Glentress World Champ trails closed

Its not just the World Champs course- that was always going to be off limits to non-racers and will largely be removed after the race.

This refers to the whole new Masterplan trails which were due to open this month.

UCI have asked that they be kept closed until after the World Champs, presumably to keep them in good condition.

The rest of GT is very much open but also very quiet, people seem to be staying away.

Has the shop and cafe reopened? I remember reading the boardwalk was taking a long time to replace..

This refers to the whole new Masterplan trails which were due to open this month.

UCI have asked that they be kept closed until after the World Champs, presumably to keep them in good condition.

So everyone loses out on a summer of riding on the say so of the UCI? Brilliant 🙄

"The rest of GT is very much open but also very quiet, people seem to be staying away."

I was there for a couple of days with the kids last week on BH Monday and Tuesday and it was dead. Car park both days had no more than 15/20 cars max in it and when out on the trails we barely saw anyone... a fantastic intro to Glentress for a 10 and 13 year old though with no pressure from faster riders... so much so it led me to take them both down Spooky Wood all the way back which they both loved... wouldn't have done that if it were as busy as it usually is.

Back in September so looking forward to the chance to look at the new stuff...

Has the shop and cafe reopened?

Closed still last week and didn't look particularly close to being reopened...

Plenty other places to ride, so only losing out if you were only planning to ride in Glentress...

(However, I get what you mean...)

So [s]everyone[/s] [b]a few[/b] loses out on a [s]summer of riding[/s] [b]access to a few local trails[/b] on the say so of the UCI?

FTFY.

Its not just the World Champs course- that was always going to be off limits to non-racers and will largely be removed after the race.

🙁

why remove something with considerable effort put into it which could be fun and even a potential draw for future visitors?

London olympics course remains, Les gets WC is basically okay to use in places (but they do climb up the green DH so obviosuly not that bit)

I dont have experience of any others

why remove something with considerable effort put into it which could be fun and even a potential draw for future visitors?

I think some parts/features might remain, but my understanding is:

1) It doesn't really tie into the existing network as the new parts of the course are lots of little bits linking to existing trails, sometimes the wrong way. Keeping it, trying to sign post it (it crosses a lot of existing trails), could be quite problematic.

2) The new course linky bits aren't built to the same standard as a permanent trail. There is little surfacing like on the permanent trails being built at GT just now, which means they'll need a lot of maintenance to keep them usable.

Its a bit poor that the regular riders of the busiest trail centre in Scotland are being short changed by this. Many businesses will suffer from the drop in visitors over the summer too.

With all the carparks being closed for over a month around the races, and the removal of the Worlds features, there appears to be little legacy benefit of the race. With so much of the trail centre in poor repair or still closed from Arwen this is quite a kick in the teeth to the forest users.

The Worlds features are way beyond what could be reasonably expected of any trail centre, so I can fully understand why they would remove them though.

Possibly quiet because it’s gubbed? They have closed the buzzards nest and the links / fun stuff around it and pedalling from the bottom is not much fun for many. Let’s hope it’s all sorted at the end of summer

I think there's a whole lot of different things going on here tbh, all getting mixed up together.

Mate of mine is working on the trails and the comments about the weather are definitely true- they're having to water everything before compacting which slows things down massively, you basically can't build an armoured trail when it's dry. (a whole lot of FB experts are slagging them off for apparently not doing this, but they already are). As usual lots of "it's basically finished" but armoured trails are a pain in the arse for that.

The thing about riders straying onto the champs trails, ties into the public-suitable-ness of the trails too so that's 2 different things. Again lots of internet experts saying "build a fence". Because that always works so well!  There's places at GT where fences have been built and removed 3 or 4 times, others where a fence has been built and people just go around the end so it was made bigger then they did it again, or where pretty serious blockages have been put in to close lines and then mysteriously they vanish a few weeks later, or where trees were felled to block trails but then got chainsawed out... after a winter storm when Magic Mushroom was shut for dangerous trees, we were in there fixing it up and an entire bloody kids club came down, the leader having guided them all round the barriers and signs... Trails that were only allowed to be built on the understanding that they'd be closed after an event that just got reopened, closed, reopened, closed... Trails that people were riding even though they didn't go anywhere yet, and then having to push back out, and then COMPLAINING. It's nonstop. Add in "there's no good reason why I can't ride that", the aforementioned "it's basically finished" and "they're going to pull it all down, what a waste" and tbh it was going to happen. And once the fence is gone or ridden round, people can do it by mistake, just like any other desire line. Basically this sucks, but IMO there's no point blaming the builders or the FC or the UCI for it, it's a consequence of past actions and many-times proven history.

But the thing about difficulty and suitability for the public, that I don't know enough about, or rather I don't know what the current exit plan is- is it all to be decommisioned, some removed, some retained but to be modified? There's been a lot of contradiction. One thing's for sure, some of the worlds' trails are not built to be longterm, they've been built to a standard that is fine for the race but won't last. There's various reasons to do that though- time constraints being one, not compromising the race for the legacy is another, but also if the plan is to remove the higher end features why make them to last? (or, if they need to be modified after, then why not take advantage of that in the initial build, is another way to look at it).

Sometimes post-race public-opening changes are as simple as ground clearing and improving fall zones, improving sightlines, tweaking lines so that the hardest route isn't the default one, dealing with contention points (like, say, where they cross walking paths or roads) Even things like signage can be a big deal- obviously nothing gets signed til it's ready to open, but then sometimes the signage is the different between safe and unsafe.

I really hope they're not ****ing it all up though. I reckon it'll fall somewhere between. But if trails that could be preserved aren't, without good reason, that's really bad.

"Possibly quiet because it’s gubbed? They have closed the buzzards nest and the links / fun stuff around it and pedalling from the bottom is not much fun for many. Let’s hope it’s all sorted at the end of summer"

All of those things you mention are permanent changes though, so wont be sorted.

Northwind- the dry weather in no way excuses a three month delay though- a few weeks until the trails can pack in, yes.  FLS have said that this is due to a request from the UCI, which to me suggests a direct link to safeguarding the trails for the event and nothing more.

All the other issues stated surrounding fencing off the XC course from the trail centre trails are entirely predictable so should have been anticipated at a much earlier stage.

Can you not drive to the top car park right now? Heading up to GT now for the w/e, was planning to do a bit of uplift driving for my kids.

Anyone know what the timescales are on teh cafe/shop now with the works there?

mtnboarder
Full Member

All the other issues stated surrounding fencing off the XC course from the trail centre trails are entirely predictable so should have been anticipated at a much earlier stage.

Like I say there's a bunch of different things here but all connected. There's essentially 2 projects happening at the same time, sometimes very close together, and the plans have changed a bunch over time and will still be changing. And there's been a bunch of changes in timescale too which affects the whole thing- they've burned a lot of margins for sure and the gaps between key dates are now small. Any of this could lead to the UCI guy going "well we thought this'd be fine but it's not" or "it's probably fine but we're worried", or similar, or "we had a plan that made sense with the old timescales but it doesn't any more".

Champs is only 2 months away now, and nothing was opening til closer to the day anyway, so they're potentially getting a lot of room to maneuvre, for what in the grand scheme isn't that big of an additional delay. I think that might be the most important bit- originally the new trails were to have been open ages ago, and saying "no, delay it til after the race" would be completely unrealistic. But "let's delay it by a few weeks in order to make things much simpler", that's different. And the mitigation and blocking and such that would have made sense for a 6 month gap between opening and the race, might well not make much sense for a short gap.

Has the shop and cafe reopened

No. Go and use the excellent and much better Riders Retreat instead (formerly the Glentress Hotel)

"Can you not drive to the top car park right now? Heading up to GT now for the w/e, was planning to do a bit of uplift driving for my kids."

Permanently closed- that's where the cabins are going.

"originally the new trails were to have been open ages ago, and saying “no, delay it til after the race” would be completely unrealistic. "

But that's exactly what they are doing. Opening date was effectively now, but has been pushed back until after the race at the request of the UCI.

Possibly quiet because it’s gubbed?

This is the reality of the situation.
I was at glentress last week - beautiful, sunny, 20+ degree Saturday during english school halt term. It should and usually would have been heaving.
However, cafe & shop closed so no rental or guidance and no easy place for families to eat immediately after riding. (Yes riders retreat is nicer for adults but you don't cycle right up to it and it isn't really suited to large numbers of young families.)
Then of course the buzzards nest car park is no more and the road is shut which makes the ability to pedal up a requirement. Even after pedalling up as normal i was surprised to be met with the entire buzzards nest area fenced off with little in the way of signed diversions except for on the walking trails.
Most of the trails in the vicinity of the work are also closed, including it appeared, sections of the blue trail. As said above, there are still significant post Arwen closures in place as well. Go Ape appeared to be closed.
On top of that there are no changing facilities and only portacabin toilets. Also the car parks remain at full price.
The whole project / series of projects appear to be spectacularly ineptly managed to the extent that it appears to be all but cloaed for the year.

mtnboarder
Full Member

But that’s exactly what they are doing. Opening date was effectively now, but has been pushed back until after the race at the request of the UCI.

No, that's not what they're doing. TBH I think the bit you quoted was pretty clear but to clarify, the "masterplan" trails were supposed to be open already- as you know this phase was supposed to happen before the buzzards nest closed.

So obviously that could change other things- the plans and compromises that would have been required with those trails already being opened around the start of the year, aren't necessarily right any more. But with the new timescales and the gap now so small, different options are available.

Remember, we don't actually know when they would have opened without the UCI thing- they were aiming for mid june, but that was before the dry spell knocked the timescales again. My guess is it was going to be into July anyway regardless.

TBH, it's not the delay I'm worried about, it's how it all ends up afterwards. I've given up trying to really predict that since it's changed so much

Even with a weather delay from June until mid July, the UCI have extended that by two months until September.

It is absolutely two projects- and the UCI shouldn't be interfering with the Masterplan delivery.

The whole project / series of projects appear to be spectacularly ineptly managed to the extent that it appears to be all but cloaed for the year.

I was up with the nipper about the same time ... the APPEARANCE doesn't even seem to be ineptly managed...
Signs were misleading .. directions to closed places to pay etc. that you couldn't even take as it was fenced off

BUT

It is absolutely two projects- and the UCI shouldn’t be interfering with the Masterplan delivery.

I strongly suspect the issue is the same issue as anything the UCI get involved in.
When you dance with the devil...

Bit disappointing to read this, I wasn't aware of how much was closed down there and it would usually be one of my favourite summer destinations but it sounds like a waste of time going this year.

It's fairly disappointing to read the negativity of many posts here. I've been teaching and guiding there a few times lately and as an occasional visitor in this way, am having no difficulty in getting around the hill. Almost everything is open, the diversions are well marked and we have had no problems at all, apart from the lack of parking up at the Buzzard, where the construction site is.  The off piste network is stunning at the moment, dry, dusty and tremendous fun, almost too loose in places. Riding Thunderstruck and Careless Whisper last night in slanting evening sunlight with a buddy was sublime...

Riders Retreat at the Glentress hotel site is looking great, they've got rental e-bikes and hardtails. Oh aye, and great cake. Ridelines are certainly still available for guiding and seem to be busy.

You're not the aforementioned guide that took a group down a closed trail then?

Hahaha, no. Always follow the signs. It would be unethical to take any groups past closed signs and anyway, there's no shortage of alternatives.

Highlandman is definitely not that person. No I'm not saying who it was, they knew better and they got told off but it's someone that contributes loads to the area and it's all old history anyway so I only mentioned it as an example of how "easy" it is to keep trails closed.

mtnboarder
Full Member

It is absolutely two projects

Of course it is, but it's 2 projects in the same place, that have been increasingly lumped together for all sorts of reasons, and I <think> there's also some overlap in the trails? (there was in some of the plans, don't know if that's survived to this point) 2 projects but not in a vaccum in other words

I guess I can come over as defensive, I basically don't like the general negativitiy but in this case, I mostly think the whole thing from day one has been a ****ing disaster, so I'm also kind of trying to focus the negativity onto the stuff that's properly crap, and there's going to be more of that to come, rather than wasting it on the stuff that's maybe just pragmatic and reasonable. If it sucks, it's not because of an additional little delay.

 I wasn’t aware of how much was closed down there

Trail wise there's not that much closed. The bike park bit at Buzzards, a wee bit of the black climb above the buzzards, and zoom or busy. Apart from that everything is open (that survived Storm Arwen)

^^^ good to know, thinking about heading through tomorrow am for a few hours…

Trails were bone dry today - great for riding new stuff, not been up for a few years so the stuff on the west side was new to me. Fun and fast, v rooty but no probs in the conditions. Got an uplift from the adrenaline guy in the pm for a late run, which is a nice option. Happy to see the troot abides - such a great trail.

Thunder storms forecast tomorrow pm Iainc, so an am ride a good call.

We went yesterday but didn't check any info before going so the closures were a bit disappointing but we assumed it was all storm damage related. Still had fun though and it was very quiet.

I've been at least 6 times in the last 2 months. In summary, it is fantastic at the moment due to how quiet it is, only if you know the area. If you turn up for the first time or only vaguely aware of the set up I think you will leave disheartened. I'm going as much as I can at the moment. Weather fantastic and when it opens after UCI events I'll leave it for a while as I expect it to be very busy.

Last few times I've been to Glentress its been very quiet, think i saw about 5 other riders last time but the Golfie has been the total opposite, seems to get busier every time I'm there

Blimey, most of you don't know how lucky you are. There is a valley rammed full of genuinely world class riding, all access able with zero ticket/cost, and you're mumping cos the new (world class) trails are a few weeks delayed.

Name me one other sport where you get investment and facilities that are free to access, other than few quid for parking. Do you realise how unique this is and how lucky we are?

A revenue free model that continues to invest is a unreal scenario. There are heaps of people, organisations and groups working bloody hard to keep things world class, and broadly free to access. They are not miracle workers though and can't beat nature.

Sorry to dredge this thread back up; but can anyone confirm what is open/recommend what to aim for at Glentress given the closures? I'm up at Inners for the first time next week (31st-1st) and unfamiliar with the centre so the info on the website is a little confusing. I'm with my GF who rides blue>red trails, so of interest:
- Do the Red/Blue loop diversions cut out any significant "good" sections of trail? I.E. should I consider elsewhere if only able to ride 1 day?
- Is buzzards nest car park and cafe (and bike wash 😉 still open?
Where is best to park if not?
- Is the Freeride area now closed?

Thanks local peeps!

- Do the Red/Blue loop diversions cut out any significant “good” sections of trail? I.E. should I consider elsewhere if only able to ride 1 day?

From FLS: "From Monday 31 July to Saturday 19 August: There will be no access via the main entrance or parking at Glentress." However you can still access the forest from the Peebles end enough by heading up Janet's Brae - bike shop and cafe are both still open.

You could do the blue and red in a day anyway, but the actual trail diversions are relatively minor

– Is the Freeride area now closed?

It no longer exists

@rhyshimself

https://forestryandland.gov.scot/visit/forest-parks/tweed-valley-forest-park/glentress

From Monday 31 July to Saturday 19 August: There will be no access via the main entrance or parking at Glentress. The Gateway building, Wildwatch Centre and Osprey Viewing, Toilets and Showers will be closed. The Glentress Forest Café and Alpine Bikes Shop will remain open. Access to trails during this time will be via Janet’s Brae or Dunslair heights.

Personally, I'd just go ride somewhere else.

For Blue/red trail centre stuff you'll be fine, very little is closed. Only problem is getting to them with the carpark closed.

The best way in is via Janets brae, which starts in Peebles off the cyclepath close to the Hydro and climbs up directly to the old Buzzards carpark. Disclaimer: may not be popular if your climbing averse! To find the start, head east from Peebles Hydro along the railway cyclepath and double back on yourself onto a forest road after a couple of minutes. If you reach a couple of switchbacks on the path you've gone too far. Follow the forest road and you'll get to Buzzards.

Great singletrack options for the return journey including trails previously used in the EWS, trailforks will see you right...

Ugh, typical timing (though I suppose I'm up for World Champs DH, so should really have expected it).
I'd personally be fine with riding up from Janets Brae but I know the Mrs will want easy access back to the van and cafe- bit of a base of operations for the day, so that's a big downer.
In that case can you locals recommend anywhere similar local to Inners that suits for a blue>red level rider please? IE decent Singletrack loops, maybe with some more hardcore freeride options for me?
Cheers guys

That's still Glentress (no other blue trails in the area). Just park in town (big car park on the south bank of the river is great) and head into the forest that way. Slink away for some easily accessible off-piste stuff and necessary.

Have a look on Trailforks to get your bearings, its free to access from a browser.

I've just noticed that the Section 11 doesn't come into force until wed 9th, so quite how they are going to enforce blocking access from the main entrance I'm not sure.

That being the case, Riders Retreat (formerly Glentress Hotel) at the entrance will probably be happy for you to use their carpark in exchange for eating/drinking there.

Or you could try Gypsy Glen?

Thanks again chaps. I've actually just realised our campsite is literally at the end of the same main entrance road - Glentress Forest Lodges; for some reason I thought the missus booked at Inners. They took the booking so I assume they are fully open and they can't stop me going up, so I'd hope (and am awaiting email response to confirm) that the camp at least can let me park there for the day. With any luck I'm all set!

The lodges have their own parking, so hopefully you're all set!

They're going to lose out long term over that, a bunch of people who're used to parking at GT itself will get their eyes opened to parking in town or on the road and riding in up Janet's Brae.

I did Janet's Brae last year and thought it was ok...would have been better if I hadn't had to stop for a pee halfway up but it was decent. More interesting that the fireroad climb and seemed to go by quick enough.
I reckon the volunteers will soon have some singletrack bits added there to make it more entertaining.

<p>When is the UCI stuff over and the Shops open again?</p>

Am I right to say that the black route diversion takes you on that new fireroad that goes above where the skills area is, over to the end of soor plooms? Are the offpistes on that side affected at all? I was just riding around fairly randomly and planning to end on the fort, then I realised that getting back to the fort or dave's trails from the main trails is now a pain in the arse because the cabin closure area's so big. And that'll be true for anyone riding up from peebles.

I think there's a walking path that runs from below careless whisper over to the end of zoom or bust, but I think it goes into zorb itself near the end rather than to the road at the end, and zorb's shut of course. But I can't see any way to ride out of the offpistes that doesn't just basically take you out on the black.

(well, I can think of one, but I know it's taped off even though it's ridable and there's no building work there currently)

Wasn't impressed with the quality of signage, as a side-grumble... It's all visible but it's "follow the arrows", it never actually tells you where you're going as far as I can tell. No maps, no explanations. Which is fine to get people just to follow the route but not good for anyone that needs to understand where they're going. That's kind of a classic for having one diversion sign fall over and have the whole thing become a fiasco like at Afan during the windfarm works.

You may be able to ride skip past the barriers in certain places, at the weekend only, allegedly. Or just go straight up the road the goes past the bottom of Careless Whisper etc

ZorB was fine for the demo weekend, that walking trail being you up no more than 50m from the end (iirc). Don’t think you’d have a problem

Yeah, getting up into the offpistes there is dead easy, just go up the road past the huts instead of up janet's brae... probably a better way to access the black than going up Janet's Brae too actually. But it doesn't work so well as an exit 🙂

Am I on the right track, the walker's trail comes through the wall just after the very last right turn on zoom or bust? Never actually been through there.

Yup, right about there

Ta, might never use it but it's good to have options in the bag.

There's actually two climbs next to each other in the Soonhope valley- both start at the junction with the track heading across the valley to the kennels. The official (and less obvious) one to the left looking up hill ends up between the start of Z or B and Jailbreak, while the more obvious one goes through the wall at the end of Z or B.

Z or B itself was mostly still in existence recently despite the works, with only a small section being taken over by a cabin footprint. I'd expect it will continue to be used once the cabins are done.

So a XC track that will only be used for the Worlds, and then removed? That's a shame - I hoped it would lead to some impetus of getting a XC World Cup on these shores. We need one, having the current Olympic chanpion, and a recent World champion.....