[Closed] Help me choose a new bike Heckler/5010/Camber Evo (or just a new rear shock?)

If it helps your decision, Stif have some cheap(er) Hecklers at the minute...

3 bikes it should be really easy to demo. The Solo and the Heckler will ride very differently, having gone from a heckler version after your's to a Blur LTc and the VPP was just a lot better in every way for me. Better climbing, better grip, better descending.

I had the exact same bike/forks/wheels and improved it's climbing and DH ability with a -1deg works components headset. That made it a better bike for 2 years until I finally decided that a new bike was "needed".

Enter the Banshee Phantom, a much better bike in every way! The Heckler suspension design is pretty crude, modern shorter travel bikes (5010, Phantom, etc) use their suspension much more efficiently and basically allow you to have the benefits of short travel up hill without losing out going down.

But the slackset did allow me some breathing room to demo other bikes to get the one I wanted. May be worth a try given that pretty much any new bike purchase these days will involve a new fork and wheels to boot.

Thanks Mike but we are all different and i work away from home a lot so weekends driving around to demo bikes is not on the cards as i'd prefer to spend it with the loved ones but thanks for the info re. VPP.

Keep an eye out if they are close though
http://www.santacruzbicycles.co.uk/demo-dates/
think some of the dealers have demo stock too, I'd certainly want to throw a leg over to check sizing as things have changed a bit since that heckler generation.

I would go for the camber, I did and love it. I think the Santa Cruz bikes are massively overpriced for what you get.

worth a try given that pretty much any new bike purchase these days will involve a new fork and wheels to boot.

Exactly Shackleton! If we didn't have 27.5" then i'd just buy a 5010 frame and be done with it. I think it's a very sneaky way to stop people doing exactly that, those wheels are hand built by Stif with a 36 hole rear, was hoping to use them for years to come but now i'm going to have to spend an extra grand and a half for a new frame with lesser components!!.......anyway rant aside, this is exactly why i'm thinking of getting a new rear shock, just to tide me over until i'm ready to splurge on a 5010.

There is still the question of whether the 5010 can take as much abuse on the fun bits as the Heckler though.

I have the one after yours without the gussetts. Hecklers are short in the toptube so will never be brilliant climbers. Getting a new shock with a proper tube may help, I got a cheap RP23 Kashima from CRC and got Loco to tune it. Wider lower bars help climbing IME. VPP will work better but you have to pay for it.

Chris i've had my santa cruz frame for seven years and it's still smashing trails like it was new but that's very interesting that you have the camber and love it. Do you ever wish it was a better climber/ descender?

Also, a SC TRC frames are about second hand every now and again, like a 26inch Solo really.

scruff the heckler would be the perfect bike for me if only it was a bit nimbler, i can't help thinking that shock needs an upgrade but the carbon 5010 R spec for 3K is really tempting. Trouble is they don't make them in this colour any more 😉

Yeah and they do the TRA (alloy) in this red too which is lovely. have considered that option too.

I still have the DHX5 coil that I used on my heckler up until I swapped bikes last July. A bit heavier than any air shock I ever put on it but also worked a lot better up and down.

Mail in profile if you are interested (I also have the works headset depending on the size of your frame.....)

I also found that an inline post (or smaller layback) improved uphill manners considerably.

Cheers,

S

There is still the question of whether the 5010 can take as much abuse on the fun bits as the Heckler though

Bronson? Matches the heckler more closely I think.

That said, I love my 5010, its never felt out of its depth on descents or technical stuff riding trail centres all over and natural stuff in/around Yorkshire.

Climbs really well too (with a CCDB inline)., but I've always been a vpp convert over single pivot.

Echo the demo thing too, if youre going to spend that much on a bike/frame, make sure you like it first.

Le French have some new TRCs-

[url= http://www.alltricks.com/mtb/frames/full-suspension/#!id_category=103&limit=40&brand=91&order_by=alphabetique&view_mode=&page=1&ProductAttributeIds=186|68|185|180|187|176|80|&ProductGroupFilterIdsType=1|1|1|1|1|1|1|&ProductAttributeValues=|||||||&inStock=true&keyword= ]http://www.alltricks.com/mtb/frames/full-suspension/#!id_category=103&limit=40&brand=91&order_by=alphabetique&view_mode=&page=1&ProductAttributeIds=186|68|185|180|187|176|80|&ProductGroupFilterIdsType=1|1|1|1|1|1|1|&ProductAttributeValues=|||||||&inStock=true&keyword=[/url]

I love my TRc and will probably replace it with a Solo when I inevitably break it. Those prices from the French would be very tempting if I didn't already have one.

[i]I'm after something with a bit more climbing prowess[/i]

Raise your saddle a bit?

I have the 2014 Heckler, if what you're looking for is something that climbs better than what you have then I'd give it a miss. Not that it's bad at it, but I doubt it would be any better than yours as it's nothing special going uphill. I love mine, but then I bought it for the descents!

The 5th element shock is massively outclassed by modern shocks. Swap it out, put a slavery on it and maybe think about some off-set bushes too. Nowt wrong with the frame, unless you want a new one?

That's meant to read slack-set, not slavery, by the way.

Having seen how hard Josh Lewis and Josh Bryceland ride their Solos, I wouldn't worry about what it can and cant handle.

This generation of the Heckler are brilliant bikes, I also have a Nomad and newer Heckler but I'd rather keep this one, it'll go on forever. Change the shock to an RP23 it'll perform so much better and you can have some pro pedal on the climbs, lighter wheels and tyres will help things (are those 5.1Ds?) should be able to get some nice light 26ers on the classifieds cheap these days, maybe drop the forks to 140mm - I found mine to handle and climb much better with 140mm rather than 150mm, who'd have thought 10mm would make a difference. Stem looks short-ish, don't follow fashion and get one that makes the bike fit better-er? ...unless of course you are looking for an excuse to get a new bike, in which case I'll have the frame if you sell?

Sounds like you might want to try one of the modern fun short-travel 29ers, from what you're asking for.

Kojaklollipop its not for sale just yet but i am going to take your advice and try a newer shock and see if that makes any difference. And maybe some lower bars. i like the forks so they can stay.

If i do decide to sell i'll probably try to sell it as a complete bike, i was thinking about keeping it for the girlfriend but its just a tad too big for her. I really dont know if i could do it!

If you compare its geometry and capability to todays "enduro" bikes there really isn't that much difference, you wouldnt think it was made in 2003. i could put lighter stuff and a 1x11 on it and nobody would know the difference 😉

Chapking i like the look of the camber evo, not sure i'd get on with only a 120mm fork though coming from this

not sure i'd get on with only a 120mm fork though coming from this

Dont worry about it.

Bigger wheel is giving you better rollover and traction than say a 120mm 26, doesn't sound like you're doing anything other than trail riding, what's the hangup?

I tend to chip in on threads like this saying "buy a bike for what you actually ride, not what you elude to.

I'm a jump what ever/find ways of getting loose rider, the 120mm forks certainly have not held me back.

PS, i've a camber evo, since getting it, basing how good it is on speed, if it's a segment i've tried on, up, down or flat, im in amongst the top 10, or atleast amongst the sponsored XCers and DHers/local pinners, these are segments of which a few thousand have ridden. Trying not to sound like a douche.

I much prefer the camber too on the "DH" spots around me.

http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/who-lives-with-or-has-lived-with-a-camber-evo

I was toyinh with the idea of a 5010, decided the geo wasn't quite right for me, too short.

I know what you mean, you can get away with a bit less travel on a 29er 'cos of the rollover - but where you ride is rocky and it's nice to have a bit more leeway.

Have a look at this guy's bike. I've ridden one around Hebden a bit and it wasn't out of its depth...
http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/new-bike-87

150mm front and 130mm rear works pretty well and the climbing is awesome on these. You'd need to do a custom build though (a plus point for me!).

On One Codeine, Orange Segment and Kona Process maybe worth a look too. Transition have a decent fun 29er now too I think.

Hecklers are short in the toptube so will never be brilliant climbers.

Longer top tube bikes make better climbers? Why is this then?

For what it's worth, I own a Stumpjumper and struggle to see why you'd end up with a Camber which costs the same and weighs only a smidge less but has less travel. MBR agreed with that- I think the Stumpjumper is more closely related to what you have now and it comes with a dropper post.

The 650b is meant to be a bit of a dog, but the 29er's meant to be great (for a 29er...).

I have just replaced a Heckler 6.0 and gone to a Bronson. Not the 5010 the OP was after but I would imagine my experience of the change to VPP and newer geometry could be useful.

As far as climbing is concerned the change is night and day. I never thought the Heckler was a bad climber but it did have a habit of lifting and wandering at the front when it got steep. I found myself using the launch control on my forks allot and dropping them down from 150 to 130mm to counter this. The Bronson on the other hand feels incredibly planted at the front. Back to back on the steep and sharp climbs we have locally there is a marked difference. Even with the 150mm Pike's at full extension it is noticeably better than the Heckler with the forks dropped. Grip at the rear with the VPP is also tenacious in comparison. When seated it just powers on up. Standing on the pedals was also something I avoided on the Heckler (with a simple Float R shock). All the power just seeped to be spat away losing traction. The Bronson on the other hand doesn't seem to mind a bit of pedal stomping.

I hope that is in some way useful to you OP

What size rear shock is it? I have a brand new rp23 kashima going cheap if you would like

Yeah that is really useful thanks Compass. I suspected the Bronson would be better at climbing. I guess the single pivot heckler is more heavily reliant on what shock it uses.

engineeringcowboy, how much do you want for it? I need a 200 x 50mm but it'll take anything from a 50mm stroke to a 57mm stroke, as long it's 200mm eye to eye.

bomberman - Member

Chris i've had my santa cruz frame for seven years and it's still smashing trails like it was new but that's very interesting that you have the camber and love it. Do you ever wish it was a better climber/ descender?

No, its an extreemly capable bike. The only time I cant ride it is in the Alps. Its hugely fast in evo spec. Personally I find the santa cruz bikes too short and too expensive for what you get.