[Closed] (Jumping) How to consciously practice “heavy feet” during take off?

You are not actively pulling, your arms have just reached the end of their range of motion.

The result of which pulls the bars in the required direction.

Pulling with a straight arm is still pulling.

The result of which pulls the bars in the required direction.

Pulling with a straight arm is still pulling.

The point is when teaching someone to manual or bunny hop it is easier and simpler to not think about pulling the bars towards you and focus of weight transfer.

By all means keep on arguing about what is it means to pull on something, it really helps beginners understand the mechanics of it 😆

Oh jesus, why is Tug o War so hard to understand. Your arms are just holding onto the rope.

You shift you weight back over your heels. Your arms then straighten as you have moved your weight back. Because you arms are only so long, once they become straight the weight transfer of hips over your heels pulls the rope.

You are NOT pulling with you arms, they have reached the limit of being straight and the weight transfer and pushing with your feet is what pulls the rope.

Make sense?

The point is when teaching someone to manual or bunny hop it is easier and simpler to not think about pulling the bars towards you and focus of weight transfer.

So basically, what you are saying, is that you do in fact pull on the bars, but via weight transfer with straight arms.

But it's better for teaching a novice, not to describe it as pulling on the bars in case they do it by bending their arms.

The point is when teaching someone to manual or bunny hop it is easier and simpler to not think about pulling the bars towards you and focus of weight transfer

That is the point. But repeating that pulling = wrong is going to confuse people if they can't imagine how it's done without their arms pulling on the bars.

Actually, it really is as simple as going out, find a jump (smaller the better), and PRACTICE. When I say practice I mean spend an hour. Do it 30 times. Just keep doing it till u have a sense of the dynamics involved. Then find a bigger different jump and repeat. Why think it comes easy? No,it requires PRACTICE. You don't buy it, you PRACTICE. Nothing sadder than blokes on 5k bikes dodging easy jumps. Just put the time in. It's really not that hard. Then start building jumps so we can all enjoy. Ooops someone is going to accuse me of trolling... I know they are... I can feel it...

That is the point. But repeating that pulling = wrong is going to confuse people if they can't imagine how it's done without their arms pulling on the bars.

Not it's not. Most people instinctively pull the bars towards them and don't ever learn how to manual or do proper bunnyhops as the mechanics are counter-intuitive.

Teaching people to forget about pulling and the arms and focusing on the weight shift and the feet overcomes this.

A bit like the trampoline example when learning to jump. Yes you can bunny hop of the lip of a jump , but it is far easier to teach someone simply to push their feet into the transition rather than [u]again[/u] trying to pull the bike upwards.

I bet just about everyone on this thread bar GW, Euro and dean are shit at jumping, bunny hopping and manualling 😆 I'm out, i've had enough arguing with armchair experts for one day.

It's the same as the Snatch in Olympic weight lifting. You think people pick up 200kg with their arms and lift it over head.
Just because they're holding on to the bar.
No. It's a lower body/upper back movement. Extension of the ankle, knee and hip & elevation of the shoulders propel the bar upwards. The arms just connect the body to the object (bar in this case). It's the same when manualing

I found the best way to learn to jump was to practice repeatedly, fall off frequently and persist until it works. (It still doesn't always work).

I've tried to explain how to jump countless times to my friend who's getting into riding and I just can't put it into words. You've just got to get a feel for it through trial and error I think. I started off riding bmx and I guess it's pretty similar to pumping/flowing around a skatepark, just one of those things you'll pick up.

Most people instinctively pull the bars towards them and don't ever learn how to manual or do proper bunnyhops as the mechanics are counter-intuitive.

So you don't actually [i]say[/i] "pull" because they will instinctively "pull" in a different way (by bending their arms)

It's a teaching technique.

It doesn't mean that they aren't pulling on the bars. And to say that they aren't is bollx.

It just means that a teaching technique is being used to get them to pull in the correct way, rather than the way they may feel is more natural.

I am really pleased with myself after tonights ride, i havent been jumping much recently, but on a nice sized double in Esholt, I cleaned it really well, front wheel down first, nice and smooth 🙂

Euro interesting advice, thanks. Can you elaborate on these points?

Sorry, Teamhurtyhurty, didn't see this before my semi-flounce, i'll try to expand.

Your pump is not like an on/off switch, it's more like a dimmer and you can dial in varied amounts depending on your need. Want to go long to clear that gap? Speed and a little bit of pump will do lovely. Want to go high? Turn the pump dial up to eleven - go can go slow and high or fast and very high but as your speed increases the actual time you have to execute the pump on the transition is shortened. That's why i think it's a good idea to have a take-off that's, at the very least, a bike length long when getting the hang of it - it's give you a bigger window to get the timing right.

Personally, i prefer to jump on a hardtail. With the rear of the bike not moving up or down, it's one less variable to worry about and unless you run the rebound fast (which i've found is bad and sore when jumping 😀 ) there'll be a suspension delay when you pump which can throw the timing out. For general jumping though, a full sus will do if that's what you're used to and all you have.

Successful jumping relies on timing your pump to match your speed and the transition of the jump. When starting out, you don't want to be turning up the pumpage dimmer too much until you are comfortable jumping with a little pump applied. Gradually increase your pump effort over time as you get comfortable with the bike getting air. You'll feel when the time is right to up apply more pump as your jumping will seem effortless. You'll might need to either slow down a touch or find a bigger jump if you are going to pump up the pump.

Today's programme what brought to you by the word Pump.

That is the point. But repeating that pulling = wrong is going to confuse people if they can't imagine how it's done without their arms pulling on the bars.

/armchair-not-very-expert

and thanks to euro, maxtorque and others whose jump advice I shall endeavour to try out next time I find some 🙂

Mark Weir pump track

I learnt to jump on a BMX I still prefer to jump fully rigid as I still sometimes mistime the pump with suspension and it sort of bounces me into the air rather than I did anything much

Thankfully suspension is much more forgiving on landing

Amongst all the claptrap it has been informative

[i]Ooops someone is going to accuse me of trolling... I know they are... I can feel it...[/i]

nah, you're not trying to validate your opinions about yourself through the medium of belittling or insulting a group you unknowningly feel excluded from; are you?

Say perhaps like our friend Empty Bell

So.................. having read all this I know not to pull up with my arms, but I'm still confused about the pump.

Presta or Schrader, or one that will do both ?

You're thinking too small, you need to stoke up your gnarr a bit more ....

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So you're saying i'm full of shit?

No, I'm saying that the 'heavy feet light hands' is widely considered a good default way to be on the bike. There are plenty of times when you actively weight the bars strongly and likewise pull on the bars with maximum force - but they are dynamic temporary moves.

Wow, this has been an interesting read indeed.

Maxtorque's:

If you have timed all that right, as the bike leaves the lip of the jump, it's suspension should be fully drooped (uncompressed), your legs straight (or practically so), and you arms straightish. What really helped for me was thinking not about jumping up, [b]but about really trying to push the bike into the ground, practically trying to shove it through the face of the ramp.[/b]

and Euro's

OP - try this little experiment. Pretend you are on your bike and stand accordingly - feet where your feet would be on the pedals (with strong foot forward and knees bent) and hands on the pretend bars, elbows bent. Now jump as high as you can holding this position. In order to leave the ground, you will have lowered your body by bending your legs before springing up into the air. This is what the pump feels like and it's the bit that you need to practice. Once you can jump really high (you'll be bending very low indeed and springing up quickly) you need to work on the timing as far too many people pump out of sync with the ground they are riding - even when just riding trails.

These two bits have helped me figure it out the most. I sessions a (super) smaller jump last night out of a bomb hole and think I got the feel for the pump. I can say I definitely wasn't pumping before this thread so it's helped me out a load. Cheers!

I had a few moments where the saddle quite comfortably (oooerrr) touched my bum last night, but in a controlled phat-air-dude kind of way. Feet felt more planted. Guess it's now down to practice.

Cheers all.

I'm gonna say it's not 'your arms' pulling the front end up, but the front ends gets pulled up, because it's attached, via the arms, to the body which has shifted it's weight further back. If you had Mr tickle arms the front end would not leave the ground!!

😕 😀 😕

This is how you learn to jump a bike
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I clearly have no excuse for not hucking the BMX off the loading bay at work!

You didn't see the landing!

[i]Guess it's now down to practice[/i]

aye.

You need to find a wee jump in the woods, something that's preferably got a shallow downhill run to it so you don't have to pedal to begin with, and something that's not too severe, and just spend time on it.

I love the way that great stack of tyres has a clothes washing line "prop" as if it'll do anything 😆 ...I wonder if the bike stayed in one piece

Technically speaking his mates should all be laid on the ground for him to jump over, other than that its perfection! 😀

"Remember, heels down"

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Aged 12/13 I managed to convince 10 of my mates (all squished like sardines) to lie down in front of my 5 brick high ramp....with absolutely no chance of actually jumping that far.But hey....I'd be fine.Pedalled like billy'o and just as as I rolled up the ramp kid number one pokes his head up just enough to give me the perfect kick and enable me soar serenely over the lot of them and another 6ft to spare.At that point I became legend far and wide (well both local schools) as [b]the[/b] bmx kid.
Best..Day...Ever.

I did something similar...unfeasible amount of kids, me pedalling like a mad fool. At the very last minute, a kid in the middle (yes Neil Mackenzie, that would be you...) decides he doesn't want to be there, and starts to stand up...

The carnage was something to behold.

chiefgrooveguru

I clearly have no excuse for not hucking the BMX off the loading bay at work!

Without wishing to sound rude, i suspect you may weigh a tad more than that 11yo kid in that pic! Hence the flat landing, might be somewhat more tearjerking..... 😉

Reminds me of this:

If i did that^^^, at my age, i would shatter into a million pieces like a dropped china vase!

😉

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Dont pull on the handlebars

I've been on a number of skills courses now, and I've never really mastered jumping. I reckon, on reflection, that they've been the wrong sort of skills courses. They've always had one coach, calmly explaining techniques, encouraging practice and giving feedback on performance. I reckon I need to find a skills course where there are are several coaches who all stand around belittling and contradicting one another. Does anyone know where I could find such a course? 😉

A kid at school once asked me how to bunny hop... I had no idea, I just did it. Told him to hook one foot under his pedal and pull up, which kept him busy for a few hours. 😈

I find it really hard to explain how to do stuff to other people, especially jumping. Stay loose is the best advice I got! Just keep trying and it'll come good.

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At that point I became legend far and wide (well both local schools) as the bmx kid.
Best..Day...Ever.

Sounds pretty similar to my cycling career. All downhill from the age of 13 😆

grenosteve - Member
I find it really hard to explain how to do stuff to other people, especially jumping. Stay loose is the best advice I got! Just keep trying and it'll come good.

I still think that as far as the OP goes, there are literally hundreds of "how to" videos out there though and it only takes one of them to 'click' and help you progress a bit further.

My advice would be make sure that you have spent your youth riding bikes over jumps, walls, street furniture etc for several hours every day for several years.

Trying to learn from scratch in the spare 1.5 hours you get every Sunday when you're 40 years old is never going to work well. Especially when you spend a significant proportion of that time watching internet 'how to' videos.

HTH

Another useful tip is to build jumps.

I have just completed a new one in the woods and been practicing on it. Seems to work a treat. Nice shape and easy to relax and get it wrong as it has a good landing ramp.

I can build it up as I improve