Going back to vee's or canti's for road riding ?

All my mtb's have hydraulic discs. They're great. My road bike has cantis. They're rubbish. Slow me down if I'm lucky and put in maximum effort. Stopping from speed or downhill isn't really an option.

I find cable discs easier to sort out when they go wrong.

Or just take your bike to the lbs and let them sort?

All my MTBs are disc brakes. I’m thankful to now have a road bike with discs, which are excellent. Rim brakes were a real PITA. I’ll not buy another bike with rim brakes.

Yo 😎

Rim brakes on summer and winter road bikes, CX bike and gravel bike.

There is still some faff (don't be tempted by cheap cantis, I wasted a few rides with some horrendous juddering and squealing, solved by just re-fitting the expensive Avid Shorty Ultimates I was saving for my now ornamental CX race bike) and yeah, rims wear out eventually, but I've yet to see any attraction in going disc, least of all because of the cost.

That said if you're as big a guy as you've alluded to in another post, and you're used to hydro discs, I'd be worried about the steep learning curve as you get used to the (lack of) power of rim brakes. I've never known any different on the road bike so just ride to the conditions and have no worries, even with cheap OEM Tektros on the winter bike, but it could be eye opening the first time you approach a corner too hot in the wet!

Edit: for absolute minimal fettling go mini-V. I've got TRP CX 8.4s with Ultegra cables on the gravel bike, much easier and more powerful than Cantis, but you're limited to 700x40mm tyres without guards. I'm suspicious of the longer arm mini-Vs (CX9s et al) as they felt awful with modern Shimano STIs, just mush and limited rim clearance).

All my bikes have hydro discs. Work perfectly.
Except my old road bike, which has DP caliper brakes. Work perfectly. They offer a bit less power than discs, but it’s hardly night and day. In the dry at least.
Maybe try some different pads in the cantis?

I have SRAM levers and Hope RX4 calipers. Zero problems so far! Had them since they were first out (4/5 years). No way would I go back to non-hydro discs now!!

Never moved from them. Of my five bikes, only the FS is disc, and very good they are for the conditions.

My Ribble 653 is running 37 year old single pivot Shimano 600, my best bike, 34 year old running DA 7402 single pivot - both are really good at stopping on CLarkes pads. My vintage Diamond Back is running Decathlon pads and stop fine on XT canti's, althugh they squeel as the pads wear (a thing with canti's).

More recently I commuted with Shimano Long Drop dual pivot A550 callipers for use with guards, and these would easily lift the rear with fully loaded panniers - that bike has gone though !

Just picked up a used 2011 Colnago World Cup CX bike with canti's (Tekro Oryx on 105 Brifters) and put new cables and pads on it - stops on a sixpense - also allowed me to use some spare road wheels, so it can use road and gravel tyres with a quick wheel swap - it's also the only road bike that has low gearing - 34x32, as my two others are vintage running a lowest of 39 x 26, which is hard work in the Peaks.

Road bike is caliper brakes, everything else is either cable disc (commuter, I need to get to work, not faff with squealing brakes) or hydraulic (MTBs).

The theory in my head is that it's less messing around. In practice I have currently just finished building a new road wheelset as the carbon front rim is worn out (about a 0.5mm gap). Although, I quite like building wheels so perhaps this is actually another point in its favour.

YMMV.

Road hydro discs on 32’s are immense 😎

I rode for years on carbon rims and had several near misses where I literally could not stop. Not in a reasonable length of time anyway. Having to jump over a traffic island after a car suddenly bombed through illegally and left me with nowhere to go was the moment I decided to get my gravel bike (and just recently a disc road bike) for road riding instead.

Carbon rims and stopping with rim brakes, forget it. Alloy rims, no issues with rim brakes and a good compound.

Discs on my mountain bikes and cross bike but calliper brakes on my road bike.

Don't see the need (and expense) for discs on my road bike. I ride in the lakes so plenty of steep downs...

However - I only ever ride the road bike solo and frankly avoid wet weather so if you like to ride in groups and the wet, I can see why you would want to stick with discs.

ride in groups and the wet, I can see why you would want to stick with discs

My misophonia* makes riding in groups with disc brakes in the wet a VERY unpleasant experience. Every time someone touches their brake the noise goes right through me, I'm a twitchy wincing mess every time we pass through a village or town! 😂

*I just learned what this means, explains my reaction to squealing brakes perfectly! I almost crashed as my reaction to the noise of my Deore disc brakes on a wet commute was so extreme I let go of the lever mid-manoeuvre

"Misophonia is a disorder in which certain sounds trigger emotional or physiological responses that some might perceive as unreasonable given the circumstance. Those who have misophonia might describe it as when a sound “drives you crazy.” Their reactions can range from anger and annoyance to panic and the need to flee"

I have hydro discs on my commuter/gravel bike but Ultegra callipers on my road bike. With alloy rims they're perfectly fine in the dry but for a bike that's used in all weathers discs are much nicer.

Discs on all my off-road bikes, calipers on all the road bikes, and they all work well enough.

Winter roadie gets through pads faster of course.

I think eventually I'd like to rationalise my Gravel, summer and winter road bikes down to one, that just gets a change of tyres and guards as seasons change. The reality is that any bike I need to change stuff on before the ride isn't going to get used as much.

Ultimately I can see all the benefits of discs on curly bared bikes, apart from costs, it's still far too expensive to go from a decent rim braked road bike to a decent disc braked road bike, and while the bike I have still works nicely I'm not going to waste the money... I'm sure more affordable options will come along eventually (right?)...

My 105 discs are great. Even better now I have decent rotors. There's no way I'd go back to not being able to stop quickly in the wet, destroying pads in wet rides and needing new wheels every couple of years.

misophonia

I've found that the cheap Shimano rotors squeal a lot where as my decent ones have yet to.

Been on MTB hydraulic discs for years, started road riding again with a club and my trusty TCR has 105 rim brakes with salmon coloured brake pads (for the wet, can't remember the make).

All winter been on the cheap wheels, stopping has been variable esp when wet. Recently put the Ultegra wheels back in  and the brakes are suddenly great (same pads etc).

I've been using my "pub" bike over the winter - an old Claude Butler with triple chainring and cantis. The brakes (once I got them set up OK) have been excellent, even in the wet. Much better than I remember my '90s road bike being.

But... my usual (summer) road/gravel bike is discs as is my MTB. I don't understand how anyone could could think discs are good on MTB but not on the road. What's the difference? They are doing the same job.

I'd never go back. But I'm not a proper roadie.

All of my bikes - MTB, road and gravel - are disc based, and very reliable & efficient.
In June 2022, I changed jobs - mainly to be within cycle commuting range - and dug out my old Raleigh hybrid, with rim brakes.
It's fine for the sedate pace of my flat commutes, but I wouldn't fancy any steep descent - they're call rim brakes for a reason (squeaky bum time)

As ever, though, some folks will have different experiences to others.

Bought a cheap old Cannondale touring bike recently for commuting, has V-brakes....did we really put up with these things for so long?! They take so much constant faffing to keep them running anything like sweet. Those little travel agent pull ratio adapters help, but they're still terrible.

I'd sooner have cable discs than any kind of rim brake.

rightho............ so consensus is rim brakes are carp, and i could possibly die a horrible death if i use em.

so last good hydro brakes i had were shimano saints on my Ventana over 10 years ago. but fancy a change.

Pauls Klampers ordered.

I've got Bontrager Speed Stop brakes on my Emonda and TRP long drop brakes on my Kinesis. Never had an issue braking in the dry or wet on carbon and alloy rims (carbon get replaced in the wet). Wheels are 5 years old, have done several Fred Whittons and training and still fine.

I've got mini-V's on my winter/SSCX/gravel/touring bike. They do the job perfectly adequately. I'd not choose them necessarily, but in no real hurry to upgrade the whole bike over them.

Going back to the summer road bike with rim brakes, even good Dura Ace ones with swisstop pads, that's exciting approaching downhill junctions 😂

My commuter has v-brakes which I put on to replace the canti's it came with. The canti's just about worked in the dry for about a week post careful set up.. the v-brakes are acceptable in the wet and eat blocks (or rims) at a rate and need occasional tinkerage to adjust cable tension and free up the arms to ensure even movement between them and avoid sticking on one side.. at least they are cheap, as are the wheels they are slowly destroying..

The Shimano hydro discs on my old HT and CX bike needed new pads and a squirt of cleaner every so often, and a set of rotors.. that was it over 5 years or so... current HT and gravel bike have so far faultless* and excellent hydro discs..

Hydraulic discs are way better imho..

*My XC bike is currently with the LBS for fluid replacement and a bleed after 6 years of service...

Pauls Klampers ordered.

If in doubt then spend spend spend 🤪.

I love all the claims that rim brakes don't work. Yet there is a total lack of cycle graveyards at the bottom of every hill!

The only time I have gone over the bars from braking is with a set of cantos on my paperound. If a 13yearold idiot can adjust them to work...

Would I buy a new bike without disks... Maybe.

Would I let the brake type put me off a second hand bike... Definitely not.

Carbon rims and stopping with rim brakes, forget it.

I disagree zip 303 carbon wheels on rim brakes are brilliant. Huge amount of stopping power and zero maintenance apart from changing brake blocks which just slide in

I love all the claims that rim brakes don’t work. Yet there is a total lack of cycle graveyards at the bottom of every hill!

I struggle to understand claims like that too, but then I remember how atrocious cheap rim brakes can be! And for that matter how easy it is to set cantilevers up wrong, they can feel awesome in the stand but wooden and powerless on the road.

But I think good pads count for a huge amount, I'm riding big gravel days in the Highlands, muddy CX, dry summer roads and miserable wet winter roads, all on rim brakes with Swissstop BXP pads and mid level aluminium rims. Granted I'm spreading the wear over several bikes but am rarely replacing pads and even more rarely replacing rims, I wouldn't be surprised if labour and material costs (for me) are pretty much comparable to when I had discs.

Still, each to their own, I just resent not still being able to buy high end rim brake road frames, I don't want to shell out thousands and bin a perfectly good Ultegra groupo just to change to discs because there's no replacement frames available 🙄

I love all the claims that rim brakes don’t work. Yet there is a total lack of cycle graveyards at the bottom of every hill!

It's not some theoretical claim, I rode cantis and calipers for decades. I know exactly what they are like. With the road calipers I last used, coming down steep hills towards junctions in the rain I was only just able to control my speed by dragging all the way down. If someone had pulled out in front of me or stepped off a pavement I'd have hit them as I had no extra power to use. And on top of that, rim brakes wear out wheels.

Don't let misty nostalgia or posters of pros on old bikes cloud your opinion of what 'looks good'. Discs are miles better, no question. Fight me.

I don’t want to shell out thousands and bin a perfectly good Ultegra groupo

It's not perfectly good if it's rim brakes 🙂

Tsk,people need to pay more attention while riding,then they wouldn't need to 'panic' brake so much 😆 😀 😊 .

Driving instructor: now we're going to learn emergency stops.
STW reading student: Oh there's no need for emergency stops, I'll just pay attention instead.

For all those dusty, early morning coffee rides in Tuscany, then rim brakes for sure.
Back in Blighty, on a cold, wet day on an austerity destroyed local council neglected road surface surrounded by absolute morons in charge of a ton or more of metal & plastic hurtling towards me, I'm picking discs.
Horses for courses.

I couldn't GAF what experience other people have with their equipment. I'm 95kg and when I unleash that potential energy over a crest along with the power plant levels of watts from my killa FTP and a 52-11, I can go VERY fast downhill. Always over 50mph on the Sunday ride and high 40's on the chaingang.

The difference in stopping distance between my Prime RR50 rim brake wheels with Swisstop pads and my Ultegra disc setup on wider tyres (that discs facilitate) is measured in the 10's if not 100's of yards. Enough to save my life.

I'm not a zealot- It's not like I wouldn't be happy heading back out on my old bike if everything else was crooked-up but sorry, disc brakes are just insane levels of better.

Combined with di2, cruising into a downhill roundabout, braking with one finger whilst feathering the shift button to sync up the ratio I next need to accelerate is just a sublime experience. I love it!

I got to contemplating this on my way home on Sunday and nobody judges others for aspiring for clever, safer or better features on a car. But (cough, road, cough) cyclists seem to revel in antiquity!

Calipers work OK. Discs are better. Cantis can get in the sea.

That's it really.

Combined with di2, cruising into a downhill roundabout, braking with one finger whilst feathering the shift button to sync up the ratio I next need to accelerate is just a sublime experience.

Who would have thought that riding a roundabout could be a sublime experience. I need to find some better roundabouts.

I do prefer discs, but also have a road bike with rim brakes that is absolutely fine.

I know! To be fair I may not have been thinking straight at the time but I was like, wow, that is actually very very cool 🤣
#easilypleased

I don't see Klampers being less faff than good hydros tbh @Ton but they have a great rep for a cable disc. I'm happy with BB7s at the mo and Klampers are a nicer version of those. The trick is setting them up well to start with and keeping on top of the regular minor adjustments as the pads wear, there's a knack to it. You might see it as faff of a different kind but mechanical disc brakes do seem to be more predictable than hydros in what they need and when. I quite like the predictable, reliable way they work and wear.
I also have some ancient XTs that never get touched and work really well but for the road/gravel/tourer bike the cable discs are more flexible for brake + shifter choices, that's an advantage to any cable brake.

It’s not some theoretical claim, I rode cantis and calipers for decades. I know exactly what they are like. With the road calipers I last used, coming down steep hills towards junctions in the rain I was only just able to control my speed by dragging all the way down. If someone had pulled out in front of me or stepped off a pavement I’d have hit them as I had no extra power to use. And on top of that, rim brakes wear out wheels.

So... Your brakes werent set up correctly.

I'll reiterate there are not piles of people all deaded from brakes ony starting to work in the last what... 20-25 years?

I didn't make any claims they were better but claiming they don't work is quite clearly absolute bollocks*.

*excluding any really crappy brakes and assuming atleast some quality in the breakpads

molgrips
Full Member
Driving instructor: Its really imprtant to pay attention when you are behind the wheel of a large automobile
STW reading student: Oh, there's no need to pay attention by brakes are epic and can emergency stop on a dime"

FTFY

I got to contemplating this on my way home on Sunday and nobody judges others for aspiring for clever, safer or better features on a car. But (cough, road, cough) cyclists seem to revel in antiquity!

If that was directed at me, I quite clearly didn't claim that. Just calling out fibbers 😀

Don't think I could ever go back to any rim brake variant, being unable to stop on rim brakes in bad weather resulted in my messy crash just over nine years ago. Hydraulic brakes have been great on the Wazoo fatbike, Cube road bike and Voodoo hybrid bought since, literally a case of periodically checking pads for wear and replace them. Only time I've had minor faff is when switching wheels on the road bike and having fun tweaking the caliper mounts to eliminate unwanted brake rub.

Ultegra calipers on a Giant TCR here, alloy rims, use Swisstop pads. They've never not stopped me, I like the simplicity so will stick with rim brakes as long as I can but concede that at some point they are inevitably going to look like some kind of antique curiosity.

I got to contemplating this on my way home on Sunday and nobody judges others for aspiring for clever, safer or better features on a car. But (cough, road, cough) cyclists seem to revel in antiquity!

Classic cars are popular for good reasons though. I like my lugged skinny tube rim brake road bike for the same reasons as some people like an old Triumph or Austin Healey compared to a modern Audi and they might own both and use them on different days for different reasons.

Brake type can influence frame and fork design so I might have rim brakes due to tube spec being a priority over tyre size or braking ability. Some of it is antiquity/aesthetics and some of it is appreciating the alternatives to the stiffer+lighter race inspired influences in bike design.
I love road bikes and I can't see me ever not owning one with rim brakes. To me one result in 'perfecting' a road bike is something along the lines of a Euro race bike from the late 80s or early 90s. Another result is discs, >30mm tyres, stiffer and lighter, etc.

I still have Campag dual pivot calipers on my road bike with - for best - Mavic wheels with the Exalith rims and the matching pads, which I'm pretty sure are made by SwissStop. They are really strong, wet or dry. Same brakes with stock pads and normal alloy rims were horrific in the wet, but pretty good with SwissStop greens, I think. I also use compressionless housing. If you use rubbish pads, it doesn't really matter what else is in the system would be my take. My 'not for best' alloy rims give perfectly good braking with decent pads fitted.

I have GRX hydraulic discs on my cross bike though and they're awesome, far better than the cable discs they replaced. If I were buying a new road bike, I'd have hydro discs no questions, but given that I don't ride a pure road bike that often and I like the one I already have, I'm perfectly happy with calipers on that. The big downside, if you cover lots of miles in all conditions, is always going to be rim wear.

I think it would be slightly perverse to choose rim brakes over hydraulic discs tbh, but I guess you could potentially spec a frame that's compatible with both like my old Soma Double Cross DC, which had removable rim-brake fittings as well as disc compatibility. Fork choice would be pretty limited though and swapping from one to the other wouldn't be a quick and easy process unless you went full-on mad and had two sets of bars with pre-fitted shifters etc.

Both my road bikes have 105 dual pivot (or whatever they are) cantis. They’re fine. I briefly had a Cube road bike with 105 discs: loved the feel, hated the squeal!

I didn’t make any claims they were better but claiming they don’t work

Obviously no-one is claiming they don't work at all. They were the only method of stopping for decades, and we all rode them. They just don't work as well, in the dry, and don't work very well at all in the wet.

So… Your brakes werent set up correctly.

I've asked many times on here exactly what setup I was missing to get rim brakes working as well in the wet as the dry but noone was able to point anything out. I asked how to fix this even before road discs were a thing. Better calipers helped slightly, but again no comparison to discs.

Also, I'm obsessive about bike setup and put a huge amount of time and a fair bit of money into getting bike setup spot on. And whilst the brakes were alright (not good) in the dry the dramatic fall off in performance in proper wet conditions with lots of standing water and rain was terrifying. The reason I didn't die is be ause I anticipated it and trundled down hills slowly with the brakes full on before the junctions in question.

There's a long fast descent on a local loop with a right turn half way down. Back in the day I used to go carefully and start braking half way down to be sure of making the turn. Now I sprint down it as fast as I can because I know I can slam on late and stop so much faster. Much more fun.

Rim brakes:
Ok in dry
Very bad in heavy rain
Destroy rims
May squeal

Discs:
Great in dry
Great in wet
Rims last indefinitely
May howl in wet

Went on a lumpy North downs road loop on Sunday, and anecdotally, lots of the weight weenie going past on the climbs were using rim brakes.
Previous time I was there was on an ultegra rim braked road bike. This time on an ultegra disc braked bike. The extra confidence that the discs provide was just great.

Classic cars are popular for nostalgic reasons though. You don’t get in a restored 205gti and think “yeah! I want all my new cars to have flaky trim, rubbish brakes and to catch randomly on fire” 🤣🤣

Shock horror, as a mtb’er at heart- I think road discs look better too 😱

I don't know how any keen cyclist can defend rim brakes over discs, unless you live in Norfolk? If you want to do any mildly aggressive braking, then there's just no competition - the bite, the modulation, the power.

I still have a rim brake Canyon Ultimate which I take out from time to time, it's light and agile and corners wonderfully; but descending the steep narrow lanes of the Chilterns is a genuinely terrifying experience, and that's in the dry!

I'm intrigued what faff you do with discs? All the pairs I've had, bar the occasional bleed, have been completely faff free.
Canti's particularly, and vee's to some degree, needed constant adjustment for pad alignment and cable stretch and other such things. No way I'd go back to them.
I've got dual pivot callipers brakes on my best road bike, but if I could fit discs to it I would.

unless you live in Norfolk?

Suffolk 😂

I don’t know how any keen cyclist can defend rim brakes over discs, unless you live in Norfolk? If you want to do any mildly aggressive braking, then there’s just no competition – the bite, the modulation, the power.

I still have a rim brake Canyon Ultimate which I take out from time to time, it’s light and agile and corners wonderfully; but descending the steep narrow lanes of the Chilterns is a genuinely terrifying experience, and that’s in the dry!

I agree. Add a bit of 'timber' into the physics mix and it's hard to recommend rim over disc if there was an option to have discs. I have one rim brake bike left - my summer road bike. I can't justify/afford to change it but if/when the time comes it will defiantly be replaced by a disc alternative.

unless you live in Norfolk?

*Cough* Scottish borders.

Classic cars are popular for nostalgic reasons though.

That, and a different ride quality or driving experience due to the lack of things that make a modern car easier to drive/safer/more comfortable? I suppose you can have the worst of both worlds in bikes or cars. To make it work you want a few things pulling in the same direction.

To make it work you want a few things pulling in the same direction.

Except rim brakes...

Rim brakes can work ok, but disk brakes work better, more of the time, IME. That's all really.

If you're sloppy with maintenance (waves) then whichever you use, you can still wear out a set of pads half way through a big hilly ride on a tandem and spend the rest of the day praying that the other brake will hold up. Having done that with rim and disk brakes I preferred the latter. Even though the rim brakes were a pretty good Magura hydraulic model.

Disks mean your rims don't wear out and explode at a moment of maximum inconvenience. They also don't melt your tyres on a big descent. But more importantly, they don't dramatically lose performance in wet and dirty conditions.

I’m intrigued what faff you do with discs? All the pairs I’ve had, bar the occasional bleed, have been completely faff free.

Disks start to suck if they don't get a lot of use ime - say you do a lot of flattish road miles and just aren't pulling the brakes much, ie the opposite of mountain biking. Or you park it up for a few weeks whilst you're riding something else.

If I ever bought a pure road bike it would have to be disk, because obv you'd want to take it up and down the hills, and not be afraid of rain. But I'd fully expect a load of faff unless I was riding it day in day out.

Just bought a rim brake TT frame as it goes - prob last chance to do this as a new purchase from a big brand. The idea of disks on a bike that sees minimal brake action sounds really unappealing for me.

Except rim brakes…

Ha.. yeah. Opposing forces there.

OT as it's rim calipers not the vees in the OP, but this bike style is an example. You can't really build a good skinny steel fork for a disc brake and a slim steel lugged frame often goes well with a fork like this. The bike will ride quite differently to a stiffer modern bike with a carbon fork that would usually have discs now. Whippier, springy.

You might say that the ride feel of the trad road bike isn't your thing, or that it's not worth compromising the brake performance for. Or you could have the skinny steel frame with a carbon fork and discs. That's fair enough and the skinny trad road bike is a bit niche now.

I've had great times on a pure road set up with discs, descending the mountain roads in Taiwan was a revelation with the first Shimano hydro discs on a Pinnacle sample road bike. That would be a 3rd road bike type for me, fitting in between the trad rim brake roadie and a gravel-rando roadie that's bigger tyred and more confident on rough lanes.

There's a reason major manufacturers stopped producing V-Brakes and Cantis... they are shite. If you want rim brakes, use a good calliper.