Inserts to prevent pinch flats?

Happy with various previous version Vittoria Airliners. Suspect the new shaped one will be just as good

I stuck a Rimpact v2 in the rear wheel of my full sus beginning of last year, don't think I've had a flat since then. Less pricey than the other options at ~£45 a wheel, but still pricey for a bit of fancy foam! Personally I can't recall more than 1 front wheel flat in the last 10 years, so I've not needed one in the front wheel. Have since bought another Rimpact for my hardtail.

Rimpacts are half the price of Cushcore and do the same thing. They've saved me a fortune in tyres and rims.

Yes they change the ride feel, it's like adding suspension to your tyres. I like it.

Yes they make the sidewalls more rigid making it much harder to burp a tyre.

I think a pair of them weighs around the same as one decent 29er innertube.

It sounds like you don't need or want them so I wouldn't bother.

Just go tubeless with a decent tyre and sealant? A good tyre at the right pressure will feel great. Thick sidewalls feel awful.

You could still get tougher tyres instead of inserts which could solve your issues, unless you're already riding DH casing tyres?

I can't say that I notice the supposed improved ride quality aspects of inserts but I guess it makes them sound better from a marketing perspective.

rimpact make riding far smoother, got them in all my bikes, including gravel.

a few grams of foam isnt gonna make much difference to a ebike weight, i cant tell on a 9-10kg gravel bike

that last pinch flat/ding i had was on some brand new dt swiss alu rims, i'd received the rimpact the day before but decided i didnt have the time to fit them and sods law was looking at my garmin went over a water bar and properly dinged them. :0( last time i had to dig out a tube

i tend to bunny hop (badly) water bars, easier on rims

Get Rimpact Pro inserts, they have virtually eliminated pinch flats for me.

You'll be raving about them if you're gettign a load now.

Rimpact original v1s on my trail bike. The v2 are a bit wider which I feared would make tyre fitting more difficult, so on my lite ebike I've just fitted Panzers. More difficult rim profile on these wheels but difficulty was about the same, so perhaps balanced out.

Trouble is to me, thicker sidewalls feel terrible a higher pressure and so I’ve gone low to maintain some control and grip.

Same. And at the lower pressure where they feel good, burping air and sealant. That's without an insert, which I couldn't manage to fit, and really was meant to be a net neutral weight exchange anyway by dropping the insert.

I think a pair of them weighs around the same as one decent 29er innertube

90g each for rimpact original 29er. As it happens I just weighed a 29er tube and it was 270g.

I use Panzers coz a big Pinkbike review said they were pretty good, light, cheap, and easier to install than most. Found that to be true, and I prefer the feel of less stiff sidewall tires at lower pressures with the insert. It stopped rim pinch snakebites on the tubeless set ups so yes, it will resolve your issues.

Hate: getting them into tires & onto rims, and even worse getting tires off again, has taken a lot of screaming frustration and thumbs like Geoff Capes. If I ever have a huge tire slashing issue on a trail I'm not sure I'd be able to resolve.  The way they turn any sealant into rolling stanimals inside the tire a bit of a pain.

Love: the traction they give, esp on the rear, at lower than normal pressures, the support they give to both tires at lower than normal pressures when leaning over in hard turns, that it removes snakebite risk.

EDIT: additional note - have thus far failed to be able to install in a kryptotal enduro casing on the rear of my eeb. after an hour of trying I sat on the floor of garage, sobbing, covered in sealant and trying to figure out how I would pull myself up with forearms and hands as useless as a t-rex.

have thus far failed to be able to install in a kryptotal enduro casing on the rear of my eeb. after an hour of trying I sat on the floor of garage, sobbing, covered in sealant and trying to figure out how I would pull myself up with forearms and hands as useless as a t-rex.

Haha, if you don't have one of these, you can thank me later:

https://www.bikeparts.co.uk/products/icetoolz-dh-tyre-lever-for-aluminium-or-carbon-rims?currency=GBP&variant=42158038057117&stkn=a894e8283159&msclkid=f2ceaa7717dd1a034523cc823e25eb00&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=.S%20Shopping&utm_term=4582283439568086&utm_content=Custom%20Targeting%20Strategy

I've got some large metal tyre levers which make the job slightly easier. Top tip is to wrap the ends in insulation tape to stop them gouging your rims.

I have 2 pairs of Rimpact Pros and 2 new bikes. Both pairs of Rimpacts are hanging on the garage wall because I'm not ready for the physical and psychological battle of fitting them. I do much prefer having them in there though. The 'feel' isn't just marketing waffle. It's like turning down the volume on trail chatter and I find it almost impossible to burp the tyres so I hit corners much harder.

One of mine needs to be converted to 27.5 to fit the new mullet. I'm going to try shortening it by cutting a chunk out and gluing it back together. It might save me £40 which is the cost of a new one.

I'm a fan of lighter tyres at lower pressures with inserts.

I used Cushcore because that's what I tried first. Some people say that inserts can make the tyre feel dead through the high ramp up, but I don't find that with Cushcore.

If I was buying again, I'd use the slightly lighter weight Cushcores.

Examining them whenever I change tyres is interesting because it shows just how many pinch flats they've prevented.

I actually find it easier to fit tyres with Cushore than without because they tend to inflate straight away.

"I’ve long been against the idea of inserts. Mainly because I don’t need them."

Sounds like you do though! Get some Rimpacts - the normal ones, not pro will be fine. They're light and not too horrible to fit. I recommend buying a Cushcore Bead Dropper tyre lever to help fit them - I've got pretty strong hands and it still makes a useful difference in easing the job.

" I’m not ready for the physical and psychological battle of fitting them"

Buy a Bead Dropper! If you use that and make sure you push the bead right under the insert as you work your way around you'll find it's really not that hard.

Examining them whenever I change tyres is interesting because it shows just how many pinch flats they’ve prevented.

Same. One pair of my Rimpacts went to Malaga for a week and when I came back it looked like I'd attacked it with a knife.

When I was there in 2012 with DH tyres I remember fixing lots of punctures and truing my wheels every night.

I run a pair because the last tyre I destroyed was on the front. This was on the sharp edge of a tiny rock on a fairly tame trail. For the value of the increased protection the weight is meaningless.

We've got a couple of bikes running Vittoria Airliners in the rear for pinch flat protection and they work great (fixed the issues we were having and been good for the last year). Just running the small xc size even in 2.5" tyres so they are easy to fit and work with standard tubeless valves. Got them for £20 at the time but no offers at the moment, and the new version is a different shape. Amazon seems to do some with very similar cross section for not much money. Shape is like this:

https://www.highonbikes.com/products/vittoria-air-liner-tubeless-tyre-insert

Buy a Bead Dropper! If you use that and make sure you push the bead right under the insert as you work your way around you’ll find it’s really not that hard.

dont use gorilla tape as rim tape with rimpact insert as the tyre glues itself to teh tape and its a right bastard to get the tyre off. i ended up having to cut the tyre to get the insert out to allow me to get the tyre off!

The original Vittoria Airliners do exactly what you want. I'm not convinced the new version will work as well. There's ZZTO copies of the originals on ali express that are cheap enough to be worth trying.

I ran one on the rear and still got pinch flats which is much more annoying trail side than when you don't have an insert in.

Went back to heavy duty tyres and 30psi. Lasted well until recently when I must have landed on a an edge. Won't rush back to inserts.

There's no way I'd run 30psi in a DH tyre. It must bounce down the street like a skateboard. Maybe for commuting or canal paths but nothing else.

I run tannus armour insert and tube on my ebike rear wheel.  Been faultless for 3 years now.

There’s no way I’d run 30psi in a DH tyre. It must bounce down the street like a skateboard. Maybe for commuting or canal paths but nothing else.

Not at all. I'm putting 115kg through it and riding fairly rocky tracks. I've never liked less than 26 anyway, but I certainly don't suffer from lack of traction.

Have some Nukeproof ones in a set of 27.5 wheels and xc tyres. Have also used the old barbieri (pipe lagging) in cx tyres and wheels for racing. Have been pleased with both although getting the cx inserts and then the 33c vittoria wets  on was an absolute bastard. If I were using that tyre/wheel combo for road/bridleslaying I’d not bother with the inserts and just use higher pressure

Thanks all. Some good points raised here.

Just to clarify a few things, I'm already setup tubeless using Stans. I've always ridden Maxxis EXO but for the last ~6 months have been on a Bontrager SE6/5 combo which are definitely stiffer in the sidewall. Similar to an EXO+ but possibly a little stiffer.

They feel really good and I prefer the more damped feeling  vs the lighter tyres which always feel a bit pingy. I used to like that feeling but now in on the fence.

I'm only looking at the rear wheel as I've never had a problem with pinching the front, even at 15psi.

(did I mention I don't ride hard...)

I guess with an effective insert, I might get away with lighter tyres and still manage to achieve a more damped feeling by dropping the pressure and relying on the insert to keep the tyre in one piece.

That's kind of not what I had in mind though. I see the idea of an insert to be a bit like a seat belt in a car. It's there for emergencies when I would otherwise be pitching the tyre rather than rely on it entirely.

I did think about heavier still carcasses (Maxxis DD or Schwalbe Gravity) but it's a huge jump in woeght and I think it's overkill for my riding. I try and squeeze as many miles in as possible and I'm not pinching the tyres every ride. But, it's been happening fairly often recently where I've been out riding rocky terrain.

If I put more air in the tyre to stop it pinching, the handling suffers. If I run the tyres at a sweep spot for grip and compliance, I'll ding the rims and pinch the tyres which is why I thought an insert would help.

There's a few 'flat' looking inserts kicking around like  Rockstop  and  Slicy Smooth. They seem like they're designed to do what I want but I can't help thinking that they would move around in the tyre and end up twisting.

I'm liking the look of the Tannus Armour as a sort of in-between a full insert and a flat one. The Vittoria XC looks good too but I think it might be a bit undersized in a 2.4/2.5 tyre. Maybe that'll make it easier to fit!

I like the look of the Rimpact (Original v2). Similar shape to the XC Airliner but made for bigger tyres so possibly the sweet spot for me. For some reason, they hadn't show up while I was searching around. The Panzer look pretty similar in terms of shape and price so they're in the running as well.

Seeing as its a Friday, I might allow wine to make a decision for me later.

To give an idea of what the original Rimpacts can do, I dented the (very soft) rear rim on my Levo within a few weeks of getting it, and that was riding on muddy rooty trails, so slower and almost no rocks. I then put the Rimpacts in and got through literally a few years without adding any obvious rim dents, so plenty of miles on faster rougher trails, and that includes swapping those wheels onto my hardtail so the rear took quite a few hard hits.

I'd take the very marginal weight difference of the Rimpact Pro.

I've killed a rim with the original Rimpact in, but don't think I've even dented one with a Pro. They last much better too, as the denser cap layer is less prone to tearing.

If you just want pinch protection and easy fit / removal then adding an xc size old shape Vittoria (copy) works great in a 2.5 tyre for very little money. You don't get the same tyre support benefits of some other systems, but you also don't have the cost and fitting hassles.

I have used the cheapo ones from ebay on my old bike but since switching to a 29er I haven't bothered. I'm not saying that the wheel diameter makes the difference. But they roll for me over more obstacles more easily. Might be a coincidence but on Wednesdays night ride, only the 27.5 wheel guys got punctures.

The real reason is I now use the DH versions of the MM & BB tyres. Not by design but by chance as they were all I could get my hands on when I bought them and I felt sticking an insert in was a bit over kill.

You could just go to a tougher rear tyre - looks like the SE5 is quite light - found a review that suggests the 29x2.6” one is barely over 1kg.

I’m generally liking the enduro casing Contis which are quoted at 1125g but are probably more like 1200g. Not as heavy as a full on DH tyre and I’m pedalling them round quite happily on a Transition Sentinel that weighs 34-35lbs depending on which shock I’m running.

I have run the original rimpact in lighter tyres but I find them a bit annoying. The valves seem to clog up quite quickly with sealant and then it all has to come apart to sort it out (it’s not just the unscrewable core - but the side facing holes in the rimpact valves).

That said - they may well do what you need them to.

The Panzer look pretty similar in terms of shape and price so they’re in the running as well.

First ride on these today, I'm not sure I can recommend them for anyone looking for improved tyre hold on the rim to prevent burps.

Wild Enduro Front normal version, ran one for ages on my trail bike with a Rimpact original v1. It has the most supple sidewall I've had to feel by and on an MTB. Ran at 20psi, no burps. Same tyre now with Panzers, and on a tighter fitting rim, and on my light eMTB (4kg heavier than my trail bike) it's burping little bits of sealant at 23psi.

I can imagine the lack of a flat base ( https://www.pinkbike.com/photo/24968667/) means it doesn't hold the bead in place as good as Rimpact does.

Rimpact fan here too, had them in the rears on both the hardtail and full suss for over a year with no dramas yet (got fed up of splitting sidewalls on otherwise good tyres) Bit of a faff to fit though!

I just cut up one of my Rimpact Pros to try to shorten it. I've made a right mess!

First attempted to glue it with 2 pack epoxy Gorilla glue because I already had it in. It was impossible to hold it still in my hands without it sliding around and coming apart. Eventually the glue got too tacky and it was never going to work.

Second plan is this ...

I'm leaving it overnight so if it works I'll let you know tomorrow. If not I'll be spending 40 quid on a new one.

I fitted the 29er to the front no problem. It actually went on really easily.

@sharkattack I once bought some factory seconds Rimpact, and one turned out to be a 26" with a piece glued in to make it 29". Turns out it wasn't meant for sale and I got a refund. It's held for over two years.

Might be worth asking them what they use, or what common alternatives they recommend.

I am kind of curious how they do it but I don't want to turn this into a major operation. Basically I had a spare 29er and thought it was worth a try.

If it doesn't work I'll suck it up and buy one. If it gets me through 2 days of BPW next weekend I'll be very happy.

What glue did you use on the cable tied attempt?

I'd have thought something to bond the ends together rather than stick them. Something which melts the foam and creates a single piece. Bit like the glue for airfix but for foam instead.

What that is though, I have no idea.

What glue did you use on the cable tied attempt?

Same again as it's all I've got apart from tiny tubes of super glue.

My theory was that the first attempt at least built up a coating on the ends and prevents the second lot from being absorbed so much. It might be a better surface to for sticking together.

I'll check on it tomorrow. Don't let the suspense keep you awake tonight.

It’ll probably be fine as you’ve got the cable ties as well - normally you’d want the glue to be as flexible as the foam. I did it with contact adhesive, evostik, as advised on here - cover each end, let it dry fully, then add another coat and press them together once tacky as usual with evostik. No cable ties and still good some months on.

I think it's worked pretty well. On my test piece, with no cable ties, I tried to pull it apart and the foam failed before the glue.

It survived installation. It's inflated and holding air, even though the tyre has 3 plugs in it.

I'm not riding it because I'm full of cold and absolutely knackered. If it lasts a few month it was worth the effort.

Extra mass and power of an e-bike leading to pinch flats in spite of tougher tyres? This is why e-bikes cause more trail erosion. I know it'll likely lead to a flaming, but haven't seen anything to lead me to question the basic physics behind this. The increased erosion on trails around here (N Lakes) since e-bikes took off is also clear. I guess people want more fun and the consequences have to be accepted.

It has nothing to do with being on an ebike. My mention of it being an ebike was not even relevant to the problem. I just like to build a little atmosphere with my posts.

I'm running tyres well below the recommended pressure and as a result, I get occasionally get pinch flats.

Same thing happens on my hardtail if I drop the pressure too low.

This is why e-bikes cause more trail erosion

Incidentally, the tyres on the hardtail are the same width as those on my ebike. I therfore erode trails at a consistent rate, whichever bike I choose to ride.

Sorry, I dont think for a second that ebikes are to blame for the erosion of your trails. The bike doesn't get up in the hills by itself. There are plenty of inconsiderate idiots on regular bikes too you know.

If there was a huge uptake in non assisted bikes, would you dislike trail bikes and blame them for erosion?

What you're saying sounds very anti cycling. Obviously, being STW no one on here actually rides bikes but it's not often I see the comments against the idea of people riding them.

Back on track... I eroded rode 30 odd miles today with more air in the back. No dings or punctures despite some less than careful line choices but it felt skittish.

I'm going to give an insert a go. I've narrowed it down to Panzer vs Rimpact. Very little between them really.

Have been running Cushcore XC in Assegai/DHR2 for last 1200 miles, no issues. Bit of a pig to fit initially (c. 20 mins of swearing). Just (last night) fitted Vittoria Airliner XC into a spare wheelset  (XR391 rims, 2.35 Barzo tyres with a few miles on them already). Absolute joy to fit. Took c.12 mins per end, and didn't involve covering the kitchen in tyre spaff either. Looking forward to trying them.

This is why e-bikes cause more trail erosion.

I cause more trail erosion on my un powered bikes than I do on my Ebike on account of I ride them more than the Ebike.

Stupid statements are stupid.

Back on topic.

Inserts are not always the answer.

DH tyre and Rimpact Pro last week.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/stu-b/54013638351/in/dateposted/

^ ouch.

Stick? Pointy rock through the sidewall?

Bit of a pig to fit initially (c. 20 mins of swearing)

Tru dat.

Try fitting them in 33mm CX tyres...#closetotears

🙂

No idea.

The trail is covered in large square loose rock on top of bedrock though.

Thought it was just a sidewall tear at first but it's actually a snake bite.

Also smashed the valve out of the rim later on in the week too.

That was defo a flying rock.

One thing i have noticed with inserts is  sometimes they seem to stop the sealant getting to any small cuts in time to seal them up.

That hole for example didn't actually blow any sealant out despite a measure and a half of Stans in the tyre.

Got the airliner in my enduro bike at the rear, it's crap compared to the nukeproof ard ones on my ebike and they're so much better.

The airliner rattles around in the wheel but was easier to put on.  I picked up the nukeproofs in the CRC firesale and didn't notice that they were mullet ones - sweet baby jesus getting a 27.5 insert into a 29" wheel was an interesting task, but got it done with a bit of trimming - It wasn't like i could send them back!  We're all running ridiculous low pressures now, it's great. When i got a puncture that wouldn't seal (i'd not topped up the sealant for ages) i rolled home on the insert.

Downside is that I definitely wouldn't rate my chances of putting a tube in on the trailside.

The airliner rattles around in the wheel but was easier to put on.

It's not the correct size then. There's a careful balance between getting it tight enough not to rattle and still being reasonable to get on.

Well, a Rimpact V2 has been delivered!

I faffed around trying to decide for far to long and by the time I'd ordered it was too late for it to arrive before the weekend. I wish I'd have had it in on Sunday after a rock/ wheel incident that cost me a whole tyre full of sealant and a puncture on the bead that refused to seal.

Anyway... It's a lot chunkier than I was expecting (hoping). I'm not looking forward to fitting it.

Next dilemma is whether I fit it with my current tyre for a proper comparison or whether I go back to an EXO casing. I have a feeling that whatever I choose is going to be fairly permanent given how much faff it's going to be getting it on!

They are not that hard to fit or remove. Like any tyre make sure the bead is in the middle of the rim. With an insert that means using a tyre lever to push the bead under the insert. Do that an it's easy enough (even on the 33mm CX tyres I did last night with tubolite inserts).

If you want a real bas##rd of a challenge (pun intended) try fitting challenge hand made tubeless CX tyres! The first bead on those is harder than any MTB tyre I've ever fitted before and the second is worse. The hand made tyres are fussy when new so very difficult to hold in shape and they the bead on. For these it was critical the bead next to the valve went on last because otherwise there was not enough stretch in the tyre (the valve makes distance longer). Also had to use a tyre key (not lever!) to get the last bit of the bead which I've never had to do with MTB tyres with or without inserts.

Dear god.

So, had a bit of a wobble on the back wheel after clouting a rock last week so whipped the tyre off to try and sort it. Found a cracked nipple so replaced that and patched the tape.

Refitted the tyre loosely and put the insert in. It took some determination and cable ties but I got it in. I just about managed to get the tyre fully onto the rim but the bead had curled around the insert and no amount of pumping was going to seat it.

Insert out, tyre off. Cleaned the old sealant off the bead (properly this time), refitted and seated the tyre without the insert. Dumped the air and pulled one side of the tyre off.

Stuffed the insert in, wrestled the tyre into place and managed to get it inflated only to find air was leaking from the spoke holes so added some sealent and hoped for the best.

That didn't happen so pulled it all off again and found the patch of tape had lifted so retaped the whole wheel.

Tyre back on, insert in, second bead on. Inflated the tyre with no more leaks around spokes only to find that the puncture I'd picked up last week hadn't sealed so stabbed a noodle through the tyre. That was never going to work because I hadn't added any sealant...

Added some sealant and seated the tyre. Found that a couple of the other repair noodles were pinched between the bead and the rim so had leaks. Deflated and unseated the tyre, wiggled the noodles around so they wouldn't get pinched. Inflated the tyre, no leaks anywhere!

Stood back to marvel at my own magnificence and realised the tyre was on backwards.

It's now fitted and inflated in the correct orientation. 5 hours after I started.

Im not sure what I'm enjoying more, the taste of beer or the soothing coolness of the glass against my harrowed skin.

This insert thing had better be amazing...

I bet you go out and pinch the front tyre.

Dropped on a girl at the side of the trail in Finale a couple of weeks ago who had crashed and a rock had snapped the valve off on her front wheel. She had three guys with her and they had snapped all there tyre levers trying to get the tyre off. It had a insert fitted. They had an inertube but couldn't move the tyre at all to fit it

We had some plastic coated metal levers and a spare valve in the back pack. Managed to move the tyre and insert enough to get the valve out and a new one in.

No way was the tyre coming off the rim trail side. She thought she had a 12 km push back to Finale

I'm not convinced they are worth the faff when it goes wrong on the trail.

 sharkattack

I bet you go out and pinch the front tyre.

Quiet you!

I managed to do the whole thing using just the tools that I carry in my rucksack. Made a point of doing that. I reckon I can get it off trailside if I have to but I really hope I don't have to.

How well I'd fare doing it at the end of a long ride, in the rain and the wind with fading light and enthusiasm is questionable though.

I've also been carrying a spare valve around me since the same thing happened to me. Snapped it off at the rim when the wheel went into an unseen rut. Pretty sure my pump wouldn't reseat the tyre though so not sure why I bother!

I reckon you could ride 12km on a Rimpact if you had to. You couldn't ride a flat tyre.

I've been very vocal about how difficult they are to fit and remove but to be fair I think mine have loosened up a bit. The last tyre change was relatively painless.

I'd still always run a pair though! The last tyre I destroyed was a front one. For the negligible weight difference I'd take the security every time.

Since running the Rimpacts I've had zero broken rims or slashed tyres. They've saved me a small fortune.

Don't use them and can't see the benefit of them myself. Seems to be a complete pita to fit (and remove), and if you run a sensible psi, it shouldn't be really be needed. Sensible being 20-25psi.
Saying that, the only flats that I seem to fix are for the kids at coaching sessions, so appears my mates have their own technique sorted to prevent pinch flats as well.
It appears plenty people can't ride without them...and there are plenty who can.
I'd try 5psi more in the tyre and see how that goes first. The ebike is heavier and generates more torque so it will cause more erosion, but it will also have slightly heavier impacts, so a wee bit more air should help.

Don’t use them and can’t see the benefit of them myself. Seems to be a complete pita to fit (and remove), and if you run a sensible psi, it shouldn’t be really be needed.

Where do you live? How heavy are you? How fast are you? What trails do you ride? What bike do you ride? Are you a DH racer or a mincer? Do you ride down bridelways or cliff faces? When's the last time you hung up on a gap and exploded a rim?

I get that they're not for everyone but pretending they're unnecessary for everyone is just daft.

Yeah, aware all that has an impact on choice...I'm not as heavy as I used to be, but my musings aren't just based on my riding...got plenty mates who are properly heavy on their bikes and riding far rockier trails than I do and they don't run them either.
It must work as plenty folk use them, but I also suspect a touch more air and that will help do the same.

I always run 20-25 psi but adding more air is not the same as having a 30mm foam crash barrier between your rims and tyres.

I'm not saying you can't ride without them obviously. I've ridden mostly DH style riding since the 90's and for almost all of that time, inserts didn't exist. For me they're a very welcome development.

At 20psi, I was getting pinch flats. At 25,the back end was just skittish and horrible.

I remember watching a Sam Pilgrim video of him doing stupid but entertaining stuff. He said he runs 40psi in his tyres.

I think riding style is important to consider when we talk about tyre pressure. I don't want a bike that feels like a coiled spring, I want something forgiving that let's me bimble way down steep techy stuff with as much control as possible. For that, I need soft tyres and suspension that works for me. Im sure if you stuck a Pro rider (or even someone mildly better) on my bike, they'd find it soft and rubbish. Equally, if I jumped on a competition ready enduro bike, I'd probably fall off at the first corner and burst into flames at the side of the track. Different bikes for different things.

With my tyres at a pressure that gives the grip level I need, they were too soft and punctured too easily so inserts make sense. I'm still not totally sure I'm sold on the whole, ride damping feel that gets thrown about but time will tell I guess.

First ride today. Nothing to report. Didn't actually feel any different really. To be fair, I was in Surrey Hills which isn't somewhere I've ever had issues with pinch flats. It's fairly tame as far as terrain goes so not really the best test.

I did come up short on a step down/drop thing and cased the back wheel into the landing. I would have expected to hear a nasty twang as the wheel hit but it just made a thud. Maybe it's the insert, maybe it would have just made thud without the insert. We'll never know...

One thing I did notice though is if I pick up the bike and drop it, the front would always have a dead kind of landing. The rear would usually make a bit of a twang noise. Even at 40psi, the rear of the bike had a 'bag of sand' feel to it when I dropped it. So I guess that's different...

It's all highly scientific here.

Best test will next time I'm on rocky stuff, that'll tell me whether it was worth it or not.

Oh, and if ebikes erode trails faster because of the extra torque and weight... Does a 85kg rider with a 400w FTP on a 15kg normal bike do more or less damage than a 70kg rider with a 200w FTP on a 20kg ebike?

And, if either of them fall over in the woods, does anyone hear a noise?

Another here who finds them pointless.

Tried the rimpacts, tyres were fine to get on and off.

Found they offered zero extra sidewall support so went back to my normal pressure, 28-30 psi in the rear on my trail bike at 95kg.

Even on my dh bike with dh tyres, 28 psi is as low as I'll go, I'd just have be on steep, wet, natural trails to drop that low.

Reasonable rider, ie normally the one of the faster in the group unless there's a sponsored racer. Rides all over.

When I drop the pressures, I don't find the slippy bits any more grippy, but I do find the grippier bits less predictable, hence can't load up as hard to get as much grip.

I think lowering pressures loads is a placebo.

Another here who finds them pointless.

Are you still damaging rims, or were you not doing so in the first place?

Most of my rides involve rocks and they very obviously protect rims from damage in my experience.

Inserts have a place. On the rear wheel of a hardcore hardtail. Or in mud spikes when the weather is filthy. On a e-bike. Or riding exclusively rocky trails. For the average rider on a 150mm trail bike riding a bit of everything, they ain’t worth the cost or hassle of fitting.

The other thing is bead retention, some tyres don't hold on very well at lower pressures by themselves and end up spurting sealant around the rim.

My Wild Enduro Fronts (non-racing version) spurt sealant at 24psi on rocky tracks and trails, but fine at 20psi with Rimpacts.