[Closed] Kings Alfred's Way gravel bike ..

Bit more of a challenge probably on a grav though. Maybe that's why they are riding one over the mtb 🤷‍♂️ after all it's not like it's the HT550

Agree with the OP - I did it over three days last weekend on a HT 29er and was really glad I wasn’t on a gravel bike.

Yes it’s not exactly Whistler but the extra tyre cush and suspension were welcome on many occasions. Saw loads of pristine gravel bikes being nursed down some relatively tame sections.

That said it was great to see so many riders out on all sorts of bikes - cycling uk have done a great marketing job.

Saw loads of pristine gravel bikes being nursed down some relatively tame sections.

Likewise.

A 29er with fast rolling tyres are super quick on the road surface too so not sure why they have fallen out of fashion.

It might look naff, but I was still able to hammer down the descents and aside from the climb with the steps climb every hill on the route AND no back pack!

You need bar ends for extra naff!

Met a lady on day2 at qecp this morning.
She wished she was on a mtb for the range of gears. Her lowest was 34.32, there was some pushimg going on.
Looked to be running 38s so some forgiveness, rigid genesis.

A 29er with fast rolling tyres.......... so not sure why they have fallen out of fashion.

Because they don’t have a new made up name. Should be called something like GnarTrack or maybe “bike”

I’ve been reading the Cycling UK guide to King Alfreds Way, trying to work out whether to do it in one hit or make a few weekends out of it with more detours and site seeing.

Took my 29er, which still had 2.6 nobby nics on. I'm sure I was slower on the way up & on the roads, but the downs were a hell of a lot of fun. So much fun it got a bit rowdy a couple of times.

I played tag with a group of guys on gravel bikes up Tan Hill, they smashed me up the hill by 10 mins, met them waiting at the bottom of the descent into Avebury. Not sure what they were waiting for, but I bet the descent was a bit sketchy unless they all had Sagan-like skills.

trying to work out whether to do it in one hit

I wild camped on the Ridgeway without any issues, had to camp in Thursley as I ran out of daylight and had to pitch at 930 pm. Some bigot took issue at 6am as her 6 dogs ran around me snarling whilst she told me it was highly illegal and filmed me on her camera. Third night some chaps in a pub told me it was fine to camp in the scouts garden of their club.

The section between Goring and the South Downs it quite limited. Lots of private land and too many people who may take issue.

Because they don’t have a new made up name

I always called mine ‘gravelbeast’. Partly because it was the one I swapped my monstercross for.

Yet also because the name seemed to fit, and that’s what I got the bike for - ie required an unroadly beast for mostly beasting around the beasty end of gravel.

In addition to the smooth end, and also the road home

Bringewood Chase is a two-faced place...

Did it over the BH weekend on my
open Wide with 2.25 g-ones and loved every minute of it.

Rode a rigid 29er on 2.4 Rangers, was ideal. Gravel bike would be fine on 90pc of the route riding sections as a day ride but putting luggage on the bike and not wanting to go easy on the fun stuff, 29er was the right choice for me. Only had 4kg or so kit but that plus water and food is enough that the 29er justifies itself.

Having said that I've ridden longer rougher stuff on a loaded gravel bike, was ok. Just depends on my mood or how I want to ride.

Did it over the BH weekend on my
open Wide with 2.25 g-ones and loved every minute of it.

I'm curious as to how you found the descents on the South Downs Way. Descending on the drops is something that just feels far too alien having ridden a straight bar mtb

I’m probably not the best person to ask to be honest. The bit of the SDW between Winch and QE is my local playground and been riding it on dropbar bikes for years, back to when I had a Crosscheck with rim brakes and bar end shifters.

The section between Goring and the South Downs it quite limited. Lots of private land and too many people who may take issue.

Saw some pictures of folk camping on Frensham Common in the FB group, I guess it's just luck of the draw.

I failed to book anything in time, so my only option this BH was wild camp. SDW was no bother - a few folk by the trailside near me outside Exton after I'd had my dinner in the pub. Ridgeway was the same - didn't even bother to hide, just kipped next to a bench just after sundown. Only people to come through was about 3:30am but I only stirred as they were flashing torches.

I have a gravel bike and love it. However for (a mercifully bone dry) KAW last October I took my Solaris and it was spot on imho. Much faster & more fun on the descents and a lot more forgiving on the body. Interestingly a couple of mates did it a few weeks before us on gravel bikes. They are theoretically faster than us but we were a surprising amount quicker.

Any of your guys done this loop in a day, or more than 24 hours in reality?

We did 2 overnight stops. Total time on the bike was 20 hours. Couple of the local club riders did it non-stop inside 24 hours:

https://www.vcventa.co.uk/articles/17-king-alfred-way-in-under-24-hours

The section between Goring and the South Downs it quite limited. Lots of private land and too many people who may take issue.

Saw some pictures of folk camping on Frensham Common in the FB group, I guess it’s just luck of the draw.

I can see this becoming a huge problem, just looking at the sheer numbers of people jumping on the bikepacking bandwagon and the amount riding the KAW in the FB group. Locals are not going to like hoards of wild campers crapping all over the place!

Do that many riders really need a dump on that sort of mileage? Constant peeing (in the name of hydrating) perhaps...

Surely dogs relieving themselves is a far greater an issue? I'm a good lover by the way

I'm not arguing here, just thinking aloud matey.😁

Do that many riders really need a dump on that sort of mileage?

Most people I have seen riding it are doing it over three maybe four days, that's a long time to "hold it in"

I’m a good lover by the way

in my experience you can get away with pretty much anything in that case.

Descending on the drops is something that just feels far too alien having ridden a straight bar mtb

I always decend in the drops, it's much more secure as you can grip the bars and still get to the brakes. If you perch on the hoods you can get shaken off and less power on the brakes. Drops also work great with a dropper post as you can get nice and low, but I've taken mine off for now and just run the saddle a tad lower when off-road.

If I were to use the 29er HT instead of the gravel, what sort of tyres would suit the 30mm ID rims? Feels like getting a fast enough tyre on it might be the limiting factor for me.

I'm doing the KAW in three weeks. I have a gravel bike but will take the mtb for this, probably fitted with Nobby Nics to keep it fairly fast rolling. My recollection of the Ridgeway (which I did on a fully rigid ancient mtb) was that I was pretty beaten up by the end of the ride, and as I'm not in a massive hurry, I'd rather have a suspension fork for comfort.

If I were to use the 29er HT instead of the gravel, what sort of tyres would suit the 30mm ID rims? Feels like getting a fast enough tyre on it might be the limiting factor for me

Any 2.4 xc tyre would do. The Maxxis range do WT ones to suit. Eg Aspen 2.4WT.

I can see this becoming a huge problem, just looking at the sheer numbers of people jumping on the bikepacking bandwagon and the amount riding the KAW in the FB group. Locals are not going to like hoards of wild campers crapping all over the place!

That's a fair point, but maybe it might be the catalyst for change in this country regarding camping. There is no reason what so ever for local authorities to not have small reserved areas for hikers and cyclists to wild camp. They have managed to do it in the US along the Great Divide route.

I don't think most cyclists "crap all over the place" the ones I meet all adopt the very strict "leave no trace". If they have to wild poo then I am confident most will dig a cat hole and pack out their toilet paper. I'd say dog shit is a far worse problem.

If I were to use the 29er HT instead of the gravel, what sort of tyres would suit the 30mm ID rims? Feels like getting a fast enough tyre on it might be the limiting factor for me.

I use Conti Race King 2.2 and like them well enough away from mud, but they may come up smaller of late.

Bonty XR2 (R) and XR3 (F) worth a look?

Just done this over three days: Sunday dinner time to yesterday dinner time. Started/finished in Reading. Very steady pace to do that, 31hrs riding time

As noted above, lots doing it on gravel bikes, some seemed fine at the handling others not so. There was a group of three who we did a tortoise and hare shuffle with. They were finishing in Winchester and said they wished they'd bigger volume tyres.

We were on rigid 29ers which were more than adequate.

In the conditions - basically completely dry except for some very short mud baths - I'd have been happy doing it on a drop bar bike with something like 650b x 47c tyres. There are a couple of descents on the SDW that I thought might have been sketchy but for the rest of it no problem.

Tyre wise I had a Vittoria Mezcal 2.6 up front and a very worn out Bonty XR2 on the back, so worn out it's virtually a slick. The only bits I didn't manage to ride were a handful of mud pits and a short steep ramp between Goring and Reading that's mentioned in the guide. Never ridden in the area before so don't know what things would be like with dampness or wet.

We just wild camped. Even on the Reading to Farnham section there are lots of places you can just get off the track by a few metres and get out of sight. Then it's the usual arrive late and leave early - we were on our way by 6am. As for going to the loo: grab a pub meal and use the facilities then.

I rode it in 3 days on my Jones back in October and decided that next time I'd do it on my gravel bike, just for a bit more speed on the road sections and don't think I'd have been any slower elsewhere.

So the guide and the GCN boys have really pushed the gravel bike for this ride, but having just returned from a 3 day trip on my hardtail 29er with carbon forks and maxxis Ikon 2.35 tyres all I can say is that I am so glad I didn’t take the gravel bike.

One thought on this - when combined with 'bikepacking' 'gravel' is a far more relevant search term right now than MTB. If CUK presented it as a mountain bike route it might put some people off. It's essentially a long old-school ATB route but in terms of publicity I expect the popularity of gravel and presenting it as accessible might have swung it, also that 'MTB' usually means people have a bike with suspension in mind. Could be wrong. It's one of those routes where bike choice is marginal anyway. It's only niche places like this where many of us have a rigid 29er in the shed.

I rode it in 3 days on my Jones back in October and decided that next time I’d do it on my gravel bike,

ha! I'd been thinking that if/when I ride it, I'd take the Jones rather than my gravel bike. I've got creaky shoulders that complain on long rides. The Jones is comfier for longer, and has 2.35 G-One speeds on Crests at the moment. Might get round to my long-thought-about, never-done gnarwhal bodge, too.

when combined with ‘bikepacking’ ‘gravel’ is a far more relevant search term right now than MTB. I

Not to hijack but what I find interesting is that nearly all drop bar 'not-road' bikes come with mounts for a rear rack and fork mounts. The number of hardtails that have reat rackmounts is vanishingly small. Even smaller if you limit to steel. I've actually been vaguely looking for one. I notice lots of people on hardtails just use saddle rolls but the rear rack much improved versatility

Another thought on gravel bikes on low-tech 'ATB' routes and how comfort x pace comes into all this. The Tour Divide is the longest well-known route on terrain that most would describe as gravel and most of the TD has a similar type of terrain mix to the KAW yet no-one has raced the Tour Divide competitively (or at all) on a gravel bike, they're all on a 29er of sorts*. The hills aren't as steep on the TD but they're longer.
You could ride KAW fast on a gravel bike if you could handle the lower comfort. Someone will do the KAW Double on a gravel bike. Sooner or later though we all hit a comfort limit that impacts our ability to ride fast and hold speed. For a fast or long days ride around the KAW there's no doubt I'd want to be on a rigid XC 29er. A gravel bike would be fine for a 5 day ride as I'd not be hitting that comfort limit each day.

*I think Mike Hall had raised the idea of a 650B gravel bike for a fast TD time - maybe he could have used a bike like that to go faster than he already had, as an outlier in this area he was a fair way out. I think it'd break most riders before halfway.

Good point on rack compatibilities @cromolyolly. Bikepacking gear might be assumed to be widespread but I still see a lot of people happily using racks.

I'd like to try the KAW on something like a Salsa Cutthroat since it was designed with rides like the TD & KAW in mind, in fact WITH the TD in mind. Dave Barter (DaveB on here) rode one when he did it. I thought Josh Kato rode one but it turns out he was on a Fargo - https://bikepacking.com/bikes/tour-divide-rigs-2019/

Certainly when we were on the Ridgeway it did cross my mind that it was pretty similar to TD style riding.

The point about this type of route is that any bike choice is a compromise:

Full suss - way too much road. Be fine for the (very few) technical downhills.
HT - great on the tracks, good on the tech downhills, so-so on the road
Rigid 29er - good on the tracks, decent enough on the roads, OK if you pick your line on the tech.
Gravel - great on the roads, good on the tracks, possible squeaky bum time on the tech.

For me the rigid 29er hits the spot, hell the Solaris with rigid carbon fork as pictured above handled the HT550 so it's certainly up to the job. One thing that might improve matters would be something like a Thudbuster seatpost to take the sting out of the hoof prints on the trail.

@jameso - for lightweight bikepacking the saddle roll is more than adequate. Any kind of weight or longer distance/duration and the panniers reign supreme, IMHO. I actually find that for e.g. shopping runs with heavier items I really miss my panniers.

Get cracking. Pinnacle ramin homage, steel obv. Full rack mounts. Modern geo (67° Head angle,17" reach on a medium.75° seat tube. ) Like a Nordest Sardinha but without the import duties. I'll even forgo my usual commission, just sort me out a discount on the first run.

Regarding the rear rack, that is why I had a custom 29er titanium frame made with rear pannier rack mounts. I actually found the Ortlieb low riders worked a treat on the rear and it also then means I have options for the future.

Rear rack and panniers when I want to carry cooking gear and also more food / clothing OR go seat pack if I want to do a light weight trip without cooking stuff.

If CUK presented it as a mountain bike route it might put some people off.

They do don't they?

CUK-GPX/route linky

Under "type of bike" it says "mountain bike" and they sort of recommend an MTB in the description without ruling out Gravel (or indeed touring) bikes...

TBH I wasn't aware of the route before seeing this thread, seeing as it passes through Reading (where I live) I might just have to have a crack at it sometime during the summer... I will have to do it on a gravel bike, as I no longer own a HT...

Get cracking. Pinnacle ramin homage, steel obv. Full rack mounts. Modern geo (67° Head angle,17″ reach on a medium.75° seat tube. ) Like a Nordest Sardinha but without the import duties. I’ll even forgo my usual commission, just sort me out a discount on the first run.

Ha... Find me a business backer and I'll put the bikes I've been sampling in the last couple of years into production. You might not like the numbers but they ride great.

They do don’t they?

CUK-GPX/route linky

Under “type of bike” it says “mountain bike” and they sort of recommend an MTB in the description without ruling out Gravel (or indeed touring) bikes…

I probably should have said Guy K and GCN rather than the rather sensible CUK. They do have MTB on the rhs info box, in the main info I scrolled past about 5 images of people on gravel bikes before I got to
A conventional touring bike will probably survive if you ride carefully, but a gravel bike or hybrid with 35mm or wider tyres and low ratio gears will be a more confident and comfortable choice. A cross country/trail style mountain bike certainly isn’t overkill either, and would be the preferred option during the wetter, muddier seasons.

They're not wrong anyway, based on all the opinions on this thread.

We did come across a lad on a Boardman road bike! He was quite a way along a track but didn't look like he was intending to ride further.

I used to live near the ridgeway in the days before mountain bikes had been thought of. Occasionally I would try to ride it on 27" x 1.1/4" tyres. It was always very unpleasant.

Now when I visit my dad, I ride it on a 29er with 2.25" tyres and occasionally marvel at just how much faster and more capable it is.

I have also ridden bits of it on my 700c 25mm road bike in the rain. That is sketchy as anything. Don't do that.

Doing this in July, I expect on my gravel bike. It has 20mm of travel on the front 😀😀😜.
Wondering if I need the inner fly for my tent or will I be eaten alive, any thoughts anyone?

If you don't have rack mounts, there's always the Tailfin X series pannier rack

https://www.tailfin.cc/product/pannier-racks/x-series-pannier-rack/

@cromolyolly

Genesis Longitude (M) close but half inch out on reach and then the seat tube drops the cigar?

FRAME SEAT TUBE 445mm
FRAME TOP TUBE 610mm
FRAME REACH 420mm
FRAME STACK 626mm
FRAME HEAD TUBE 135mm
FRAME HEAD ANGLE 68°
FRAME SEAT ANGLE 71°

Another HT fan here, did KAW last October on 29er HT with conti race kings 2.0 and it was fine apart from the wet chalk. Friend on a gravel bike did not enjoy himself and was slower on all but the road bits. His take was why am I on a bike which is better on the road bits, not the best bits?

@p7eaven - I've gone back and forth on the Longitude. A few years back I really fancied one. Then I didn't. Not sure why. It's a bit weighty, the seat tube angle is a bit odd, putting a short travel fork on it might be iffy, and the geo is odd - the Medium would do me nicely in most respects except the standove is nearly 32" - on a medium. For me thats the same shortcoming as my house when I want to dance - no ballroom.

But I might yet. I do like the Kona Unit, Breezer Thunder and Nordest but I think only the Nordest has the mounts.

Ha… Find me a business backer and I’ll put the bikes I’ve been sampling in the last couple of years into productio

I smell the first ever singletrackforumgrouobuybike. Like the t-shirts only rideable. Marketing pics with grass, fence and patio that needs sorting, natch. I'll chip in the first £200 but I get to name it. I'm leaning towards Ill! Slogan - we'll actually deliver.

Its already happening....

This was posted on the KAW facebook group today

Hi, given that wild camping is illegal in England, does the official guide give advice on it? Where I live near Bramshill, more people using the forest has resulted in a depressingly large increase in litter and human excrement, so my opinion of humans in the countryside has plummeted.
Since the KAW (and wild camping on it) has been so popular, how have people found it? Is it ‘leave no trace’ or crap everywhere!

I've been leafing through the official guide and it does include towns/villages with campsites on the facilities table (pages 92 & 93). There's not masses but you could plan a 2 or 3 dayer around stopping at 'legal' campsites. The guide makes no mention of wild camping that I could see so CUK are giving a "responsible steer" towards more conventional accomodation.

On top of that, Bramshill (mentioned in the FB comment above) is pretty close to Wellington country park, which has a woodland campsite (apparently re-opened mid-April).

I think given the fact you'll be trundling about semi-rural Berkshire and Hampshire, discrete wild camping is inevitably going to be harder. There's lots of grumpy old duffers down this way. But also don't shit in the woods (and leave it there), you're not a bear...

Not sure there's anything specific about wild camping in the guide but there is on the site: https://www.cyclinguk.org/article/king-alfreds-way-faq#wild-camping which has a link to https://www.cyclinguk.org/wildcamping neither mentions toil duties.

Hmmm, that's problematic then.

I'm quite keen on squeezing KAW into a long weekend sometime this summer, but I think I'll either be 'legal' campsite camping and/or possibly being lazy and doing a B&B perhaps. I'm not fancying conflicts with locals TBH

It’s entirely possible to wild camp discreetly and responsibly at loads of places on the route. If you do it right no one will ever know you were there. It’s people who don’t do it right that will cause, and experience, conflict with the locals.

+1 to this. We wild camped for three nights and unless you actually saw us camping you wouldn’t know we had been there. No litter, no fires and we scurried the grass/leaves before leaving so there wasn’t the telltale tent “footprint”.

The troublesome section is between Goring and Fliss. Away from that it’s much less populated so easier to camp

Where is Fliss, we are hoping to do 3 nights starting in Reading, think somewhere beyond Petersfield for first night, that's about 200km from Reading, although some regular campsites are around that area, not going to wildcamp if a campsite with a shower and bog is nearby

Petersfield is on the sdw section, well a few km off. Lots of bits of woodland to use on the trail itself. You may meed to go 100mtr for spme seclusion, find a flat area, get away from the dog shiite.
Lots of corners of feilds as well.
A few pop up campsites were in operation last weekend, both i saw maybe a 10mim ride away. Meon springs fishery might also have a camping feild its en rpute, plus cafe iirc.

Edit
Holden farm at cheriton looks ok. Ace brew pub nearby, not far from the sdw at all.
Quiet village location too.

Reading - Petersfield is more like 125km ish if you’re following the KAW

There is the youth hostel at Wantage/letcombe. Not sure if open yet, but is right on the ridge way.

A 29er with fast rolling tyres are super quick on the road surface too so not sure why they have fallen out of fashion.

Fashion

Gravel bikes are the latest 'thing' (before that it was plus bikes, before that it was fat bikes). I wait to see what the next niche will be.

I do see the appeal behind them, but their use case over a CX bike or XC bike seems extremely limited.

Reading – Petersfield is more like 125km ish if you’re following the KAW

Yeah just saw that, fat fingers, I meant to say 100km...no way am I doing 200km in a day!!

Fliss is just before Petersfield.

Gravel bikes do make sense out in the mid-west of the States where you've hundreds of kilometres of gravel roads. Can make sense here but many seem to be road bikes with a bit more tyre clearance - I tested one, the gearing was ridiculous for off-road use.

Gravel bikes are great, just a different challenge needing a different attitude. Can never understand why people get so upset by others riding them.

God knows there’s enough threads on this forum about whether gravel bikes are great or rubbish without this turning into another one.

True

Not all gravel bikes are the same. Surely get one with the tyre clearance and gearing that suits the riding you do. Mine has relatively big tyres and low gearing as its used more off road, but others I know have ones that are little more than beefed up road bikes. Horse for courses.

Anotber potential is The Milburys, pub pub on the sdw. Were allowing campervans to use the feild next to the pub for while.
Might be worth a phone call, given the KAW popularity any landlord not cashing in on the lucrative trend setting gravel market, with potential of dozens of overnight stoppers all eating and drinking, would be mad

The Millburys pub has been used for bike race HQ so they’re used to lots of smelly folks in Lycra 🤪

Fliss is just before Petersfield.

Do you mean "Liss"?

Quite likely- no wonder we never found it 😀

TD folk manage with rigid bikes to go fast and have less breakages - many lose the feelings in their hands for a few weeks after getting to the 'Wells. I was happy on a FS but was never getting below 21 days, so comfort counts for me. I did the KAW on the Tallboy last season and was very happy to have the boing around me...... going to get the double done this summer on the same machine once I can get the weather, legs and a support crew lined up my other half can't safely drive n crew for long enough to get a 48 hour in the bag.

Wild camping and bike packing in general is not my thing so me and my OH did the KAW over 4 days with Rough ride guides,staying in pubs/hotels,I was on my Orange Segment and she was on her 20 year old Giant nrs,we had a fantastic time and we want to do it again to see some of the sites we missed
https://www.roughrideguide.co.uk/King-Alfreds-Way-Supported-Events---New-September-date-and-last-few-remaining-places-in-June

I completed the route on my SS gravel bike with 38mm tyres. Coming from a mountain bike background, I found the descents fun and challenging in places. I could have cleaned more of the climbs on my geared bike, but it's nice to get off and take in the countryside sometimes.

I wouldn't use a mtn bike on the route, for me, it's simply not technical enough to warrant the extra weight and lack of hand positions. I completed the route over 3 days and cycled to the start from Bristol along a mostly traffic free route to Devizes. Took it at a leisurely pace and stopped in plenty of pubs for 'refreshments', inc the rather lovely one at the top of "the Devil's punchbowl".

[img] [/img]

I start the KAW on Thursday, and am taking my Giant Anthem. I've fitted Nobby Nics for fast rolling and will run higher pressures in the tyres and shocks than usual. I could've taken the Arkose but I'm not in a hurry so I'm sure I'll appreciate the extra comfort. Plus I can divert and do a lap at the QE bike park.

I completed the route on my SS gravel

Did you camp or bivvy?

Did you camp or bivvy?

I wild camped the first night and then stayed in the the Travel Inn the second night as I knew I'd have the long day at the end. Lovely Indian takeaway that delivers in Winchester. 😊

[img] [/img]
[img] [/img]
[img] [/img]

@hopster

Awesome endurance, especially on a SS. What gearing did you use?

Awesome endurance, especially on a SS. What gearing did you use?

38x17 is the gear I normally run, but with luggage a swap the 17t to a 18t cog.