[Closed] Have we reached a tipping point with regard to E-bikes?

those left on normal bikes will become the social outcasts

already there, e-bikes can't claim that victory!

I don't think e-bikes will take over from non e-bikes, I think they'll settle into being another category of bike that people will choose between when buying, based on the type of riding, where they ride, who they ride with etc.

Just like the FS bike didn't kill off hardtails.

On the flip side, on a regular shop ride I do, there's occasionally a single e-bike out of 10 or so bikes total.

I'm 57 and find pedaling uphill very difficult nowadays. I think that quite a few users on this site may be in a similar position. Currently I ride a bespoke niche bike from a decade ago that is a total joy even now but is pretty much obsolete. Finding rims, tyres, forks and so on is becoming increasingly difficult.

I am financially secure so I genuinely think that my next bike will be an E. I love riding but it is becoming physically more and more difficult. If an E bike allows me to have the fun and frolics I may well do so.

There will always be some that will only want a human powered bike. It's a fundamental red line to them.

It's not the same as suspension, or electric shifting etc IMO. Adding electric power to a bike will always be a fundamental change too far for some and a great bonus for others.

I do see a divergence coming over the years though. Where bikes incorporating electric power go off on a different tangent to "push bikes" and attract people that might never have really thought of purchasing a human powered bike as an adult. It's going to revolutionise commuting which is a great thing for everyone.

None of the above is bad in my opinion. As long as riders that want non ebikes can still buy them easily enough and the same for ebike riders, its all good.

Hopefully we’ll see more of the in between types like the EZesty. Lower weight and power, a normal bike that gives you a little boost up the hills.

I genuinely ceased caring with the introduction of 650b.
It became obvious that we were all just being played.

I miss the lie of being part of some fictional collective.

Rusty Spanner

Subscriber
I genuinely ceased caring with the introduction of 650b.
It became obvious that we were all just being played.

I think many would agree that 650 was a deeply cynical move by the industry. Hell, it's partly why I went straight from 26 to 29 as at least there was a genuine, measurable difference in "performance" between the two. Both good and bad, mind.

That said,I don't think the wheel size debate is a good analogy for push bike vs ebike. Ebikes really do introduce something new to the mix whether you like them or not.

I think with e-bikes becoming a popular commuting tool (which is a good thing) but bridging the gap between human powered and mechanically propelled, they'll be the reason we'll all end up with bikes being registered, licenced and insured

As the powers that be have already proven, they are unable to differentiate between nuances of technology and more than willing to press on with unworkable schemes based on nothing more than whimsy.

I'll wait for affordable jetpacks thanks.

And why wouldn’t you?

I can see the appeal, but for me one of the big attractions of bikes is the mechanical simplicity and the fact that it's me providing the power.

I very rarely ride in groups, so if everyone else gets an ebike I'll still be quite happy with my normal bike.

Edit: I should add that I'm not anti e-bike. On my (rural) commute, for several years I never saw another regular cyclist. In the last year or so I've been passing a regular e-bike commuter, and I saw a second e-bike rider the other day. Neither look like 'cyclists' which means they have presumably exchanged driving for e-biking, and that's awesome.

They're just too bloody expensive for me at the minute....

once a certain critical mass is achieved, those left on normal bikes will become the social outcasts, forcing more pressure on them to buy into the E-bike scene.

And why wouldn’t you?

Fun on the ups as well as the downs
More downs per day as you can get back up more quickly
The technology is only going in one direction making E-bikes lighter, and the batteries lasting longer

I said a while back that I think MTB will be a powered thing not to far in the future. Not entirely, but in the eyes of many. May be wrong but basically cycling is physically hard as well as the enjoyable side or practical need and now there's an option to reduce the hard part. People tend to take that option in every area of life. The tipping point is a way off based on price but wait til there's a good FS E-MTB under £2k.

Why wouldn't you? Some just don't ride only for the downs and find the physical test of climbing is as rewarding as the downs are fun. Some also think e-bikes just aren't nice things in the way an old steel Kona is lovely and there's a product aesthetic side to all this for many.

I genuinely ceased caring with the introduction of 650b.

It was great to have good rims for disc road bike options though.

Yes its great. The price of normal bikes will fall as they wont have a motor. Which means highend bikes will be much more affordable than the equivalent ebike version.

Mtbing for me over the last 33 years has always been about the challenge, never wanted to water it down and make it easier. Hopefully will now get more bang for buck in the sport i love.

Yes its great. The price of normal bikes will fall as they wont have a motor. Which means highend bikes will be much more affordable than the equivalent ebike version.

Aye, cos that's how it works. 🙄

In reality, they'll be more expensive, less demand, less manufactured, more expensive.

Bring on the e-volution, **** it, the roadies sneer at us anyway, give em some proper sand for their fannies.

Dunno, but I think we may be reaching it for E-bike threads. Different strokes for different folks and all that. I think most normal bikes are ridiculously priced so the E variants can jog on. One of the reasons that I personally like pedal bikes is because I’m the engine. If I had a long commute or wanted to go up hill quicker I’d get a motorcycle. Nothing against E-bikes though. If it gets more people off their arses and exercising that can only be a good thing.

As previously written here; if e bikes are the norm then licensing/tax will be introduced not long after.

I certainly see the benefits of e bikes. My biggest reluctance is based on the costs involved. The high initial pay out and the resulting costs of taking it to a bike shop to fix because it’s just so hi tech by then ... I like cheap simplicity.

* I also avoid electric gears

The recent negative article about them in the times or telegraph, I forget which, is interesting.

Just thinking out loud, I wonder how and when the first e-bike/pedestrian accident will be reported, and whether it and subsequent collisions will perhaps trigger a change of rules from the policy makers. Perhaps there’s a possible future where e-bikes are restricted to the road and trail centres, whilst convention bicycles get greater access freedoms as per Scotland and hopefully Wales?

E-road bikes are now coming in too, I noticed from idly flipping through a magazine in WHS recently - MTBers might be resistant to change (whether we agree with it or not) but the roadies will be foaming at the mouth! 🙂

I genuinely ceased caring with the introduction of 650b.
It became obvious that we were all just being played.

Agree wholeheartedly.

Just thinking out loud, I wonder how and when the first e-bike/pedestrian accident will be reported, and whether it and subsequent collisions will perhaps trigger a change of rules from the policy makers.

Why would it be an issue? E bikes don't have higher top speeds, they just go faster up climbs. I spend a lot of my rides going 15mph or more on my normal bike.

And why wouldn’t you?

Because you're not a lazy bastard? 😉

An ebike for the road for a long commute/slog back from the shops with a full load is on my wish list. Still don’t have the real urge for an emtb yet, but I have liked the two I’ve ridden.

We have had Powerfly 9 for a while now, it is a fantastic bike and there isn't much I can't get up on it and it descends really well. But I actually prefer riding the normal bikes even when going out on my own. Yeah I can get further and climb more on it but that just puts me at a point where I'm thinking any remaining charge to get back without the battery being completely flat.

I ride with a few people on ebikes and I'll still take a normal bike out of preference. If all my fitter friends were to get ebikes then I may have to think about bike choice for doing enduro laps on big hills.

So no I don't think tipping point has been reached yet and I don't think it will be for a while yet.

And why wouldn’t you?

For me, I like climbing and the physical challenge it provides. Most of my favourite trails are up hill and not down, and if I don't finish a ride on my hands and knees then I feel I've missed out.
If the ups are just a wayto get to the downs then go for it, but it's not for me.

Outside the rarified atmosphere of STW are many thousands of people who have neither the money or the desire to spend it on £500 of bike let alone several thousands so let's just keep some perspective.

I genuinely ceased caring with the introduction of 650b.
It became obvious that we were all just being played.

Agree wholeheartedly.

We were all getting played wayyyyy before that

Interest free ebike loans, in Scotland anyway, not sure about the other side of the wall.

https://www.energysavingtrust.org.uk/scotland/grants-loans/ebike-loan

Lately though he has been coming out less and less

Could be they are just riding less and less. My experience of friends with ebikes is they’ve fallen out of love with cycling, and ebikes let them focus on what was fun for them. As they loose fitness on an ebike, it continues to becomes harder and they enjoy it even less, and ride less. Ebike death spiral.

And why wouldn’t you?

Exercise. If you think you put in as much effort on an ebike perhaps you’ve missed the point of them. I find the need to get out and keep fitness topped up a great motivator to get out on the bike more. If I didn’t have this I’d ride less.

I don’t really mind what other people do and I don’t think we’ve reached peak ebike, but for me I enjoy self powering, climbing and sometimes burying myself in the effort. I think what I object to is the assertion we are all aspiring to powered assistance – if that were true for me I’d still be riding motorbikes.

They’re just too bloody expensive for me at the minute….

And thats the tipping point, certainly as far as e-mtb's go. The majority can't or wont spend anything like what a good e-mtb costs. Commuter type things are a lot cheaper and make sense for personal tranport so people are more likely to buy those.
And to molegrips, e-bikes are routinely modified to make them faster, when someone gets taken out by one of those and its a slow news day just watch the hysterical reaction it gets from or media 🙁

In the near future as E bikes get older I think the cost of repairs will start to appear on these pages. Most will have been bought by diverting some of the household budget into an interest free finance deal. What's going to happen when E bike owners have to ask senior management for several hundred pounds for a new battery or motor that's gone fizz. Lots of E bikes stuck in sheds and the old bike brought back into service.

I was at Llandegla this week. If anywhere was the spiritual home of E-bikes it should be there - a long slog up followed by mainly down. But I saw very few. Perhaps one or two but most people still pedalling or pushing to the top.

So I don’t think the pedalling is dead yet.

Interesting aside all the E-bikers were male!

My view is that if there is a tipping point, all that will happen is the two sports (cycling and e-biking) will become more separated. No reason why they can't co-exist in the same way that motor boating and yachting co-exist. Personally I think this is a good thing as it'd allow access rights to become more nuanced.

I have zero interest at present in an e-bike despite being able to afford it, I'm sure a lot of others feel the same way - one of the things I enjoy about cycling is the exercise and the fact it keeps me healthy, moving to e-biking would mitigate both of those for me (this won't be true for all of course). I guess that view would change in the future should I develop some health ailment.

As batteries get better I think the third variant will become popular, that is, e-mtb with no pedals, or rather, an electric motorbike.

I wonder how and when the first e-bike/pedestrian accident will be reported

Are we forgetting the woman who ran out in front of one and subsequently died? [url= https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/09/12/uks-first-electric-bicycle-death-female-pedestrian-dies-hospital/ ]here[/url]

Nicely worded post from the OP, hard to argue with it.
And it backs up my desire to keep them as a separate entity from mountain biking.
Also thinking on the same lines as crasher50 - repair isn't like normal bikes, can't hike it onto the repair stand and fix pretty much all problems. So more expensive to buy and more expensive to maintain. I also havne't got the disposable income to buy and run one, so even though it's tougher at my age and health condition(!) I'll stick with the real bikes.

The exercise is an intrinsic part of cycling for me so for the moment e-bikes aren't for me. Having said that I watched a video recently of a race between the presenter on an e-bike and a world class XC rider and the presenter certainly put a lot of effort into it. (the e-bike won BTW)

If I lived and commuted in a town or city I'd see an e-bike as an ideal utility bike, yes they are limited to 15mph in assist mode but how much faster is the average urban journey by car?

Not sure about access rights becoming more nuanced - it's hard enough with the limited selection we have!

I think for me and a number of the people I ride with (not all of them), eMTBs are just not really an attraction.

I can see why people would want one, for a variety of reasons, but it's clearly a different pursuit, and people of equal ability won't use eMTBs and MTBs together for obvious reasons.

I like both the physical challenge and the challenge of choosing the right bits for what you're doing - ebikes take away both of those by compensating with excess power. That's not the solution to a human powered vehicle problem. Unless it's carrying some cargo (I have seriously considered dumping the car and getting an e-cargo bike, could get the kids around easily and at a decent speed, pick up huge amounts of shopping, and negligible running costs and environmental damage compared to a car).

I don't think there will be a tipping point. Ive lost more riding buddies to Zwift than e-bikes!

Went out for a ride with the roadies last night, 50miles, 2000ft at 17.7mph. The fun of that is in trying your hardest to hang onto a back wheel and occasionally doing a turn at the front to inflict a bit if pain in return. The complete antithesis of an e-bike.

Same with the mtb group, there's 3 groups riding, painfully slow, slow and painfully fast. The first two I can see a few people getting e-bikes, maybe. I think they like the idea of getting fitter but don't commit to it. The latter group I suspect would point and laugh, and like the roadies a lot of the fun is in trying to beat the rest of the group.

And why wouldn’t you?
................If I were in the market for a new bike with 4-6K in my pocket, I think it would be a no brainer. I can see high end “normal” bike sales plummeting

I hate to break this to you, but that's 4 months wages (5 after tax!).

I suspect the average kenevo owner is probably the time poor money rich guy who bought an s-works enduro last time around.

The other market is probably DH/Enduro riders. If you lived in Peebles or S.Wales (or anywhere else with a big hill and a DH scene) then all of a sudden it opens up the idea of going for a ride after work rather than just one or two runs.

It's the guys rising them round Swinley I just don't get. I'm sure some are old/injured/disabled, but the majority are just a bit fat! If anyone thinks pedaling an e-bike is going to be some sort of training, just look arround the lookout car park.

can’t co-exist in the same way that motor boating and yachting co-exist

It's a good analogy, sailors hate motorboats for just about every reason possible, and motorboaters just assume sailors cant afford an engine.

I can see high end “normal” bike sales plummeting in the next couple of years.

I don't see why that should be the case TBH. Apart from the motor, all the other components stay the same. so the cost difference in producing a  non powered frame, or one that can accommodate a battery and motor can't be massive, and there's always going to be a market for human powered bikes. Remember that the market you're talking about (high end MTBs) is pretty small anyway, you may loose a few older folk to e-MTB, but there's always younger riders for whom e-MTB just won't be attractive.

I don't think I'm as pessimistic as the OP (and I don't think there's reason to be) , and I can see eMTB and regular bikes happily co-existing. In the 30 or so years I've been riding mountain bikes, I don't think there's never been a point where there doesn't seem to be some existential threat of wholesale change to the MTB world, whether that's access rights or standards arguments, or gearboxes or e-bikes, and after all that time, I'm still riding essentially the same sort of bike, over the same sort of terrain, having as much fun as I always have. I can't see that stopping soon.

but it’s clearly a different pursuit, and people of equal ability won’t use eMTBs and MTBs together for obvious reasons.

It's really not, and I ride my Bronson with a few mates on ebikes. Keeps me on my toes!.

I suspect the average kenevo owner is probably the time poor money rich guy who bought an s-works enduro last time around

Non of the Kenevo owners I know fit this description.
All of them also own other bikes that still get riden.
Oh and non of them would ride Swinley on any bike never mind an Ebike.😉

Ebike article referred to above was in the Times but there's a paywall. From what I can see paragraph 4 starts as follows so we're in weapons grade NIMBY territory straight away...

“E-bikes are an increasing problem,” said Gale Gould, vice-chairwoman of the Friends of the New Forest in Hampshire.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/guilty-as-charged-e-bikers-plug-in-climb-on-and-carve-up-the-countryside-bfr7rkz96

As for the 'being played' comments above you can hardly say a shift from pedal powered to electric assisted is some incremental standards or niche refining nudge to force us all to buy again. It's a bit more fundamental than that. Not to say that ebikes won't have their own industry driven standards tweaks along with the more general bike-wide ones but I don't believe you're 'being played' by the industry with the introduction of something so significant.

I do wonder if the old 90s debate of trail erosion will rear it's head again. I think it was mentioned in the Times article. But e-bikes do make bigger ruts, so as someone said on page 1, possibly could result in legislation that affects all off road bikes...

I do wonder if the old 90s debate of trail erosion will rear it’s head again. 

I don't think an e-mtb passing over the ground causes any more erosion than a normal mtb, or at least only a tiny amount. Its the ability to turn any riding area into a uplift zone with multiple runs of often un maintained trails that can cause more erosion than conventional bikes.

Just thinking out loud, I wonder how and when the first e-bike/pedestrian accident will be reported, and whether it and subsequent collisions will perhaps trigger a change of rules from the policy makers.

It's been a few years now and we're still waiting on this wean getting its eye poked out! 😆

I don’t think an e-mtb passing over the ground causes any more erosion than a normal mtb,

It does. Maybe not "passing over the ground", but in other scenarios they definitely make a bigger mark on the ground.

Saw a big group of old lads (and ladies) started the climb up Cragg Road this morning. About 50/50 ebikes and not. Looked happy enough riding together to me. If you're super competitive or impatient, then perhaps buying an ebike might lead to you wanting to only ride with other people on ebikes, no one else should care.

Outside the rarified atmosphere of STW are many thousands of people who have neither the money or the desire to spend it on £500 of bike let alone several thousands so let’s just keep some perspective.

true, but ride-to-work schemes can sell a lot of bikes for retailers and the limit can go over £1000 now. E bikes can be had for £1000 already, most aren't that great but it will improve and putting them in front of people in shops vs online only bans will help. E-MTB will be carried or helped along by the growth of E bikes generally, plenty of E-MTBs are bought and used as the bike equivalent of an SUV rather than for 'mountain biking' as such.

RE all the sky-falling-in stuff about licensing after any accident backlash etc, they're already in law as bikes if they're EPAC spec, highly unlikely to change. DfT released a report not long ago suggesting little interest in further legislation on electric transport like bikes and scooters. Resource or political will unlikely to be there anyway. Can't see how that would happen just based on a rut 10% deeper than current bikes make either.

Round my way E-Bikes are being ridden on trails that are rubbish in the wet on a normal bike and so subsequently would be left alone until dry. Now the erosion caused by a group of +tyred mopeds plowing through the mud has wrecked a number of trails beyond repair.

In reality, they’ll be more expensive, less demand, less manufactured, more expensive.

I presume you mean fewer manufactured. How can a bike be less manufactured?

As for the OP, "social outcasts" seems to be putting it a bit strong. In a minority, possibly.

Now the erosion caused by a group of +tyred mopeds plowing through the mud has wrecked a number of trails beyond repair.

I remember a few years ago spending about 3 hours digging out slop and packing down good earth on a DH section of trail before a jump. Just as I’m stood there leaning on my spade admiring my work a group of maybe 15 Lycra clad XC boys churned their way up the trail right through my just repaired section.
This was pre-ebike days.

Wadda ya gona do?

Way to go with the pedant points nico.

As for the erosion issue, what exactly is the issue? If it wasn't for erosion that wee ribbon of singletrack you love so much on your local trails wouldn't exist.

Or is your level of erosion acceptable, wholesome, almost righteous? 🤣

It’s really not, and I ride my Bronson with a few mates on ebikes. Keeps me on my toes!.

I would suggest that perhaps they're very patient or you're a fair bit quicker uphill.

And it simply is a different pursuit. The two can be combined, but you can't say you're getting the same experience as them for a variety of reasons. (Not that I have any objection to them being out there and used by folk).

If you have absolutely no interest or take no enjoyment out of riding up a hill I see that an ebike would be the way forward. But for those that get enjoyment from going both up and down i cant see an ebike holding much appeal, at least not if you are physically able to pedal a normal bike.

I can see the market therefore for those long travel ebikes, however I fail to see why anyone, other than someone old or with a medical condition, would choose a road ebike over a normal one. The only exception being if a super keen roadie bought his wife one (or vice versa) so they could go riding together.

I joined one of my local groups, Calderdale MTB for a rare group ride on Wed night, 18 riders no e-bikes and a mixed bunch age wise, although mostly under 50 yrs old. In fact, so far not one of the people I ride with has succumbed.

On the flip side another local group of riders who are over 50yrs old are now over 50% e bikes.

Most people I know seem to agree that they look fun and as somebody already said if you lived near somewhere like the Golfie it would be a no brainer.

On a personal note I'm not really the target audience as while I can probably afford to buy a decent one I couldn't bring myself to spend that much money.

Ach, I'm out, another e-groundhog thread.

Do what you want, and stop moaning about what others are doing*.

*Though, I love a moan as much as the next man! 🙂

With the introduction of ebikes for kids, we may well end up with people who would never need to consider a non-bike.

My local riding "Group" IS now two groups, those with e and those without. In reality, with riders of similar fitness, the non e's can't hope to keep up with the e's, because they have twice the power, and you'd have to be a World class XC rider to keep up.

The other interesting thing is that in the e group, everyone also has an off road motorcycle, and had been an off road motor cyclist for years. Not sure what that shows but there is a strong correlation?

I think on bigger rides evokes can really push a gap in between abilities, both positively ie you can now keep up with your fitter mates or negatively you’re basically riding in your own as you don’t produce 250watts let alone have them on tap!! But it all comes down to not being a tool about it on a group ride, line if you’re a lot fitter then you don’t need to hammer everyone every time!

As for making things easier realistically there’s not many MTBers who recreationally ride once twice a week say that will be able to know out a day long Lakes ride and feel fresh as a daisy afterwards!! The Ebike fills that gap and that’s cool.

I’m prob the ideal Ebike candidate but Ive just bought a “analogue” (I love that phrase! 😂) bike as I want to use it to get fitter and don’t Mind that my rides will get proportionally longer as I do.

I’m surprised at how many Enikes are about mind you they almost rival Santa Cruz at Whinlatter now....😈

“E-bikes are an increasing problem,” said Gale Gould, vice-chairwoman of the Friends of the New Forest in Hampshire.

Interesting. All my riding is in the New Forest and I would estimate the number of E-Bikes to non E-Bikes that I see is well under 1%. Gale sounds like a typical bitter and entitled New Forest resident, they also hate immigrants but we don't have those either.

I want more E-Bikes on road and gravel as they give me something to pace going uphill.

You have to remember that motorbikes have been around for more than 100 years. There's a reason people still pedal around on bicycles rather than just jumping in a car and having the highest level of comfort possible.

The appeal of eBikes is understandable, and it will continue to grow. There was a time I probably would have lusted after one, but nowadays I go out more for the pedal up the hills than the ride back down.

 There was a time I probably would have lusted after one, but nowadays I go out more for the pedal up the hills than the ride back down.

I'm nearly at that point as well. Nearly 60 and I'm finding it harder to go fast on narrow downhill singletrack, my eyes seem to loose focuse and my balance starts to go. The faster and more bumby things are the worse it gets. My fitness is still good so attacking climbs and taking things a bit easier descending makes sense for me at the moment.
E-biking up the hills would remove that challenge and enjoyment.

I wonder how many of you have ridden an ebike? You have to pedal or it doesn’t go! If you like pedalling you still pedal hard, you just go faster.

Today I rode 14 miles with 1400’ of climbing for commuting reasons, both on and off road and jumped some doubles - in under an hour of cycling.

Tell us more about those sweet commuter doubles Chief.
Middle aged fitness snobbery and deluded fitness pride bores me rigid.
er... wait. no.. not rigid. limp!
honestly I'm not aroused at all.
well.. ok. maybe a little.

I think/hope e-bikes will fizzle out as people get fed up with their whizzy little motors wearing out and their 5K toy not working any more. They probably won't feel like stumping up for another one every few years, well some will but not the majority.
Just like I'd love all car drivers to be forced into riding a bike for a while, I'd love all mtb'ers to be forced to ride a single speed for a winter. Aaahh, the silence! Something that's been lost in the new generation of assisted cycles. Whrrrrrrr, whrrrrr, whrrrrrr, the sound of an electric drill taped to your bike. Great!

I'm not saying riding an ebike is "easy" because all they do is boost the riders input, but in the uk, where more time is spent going up (because the average speed is much lower) an ebike provides, ime, an un-beatable advantage. On my local loop, the guys on ebikes can actually ride every "run" twice in the time it takes me to ride it once, and whilst i'm no cross country whippet, i'm not that slow either! This isn't necessarily a bad thing, they get twice the miles (if not twice the smiles...) but it does preclude riding together ime, because waiting for a normal non e'd up rider to get up a climb feels like an eternity, time there riders would rather spend doing more riding!

I’d love all mtb’ers to be forced to ride a single speed for a winter.

Bloody hell, the purist caliphate is forming right here on STW.

I’d love all mtb’ers to be forced to ride a single speed for a winter.

I've done over a decades worth of that shit before realising how shit it was.😁
Been up in Inners this week and ridden 7 days on the trot with around 1300 meters of descending every day apart from today when we did 1900 meters
All on ebikes apart from 1 day on a non assisted bike.
Did I miss my single speed at any point?
I'll let you guess 😆

Just checking something, are you saying you’ve spent an entire week riding at Innerleithen?

Inners,Golfie,GT and Yair.
Still not riden all the trails.
Didn't have time to get over Thornielee this trip.
Why?

See I like the challenge of riding up hill, I like a not too heavy bike (especially off road) but I can see one use that would completely drive me to E-Bikery...

Commuting, if I ride to work its 16-20 miles each way with a laptop and a few other bits (say 5-10kg of luggage, tools and water), it's undulating and plenty of stopping at lights etc. I reckon the shortest distance commute at rush hour is easily 30 miles worth of "riding in the countryside" road riding because of the constant stopping and starting and compromising on flow to deal with other traffic.

An e-tourer or e-hybrid using a low-ish assist setting would I think be a really interesting way to make that commute viable for someone (me) who is not mega fit but loves riding a bike but doesn't want to take 90minutes to get to work and arrive tired. This for me is the potential future of e-bikes.

Going back to the original question, i think we've past the tipping point now, a lot of focus and money is being spent on developing E-Bikes, take up is getting better and with the cycle to work scheme and others assisting sales, i can't see it falling away, only getting more of a demand which will in turn drive more innovation.

As for my opinion, i love E-Bikes, never had one, or used one, but i think they get people who wouldn't normally do stuff out and about, up FoD, Cwmcarn, etc i see people enjoying mountain biking that wouldn't be at those places without the assist, i also see people who are way fitter than me using them and still burning as much energy as i do, they just get twice the distance in a day. There's definitely a place for E-Bikes in almost every avenue of cycling, just wish they were cheaper!

I have done 3 mtb events this year that had ebike classes ( Boltby bash enduro and a couple of mtb challenges) very few ebikes entered on any of them,I think there is a long way to go before they become the norm, I bought a Vitus e sommet last July and although it's fun to ride I prefer my Pace RC529 hardtail

" plenty of E-MTBs are bought and used as the bike equivalent of an SUV rather than for ‘mountain biking’ as such."

Yo. Buying a full suspension ebike with suspended rack for comfort/commuting, that's an SUV if ever there was one. Nearly bought a full suspension cargo bike but it wouldn't fit in the work bike racks.

Seriously though I'm obese class 2 (there are no obese-r classes) and riding my acoustic bike is too much effort for me to do every day, I end up drenched with sweat and entirely inappropriate for an office environment so I just don't do it. The few times I've done it with a rented ebike have been amazing. It's knocked tens of minutes off my usually hour or so commute and I've arrived fresh as a daisy. If I want to put some effort in on the way home I still can, as evidenced by a recent ebike hire in the lakes. While on full assistance (to catch up with my wife who had given up halfway and was going back) I was dripping with sweat from a trip starting at the ferry crossing by Bowness, going up to High Wray, then on to Wray Castle and back again. It was great fun and not something I'd have ever been able/willing to tackle on an acoustic bike.

Are ebikes reaching a critical mass? I don't think so, but I hope so, there are an awful lot of fat folk in the world who could do with fun exercise enabling for them. If it takes money to do so, so be it.

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I wonder how many of you have ridden an ebike? You have to pedal or it doesn’t go!

I have ridden one and although you have to pedal going up a hill at 15mph is A LOT less work than going up a hill at 15mph on a non e-bike. I have also followed one up a mostly uphill 3 mile gravel road and while I was putting in everything I have to maintain 15mph the e-bike rider was sat up just casually spinning the pedals around.

“I have ridden one and although you have to pedal going up a hill at 15mph is A LOT less work than going up a hill at 15mph on a non e-bike.“

Well, duh!

But you’re looking at it the wrong way around. I pedal just as hard a lot of the time but go faster.

Or when I’m with my mates on non-e bikes, most of the time I turn the assistance off.

Inners,Golfie,GT and Yair.
Still not riden all the trails.
Didn’t have time to get over Thornielee this trip.
Why?

Just me gaining a little insight. That’s the sort of trip I’d never consider and have no interest in. Although I can see the appeal, I can’t recall empathise with it.