[Closed] Is 65 degree head angle too much for a beginner

No.  TBH it depends on the bike as a whole, riding a full on Downhill bike along smooth, flat trails will be a bit of a drag.

What's the bike and what kind of riding do you do.

Nukeproof scout 275 took my fancy

so far Pines and Cannock red routes. They’ve been a real pain and think I’d benefit from bigger than 26x2 tyres for starters

You may find that bigger, grippiier tyres work wonders, even on steeper xc bike.

I'd happily ride that around Cannock.  I used to do it on a £200 Claude Butler thing with 3x7 gears and 80mm of undamped suspension.  then similar hardtail to the Nukeproof, then a 5 inch FS.  Each one has been better than the last, but the biggest jump was to the long travel hardtail, the modern geometry made a big difference.

no

No. But my 67 degree 120mm hardtail is a fair bit quicker and possibly more fun at Cannock than my 65 degree 150/160 bike. If that helps!.

It's not too much, it just dulls the trails a bit. However, if you want to start doing things like Stile Cop, bigger bike parks etc then the 65 degree bike will feel a lot nicer 🙂 if you're just planning on hitting more stuff like Cannock then a 67ish 130ish bike might make them more fun.

A lot of it is personal taste though.

Great thanks for the advice. I’m not planning to be a downhill god so it sounds like I may be better off with something a little milder to get the most enjoyment.

67 and 130mm sounds like it may be better than 65 and 140 then.

Will the bike take a headset angle adjuster , if its a great deal and the bike fits you - you could try it at 65 and adjust it if its too slack .

When Cannock was fairly local to me, I rode bikes when 68 degrees was considered slack and 70 degrees was xc.  I think the last time I rode there I was on either a On-One C456 or a Lapierre Zesty.  Both 26inch wheels.

Things have probably improved since then but it always seemed the slacker bikes I rode were more like a barge round some of the tighter turns and the more xc oriented bikes better in the tight stuff but a bit less stable on steep or flat out sections and drops.

Cannock isn't that technical, so I reckon 65 would be a bit too slack.  A couple of degrees steeper than 65 would still give some confidence compared to your current set up.

A 65 deg head angle on a typical hardtail will actually be more like a 67 deg full-sus, because when a hardtail sags it get steeper (whilst a full-sus gets a bit slacker under sag).

no it'll be absolutely fine

TBH you'll likely find it easier than you would if you'd spent 20 years on old school geometry- you don't have as much coping-with-rubbishness to unlearn as a lot of folks did so you'll likely be able to just get on with it.

(if that sounds a bit rude, it is but it's exactly what happened to me when I switched to suspension- I'd built up years of knowing how to ride around skinny tyres and rigid forks, so the sheer change to bikes that work was trouble by itself.)

I wouldn’t worry too much tbh,

for years i was convinced i preferred short travel, steeper geometry bikes.

until i burst a pair of forks on my hardtail at laggan, i managed to get them working again, after removing the spacers, (they were spaced down to 80mm travel) after removal they were 130mm.

it was the most travel i had ridden, ever, to my surprise I really liked it, it didn’t feel at all the way i expected.

Don’t get fixated on one number, it’s rarely that simple.

Edit: i agree with northwind too.

It'll be fine, I've got a Scout it's great for normal riding around. It's even my go to bike for trips to the shops ect 😊

You'll be fine at Cannock on a slack bike.

Can Rebas have their travel reduced?

I guess there’s ways of fixing it by either changing travel or the headset adjusters.

Decisions decisions!

Travel reduced will deepen the HA.

There is a lot more to a bike than just the HA in isolation. Try some demo bikes if you can. Cy Turner of Cotic explained it really well in the STW vid with Wii, a slacker/ longer bike can be good for any rider when it is done as a complete package as it is nice and stable which is good for beginners as much as an experienced Gnar-whale.

Are you sure it’s the bike? What aren’t you finding fun/struggling with?

Part of the struggle is fitness, but it's also pretty harsh which I hoped bigger tyres would help with.

I'm due a new bike anyway (and also want to treat myself due to a recent work redundancy!), the current one's 7 years old and needing a bit of work here and there.

Like chiefguru says 65 will be more like a trail FS bike at sag, my HT is 66° but it feels a lot steeper on the trails than my old 67° FS.

I ride Cannock a lot (going over in the morning for the first time this year though 😱) and a scout was on my shortlist when I bought mine, but it was a bit out of budget

Slack bikes take a bit of getting used to on trail centres; you need to have your shoulders right above the bars on berms & stuff or you'll get no grip at all from the front wheel. For everything else I think they're brilliant, they are much more forgiving on steep hand built/natural trails.

65 degrees is no problem. It's a matter of taste and matter of biking style. Have slack bikes and ones which are more "old fashioned". Both fine - and fine for beginners as well...

Proposal: sounds like your bike was designed for a 100 mm fork?

Your bike will change dramatically when you swap the fork. Put a 130 mm fork in and pick one where you are able to put a 2.3 or 2.4 wide front tire in. Front rim inner bead width 25 mm or so (minium). Rest of the bike unchanged.

My opinon: many mountain (trail) bikes simply have too short travel forks. For me the 80 or 100 mm forks were the fun-killers. Full suspension bikes are fine with 120/120 or similar. On a trail hardtail I like to have minium 130 mm travel... and minium 2.3 wide front tires...

The 65 degree head angle I like. But I like to bike other, "less slack" bikes as well. Don't judge the 65 degree bike as "more difficult" or so.

On flat stuff like cannock, you'll have to ride more confidently weighting the front wheel more to get it to grip.

Though you're looking at a ht, so a 65ha will be 67+ by the time the forks are sagged, go for it.

I'd be concerned about understeer and lack of front wheel grip on that terrain on a fs enduro gnarpoon bike.

The current one is a bit of a pain for stuff like that. Straight steerer and 26” wheels. Hard to find forks and tyres and reluctant to spend on old tech.

Sounds like I should just bite the bullet and buy it and see if I like it. It’s a 2018 model so shouldn’t be a hard sell in 6 months if not for me.

Unless anyone in Nottingham fancies letting me have a go on their modern bike tomorrow? 😉

Any excuse is a good excuse for a new bike! Although bigger tyres and/or dropping the pressure a bit might help? Is the bike more fun on the blue runs?

65 ha with 160mm on a HT is a great all rounder for me. No downsides with a decently steep seat angle for climbing.

@nickfrog:

sounds good!

Yes - HT and 160 mm travel is GREAT!

The two most relevant replies were already given:

Chiefgrooveguru:

A 65 deg head angle on a typical hardtail will actually be more like a 67 deg full-sus, because when a hardtail sags it get steeper (whilst a full-sus gets a bit slacker under sag).

Would you be asking the same question if it was a 67 degree full sus? Or, if you had already known a hardtail at 65 degrees will actually be more like 67 once you're on it?

Bigjim:

no it’ll be absolutely fine

Head angles, inversely directly proportional to pension age.

I ride Cannock a lot and don't think the head angle will make much of a difference unless the bike rides like a pig in general, which it probably won't.

What I have noticed there though, is that some of the newer trail features, such as the new stream crossing and the end of the first section, are possibly better suited to bigger wheels.

All cleanable with 26" wheels of course, but some of the gaps in those pesky stones swallow a smaller wheel very nicely.

Essentially, as long as you get used to what ever bike you choose before tackling something tricky, you'll be fine.