unanswered expecting you to give up. You then try his insurance. At this point he tells them he paid for the damage...exactly the first installment sum... etc etc.

You eventually give up as he becomes abusive on the phone...the stress..

As you decides to call him against reason- Im out. Good luck.

I was knocked off Nike by a bus who didn't stop. Damage to me, road rash down one side and a torn chest muscle. Went straight to police to report it ( get a crime ref number) photograph to bike and person, take photos of person when bruising etc starts to appear. Get witness details and statements. I tried to claim by going straight to the bus company and the legal dept, but after being dicked about for 11 months by them with all the excuses under the sun to drag it out, I think they were hoping I would just go away. I was just wanting the cost of repairing my bike and kit. I went to a bike specific solicitor who got it all sorted within 5 months. Kit costs and injury paid out. Probably got 5 times as much by going through the solicitor.

Keep a copy of all photos, emails and any letters etc.

http://www.royds.com/our-people/profiles/partners/james-millar-craig/

was described by the Times as a number one PI specialist. Might be worth a call.

no relation, BTW.

Member of either BC or CTC?
http://www.britishcycling.org.uk/membership/article/memst-Legal-Support-and-Assistance-0
http://www.slatergordon.co.uk/unions-federations-and-charities/ctc/ctc-accident-line/
(may not even need to be a member of CTC for that either)

At 5pm my wife had a call telling her he 'earned a lot of money' so would pay for the damage.

I'd also be asking that he makes any offers in writing and that you wont make any verbal agreements.

Have you contacted CTC etc yet? You already have broken promises from the guy, personally I wouldn't be dealing direct with him at all, makes you more vulnerable.

At the end of the day you have your wife still here which is the main thing.

Next time you speak to them, you could suggest that 20,000 (paid within the week) would make the problem go away. But unless they pay up pronto, police/insurers/solicitors is the way to go. Don't skimp on pain, suffering and inconvenience in the claim, eg including your time in chauffeuring around your wife and chasing up this mess.

Oh, and get well soon to mrs mog.

[i]Thanks all - some good advice. I get what b r means and don't take any offence by it, playing things over in your head always makes you wonder what you'd do differently next time[/i]

Thanks Mog.

I wasn't blaming your wife at all, just pointing out that we owe it to ourselves to always think after an accident - could I have avoided that one, or at least mitigated the damage.

Next time you speak to them, you could suggest that 20,000 (paid within the week) would make the problem go away.

I assume that's a 'joke'. Don't do this.

Just to give you an idea of ball park. I had a similar off before Xmas . The police did not pursue it for reasons I disagree with . I could not be bothered to do the work myself so instructed a local personal injury solicitor think one man band dodgy shop front in a low income area . My injuries were soft tissue principally to knees but also shoulders I also had some really bad psychiatric effects as mine was a real near death experience . Due to personal preference I did not wish to push the psycho point so we just used a independent gp who described situational anxiety. I was off the bike till easter but in truth have only just got happy commuting again .
We settled at £ 3500 for my injuries. Plus some specific expenses new helmet glasses bike repairs.
I have not had to pay a penny to my solicitor who will recover his costs and the DR's from the other sides insurance co. I spent 1/2 an hour in his office and an hour at the DR's and have had a couple of phone calls and letters to deal with.
I strongly recommended you get his insurance details and lawyer up.
By way of contrast I did my last crash dealing direct with the other sides insurers and got £2500 for worse physical better psycho injury's but got royally messed around by the insurance co first.

I have been in an identical situation, coming down a hill, a car coming from the opposite direction waiting to turn right with indicator on up ahead.
As soon as the car in front cleared the junction, the car waiting to go right went.
I Braked hard , they realised I was not stopping so stopped half way across my lane and I did stop pretty much in front of their car.

The drivers response was did you not see me indicating, so he saw me .
And he knew the car in front of me had right of way, that's why he waited but then thought car trumps bike. And genuinely thought he had right of way over me and that I would/should stop to let him go.

I beleive a lot of drivers think the same way and b r was merely pointing out you should not take people doing the right thing for granted, and are sometimes safer if you think the opposite.

Hope mrs mog gets well soon.

but then thought car trumps bike.

Similar with me just last night. Riding down a residential street with cars on one side, our side is clear and a car coming the other way stopped to let the car in front of me go through. And then once clear she decided that the oncoming bike (me) doesn't count in the same way. I wasn't tailgating, there was about 25m between me and the car in front by the time they'd cleared the pinch point, so she must have seen me, but on she came anyway. Would have taken me about 5 seconds to get through, but that's too long for her.

I took my usual assertive position, ie: not in the gutter so we came to a halt, and when i asked why she gave way to a car but not to me all i got was that if I'd either been riding tight into the side or gone onto the pavement she could have squeezed past!!

Back to the OP - everything I've heard about the other party doesn't make me feel comfortable. Trying to leave the scene, 'I'm very rich, i'll just pay to make it go away' doesn't make me feel that anything 'unofficial' is merited in this case.

Get his insurance details and do it through the channels. Better done properly even if it takes longer, than go for the quick fix only for him to 'disappear'. And *if it were me* I'd be on to the police this morning advising that he has failed to provide insurance details, he wants to sort it out privately but you aren't happy given the as yet unknown extent of your wife's rehab, etc., and use the excuse to politely enquire why attempting to leave the scene hasn't resulted in them pursuing this further.

To put a bit of perspective on the driver trying to leave the scene of an accident, if a pedestrian had been knocked over rather than a cyclist, do you really think the Police would be so quick to try and drop the matter? Especially given that there is a reliable witness.

Yet again it highlights how cyclists really are viewed as the bottom of the food chain.

To put a bit of perspective on the driver trying to leave the scene of an accident, if a pedestrian had been knocked over rather than a cyclist, do you really think the Police would be so quick to try and drop the matter? Especially given that there is a reliable witness.

Yet again it highlights how cyclists really are viewed as the bottom of the food chain

What are the Police supposed to do in this case then?

Its a RTC with no malice but there is fault. I guess its easier to process by saying 'involve insurers'.

If the driver was under the influence, driving without insurance, steered at intentionally, road rage etc then thats different.

What are the Police supposed to do in this case then?

Its a RTC with no malice but there is fault.

It's driving without due care at the least, IMO, drivers need to take responsibility for their choice of vehicle, not get distracted and act accordingly.

@ OP - Solicitor? The mrs is a PI lawyer and a cyclist, she's done few bike claims now, she's very good, if you are interested i'll give you her details, might be worth a chat if nothing else?

Its a RTC with no malice but there is fault. I guess its easier to process by saying 'involve insurers'.

It's always going to be easier for the police to say "we're not doing anything", whether it's a bump in a car park or a murder. They're supposed to do their bloody job properly, not just say "we can't be arsed, sod off".

hora - Member

To put a bit of perspective on the driver trying to leave the scene of an accident, if a pedestrian had been knocked over rather than a cyclist, do you really think the Police would be so quick to try and drop the matter? Especially given that there is a reliable witness.

Yet again it highlights how cyclists really are viewed as the bottom of the food chain

What are the Police supposed to do in this case then?

Its a RTC with no malice but there is fault. I guess its easier to process by saying 'involve insurers'.

If the driver was under the influence, driving without insurance, steered at intentionally, road rage etc then thats different.

So you're saying its an accident and therefore thats it, no further action. What about the driver trying to leave the scene? Suppose the OPs wife had internal bleeding and later died in hospital. Would that still be ok?
We all make mistakes, grated, but there are consequences which need to be faced up to and dealt with.
The driver if unpunished will not modify their behavior and never learn anything.

What are the Police supposed to do in this case then?
Its a RTC with no malice but there is fault.

I crashed a motorbike into a stationary vehicle waiting at a set of filter lights.
I fractured my spine and smashed my heel.
Looked like I was sponsored by mechano and had a cast and not allowed to put my foot down for three months.

Car had a dented rear bumper from my foot peg where my bike slid under the back of the car.

I got done for driving without due care and attention, rightly so as I was not looking where I was going, and so should this driver, the reason they may not, is surely to save money.

What do you want them to do though? He didn't leave the scene.

The OP has a credible witness and legally can claim/receive good compensation. IF (and I hope I never am) knocked off in a similar situation I'd expect upwards towards 10k to cover the bike and me. I've falled bad off my bike before and it DOES affect your work life for weeks. It disrupts your love life, your plans for the weekend(s), it royally balls up your life because of an idiot. 3k wouldn't be enough would it? If you had to put a £ on your injury, time lost/affect etc.

Plus- I wouldn't exactly be rushing out on a bike on a commute again.

What do you want them to do though? He didn't leave the scene.

He tried to, though. It's not just a crime if you do it successfully.

What do you want them to do though?

You seem to be asking the same question again.

Too many people seem to think being allowed to drive is a right, it is not. It should be respected for what it is and denied if that person can not take the responsibility seriously.

There seems to be in my mind anyway a public opinion when someone is knocked off a bike of.
Well roads are dangerous places and what do you expect or that's why I would never ride a bike because it's too dangerous.

So that anyone cycling on public roads is running a gauntlet and not surprising a few get taken out.

If that had been a pedestrian crossing the road and a car suddenly turned in running them over the driver would be facing charges.

Charge him, find him guilty if so, print his name in the paper and his insurance company will penalise him for his claim and subsequent driving convictions.
And try and work towards getting rid of the attitude that getting knocked of is to be expected if you choose to ride on the road.

The roads are only dangerous because people make it so. If they are punished for being dangerous then they're less likely to do it again surely?
That's the reason why there is a penal system. Otherwise you'd have anarchy.

There seems to be in my mind anyway a public opinion when someone is knocked off a bike of.
Well roads are dangerous places and what do you expect or that's why I would never ride a bike because it's too dangerous.

At our club committee meeting last night there was a distinct attitude of 'if a driver gets angry and pulls a stupid overtake then we're partly to blame'

This idea that cyclists are contributing to their own abuse seems to go pretty deep. After yet another near injury/death experience this week from a driver who took exception to me simply being in the road, I'm taking time out from riding on my own, and only in club groups. The bad attitudes/utter ignorance is scaring me now...

I'm the other way around, I dislike riding in groups because of the extra aggro it causes, not unreasonably, so many groups are an unruly mess on the roads!

it's like bad driving is accepted as common place and the norm so there for roads are dangerous and anyone who chooses to cycle on them are taking their life into their own hands.

If someone is knocked off their bike and hurt the police should investigate and find who's at fault and prosecute even if it turns out to be the cyclist.
I was stood in front of the judge in a body brace and on crutches when I got done.

In my lifetime I have seen a real shift in public attitude towards drink driving and speeding, from we all do it to outrage.
But peoples attitude to road safety towards cyclist is terrible to the point it is acceptable to publically announce a hatred of cyclist and wish them harm and more likely have someone join in than be berrated for it.
This may be casual banter in reality because I can not see anyone want to deliberately mow down a cyclist, but there is distinct attitude of bloody cyclists getting in the way rather than cyclists have as much right to be on the road.

So, another day after the accident and mrs mog is getting more bruises popping up, stiffer, but in good humour.
My fears about the driver are now confirmed. By the second 'deadline' to give me his details I still have nothing. I've sent him a text (wanted it recorded) explaining that I was now reporting it back to the police. That was at 3pm today and I've had no reply. I've tried to contact the policeman who gave us his details but he's off duty so will contact us tomorrow.
It turns out the driver's father turned up while we were in the ambulance, gave him a telling off and then left again. Seems wierd. Obviously we now think the worse and assume he has no insurance, which is why dad rollocked him and left and why he's not giving us his details.
One of the witnesses also told us today that they didn't breathalise him (may not have had reason to) as they didn't have a kit in the van and nobody checked his car at all as he'd moved it to a nearby pub car park. None of that seems right to me?
Beginning to get a bad, frustrated feeling about this.
But....she's still here (although the bloody bake off is on the tv!).

skellnonch - can you drop me an email? I'll add my address to my profile now....... Cheers

have nothing of worth to add except i wish your wife a speedy recovery,am glad she is reasonably ok.

Cheers raceface, that's the bigger picture. My immediate worry is over as the pc contact has just emailed me to confirm the driver was insured and has told me I'll have details on Monday, when he's next in.
Part of me thinks the driver is an even bigger nuisance now as he's obviously just ignoring me, can't think why you'd wait for the police to call for the details when you could just supply them? People, eh?
Although curiosity has got the better of me and I've googled his facebook page, which was pretty much exactly as I thought it would be.

Although curiosity has got the better of me and I've googled his facebook page, which was pretty much exactly as I thought it would be.

Just a picture of a massive cock? 🙂

@ wonkey donkey - genius!

which was pretty much exactly as I thought it would be.

Nothing anti cycling on it, more just summed up what he and his mates are like. I kind of get the feeling he may be dining out on causing the accident. But I may be wrong.
Wonkey donkey - in my mind, yes!