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Video about why nipples are cracking on Hunt wheels
Makes a change from their rims cracking 🙂
Ha! Was just about to say it was my rear rim that cracked 🤣
They are some of the worst wheels for quality I've ever experienced
The problem is when your simply picking items out of a catalogue then submitting the order to Taiwan with very little control over how the production quality is for the parts being used then letting the factory in Taiwan build them and ship them in a container .
Hunt at best will simply pick a few off the container when it arrives and do a visual check .
Yes they get sent samples before ordering for testing and will visit the factory once in a blue moonbut once your not there you can't qc items or have any control .
Then if there is an issue with the product, hunt buy them without warranty from Taiwan as its absolutely nigh on impossible to get a shipment returned in full if it's faulty so they simply take them fob.
Hunt then factor in the percentage to cover on top of all costs any warranty issues which is why they'll simply send you a new wheel parts etc with very little questions .......
They then get lauded for outstanding customer service when Infact the wheels are not for for purpose
Week rims inconsistent spoke tension poorly sealed hubs novatec hubs (rebounded 6 series) not even the pre installed rim tape is fitted correctly
Then take out a advanced subscription run of half page adverts with a verbal agreement to renew with mbr mbuk stw etc almost guarantees even if 3 sets of wheels explode sending the tester to the moon that you'll still get a high score review
The industry in this regard is flawed
Yet when you look at the pricing the gap is so slight to something actually far superior I still can't believe they make a business of it .
watching the vid, the problem is clearly a design problem, rather than QC or build issue.
May not even be a design issue, might be component choices as he says; may be just need smaller hub flanges.
Are they aluminium nipples?
might be component choices as he says; may be just need smaller hub flanges.
Where I come from that's a design change
They are some of the worst wheels for quality I’ve ever experienced
They are some of the best and not just for the money. I think you either have made a lot of assumptions in your post or you have done a tremendous amount of research on the field.
My Trailwide V2s are getting a serious hammering at the back of my Meta HT and I can't fault them.
The nipples are fine but they don't have thevl acute angles of the wheels in the YT video. Not sure what model they are.
I wasn't so lucky with my last DT Swiss which were similar money but far heavier.
They are some of the best
Well yes you paid for some so your biased to think that.
I'm also wondering why if the acute angles are the issue. Neither of my high flange hubs have this issue.
And dt complete wheels do indeed suck
I’m also wondering why if the acute angles are the issue
I think he’s suggesting the problem is the hole in the 4mm thick carbon doesn’t point the nipple at the flange and doesn’t allow any ball and socket type movement of the nipple. Smaller flanges aren’t the solution, just a potential slight mitigation. Their aluminium rims won’t have the same issue as I doubt they are anything like as thick
Nothing wrong with offset rims.
Nothing wrong with 14mm nipples.
Nothing wrong with the hub flanges. They look pretty normal to me. Shimano are small.
Just need to look at the spoke angles of a rear wheel to see that spoke angle itself isn't the issue.
Decent nipples are designed to move in the direction of force:
https://www.sapim.be/nipples/design/polyax
So either the spoke holes are too narrow so the nipple can't sit in the direction of the force as designed.
Or as mentioned, the holes aren't drilled correctly.
FWIW I'd see if the nipples can move in the holes, and if so rebuild with decent brass nipples and concave nipple washers.
Or not buy rebranded catalogue wheels.....
Big flanges definitely shouldn't cause that. The actual differences in angle at the nipple are tiny, and those flanges aren't especially large really.
The more I think about it, the more I think that this can only really be a problem with the rim drilling. I mean, maybe with a different hub it'd be fine but that's just masking so I'm not even going to call it incompatibility, I think the rims are just wrong.
I'm suspecting that it's the thick rim and what looks like a relatively small nipple-hole? Normally nipples have a pretty good degree of movement available, eyeletted rims aren't far off being a ball joint and eyeletless rims usually still have fairly "free" nipples... but the narrower and longer the "tunnel" through the rim, the less that'll be. And if the tunnel has parallel sides and is at right angles to the axle (which it likely is, to simplify building and drilling) of course the spoke is not and at some point it becomes a problem. I'd want to actually have one to play with before stating any of this as a fact but, if the video is right and the problem is that the nipples are sideloaded, I'm pretty sure that's the likely cause.
(and if it's a big enough deal to break nipples it ought to be pretty obvious in assembly? I'm not a "wheelbuilder"- I can make a good wheel but I'm not, like, knowledgable in the arcane ways of rim and spoke. But if I was building a wheel and the spokes were sideloaded like this I'd think I'd notice, you'd expect to feel resistance to assembly, probably the spokes would fight you a bit. The problem in use is probably also a problem in building in other words.
On a side note, I think mapdec videos are really good. I've been following him for a while.
Tbf to hunt they offer a pretty good no quibble 3 year warranty.<span style="font-size: 0.8rem;"> I know my lbs have even had things replaced out of warranty. (but that's probably because hunt know they have problems with that product.)</span>
They fill a gap in the market, fairly light, fairly strong, fairly cheap. If you want better, pay more.
I’m also wondering why if the acute angles are the issue. Neither of my high flange hubs have this issue.
Its the spoke hole in the rim limiting the nipple articulation. If you fit brass nipples they then start breaking spokes right at the nipple.
Other brands have angle drilled rims, some use slightly larger holes and nipple washers, ball seat nipples, inverted nipples etc.
Even Light Bicycle carbon rims are angled drilled and have an arrow on a spoke hole indicating lacing direction.
Makes a change from their rims cracking
Lol
+1 what Northwind said. Mapdec may be a decent mechanic but from what I've seen of his videos he does not have a good grasp of Physics or Engineering.
They are some of the worst wheels for quality I’ve ever experienced ...
In my mind, Hunt is a marketing, insurance, and customer service company. Which happens to be in the wheels business.
And dt complete wheels do indeed suck
Wow, disappointed to hear that, because I've owned all the individual components on various builds (rims, buhs, spokes) and considered them all amongst the best examples of each (albeit only shallow section aluminium rims).
What was do bad about the wheels? Only just today recommended a buddy maybe consider a DT set instead of some £700 Hunt carbons 😬
At the price, I originally purchased hunt wheels thinking they would be disposable without much guilt compared to the cost of hope hubs alone. In the end between myself and my wife we have had 5 sets of their wheels and not had a single issue with any of them.
Saying they just pick from a parts catalogue is doing them an injustice as they do more than that I think a little research will tell you?
@TheGingerone I'm sorry your wrong ,I don't need to do my research.
I lived it for 13 years
It was my job
My job was to find the factories in Taiwan and China to produce the items for a specific price point.
In a nutshell
Everything was price point orientated
This is what we'd like please .........
The buyer would then say that's not going to work as we need to hit this price point
I'd then find cost saving solutions
There would be several back and forths with buyer and maker
Lots of compromises made until the price point is made
I've stood there in Taiwan watching the same factory build wheels for hunt ,along with nukeproof for crc/wiggle using the Exact same parts
One has ordered 300 units at 115 usd
One has ordered 1500 units at 95 usd
People are always surprised that there are so many of the same items out there simply rebranded ,I think people would be shocked if they were to see how it operates .
Don't let the gmbn gcn fancy lookinb trp tours fool you .
They'll often have a dedicated area of production with there longest most valued experienced staff working in zone A that's open to buyers media etc but the rest of the factory is very much still like brittish Leyland I the 70,s
Another one
Sixth element wheels
Jesus christ graham is having your pants down there
You can buy those exact same carbon wheels I mean exact from at least 3 other uk companies for 40% less
He's asking over £1150 for what is a 250usd wheelset now I know 20ft and 40ft went absolutely mental.
Was around a grand fob 20ft
Went as high as £5800 but that's all settled
trail_rat
Free MemberAnd dt complete wheels do indeed suck
Really? They're generally too expensive, and the cheaper/OEM ones are very built-down-to-a-price and can have replacement-parts issues but the good ones are basically just sensible collections of DT parts- and since they make the best hubs, some of the best rims, and some excellent spokes that does not suck imo.
(I don't buy em because of the price thing)
This all reminds me of this masterpiece from a few years ago:
Just rebuilt a 30 year old zipp 440 rim onto a DT track hub. The angle of the nipples wasn’t too bad. No dishing for a symmetric wheel, modest spoke tension by ear, which was the reason most early carbon rims failed. And it didn’t kill me when I rode it either. Sadly it’s 21 mm tubular so I’ll just be riding it on the track.
I am getting a quote from DCR for their own (maybe) carbon rims laced to Royce low flange hubs for road riding. Hunt don’t sell fixed wheel, and I had presumed they were generic carbon rims with novatech hubs Royce are something else it’s also hard to find low spoke hole non track fixed hubs for carbon rims hence the wheel below is 28 hole DT track
Anyone know if the Hunt XC Wide wheels are straight pull spokes ? I was going to buy a set at £260, seem fairly light at 1693gms. Any particular reasons to stay away from these ? (That’s around my budget for what I’m building)
https://www.huntbikewheels.com/products/hunt-xcwide-mtb-wheelset?variant=40024128290893
some of the best rims,
Gruere or brie ? Insert soft cheese of choice. Good hubs poor rims and usually coupled in their complete builds with an inappropriate amount of their excellent spokes .
Both road and MTB ... Not sure about their gravel
Didn't realise these were known to be that bad, was looking at getting the Enduro Wide set when funds allow!
What "enduro" wheelset is considered a good budget option these days then?
Sixth element wheels
Jesus christ graham is having your pants down there
You can buy those exact same carbon wheels I mean exact from at least 3 other uk companies for 40% less
Now I can't speak for the provenance of the rims he uses, but given he hand builds them onto the hubs of your choice, I'm not sure that really stands up to much scrutiny. You can query the vfm for sure, but he's not selling on china-made wheelsets.
*Disclaimer - I have a set of Sixth Element carbon road wheels, that were very definitely hand laced onto Hope RS4 hubs for me.
My Prime carbon road wheels (3yrs old) have lots of cracked alloy nipples. I put it down to my 95kgs and love of the bunny hop.
I bought a bag of Sapim brass ones from superstar for £7. Not fitted yet.
Anyone know if the Hunt XC Wide wheels are straight pull spokes ?
No, they’re not. The Hunt “Race XC Wide” are though. I have those and they’ve been trouble free. As have some older wheels I’ve had for years (the ones co-branded with Mason and some V1 Trail Wides). I’ve found them all to be reliable. All of them having “wide” in the model name, even the narrower ones, is just damn confusing though.
You get what you pay for! I’ve had the rims crack on Hope, Hunt, e-thirteen & Nukproof wheel sets in the four years I’ve been using a set of hand built DT Swiss that were approximately twice the price of those listed. All were warranted with out issue.
Maybe I’m a poo rider but like to think I’ve progressed where I do push the bike a little? I’ve never spent mega money on a wheel set but I’m getting the urge to try Reserve wheel set, any good?
Have a set of Aluminium ibis 35mm wheels at the moment seem ok but the rear hub is a bit meh.
Not only the Hunt off-road rims crack, just started a warranty claim for my 34 Aero Wide. Drive side spoke pulling through the rim, 14 months old and only used for summer riding. At least the warranty is good I suppose. I may go for carbon next, will they be any better?
trail_rat
Free MemberGruere or brie ? Insert soft cheese of choice.
We must be talking about some different DT Swiss. I'm talking about these guys:
If they are just catalogue wheels, where can I (as an average joe) buy the same thing with the same warranty for cheaper?
Looking at something like the superdura 4 seasons ?
Well yes you paid for some so your biased to think that.
Weird logic or perhaps you're judging me by your own standards.
Having paid for them would probably make me bias against them if they didn't perform. But they do and reliably so (they are Trail V2s so a different design to the the ones featured in YT video) so I am not going to slag them off just in case someone thinks I have a bias.
I have also paid for my DT Swiss and they're all right but they're not as good, so much for bias.