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Morning,
I'm in the market for a new steel hardtail. I currently ride a Cove Handjob for trails, the odd trip to trail centres and general mucking about. For slogging through the wilderness I've got a fatbike. I've come to the conclusion that while the Cove is huge fun and can absolutely rip, it's just too small. I deliberately got it small for chucking about, but in retrospect this wasn't clever; after 10mls it just hurts to ride it.
In an effort to get with the times, I'm thinking about 27.5 as a preference.
So now I'm looking at the following:
PP Shan 27 917 - The complete bike looks very tempting. But is it TOO hardcore for a moocher like me? If I'm going for PP would an Oka be better?
Stanton Switchback - I like the wheel size, the bolt-through rear axle and the frame looks great, that that headtube angle is insane. I'd like to be able to knock a few up and down miles off. Which leads me to:
Stanton Sherpa (27.5+) - Bit of a wildcard with the plus wheels. It's also a QR rear axle. If I go down the plus route then I may as well chuck my fattie in the bin right?
Other obvious choices are the Transition Trans AM, NS Eccentric (complete bike going cheap(ish) on CR right now), BFE and innumerable others. The reviews of the On One 45650(?) are mixed, so I'm not convinced about that one.
And then (of course) there's the chorus of my friends demanding to know why I'm not buying a full bouncer... There's too much choice. I need a lie down.
Yes there is a bewildering choice and many good frames too which you can add a multitude of different components. I am very happy with my BFe and I'm sure I'd love a Soul or indeed other brand options. I have a Covert and like the look of the TransAm. In some respects I think it's best to just buy what you fancy. Unless you go out on a limb given its such a competitive sector most frames are well sorted
NS Surge (or equivalent full build) would be my choice, great ride. Wouldn't get too hung up on bolt through axle, Cy at Cotic wrote a piece on it a couple of months back. Might be on the geek section of their website.
There's the [url= http://www.pacecycles.com/pacecycles-rc127/ ]pace rc127[/url] also, it's what I have, so far it's really quite nice. Singletrack reviewed it in issue 100 and really liked it. You can also run 650b+ in it if you want.
It's not as slack as the switchback so a bit better for all round riding. I was also tempted by the shan but they had none in when I was ready to buy so I went for the pace.
I'm looking at that list and wondering why the Cotic Soul isn't on it.
Sure you want steel?
ahem....
http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/nicolai-argon-am-frame-650b-rockshox-pike-650b-150-rct3-solo-air-1
Stop bloody posting that, Wrecker. I spent long enough looking at it last night.
This one? (scuse cables and shit drystone wall)
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😉
Cabletastic!
🙂
If I hadn't just bought a hardtail, I'd be finding ways to make that happen.
Yeah, before I chopped and bled everything. Sorry. 😳
OK let me be clear that I an NOT buying a steel HT, but if I was I'd probably be looking at the Slackline or Pace.
Are you very tall? There are only two sizes in the Slackline.
Oh - in ths spriti of recommending what you have - I went for this
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Oooh, that's niiiice.
I'm in the same boat, after selling my BMX and Chumba HX1 I've spent a lot of time thinking about hardtails for hooning round trail centers! I've still got an out and out XC bike for mile munching, and a Fat bike for (well, not much, it's just fun).
Part of me thinks Parkwood for commonality of spares with my XC bike, part of me want's a modern/lighter version of my old 456 which had 2.5" tyres on wide rims before '+' became a thing (I'd like a 45650b, but I keep looking at the geometry and it just doesn't look 'right' with the tall BB, downside of mail order only, it might be brilliant on a test ride).
But then there's things like the Triggers at Pauls which make me question the point of a hardtail when you can get a good FS for similar money!
[edit]Just found that Last, looks fantastic! Even their one size fit's all 4X bike isn't stingy on the top tube!
Another recommendation of own bike, but a Switchback is more than capable of bashing out many miles up and down.
How about a Kingdom Vendetta. http://kingdombike.com/en/ti_bike/vendetta2
Very biased, mines being shipped today hopefully.
wrecker - MemberOooh, that's niiiice.
Got it from their Kickstarter page. 399 Euro for the frame, including shipping and a free t-shirt. Doesn't arrive until February, though.
That Vendetta is a lovely looking bike, but a smidge out of my budget. I'd end up hanging shite parts from it and feeling depressed.
I was also looking at the Chromag Wide Angle.
550euro retail isn't bad depending on exchange rates.Got it from their Kickstarter page. 399 Euro for the frame, including shipping and a free t-shirt. Doesn't arrive until February, though.
Will be interested to see the tyre clearances when it arrives, if somethi.g like 2.35 HD or 2.4 Schwalble or Conti tyres fit I'm tempted.
thisisnotaspoon - MemberWill be interested to see the tyre clearances when it arrives, if somethi.g like 2.35 HD or 2.4 Schwalble or Conti tyres fit I'm tempted.
They say it takes 2.35 tyres - a 2.5" Maxxis will fit, or 2.36 Schwalbes. 3.0 Schwalbes fit in 650+, pic shows 3.0 Rocket Rons on 45mm rims
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Theres only one thing on my shopping list for next year.....
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Luuurverley innit?
That reminds me the new Crush frame looks fantastic.
Shame they only offer boring black without a £100 upcharge.
This is the correct answer.
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They say it takes 2.35 tyres - a 2.5" Maxxis will fit
Yea, but a 2.5 maxxis is closer to some 2.2's!
Interesting that a 27x3 fits but they recommend a 2.8, and a 29x2.5 fits but they recommend a 2.3, makes me wonder if they've built it and then found that it gets better the lower you go, in which case 27x2.4 might even be a fun option when ground clearance isn't an issue (then again, why ride a 140mm bike when ground clearance isn't an issue). It does look like they've got it bonkers short out back.
in the spirit of recommending what you have
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Okay. I'm about a millimetre from pulling the trigger on the PP Shan 27 917 (complete bike).
Final question. While it's clearly geared toward having a whale of a time going downhill, how is it for 'normal' trail duties? You know, just sort of going up and down and round a little bit? Sometimes fast, sometimes gasping for air. Perhaps going to the newsagents to get a Snickers.... that sort of thing.
Final question. While it's clearly geared toward having a whale of a time going downhill, how is it for 'normal' trail duties? You know, just sort of going up and down and round a little bit? Sometimes fast, sometimes gasping for air. Perhaps going to the newsagents to get a Snickers.... that sort of thing.
It'll be fine for all that - I've been doing all my riding, including my urban commute, on my full sus recently, which is much longer and slacker than a Shan. Only issue is it getting nicked whilst you get your Snickers - you may end up running a Marathon trying to get it back!
I've had a Shan, and while it's a great bike for DH especially with some stiff forks up front (lyriks, Pike, F36 etc) and TBH even climbing it wasn't so bad, think of a bulldozer and you be not far from how it handles...i.e. not stopping for anything and holding any line regardless of how sketchy! But...For general pootling about it wasn't fabulous, that's not to say it wasn't liveable with, but it was obviously where it didn't shine.
It was a bit heavy, mine slathered in XTR and with not an outrageously heavy wheels, X819 on hopes, it was knocking on for 30lbs, the lyriks didn't help! Nicest HT to look at and hoon about on...But...I broke mine, headtube to toptube junction, along the welds on both sides, I'm about 75kg all kitted up, and I'm not a bike killer, in fact the Shan was the first bike in 20 years I've actually broken. and the pressfit BB and integrated headsets were a PITA, and not something I'd be keen to live with again, especially the headset, personally I think with longer harder hitting forks, it just didn't seem like the best solution, worked loose most rides, and while in looked neat, it did need looking after more than the equivalent standard HS.
Replaced it with a Bfe which lasted 2 rides before it was moved on, as in comparison to the Shan it was just dead feeling. I like the look of the Last thing.
Only issue is it getting nicked whilst you get your [b]Snickers [/b]- you may end up running a [b]Marathon [/b]trying to get it back!
I see what you did there 
thisisnotaspoon - MemberYea, but a 2.5 maxxis is closer to some 2.2's!
I think that's the case for the Older Maxxis, les so with the new
Wrecker that looks great 🙂 I keep lusting for a hardtail for some reason despite knowing full well I prefer full sus for everything.
The dartmoor hornet looks great especially in the petrol colour! I'm tempted by one. It's not steel though.
Just get a bigger cove?
Fancy a p7 myself but no sign so far.
A Shan will be fine for trail duties. It's maybe a touch heavy, but not to the extent that it's a hindrance. You'll be having so much fun on it you won't care anyway!
Dialled Alpine. Check those out too. Such a fun little bike.
I was in a similar position at the beginning of the year.
Having had biggish bikes for a while, I'd built up a Stanton Slackline as a second bike which I really liked and rode more and more but it was too small for longer rides so I decided to build up a hardtail that fitted. I narrowed my choice down to a Shan and a Switchback.
I really, really like the Shan. It's a very pretty bike especially in Gulf colours but I was put off by the BB. I also heard that the paint quality was poor and chipped just looking at it.
I ended up with a Switchback which I love. Really love. It's great - climbs well, decends well, is fun popping off stuff etc. I like it so much that I all but stopped riding my Banshee because it felt heavy, slow and sluggish.
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I thought the Switchback was so good that I've sold the Banshee and the steel Switchback and have literally just built the Ti version.
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Anyone have a NS surge with 120 forks. What are they like ?
I also heard that the paint quality was poor and chipped just looking at it.
oh yeah, that as well. 😕
The Last looks fantastic.
futon river crossing - MemberThe Last looks fantastic.
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I literally just built this. Come from a soul 26. It's two very muddy rides in with bonty xr4 both ends and a reverb now. It's a couple of pounds heavier than the soul. Some of that's the 27.5 and some of it is the frame. It feels very capable. Really confident descending with better rollover than the soul and masses of grip. Climbs fine too. It's too muddy to compare strava times at the moment but so far I really like it.
The Last does look pretty awesome. My next bike I'm pretty certain is going to be a Stanton Switchback but that's put the cat amongst the pigeons a bit.
ceepers. I'm currently on a Soul 26", but want something slacker and more upto date headtube/seattube. Too much choice out there!
One of my options is the TransAm, so the more you can tell me the difference in ride quality between that and the soul the better! Thanks!
It's a little early to be that sure and it's so wet out I haven't been able to crank it and compare my strava times. I had a small soul and have gone to a medium trans am I'm 5'7. The ETT is a fair bit longer and the reach is a bit longer. I have a medium bandit 275 and the reach on this is the same. It feels less cramped than the soul did (once I'd got the bandit)
I just bought the frame and fork and have borrowed the wheels from the bandit for now. All the other bits came off the soul. It's got bigger tyre than the soul as well as the bigger wheels size. The trans am is 130 up front and the soul was at 120. Same 50mm stem and bars on both.
It's definitely a pound or so heavier but it climbs well and the slacker head angle hasn't felt wandery. The soul was so nimble it almost felt a bit too skittery sometimes and this feels like it has the balance right. It corners well and I had one particularly satisfying railing of a corner I know well yesterday. The grip felt good.
I love descending (even though I'm a fairly good climber) it's definitely got more rollover than the soul had and felt very composed on the roots descent I did yesterday. The slacker angle and extra 10mm travel swallowed more of the bumps.
I really like it so far. My only issue with the soul was that it felt a little short and skittery compared to the bandit and this seems to have solved those issues. It's really easy to manual too, easier than the soul
We've just finished building up a Transam 27.5 and I must say, it looks fantastic. Very tempted to get one myself but I've just ordered a new Salsa frame. Can I justify a 27.5 and a 29er hardtail?
If anyone has any queries about the Transam I'd be happy to try to help.
Again, in the spirit of recommending what you have...
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Never mind the bike. Where is that last pic from?
I've been playing around on a 2souls slim jim and I'm very impressed with it . So much fun with the short wheelbase and the speed of the bigger wheels.
Orange crush frame.. £400 in orange
Never mind the bike. Where is that last pic from?
*sigh*
The trail always gets more attention than the bike. But it was superb. Park Head Road heading towards Seathwaite in the Lakes. Just seemed to be never ending, sketchy, loose rock descent. The BFE handled it well.
Dartmoor hornet or primal if you want somthing not so slack.
Chromag Rootdown. Steel, slack, 140mm up front = mucho fun. Great on the steep and twisty stuff too.
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Isn't there a new P7 out soon from Orange? http://www.vitalmtb.com/photos/features/2016-Trail-All-Mountain-Enduro-Bikes-at-Eurobike,9335/Orange-P7,97083/bturman,109
Looks mint to me - all the right angles etc.
Isn't there a new P7 out soon from Orange?
There is (see page 1), dunno if its the new owner shaking things uo a little but next years hardtails are lookin brilliant, vlockwork is an inch longer and degree slacker too.
Wait but just wait for the new P7 it looks feels rides amazingly
Bought the shan yet?
I love mine and as for pootling or non gnar it did 40 miles of fireoads and big climbs on the great glen way last week fine...[URL= http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f384/muz_topbanana/Bikes/20151105_110726_zpshvvhwnfx.jp g" target="_blank">
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Thanks everyone for the suggestions. In the end I went with the Shan. Having never ridden it (or many of the other suggestions) it came down to taking a punt. And I was sold by the look and the comparative rarity. I should also add that the emails I've sent have been responded to within hours and so far the service seems okay. I'll post a review on the bike later.
I've had a dialled alpine and is a great little bike but my new one is just a complete monster in comparison actually climbs better but going down is where it is just hilariously fun!
Old Dialled
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New Fuse
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Thanks everyone for the suggestions. In the end I went with the Shan. Having never ridden it (or many of the other suggestions) it came down to taking a punt. And I was sold by the look and the comparative rarity. I should also add that the emails I've sent have been responded to within hours and so far the service seems okay. I'll post a review on the bike later.
Good stuff. Enjoy.
They are very, very pretty bikes.
its pretty smart that shan other than the reach
[quote=catbaiter ]Thanks everyone for the suggestions. In the end I went with the Shan. Having never ridden it (or many of the other suggestions) it came down to taking a punt. And I was sold by the look and the comparative rarity. I should also add that the emails I've sent have been responded to within hours and so far the service seems okay. I'll post a review on the bike later.
when are we going to go get it muddy then...
Mid-week night ride on the Quantocks? I'll have the bike by early next week.
I want that Last. Is it just me thinking it's weird to build a bike specifically to be b+ compatible but only make it work with 2.8s?
More positive feedback for Production Privee. I've just received an email letting me know that the bike has been posted, included in the email were some images of the contents and parts etc. If the bike lives up to the service so far, then it's going to be a blinder.
I believe that the Last is built specifically for 29 inch wheels but will accept a b+ rather than the other way around
emmodd - Member
I believe that the Last is built specifically for 29 inch wheels but will accept a b+ rather than the other way around
Designed from the start towork with either wheelsize. Although 650+ as a wheesslze was only ever "designed" to fit 29ers
[i]"This kind of bike started to make sense with the appearance of burlier 29" components and the new 650+ wheel size."[/i]
[i]"With 29 inch and 650+ wheels having less then 10 mm difference in tire size, it was possible to design one frame that can take both.[/i]"
Northwind - MemberI want that Last. Is it just me thinking it's weird to build a bike specifically to be b+ compatible but only make it work with 2.8s?
It will fir a 3.0 - pictures below are with Schwalbe 3.0s on 45mm rims - Not sure how their plus tyres size up, but Schwalbe are generally on the bigger end of the tyre spectrum.
They just commented that they'd generally lean towards 2.8s, as they save a little weight and offer better clearance.
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I just got myself a Switchback in gun metal. I'm coming from a Soul 26" and was torn between 3 frames, Switchback/TransAm/Shan. I very nearly bought the Shan with DVO forks combo as 3 of my riding mates have them and DD Cycles are not far away. The BB, lack of bottlecage bosses + what appears to be cheaper, less forgiving steel (4130) put me off +I didnt need such expensive forks (this was meant to be a cheapish upgrade!). The TransAm was the same steel, plus it wasnt as slack as the Stanton.
I'm going to be using the Switchback with all components from Soul 26" for the time being - except for a last min bargain set of 650b forks from Bird lol! I've got 150mm forks going on, which would higher the BB a little (apparently 140mm is best), however, my 26" wheels will lower it again.
I have a Banshee Rune FS too, so it sounds like similar background to other Stanton riders?!
So have you bought one yet? If not , I just have the one word for you.......
STAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANTON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I went for a stif morf. Best bike I've ever ridden. My house backs onto trails so I ride it almost daily and haven't ridden my orange five since I got it.
In addition to that, it sounds to me like the new slackline would be right up your street, not as slack as the switchback, can take plus tyres if your little heart so desires, but if you're not adverse to the old 29" thang, the Sherpa is a magnificent uk trail bike, I've owned a ti slackline, a ti mk2 switchback, and currently own a 853 steel mk1 Sherpa, if you're local ish to me, you're welcome to have a play on it if you want to meet up sometime. Also, if you're on Facebook, check out the Stanton owners group, we have 670 odd members, were a helpful bunch,and you'll probs be able to blag a ride on any of the models from one of the members on there, and get lots of good advice, and probably a bit of banter and piss taking!
Cheers,
Si.
Aaaaah, just seen, you went with a Shan...... Never mind, maybe next new bike time eh!