[Closed] Hope Brake Opinions

Just get a V4 up front with a 203mm rotor, it'll be nice to have the extra power there if you need it, and also they'll need less of a pull vs the E4 to achieve the same stopping power, good for tired arms and hands on long descents.

Thanks, this is my current thinking. Won't notice the weight and don't want to get e4s front and rear and ever think I want an upgrade.

Guess I'm probably looking for any sound reason not to run v4 203mm and e4 180mm.

Got Race E4’s with 183mm rotors front and rear, weigh about 13st kitted up and they feel great, but V4’s would have extra bite for sure. To be honest i think a 203mm rotor on the front would be enough for me if I wanted a bit more power on the E4’s unless I was banging round the alps, then V4’s would be my choice. I doubt you’d be disappointed with either brake to be fair, though I’d suggest matching front and rear just because of the pads being the same rather than different, just makes life easier

I have E4s. If i was going Hope again I'd go V4. But I doubt I will.

The E4s lack power compared to my old XTs and lack the adjustability range of them too. Just been out in the rain and both are squealing like mad too.

At half the price I wouldn't even look at the Hopes again and just buy Shimano.

<div class="bbp-reply-author">kiksy
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I have E4s. If i was going Hope again I’d go V4. But I doubt I will.

The E4s lack power compared to my old XTs and lack the adjustability range of them too. Just been out in the rain and both are squealing like mad too.

At half the price I wouldn’t even look at the Hopes again and just buy Shimano

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I have both, XT feel more powerful but in reality don’t cope when pushed hard.

The adjustment on the E4 is far more useful than on the XT.

In slippery conditions Hope all day long. In my opinion there’s only two areas where the XT win, ease of set up an price.

Maybe my SLX need a good service then though the lever's still feel really firm. The SLX and XT are basically the same brake and mine felt a mile off the e4s.

Good point re. the same size pads. Maybe just get a set of v4s and run a 203 and 180 rotor on them and have all the power i will ever need.

it looks about 88g difference for front and rear compared to e4s if using braided hoses on both.

V4 pads have a different shape and larger surface area than E4.

Never felt under-braked with E4's and a 203mm rotor on the front, but the magpie in me likes V4's because MOAR!

car park isn't the same as on the trail. what rotors do you have? increasing size will improve your braking.  pads on the E4 are the same as SLX/XT

No i know it's not the same but equally you can tell if something almost tips you off the bike it stops harder than your own.

Both use 203mm upfront so similar there. i've got shimano disc up front and dont like it gives a buzzing sort of feeling during high speed braking, not the first shimano rotor i've had that does that on different calipers and forks as well, wouldn't buy a shimano rotor again, rear is the original avid 180mm rotor.

I'm sure i wouldn't feel underbraked on e4s but when money is almost the same and weight is not a lot in it why not go bigger?

81kg +kit here. E4 front, x2 rear in 180mm rotors. Were spot on I'm the peaks a few weeks ago. If you want more I'd imagine 200mm front rotor with an e4 caliper I'm the back would be.more than enough.

Shimano, not buying those again till they sort the caliper leak issue (four failed calipers now!).

I've got e4's on one bike, and SRAM code rsc on another bike.

The bike with the e4 did have Shimano xt before.

The e4 are not as powerful as they should be imo, they lack a bit of power compared to Shimano xt,but they are reliable and the range of adjustment is great, and they do have good modulation.

But the SRAM codes are a different beast entirely compared to both e4 and xt. Loads more power, they're really really good.

Said it many times. They don't lack power. There are multiple tests that quantify the actual measured power levels (on proper equipment) and the e4 is right there. They don't have brutal bite which many seem to misinterprete as lack of power. Pull the levers and the power is there.

I’ve got e4s with 180mm front and back. They are the best brake I’ve ever used by a long way (previously had slx, xt and Clarks). The modulation is incredible in comparison to Shimano, as is the adjustment. Outright power might not be quite as good as XT but with my style of riding I’m much faster on Hope. I don’t think there would be much in it with a 200mm rotor but in the slop the modulation is epic.

Setup can be a bit harder than Shimano but it’s worth the effort. Once they’re setup they are solid.

I haven't seen any tests but to me the hopes feel that for every kg of force you apply to the lever, the caliper applies less force on the disc than the xt (and others) not lots less, but deffo less. IE the hopes take more of a squeeze at the lever to get the same level of retardation compared to xt and some others.

They're a good brake, but the e4 are under powered for me anyway, I haven't tried the v4 but if the op is definitely going hope then I'd go v4.

<div class="bbp-reply-author">nixie
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Said it many times. They don’t lack power. There are multiple tests that quantify the actual measured power levels (on proper equipment) and the e4 is right there. They don’t have brutal bite which many seem to misinterprete as lack of power. Pull the levers and the power is there.

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Agreed, I guess it’s a bit like over servo’d brakes in some modern cars, my car will stop much faster than my girlfriends car but you have to push the pedal harder.

It's exactly that, servowave in shimano brakes moves the pads towards the disc at an increased speed in the initial part of the lever stroke, which gives the grabby/instant power feeling. I think SRAM swinglink does the same just with a bit more modulation.

That IMO is just wrong, it goes against everything my brain has taught me over the past few years. I want brakes that give a good initial 'bite' and then as you squeeze the lever more and more the stopping power just keeps coming.

Coming from motorbikes, the last thing you want is a brake that grabs with loads of power when you touch the lever, that will just lead to a locked front tyre and pain. Literally one of the first things you learn when doing basic motorbike training is to squeeze, not grab the front brake. Once the brakes have started to bite and the tyre/suspension has compressed, then the brake can do it's job and the power can be squeezed on.

This also explains why I like my levers far out and the bite point also far out - some people say having loads of free play prevents panic braking, to me it's the opposite. If I go to feather the brakes and there's nothing there, I'll then be braking later than I want and pull harder, then when they do bite I'm braking harder than I should be, later than I should be. Less free travel means I can feather then brakes with a light touch and the bite point is right there if I need it. I can sort of see the advantage of the lever being closer to the bar giving a better grip on the bars, but you're still gripping when 3 fingers regardless when the lever is.

Speaking from experience of locking a front wheel on a motorbike due to dodgy brakes which had loads free play before biting. It hurt a little. There is nothing more scary than having to emergency brake from 30/40mph and pulling on the brakes only for there to be nothing there...

According to this test in a moped comic, E4's fare well on power

https://ebike-mtb.com/en/group-test-e-mtb-disc-brakes/2/

The car park test tells you nothing except for how much braking force you get when you grab a certain amount of lever. What's most important is the maximum force you can apply when you are hurtling down something really steep.

I have some old Mono Minis and an old XTR lever attached to a modern XT caliper, on different bikes. The Shimano feel sharper in normal use because they seem to grab more easily. However, there is a road near me which is a 40mph fast steep main road into a dip where there is an entrance to a bridleway. So I brake as hard as I can from high speed with plenty of traction. This is a proper test of maximum braking power in my opinion, and I find there is no noticeable difference between the two.

I have been running XTR Trail 9020's on my trail bike for the last 2 years. Had Hope Tech 3 E4's fitted to my new All Mountain/Enduro sled last month. In my opinion the Hope are far superior. The wandering bite point on the XTR's was the reason I didn't want another set of Shimano's, but I found the Hopes to be better all round so far. The modulation on steep stuff in La Thuile and Les Arc recently was impressive and I had no problems with overheating, though I did use RT99 IceTech rotors and Uberbike finned race matrix pads. Got back on the trail bike last week and the XTR felt weak in comparsion.

Big plus for the Hopes is you can get any spare part you'll ever need, any issues with shimano and it's likely you be buying either a new lever or caliper.

Well reckon it will be V4s. No one can give a good reason to get the e4s other than they will be enough. Don't think you can have too much braking power though. 😀

I've just traded my V4s for TRP Quadiems (for £100 an end I couldn't resist). The V4 is a powerful brake but I have to say I agree it's not as powerful as it should be. Also, if you like to run the lever quite close to the bar like I do then they'll feel spongy no matter how you bleed them. The modulation is awesome but I think there are better options out there now. I'm very happy with the TRP but I'd love to try Formulas and Magura (despite that other thread..) as I've heard great things there too.

Hmmmm I do like the lever touching the bar when cold. Might have a play with my mates a bit more see how they feel.

Like the look of maguras and not as expensive as I maybe thought but read a lot that says they are a bit wooden and have lever issues. Like the repairable nature of hopes.

The Magura MT5/MT7 brakes are awesome. Ultra powerful (The most powerful brakes I have ever tried)  but with really good modulation as well. I bought them because they were cheaper than Hopes and I thought I'd give them a bash but I might actually prefer them regardless of price. I have MT5s with the HC levers. That lever makes a big difference to the feel.

John

the last thing you want is a brake that grabs with loads of power when you touch the lever, that will just lead to a locked front tyre and pain

seconded.  I've never got on with Shimano. Katie recently switched from XT to SRAM Guides and is much happier on them.

I'm not sure there's any shortage of power on the Shimanos if they're set up properly but it's a very different form of control.  I'm suprised the Hopes felt more powerful in the car park- normally i'd expect the opposite to be true.

Yeah I've used Deore, XT, Code R and Guide R brakes, on various demo bikes - XT's just felt far too grabby and in the wet conditions I was actually a little scared to use the front in fear of locking up, but did have good adjustment. Guide R felt OK, Code R felt mega powerful and both SRAM brakes felt nice and progressive. The only issue I've found on SRAM brakes is not being able to get the lever out far enough, with the reach adjustment on the max they were still pulling too far in with too much free stroke. probably something that can be adjusted out but I have a feeling Hope E4/V4's will be the Goldilocks brake for me 🙂

I have my own Deore brakes set at 6cm from the bar (to the outside of the 'crook' at the end of the lever when your finger sits) and at the bite point is they're 4.5cm from the bar/grip, so pretty far out as far I'm aware.

I have fairly recent Deore, XT and Hope E4's. I have always really liked the modern Shimano stuff but much prefer the Hope for reasons given above. You can feel what the brakes are doing far better with the Hope from scrubbing off a touch of speed to full on lock up. The Shimano, although very good lack the finesse of the E4's IMO. I find the Shimano a little more delicate too, much quicker to spoil the pads or lose power.

V4 for the front. E4 fealt Great in the carpark for me but once you hit any sustained downs...