[Closed] Glasgow riders - any news on Cathkin progress over last month ?

On a related topic, anyone venturing up for a look should consider bringing a mate along. There's been a spate of muggings there lately; seemingly a couple of stabby types relieving dog-walkers of cash and smart phones.

arrpee - that's kinda worrying - I was there on a Sat with my 9yr old son and we saw a few shifty characters but no hassles. I rode the old trails a bit in the past, but always in decent sized groups given the location and Castlemilk next door.

Have there been any press reports on the muggings ? Was thinking about taking the kids this weekend if the trails have progressed well, but now not so sure... 😥

Linky:

http://www.strathclyde.police.uk/whats_happening/news/2012/september/robberies_rutherglen/

As you say, it's often a bit dodgy up there, but usually it's the comparatively benign pursuits of cruising and dogging you tend to happen across. Gets them out in the fresh air, I suppose...

progress on the actual build is going well and yes the trail should be finished by the end of the year (weather permitting) it may run into janruary depending on contractors holidays etc

the progress at the start was very quick as the contractor had a lot of spare men around so at time there were 40 staff on site but as work has picked up elsewhere numbers have dropped a bit so progress has slowed a bit....the trail itself is fully cut but as you have said lots of stone work and features to be build still as well as air - axe work to expose bedrock

enduro-aid - thanks for this - are you involved in the build ?

not directly but i work for the city council in the civil engineering department and work with the bloke incharge of the build / design so have a bit of an inside view and have been up a few times on vists / inspections etc

also just being a keen bike user ive been asking questions of him a lot haha

Been up there a few times myself, it's my local run when it's dry enough. Got to say i'm impressed with the design, it doesn't look to "olympic" depending on what they finish it with it could be quite good. Some nice use of elevation for descents etc. Quite a lot has had the first fill of heavy stone. Hard to ride on. So not really worth the trip, and they are keeping out the way of some of the decent other stuff.

Quite concerned about the muggings, hope they don't increase as it gains popularity. Generally give people a wide berth up there as a rule. Gays, motocross boys, neds and excitable dogs.

Cheers Enduro. Yep local for me too but will be cautious !

I wouldn't want to ride about there without a few mates. Too many nuggets who would rather take than earn.

Typical. Of all the places that Scotland could have used to showcase the amazing biking we have, and we build a wee trail right next to one of the biggest shoiteholes in the bloody country. Another opportunity missed.

>Another opportunity missed.<

Or another opportunity seized - depending on your perspective...

Where in Glasgow would you have built it - Bearsden?

In 2 minds on this one. Trying to regenerate somewhere etc is usually a good thing. The problem is I would not ever wish to ride there alone and probably would not ride there with friends as I know the area and you are too exposed. Riding a mtb that is regarded as an expensive item even when it is not could put you at risk. The track may also struggle with boys on scramblers ripping it up etc. Tough call but I think wrong call and the site was probably chosen for the least amount of red tape to the council as the place is a 5hithole. Sorry, but true imo.

I really don't think GC were worrying too much about whether the STW demographic were going to use the facility when they chose it. Hopefully they have a little more vision and are focused more on what it can become as opposed to what it may be now.

What can it become?

Where in Glasgow would you have built it - Bearsden?

Why would it have to be in Glasgow?. Was the Olympics course in greater London? No, it wasn't.

Off the top of my head, I'd say Whitelee forest or Muirsheil over by Lochwinnoch. Both good transport links, and in the West of Scotland, an area with no trail centres. And the chances of them having knife weilding f[i]u[/i]ckwits is significantly less than at Cathkin.

I really don't think GC were worrying too much about whether the STW demographic were going to use the facility when they chose it. Hopefully they have a little more vision and are focused more on what it can become as opposed to what it may be now.

It's exactly people like us that have a valid opinion that should be taken into consideration. Glasgow Council? Vision? mwahhaahhaa!.

Hmmm. So GCC should have built a mountain bike trail in East Renfrewshire or East Dunbartonshire? Seriously? 😆

For those complaining about where it should have gone and worrying about crime, why not wait until it is finished and go and give it a go for yourself? I've ridden up there prior to the construction work starting and I can't say that I felt in any way threatened or intimidated. If not Cathkin then where else in Glasgow (remember, these are being built for the Commonwealth Games in Glasgow) would you put it? The site has a great vertical drop, views across the city and the underlying geology is proving to be great to build on.

While you may not like the site, Glasgow should be applauded for building a site in a regeneration area and actively bringing what has the makings of a great facility to as wide a population as possible. In the same way that the Velodrome is located in the east end in a regeneration area, Glasgow is delivering on it's promise of legacy even before the Games take place in two years time.

If you don't like it, you don't have to use it. It's another facility to use so surely that's no bad thing?

sadly, i reckon nobeer is right. the motorcross and ned factor is a serious issue. other trail centres are far enough away from certain parts of society that the risk of mugging etc is lowered. tough one though. maybe they could have built the commonwealth course in mugdock or used the money to finally complete carron valley...

some good points as well there Sanny - I was forgetting that GCC don't run East Renfrewshire or Dunbartonshire - 😳

but surely it would have been better to use this money to build proper bike paths and lanes around Glasgow so that folks can get safely around the city rather than blowing a lot of money on what are really little more than a couple of playgrounds aimed at a minority?

Sanny +1

>Vision? mwahhaahhaa!.<

And your narrow minded vision / utopia is to build things where there's no bad people?

FWIW FCS offered the CGC not Whitelees but....................Glentress! Clearly of the same mindset as yourself.

CGC?
I've ridden up there a few times (daytime and at night) and it does have some great potential, the plus points noted above are true. But then so are the downsides..
If its going to be a mini trail centre after the games it's going to need round the clock patrols.
When I was up there I saw plenty of folks sitting about in the woods drinking- plus all the other stuff that prob goes on. It didnt bother me, but I'm sure there will be a ton of folk put off by it. Plus the comments about quads and scramblers is very valid- the place will get torn up rapid style unless there's security onside 24/7.

There is nothin wrong with cathkin been there several times for both work and bike riding, seen neds but never had any issues.

I think the only event that is taking place outside Glasgow is teh diving that is happening in the edinburgh commonwealth pool

Sanny, I admit it is easy to snipe etc than bring something positive. 🙁

Unfortuantely I cannot see what a pro level course can grow to be in such an area when the demographic of mountainbikers using a challenging hilly courses is people spending over £800 on their equipment and not wanting mugged. Even dulled down for noobs the hills will put them off off pretty fast on a relatively small intensive loop. I doubt it shall maintain the numbers required to justify proper maintenance such as the seven stanes due to it's location and proximity to a high amount of potential trouble. This on top of the fact the kids on MX bikes are going to wreck it. Come xmas and the locals see the track and mx bikes will be at the top of all their wish lists - not mtbs.

I have walked dogs there and everytime have felt threatened by drinking groups of youths or people on mx bikes. I would not be taking my bike there or leaving my car out of sight.

Glad to see my thread getting the conversation going, that's what it's all about. 😀

People have been riding there for ages, as Sanny says - we have done some GMBC and some Walker Cycles club rides there. We have never had any hassles, but rides have generally been with biggish numbers and in poorish weather. the new trails are much further east than the old ones, so don't drop down towards the main Castlemilk Road like they used to, so not quite so handy ambush points !

There has been a lot of time and effort put into the trails and when i was there a few weeks ago I was really impressed with how they are shaping up :

[img] https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/564678_371029539634627_394666609_n.jpg [/img][img] https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/p206x206/217164_371029176301330_71310320_n.jp g" target="_blank">https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/564678_371029539634627_394666609_n.jpg [/img][img] https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/p206x206/217164_371029176301330_71310320_n.jp g"/> [/img]

I do share all the concerns about the trails getting ripped up, and the safety issue is a real one for me, as it is a very handy place to ride with the kids as only 10 min drive from home. I don't know how it will pan out - hopefully if we can find safe and regular ways to ride it then the place wil become established for the right reasons

On a related issue, I was at the Velodrome on Tuesday (look out for a piece on the front page) for the press launch and I have to tell you, it's frikkin awesome! I reckon folk will be genuinely blown away by the facilities that have been built and which can be used from this weekend onwards! 😀 😀 😀

even some log features :lol:[img] [/img]

Jeezo- that looks pretty good! Might need to have another wee ride up there soon!
Looks good. But with the best will in the world. I doubt it will be maintained by the council after the games, and it will get torn up by weans and mx'ers!
What are the council sayi g about after the games then? Sure the velodrome and sports venues will be looked after but I doubt this place will! Shame really.
Sorry to sound so cynical but I know folk in the parks dept and they're all saying similar things..

I searched this on google the other day and found this thread http://www.trailscotland.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3874&hilit=Cathkin

just seen the bit on that link about planning approval for short trails and a pump track at Whitelee ?

[url= http://www.eastrenfrewshire.gov.uk/CHttpHandler.ashx?id=5184 ]here[/url]

My kids are gonna love it 😆

Rode there once and we got attacked by bams with a feral dog.

Don't think I'll ever be back.

Hmmm. So GCC should have built a mountain bike trail in East Renfrewshire or East Dunbartonshire? Seriously?

Surely all the funding isn't coming just from GCC? If it's coming from Scotland as a whole, then it's not outwith the realms of possibilty that a more suitable venue could be found that wasn't right next to one of the worst housing estates in Scotland

Cycled there many times, alone and with company. Worst I've seen was a man on all fours who was being pushed along from behind by his pal, who for some reason was wearing a long black wig. I stopped finding the doggers and gays funny at that point and don't visit as often. I'll be back soon to try these trails out though.

>then it's not outwith the realms of possibilty that a more suitable venue could be found that wasn't right next to one of the worst housing estates in Scotland<

And what fluffywuffy venue would sir prefer?

More than a few folk sneering down their collective noses on this thread.

I have lived in a lot of rough areas in my life and if there is one thing that attracts neds, it's walking/riding around looking like you're crapping yourself. If you have a bit of a swagger about you and look a wee bit rough around the edges you'll be grand.

That and if some wee ned tries to mug you - you're on a bike and probably going at speed - flatten them.

If you have a bit of a swagger about you and look a wee bit rough around the edges you'll be grand

I have lived in a lot of rough areas in my life and if there is one thing that attracts neds, it's walking/riding around looking like you're crapping yourself. If you have a bit of a swagger about you and look a wee bit rough around the edges you'll be grand.

That and if some wee ned tries to mug you - you're on a bike and probably going at speed - flatten them.

Nae bother Chuck Norris...

More than a few folk sneering down their collective noses on this thread

a) I've actually been there

b) We got attacked when we were there

c) I take it you live in Castlemilk. Nae luck.

Boardinbob - you from Bearsden, Milngavie, or Newton Mearns? Which one is it? 😀

The SXC manage to put on great races all year all over Scotland so why not do the same without chucking money at some white elephant trail. This is not the Olympics, it does not have to be an easy to film, new build flat track with specific features type venue with 10 billion live viewer expected worldwide. It is the commy games.

A venue could have been picked to showcase how beautiful Scotland is to oversees viewers etc. Maybe a bit of slightly more rural heritage close to Glasgow. Now they have a crushed stone Olympic copy track with Castlemilk as the backdrop. Lovely.

I'm not sneering, I just think the places I listed have better potential for further expansion than Cathkin, and are nicer areas to go riding in. And as mr Salmond keeps telling us, these are Scotland's games, not Glasgows. It's us that are funding this, not GCC.

Boardinbob - you from Bearsden, Milngavie, or Newton Mearns? Which one is it?

The mean streets of Kilmarnock

What tyres for broken bottles? 😉

If I remember correctly, one of the reasons for choosing Cathkin Braes for the course was so that the city of Glasgow could be seen as the backdrop to the event on TV. I believe the other was to try to have a positive financial and social impact on some of the city's more deprived areas. Which is admirable, but I wonder how much real value the trails would deliver in the long run. Based on the stereotypes of Castlemilk there may not be too many people stopping on the way through for coffee and cake.

If GCC are not planning to maintain the trails post games, it does seem like a waste of money that could otherwise have been used to shore up existing facilities elsewhere.

I really hope it's a great trail, as it's only 25 minutes from where I live. After the carry on with CV amongst others, I've become a cynic. Oh, and I'll see boardinbobs Kilmarnock, and raise him a Saltcoats!. 😉

One of the reasons behind choosing the site was that by increasing the amount of "legitimate" users (see the amount of use the Pollok Park MTB trails get from normal kids and their parents) the less desirable users of the park are discouraged (and presumably go somewhere else, in East Ren....)
Also, the venue IS being paid for by GCC, unlike the majority of the games sites. SO it's just the 500k of you that live in GCC paying for it.

Freeflow bikes are planning a big expansion of their facility up there. I'm thinking a hub-esque scenario which would go some way to keeping the trails sustainable beyond the games

SO it's just the 500k of you that live in GCC paying for it.

Minus the 228,000 that don't bother their arse paying their council tax

http://discuss.glasgowguide.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=20516

liking the idea of a fixed facility from Freeflow or others - I guess it's Neil's local trails so makes some sense..

Aye, but would it go the way of CV?

Who knows?

>I'm not sneering, I just think the places I listed have better potential for further expansion than Cathkin, and are nicer areas to go riding in. And as mr Salmond keeps telling us, these are Scotland's games, not Glasgows. It's us that are funding this, not GCC.<

Scotland's full of better places to go riding in - I think you need to open your mind a little in terms of what this is all about.

I'm not from Castlemilk incidentally BB but I sure am having a laugh at you posh boys from Kili and Saltcoats 😉

>Aye, but would it go the way of CV?,

No - CV involved the Forestry Commission. Certain FC Managers would rather have burned in hell than see Glasgow use that as a venue.

As I said earlier, their nearest offer was GT.

Theblackmouth, You're just looking for an argument. How does me not wanting to ride next to one of the worst areas of Glasgow make me 'posh'?. Away an take yer face for a sh1te.

Heading up here tonight with pals, I may report back unless I get mugged by neds. You bunch of fearty, negative, middle class whiners 😀

Guys, has anyone heard from waderider, he went up the braes and now nothing. I fear the castle milk young team have him.

The trails at whitelees wind farm got planning permission. They are looking to start work in January 2013 and will take three months to complete.
Also they are going to do some work on the old weavers trail between carrot(just up from eaglesham) and darvel.

Cheers for your concern Johnbot, got an update on the state of the trails indicating 100% that other local trails are still a better bet.....so went there instead.

For the record, as of yesterday I heard a visit is still not worthwhile, not least because all the recent rainfall has meant plant and machinery has created a mud bath in the vicinity of unfinished trails.

Still, looking forward to it. Had a look at the plans for Whitelees, a bit underwhelming for a 'serious' mountain biker, but something is better than nothing.

Update, visited last night, still not really worth it. Unfinished sections that it is politer to avoid. Additionally, some of the sections that appear finished have soft aggregate that is unpleasant to cycle on. Some parts that are interesting and show potential, technical bits with chicken/intermediate/hard lines, but lots of pointless meandering berms just a smidge off straight.

Ive ridden up there a few times, never saw any shadyness, never felt under threat fae nae one, the thought of where it is in the city and the potential of being mugged never crossed my mind, the trail looks interesting, need to give it another visit, not been for a while, btw been attacked by local mugdock dogs more than once 😉

I've been up the last two weekends for a quick blast and I was very impressed, in my humble opinion the final loop will be loads more fun than Carron valley. I'm guessing it will be after Xmas before it's finished.

Over the last few years I have rode cathkin loads and I have seen...
drunken neds
suspicious single men standing in the trees (not walking just... standing)
loads of big unfriendly dogs with rough as **** looking owners
burnt out cars wrapped around trees (I'm from Belfast so this stuff makes me feel very at home)

I've also spotted loads of what looked like NORMAL people, I even talked to some of them.

This could be a cracking little loop on our doorsteps, not Glentress but then again not an hours drive away.
I'll was thinking of building a website that could be used to arrange group rides and record the muggings.

There is no point giving up on this before it has started.
BTW if anyone sees stranges lights in the woods above Glasgow at 6 in the morning, it may well be me in a ned free, dogging free Cathkin.

I'll was thinking of building a website that could be used to arrange[s] group rides [/s] muggings and record the [s]muggings[/s] group rides.

Sorry - couldn't resist.

The sad fact is that any facility in the West of Scotland that is relatively close to a residential area is going to attract the local young team. Having skated for many years before taking up mountain biking, ive had to deal with many a team of neds at various skate parks. No matter how much of a hard man you claim to be, its still annoying as hell and tends to take the shine off of an otherwise awesome day. Saying that, I'd still rather face the bams than get mistaken by some fruity characters while putting my mountain biking gear into the back of the car.

don't flatter yourself, ducky.

Was up last night with pals, the trails are shaping up far better than I expected. Worth a visit now I would say. Maps are available if you google for them 😀

Also enjoyed 'cycling' one of the construction tracks which is literally knee deep mud for hundreds of yards.

Yeah why not Castlemilk? - nothing wrong with it. Glasgow Life, Urban Fox and the Various east end youth groups and cycle clubs will no doubt be heavy users of the bike course. The Value of the bike course is that some people not as lucky as the average singletrackrider might live a slightly longer more fulfilling life.

My Theatre in Easterhouse outclasses anything on offer in Milngavie or Bearsden. You'd think the locals wouldn't use it but its jumping. We can take Full scale productions from Scottish opera and NTS.

progress on the trails is being slowed down due to the weather folks it will defo be after christmas before they are completed, the soft fine material which is on top of the trails and was referred to in previous posts is whin dust

areas where there isnt any bedrock to expose there is a need to top the trail off to make it last longer, the whin dust will settle down over time as it rains and as more and more riders run over it.....so all i can say is the more folk that get out and ride it the better the trail conditions will be, but please if areas looked blocked off or look unfinished or are just bare mud please do not ride on that section.

all of the construction tracks have to be returned to native grass etc

thanks for the updates - will get down again soon

I hope Cathkin is as promising as it sounds. The future seems to be these small trails, and hopefully volunteer efforts to maintain and add to the trails. There is enough space and height to sculpt some more runs up there, the cynic in me is softening 🙂

Linky for trail description with a few pics:

Good link Arrpee!

Great link arrpee!

Facebook group keen to gauge interest in the track and the (quite promising) potential for a Hub-style facility run as a community-based project:

thread resurrection time 😆

sounds from the FB page like the trails are largely finished and riding well, anyone been there in the last week ?

Going to try and get round in the next few days; either early am or night ride to avoid disturbing the wildlife... 😛

Was up last week - almost done. Great trail, well worth a visit.
From what I hear it will be completed within the next 2-3 weeks.

Only bad bit at the moment is the access paths for the diggers etc. 80% rideable just now

theupsetter - sounds good 🙂

Was up there over the holidays. They've done a good job, I'd say.

It's no Badaguish: definitely not 'traditional' XC, but obviously that type of course was neither possible nor desirable, given the location, intended use, volume of traffic, etc. Instead, what we've got is a nicely varied, all-weather XC race course, not too far from the city centre.

The exposed, pedally bedrock section running more or less parallel to the road will be pretty challenging for racers; can imagine it being very sapping, especially if most of the lines remain hidden under a foot of muddy rainwater (doubtless, some spoilsport will sort out the drainage, but I'm all for keeping it this way).

There's a nice, flowy descent to follow with a wee sting in the tail if you're not paying attention. After a bit of a meander onto the moor, this is followed by the dual descent: fun and fast with a couple of jumps at the bottom.

From this point, it's a grind back up to the radio mast, largely following the old XC course. There's a couple of steepish descents off the top of the hill with multiple line choices and big drops for those taking the A-line.

Criticisms? There are a few rock gardens which feel a bit tokenistic, i.e. a bit tame and not requiring much thought in terms of line choice.

There's plenty of scope for race organisers to add in a few natural sections to mix it up a bit. Hope this happens.

I see there is a good piece in the MBR that has just landed so that should get some tyres on the trails 🙂

Rideable now?? Ie- open?
Edit- that'll teach me to just read the last post!

anyone up for riding it this wed evening, 9th Jan. Should be a few GMBC folks out. Car park at the start of the trails, ready to ride 745pm

Biggest gripe i have with it at the moment is Malcoms site which is covering one of the large rock gardens/ decents that takes you back into the woods after the moor climb. Couple of wind turbines going in. Anyway, stick to the right of the heras fence on the foot path and skirt round it. Going to the left takes you into a boggy area with no decent link into the next section of trail.

Considering that a small amount of rain turns the Braes into a damp slog what we are ending up with is great. Everyone i meet up there is pleased with it as it is.

Raced my mate on the long dual slalom type bit the other day a few times, it was a hoot.

John - is there route signage/markers up yet ?