[Closed] Gravel / Gnarmac still well under the radar in the UK?

Do I/[s]we have an inflated [/s]/ unrealistic view of the interest in this kind of cycling by being too close to the hardcore few do you think?

I just ride me bike

Not sure a frame that only takes up to 35mm is a gnarmac/gravel/adventure/monster cx etc etc ?

I could be totally wrong but I thought standard cx bikes take up to 35mm and gravelly types are designed for bigger rubber ?

Its pretty damn popular in the events that are available. I think the problem you have is your stuck with a CX bike that wont fit proper tyres, time to upgrade 😆

I wouldn't fret too much about it. I've done a couple of gravel races and just used my ss rigid 29er. Most folk just run what they've got, so hardtails, rigids, cx and maybe the odd one or 2 gravel/gnarmac bikes.

If you are wrecking the biggest cx tyres you have, then maybe use a mtb?

[quote=STATO ]I think the problem you have is your stuck with a CX bike that wont fit proper tyres, time to upgrade That.

If you can only fit 35's and you've damaged 'fragile' cx tyres (seriously tho, semislick cx are the same build as light gravel tyres) then fit some Landcruisers. Fast rolling, grip in gravel, tough as nails, bit heavier than premium tyres.

Do I/we have an inflated / unrealistic view of the interest in this kind of cycling by being too close to the hardcore few do you think?

there seems to be little interest in Gravel / Adventure etc... riding in the UK still. There are a few events springing up, but as far as stocking of components & such..

Well for starters I don't think you're as hardcore as you think you are, if you were then you'd have been doing it before it was a thing and bodging/fixing/making it up as you go along instead of looking for specific parts labelled 'gnarmac approved!' in the shops

Also, although there are some events around I think you'll find part of the appeal of 'just riding around' (as I prefer to call it) are that you can just go out and do it, no need for events, no need to be told where to go, no need to use specific equipment or to be told what equipment is right, you just work out what works for you and go ride your bike places.

If you're actually after proper gravel [i]racing [/i]then yeah, you're probably right it is a bit lacking, but in no small part because we simply don't have the miles and miles of gravel roads like other big countries, nor the space to do multi-day events without coming close to civilisation on a too-regular-to-be-worthwhile basis. The only exception to this perhaps being Scotland, and even then, it wouldn't be an easy event to run...

I'm struggling to get any decent tyres for a start. I can only go up to 35c due to frame clearance... I don't want to use fragile CX tyres. (I have the 32c Gravel King SK, but they are a bit narrow for rockier riding.)

So use a XC mountain bike instead? If you can't cope with it on 32/32c tyres then either go slower or you're using the wrong tool for the job.

CX tyres aren't any less fragile than gravel tyres really, if you need more beef then you're going to have to look at touring tyres (and associated compromises) or a frame with more clearance.

I'm annoyed I can't get Thunder Burts in mine without losing paint and Speed King2s only come in 2.2. I know.

Gee from here won the Dirty Reiver, then reckoned he'd have gone faster on a hardtail. He also used a hardtail to win this years Gravel Dash 100.

So then, if gravel/gnarmac stuff isn't the best at gravel races, then what's the point?

isnt gravel/gnarmic just an N+1 justification on the fringes of a fringe hobby

What is a gravel track? Is this the same as fire roads/Land Rover tracks?

Yes.

But you can't sell that. So

It's a go anywhere approach, big distance, self sufficiency, not seeking technicality, but covering the miles in a big place etc....

Gee from here won the Dirty Reiver, then reckoned he'd have gone faster on a hardtail. He also used a hardtail to win this years Gravel Dash 100.

That's because he was miles out in front of everyone 😆
Kielder is also pretty rough for the whole distance

In the US the races are more popular so they seem to be raced like road-races with packs forming and lots of drafting.

Think of it more like mountain biking 25 years ago 🙂

Or stick 26" wheels in with 2.1/2.25 rubber on !!

[url= https://c3.staticflickr.com/9/8809/29406763970_9deb5da7f7_k.jp g" target="_blank">https://c3.staticflickr.com/9/8809/29406763970_9deb5da7f7_k.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/LNzmpU ]Pickenflick on 26"[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/54931015@N07/ ]Plus one2010[/url], on Flickr

If you're actually after proper gravel racing then yeah, you're probably right it is a bit lacking, but in no small part because we simply don't have the miles and miles of gravel roads like other big countries, nor the space to do multi-day events without coming close to civilisation on a too-regular-to-be-worthwhile basis. The only exception to this perhaps being Scotland, and even then, it wouldn't be an easy event to run...

I think that pretty much sums it up.

Well yes, but you can still draft on an mtb, and if it covers the ground better (for UK gravels races anyway), then it's got to be the best choice.

The reality is we don't have the terrain of the USA, but we are trying to make the 'gravel' thing fit here.

Thanks for the replies - a few answers to suggestions / comments so far:
I've done my fair share of riding MTBs over the years and have been re-discovering the joys of drop bar bikes of late.
I don't "race" any more but I've done the odd Adventure Cross CX style sportive and similar events. I ride a GT Grade and 35c is the max tyre width that'll leave any mud room. The "Gravel Specific" tyres I mentioned come with puncture protection layers which CX race tyres don't as I understand it. I've not tried proper CX tyres on my Grade, but have been put off by plentiful reports of multiple punctures when riding Cross tyres away from the race circuit, as they are built for speed, grip & lightweight, rather than robustness / durability.
I've done some fairly rugged rides on 32c with not a single flat, but would like a bit more airspace for extra grip / comfort / protection.
I do have some 35c Landcruisers, but they are waaay heavy for longer rides, especially where a lot of tarmac is involved.

I can get by ok with what I have, but it's frustrating when you can see riders on what appears to be exactly what you want in the USA and you can't buy here.

I'll be the first to admit that the Gravel tag is a bit stupid here in the UK.
I'm just enjoying big(ish), fast(ish), miles over a variety of terrain.

According to the bicycle academy 70% of people passing through their doors are building 'all road' drop bar bikes. I reckon most of them (and myself included) just ride them without the need for events. Now, as a statistic it might be that if you're going to the hassle of doing a weeks course to build a frame a life bike makes sense. I love MTB, CX and road and work in all of those fields. However, 90% of my riding is on a customer cx/all road. This lunchtime is an example:
[IMG] [/IMG]

Not quite sure how you've missed this trend really, there seems to be a never ending range of drop bar bikes that can take bigger rubber, tonnes of tyre choice, and interesting 1x11 drop bar groupsets.

I think the 'gravel'/adventure label has caught on pretty well, but 'gravel' is a pretty useless term and as already mentioned, one that doesn't hold up in the UK because of the terrain. There's not a great deal of difference between the dirt drop bar bikes here or in the US really, but here they are used for different things. Gravel in the US is graded, non-metalled roads covering big distances, which they have plenty of (and so does some of Scandinavia too FWIW). In the UK we make do with the same trails and tracks (fireroads being very different from a graded 'gravel' road) as mtbs and so often an mtb does just as good a job.

In my opinion (as the owner of a 'Gravel bike') there are two ways you can look at this.

1) We don't have any real gravel roads, certainly not in the south east. Therefore a bike designed specifically for the purpose of riding on gravel roads is a bit pointless (in theory). I personally find mine to be a pain in the arse off-road compared to my MTB and not as quick as my road bike on tarmac. So I don't use it

2) For some people they make a lot of sense. Disc brakes, sturdy build, higher at the front, able to take guards, bigger tyres and so on - for said people this gives them a bike that for them is far more practical than either an MTB or full on road bike.

There are a few races but most of our off-road terrain is better suited to an MTB rather than a slackened out cross bike. Tyre wise I've only used G ones and some vittoria cross things that were crap. The G ones seem a bit more robust, but I doubt they'd stand up to rocks.

Your second point is mainly why I bought the Grade, Flange.
It's almost as good as a "proper" road bike for fast tarmac rides and pretty capable off-road, most fun when mixing up the two.
There's limited MTB worthy off-road near where I live, so I bought it to allow more riding from the front door. (I could have bought a CX bike ages ago, I guess, but the idea didn't occur to me until I started seeing the GT Grade adverts & videos and I liked the slightly more road bias of this particular bike.)

See, I've got a few road bikes as well as the Grade and I always take one of them rather than the Grade - it just feels so slow compared to the others. It's also higher at the front which I can't get on with, but I realise that's purely personal as some folk can't stand a high front end.

I forced myself to commute on it the other week and it was bloody miserable. I then took it round Bedgebury and again it was zero fun, although riding there and avoiding paying £12 for the car park made me feel better.

Different strokes for different folks I suppose

I ride the same stuff on my MTB with 2.4" tyres as I do on my cross bike with 35c tyres, just a bit slower when on the skinny wheels.

Ride back roads to somewhere with good off-road riding, ride the off-road stuff, ride home on back roads. Or, link a couple of different off-road areas (like Swaledale and Hamsterley) on one ride. Or, ride to somewhere via Sustrans routes. Or, ride local tamer BWs and farm tracks.

Am I riding gnarmac/adventure?

The only real reason for the title of my post was because I'm frustrated that I can't buy the tyres I want in this country. 😳
I'd have thought they would have been worth the distributors importing by now.

Nothing should come between a man and his tyres! 👿

These tyres are widely available in 35mm wide.

Small Block 8:
[img] [/img]

Land Cruiser:
[img] [/img]

The Land Cruiser is particularly good for all-round, on/off road use.

On the subject of gravel roads: [b]the UK must be one of the most tarmac'd countries in the world[/b]. The proportion of public roads that are not covered in tough black stuff or concrete is tiny. We certainly don't have long sections of unsurfaced roads between towns.

The only real reason for the title of my post was because I'm frustrated that I can't buy the tyres I want in this country.

Any shop with a ZyroFisher account can get you a pair of Gravel King SK in a 35c. £34.99 each.

Yes.

But you can't sell that. So

It's [s]a go anywhere approach, big distance, self sufficiency, not seeking technicality, but covering the miles in a big place etc....[/s] [b]still riding on fire roads[/b]

If you're actually after proper gravel racing then yeah, you're probably right it is a bit lacking, but in no small part because we simply don't have the miles and miles of gravel roads like other big countries, nor the space to do multi-day events without coming close to civilisation on a too-regular-to-be-worthwhile basis. The only exception to this perhaps being Scotland, and even then, it wouldn't be an easy event to run...

I think that pretty much sums it up.

Pretty much the same reason that the UK's premier freerider is [url= http://elbry.blogspot.co.uk/ ]Elbry[/url]

Yes.

But you can't sell that. So

It's [s]a go anywhere approach, big distance, self sufficiency, not seeking technicality, but covering the miles in a big place etc.... [/s]still riding on fire roads

If you are trashing tyres on any bike, it's you that's the problem.

The Scwalbe G-One's are trickling in now I believe

simondbarnes wrote:

Any shop with a ZyroFisher account can get you a pair of Gravel King SK in a 35c. £34.99 each.

No one seemed to stock them, so I e-mailed Zyro. They didn't reply.

crikey wrote:

If you are trashing tyres on any bike, it's you that's the problem.

I'm not. I've not even punctured once since I bought the bike in June last year. I was just after a bit more volume!

Even halfords stock land cruisers! As well as their svelte cousins,the cx comp&pro!

For me it's simply getting out and riding, however I have ridden the Gravel Dash a couple of times on both CX and fatbike with not a huge difference in time or finishing position. From someone who started riding rigid bikes offroad and never seen the need to change, magazines and bike makers place too much emphasis on the bike - most people are over-biked and if you adapt your riding style, a monster CX with 40-50mm tyres is hugely capable and great fun, particularly where you can join up sections of trail and tarmac. I race CX too, but I have two difference set-ups - carbon wheels and tubulars for CX and 40mm+ tubeless for regular offroad.

I ride the same stuff on my MTB with 2.4" tyres as I do on my cross bike with 35c tyres, just a bit slower when on the skinny wheels.

So do I apart from the fact I am faster on my fixed track bike than my MTB on most segments due to living in an area made of fire roads.

I wouldn't use gravel tyres though as they would puncture within 10 minutes...

Just move to Norway, I did and there's about a billion miles of this out here:

[img] [/img]

Easier to move country than buy a new bike... 😀

Got back home on Sunday from the most excellent 1st Torino Nice Rally...

franki - Member
simondbarnes wrote:

Any shop with a ZyroFisher account can get you a pair of Gravel King SK in a 35c. £34.99 each.
No one seemed to stock them, so I e-mailed Zyro. They didn't reply.

i can look on saturday on the zyro-fisher site if you want, email in profile

and rail-trails, and byways, and many bridleways, and towpaths, and country roads that are neglected, etc.

True, but I ride all those on 23c tyres on my 'racing' bike too, because for the most part there's not enough of them really to justify a bike, or trying to link enough of them together for a ride.

I do see the appeal and utility of gravel bikes in big sparsely populated countries with a network of unmetalled roads because there's insufficient traffic to justify sealing them. But for the most part you're kidding yourself in this country. Even Charlies Gravel dash was non-technical off road rather than gravel (and therefore quicker on an XC bike).

I do in fact own a [s]touring[/s] [b][i]gravel[/b][/i] bike compete with tough-ish 38c tyres. I'm just not evangelical about it.

I do see the appeal and utility of gravel bikes in big sparsely populated countries with a network of unmetalled roads because there's insufficient traffic to justify sealing them. But for the most part you're kidding yourself in this country. Even Charlies Gravel dash was non-technical off road rather than gravel (and therefore quicker on an XC bike).

+1

I would like to do one of those big Kansas or Norwegian gravel races though. On the to-do list for my 50s I reckon.

I've been riding the UK version of gravel roads for 20-odd years, and have seen the way that cross bikes have been sexed up to make them a 'must have'. All the trails people are gnarmaccing or gravel racing on have been there forever, it's just marketing shite to suggest it's a new thing and you must buy a new bike to explore this new niche.

Before mountain bikes, people were riding off road in the Peaks and the Dales and managing perfectly well.

Has grit.cx died yet ?

No one seemed to stock them, so I e-mailed Zyro. They didn't reply.

Have you tried walking into a bike shop and speaking to someone? Or phoning a shop? If someone had asked me to get them a pair of them this morning they'd have probably had them tomorrow.

I reckon you are going about it from the wrong end. Assuming you are ridng gravel and by that I mean Fc type stuff or Salisbury Plain stuff then you don't need knobblies. As you have found CX tyres are meant for just that. An hours blast around a playing field. Punctures are few ( well lungs might feel as if they are).
You don't need tread for gravel but you might need puncture resistance.
I have been banging round the Fc tracks here in the FoD for at least a dozen years on my road bikes and have always ended up going back to heavy road/touring tyres. I must admit to starting with road tubs as that's all I had and I rarely punctured. They fell apart first. Road tyres will also allow you go up a bit in size as the knobbles are not getting in the way.
Should you do as I do and also ride on single track, green lanes and the road you will still find that virtually all of the time your road tyres work. Wet HONCs included. The odd off camber descent will benefit from tread I admit.
You'll also find that tyres last longer. I had some CX tyres given to me so I tried them over a winter. In a couple of months the rear was through to the inner. That's in around 1000 miles. I will say that CX tyres worn slick roll well and do still have a bit of side tread. I'll tempt fate and say that in all those years I have had 2 offs. One on black ice and the other hitting a rock on a slow chicane when I was eyeing up some woman's arse. Neither can be attributed to tyres.
Of course this may not suit every one but its worth a thought.

I bought a gravel/adventure/marketingmansdream bike and if i put skinny tyres on and pump them up rock hard it goes fast on the road, and if I put bigger ones on it goes slower than my hardtail on the rough stuff. It's just a little less twitchy than a cx bike and i'm old so twitchy is a bit of a faff. There you go marketing people - 'cx bikes for old blokes'. You can have that for free. It's a bike at the end of the day, innit? Sit on it and pedal...

I don't think it's the same sort of "Gravel" riding here in the UK as they have in the states.

I get the impression that the US has something a bit more like offroad audax'. Large organised events and a bit of a "scene" to go along with it. Most "gravel" type bikes sold in this country are used for commuting I reckon...

To most people here, "Gravel riding" probably means trundling about bridleways and tow paths on your own or maybe with a mate or two at your own pace...

Second using touring tires for non technical off road. I have done this on road bikes and in touring mode loads. Sometimes a little spicy in the wet round corners but if I wanted max off road control i would be on a MTB.

You don't need tread for gravel but you might need puncture resistance

Agree. My experience over last 10+ years of riding on fire-roads and smooth singletrack. My rides tend to be under 2 hours so I am not even bothered about how big the tyres are and use 25c quite happily.
In other words I can just take a road / track / whatever 700c bike and ride gravel with no issues other than number of puncture based on how flimsy a tyre I choose.
Mainly why I keep a Marathon + on the back as I really hate getting punctures...

On the subject of tyres.... WTB Cross Boss come in 35c and look good for an all-round (slight bias to off-road) tyre.
Mine went up tubeless hassle free and held air overnight without any gunk. I'll still put some in but it suggests the sidewalls should be pretty robust.

Mainly why I keep a Marathon + on the back as I really hate getting punctures...

I have 28c Marathon Plus tyres on my Cotic X and have taken them off road with no problems and no punctures.

My rides tend to be under 2 hours so I am not even bothered about how big the tyres are and use 25c quite happily

I keep a Marathon + on the back as I really hate getting punctures

Marathon+ are aweful on the road, I think id enjoy carrying my bike more than I would riding those offroad, especially in 25c 😆

Tell me again why gravel bikes with 40c tyres are just marketing?

I'm running a 40mm on one gravel tyre(made by vee rubber) on rear.. went up tubeless fine despite not being tubeless and it
Is quick/grippy and robust £19.99

crikey - Member
...All the trails people are gnarmaccing or gravel racing on have been there forever, it's just marketing shite to suggest it's a new thing and you must buy a new bike to explore this new niche.

Before mountain bikes, people were riding off road in the Peaks and the Dales and managing perfectly well.

I agree, but it's good that there's finally a move to having bikes made for the job (again*).

The danger is that racing will rear its ugly head and the evolution of the perfect offroad bike will be stunted by being narrowly defined.

When I was young, before mtbs, I was riding the same offroad stuff as I'm riding now but on 1¼" tyres (32mm) with road tread, ie no tread, and later tubulars.

These days I ride it on 2.35" Big Apples, still no tread, and that is perfectly good for anything but slick mud. I'd sooner ride the 2.35" slicks at a low pressure than a skinny cx high pressure tyre, because it's more comfortable, and its got better grip IMO. (Someone travelling at high speeds may have a different outlook).

Obviously I have to use a 29er to fit tyres that size, and it is a compromise.

I think the ideal "gravel" bike would be something shaped like a Pompino (nice handling on gravel) but with clearance for big tyres. If you ride with slick big tyres then the on road riding doesn't feel draggy, and all those road obstacles you normal swerve for can be steamrolled.

I doubt most of us would feel any performance hit with a bike like this - other than the dedicated high speed roadies. BTW braking and cornering are brilliant on road, effing amazing compared to the skinny stuff.

*This sort of bike was perfected around 1900 in the colonies - all roads were "gravel", and 28" bikes with dropbars and 2" tyres were used.

Marathon+ are aweful on the road, I think id enjoy carrying my bike more than I would riding those offroad, especially in 25c

Yes, they are not the best road tyres but they are fine off road.
Horses for courses, you would rather get punctures/walk home, I would rather use a heavier/worse riding tyre and not get punctures.

Like I said, I hate getting punctures as they completely screw up a 1-2 hour blast around the forest (especially at 0 degrees in middle of January!)

Horses for courses, you would rather get punctures/walk home, I would rather use a heavier/worse riding tyre and not get punctures.

No, id rather have a gravel bike (or cx bike) with 40mm tyres so I can blast around with more comfort, grip and no punctures 😆

These days I ride it on 2.35" Big Apples, still no tread, and that is perfectly good for anything but slick mud. I'd sooner ride the 2.35" slicks at a low pressure than a skinny cx high pressure tyre, because it's more comfortable, and its got better grip IMO. (Someone travelling at high speeds may have a different outlook).

The guy who came second (I think) at the Dirty Reiver was on a Cannondale slate with the lefty and 650b x 42mm slicks. Briefly heard him say at the finish they were fast but a bit sketchy on the loose corners.

How's everyone puncturing offroad? If it's snake bites then just put a bit more air in, if it's sharp objects then pick your line better. Gravel bikes really aren't designed for smashing over stuff, leave that for your Enduro bike.

For what it's worth I'm currently running 700 x 35 Rapid Robs.

How's everyone puncturing offroad?

I have Soma Cazadero 42c for days when a little cornering tread and volume is needed and usually run Vittoria Voyager Hyper 38c.

I ride road and estate tracks with gentle off road on my charge plug 5 titanium. As said 95% of the time a big volume slick is great off road.

The 38c vittoria voyager hyper are brilliant, a bargain at £15 for the shop you love to hate, supple and low rolling resistance, proves you don't need a 100psi 25c tyre bone shaker to go fast.

I think tyres make the single biggest difference to any decent road or cross bike. Choose supple (120 tpi), wide (38c+), and lightweight (folding) and run them tubeless and at low pressures.

How's everyone puncturing offroad? If it's snake bites then just put a bit more air in, if it's sharp objects then pick your line better.

The punctures are caused by small pieces of sharp flint from the stony gravel. You may be able to pick your line to avoid the 3mm big pieces of flint but my eyesight is not that good....

No, id rather have a gravel bike (or cx bike) with 40mm tyres so I can blast around with more comfort, grip and no punctures

Whether running a 40 or a 25 does not make any difference. I tried all sorts of larger tyres when I used a cross bike the only tyres that didn't puncture were the tough (and very heavy) touring tyes.

And as I said, I am comfortable enough on 25c and I have the grip I need on 25c with the benefit that for a given tyre, 25c is lighter.

Realise this is not for everyone but after 10+ years of riding gravel it is where I have settled.

Tubeless(35-45mm) tyres is a no brainer for me off/on road bit of everything riding .. no issues with flats

Or run your 25 or 28's tubeless ? (Tubeless ready tyres)

Realise this is not for everyone but after 10+ years of riding gravel it is where I have settled.

So you've used lots of tyre in the last 10 years but settled on 25. So you've not used these new crop of gravel tyres then since they are only new?

I agree its amazing what you can you can ride on 25's, I just recently rattled my way along the Edinburgh-Glasgow canal route on my fixie with skinny Halo Twin-rails, ive done the offroad coast and castles (inc dunes and beaches) route on a road bike with 25c GP4seasons and on my Tourer with 35mm Marathons. But having done the same tracks on 40mm WTB nano and now 40mm Gravel-kings I can say its a lot easier and comfier and hence I go faster, on these tyres built for the job plus they are perfectly puncture proof.

I'm running a 40mm on one gravel tyre(made by vee rubber) on rear.. went up tubeless fine despite not being tubeless and it
Is quick/grippy and robust £19.99

And sold out, sadly.

Says it all ^ 🙁

Mountain biker is educated and thanks you for your explanations. Mountain biker won't be buying a gravel bike.

Great thread. I've been riding my Fuji Tread all year, on road, trails etc. Its such a laugh and very similar to my first taste of mountain biking in Surrey 20+ years ago. I can mix up quiet back lanes with bridleways I wouldn't normally bother with on my MTB. Consequently i've opened up hours of picturesque, quiet riding on my doorstep without loading the bike onto the car.
So far i've been on the stock touring tyres it came fitted with, but planning on fitting some bigger tyres for a little off-road riding this weekend.

Can't say I really see the point in the whole gravel bike thing here in the UK. 29er with fast tubeless XC tyres rolls along plenty fast enough, and is far more versatile.

For what it's worth I'm currently running 700 x 35 Rapid Robs.

In answer to the OPs original question, I would say, yes it is very much under the radar. Until I read this thread I had literally no idea that 'Gnarmac / Gravelmac' was anything other than a ironic (? perhaps not?) way of referring to cyclocross. I certainly didn't know there were dedicated bikes. Learn something new every day - i'm evidently not as well informed about bikes as I thought!

Am I alone?

Ride the 3 Peaks CX, and you'll realise 35mm tyres can cope with anything 😉

As others have said, if you want bigger tyres, buy the right frame.

My new On One CX frame has enough clearance for these tyres:

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/continental-mud-king-mtb-tyre-protection/rp-prod83014

but I've got MTBs, so don't need to go that silly, and just stick to 38mm Armadillos for road riding (still get 1cm clearance each side of tyre).

Try the Tour of the Black Country sportive, it's fun (sorry for using the 's' word here).

Am I alone?

No. I read a Cyclist magazine supplement all about gravel bikes, and I was still none the wiser about why they are different from cyclocross bikes. Is it just chunkier tyres? Different geometry? I scan read all that up there ^ and I'm still unsure.

Is it road, cyclocross, gravel, XC in terms of off-road capability then?

No. I read a Cyclist magazine supplement all about gravel bikes, and I was still none the wiser about why they are different from cyclocross bikes. Is it just chunkier tyres? Different geometry? I scan read all that up there ^ and I'm still unsure.

A gravel specific bike will tend to have bigger tyre clearance, more relaxed geometry, and possibly a slightly slacker head angle.
The gravel bike is to a CX bike what a sportive bike is to a race bike.

So you've not used these new crop of gravel tyres then since they are only new?

I don't need to use them, a tyre than weighs 240 grams for a 25c is going to puncture where I ride. The tyre has nothing about it that makes it any more special than many tyres made for puncture resistance and as I have punctured the likes of RibMo, Armadillos and even a Marathon+ once, I can make that statement.

Of course if I went tubeless this all changes (just as it did on my MTB where I have had one puncture in 18 months)

The gravel bike is to a CX bike what a sportive bike is to a race bike.

Now i get it. Thanks Andy

I recently ride NCN78 and had to choose a tyre to suit both the extensive tarmac and the few off-road sections including the forest track at Clunes. I decided on 28mm Marathons (not the Plus version). For sure they could have been comfier on the rough gravel but grip wasn't an issue. I'd day the whole Marathon range would be fine for most "gravel" riding in the UK, especially as you'll likely have to involve tarmac sections to make up a decent length of ride.

I'm currently considering some touring round the Caithness flow country where there is a bit of a network of gravel roads.

I'm with Ollybus, riding a CX with some middle of the pack tyres has opened up huge amounts of fun, scenic mixed surface riding from my doorstep. Maybe a 29er XC bike would do similar, but I only have a heavyish full-sus as an MTB. Makes my commute a lot less boring too...

Tubeless Schwalbe G-One's are a lovely compromise.

The gravel bike is to a CX bike what a sportive bike is to a race bike.

It also crosses over into tourer and traditional ATB territory as there's as much variation within the niche as there is outside of it!

It crosses the whole gamut from relaxed road bikes wit bigger tyres, to XC29er with smaller tyres, and darts sideways into offroad tourer as well.

Just 'bikes for riding places' really, and adjust the bias in whatever direction floats your boat.

Yawn!! …all this talk about tyres is quite tyresome really! I don’t even know what tyres I have on my CX bike. What I do know is that I enjoy riding it!

@ plus_one I am going to try the 26" wheels thing