[Closed] Giro d'Italia thread (with likely spoilers)

Suspect it won't be huge chunks of time. Porte's lost mass to make him a better climber but that'll cost him a bit in the TT. And Aru will likely be better than last year as if he's got any GC aspirations he'll have been training hard on the TT bike. Doubt we'll see a repeat of last years Giro TT where he lost minutes to Uran.

It is 60km...

#mafiosi

Daniel Lloyd ?@daniellloyd1
Suggestion, everyone in top 50 GC EXCEPT Richie Porte swaps wheels with someone from another team. Everyone gets 2 minutes. #saveporte

A tweet doing the rounds, sounds like a great solution

Trivia

Am I remembering wrongly or is there a plaque with Aru's name on it in the caff at Fort Bill as he won a junior MTB world cup round there a few years back.

the giro really struggles with non italian contenders ... wonder if
that had been modolo and aru whether the outcome would have been the
same ... not 🙁

really do wish the license commission had backed the uci and
withdrawn the astana license .... ggrrrrrrr

been a great Giro so far, would be a shame to let this daft ruling reduce the number of GC contenders,

its a nice idea, but no one will be swapping wheels this morning

Would be good to see!

Got to ask where the rest of his team were though. Final few k's of a stage and your GC leader is on his own...?

Also interesting point made over at inrng that maybe the "marginal gains" concept should have covered having your riders know the rule book!

It's difficult to see on the highlights as most of it was missed but they were dropping back, from pics I've seen there were also Sky riders there but in the heat of the moment Clarke was closer. It's easy to say "where were Sky" but at that point the peloton was full gas, all it takes is a corner taken a bit wrong and you're moving back, puncture on top and you're ooot the back very quickly.

Got to ask where the rest of his team were though. Final few k's of a stage and your GC leader is on his own...?

Depends on which photo. In most of the larger ones you can clearly see the left arm of somebody in sky kit. I would imagine that the Orica guy gave Richie the wheel allowing the other sky rider to keep going and pace him back as best he could.

Interesting one. I can see why it is in the rules but in this case I think it was the wrong decision. He lost time in any case and his team mate will have had to expend a huge amount of energy towing him back so he lost out. The rule needs to be there to stop very strong alliances forming and ending up with what would be super teams of 18 or 27 riders.

Best to decide races on rider ability though rather than technicalities.

Thing is that sort of thing goes on anyway and a wheel change seems pretty trivial. Remember (I think) Tiralongo helping former Astana teammate Contador take the lead of the Vuelta a couple of years back by doing some massive turns to put time into Rodriguez. Much more assistance than a simple wheel swap!

That rule is hardly ever enforced anyway as, by the letter of the rule, it should penalise an entire peloton who wait for anyone who has a mechanical or accident, which happens a fair bit and is praised as a sign of sportsmanship. Just seems a bit silly.

Have Team Sky appealed the ruling?

No appeal permitted. According to race director Mauro Vegni

Rules are rules, and I think rules have to be respected for the credibility of this sport and, in this case, the credibility of the Giro d’Italia

Do marginal gains not extend to putting sealant in their tubs or would it completely fubar them? I doubt weight is an issue with the antiquated minimum weight limit for bikes.

Did I imagine it or were BMC doling out bidons to other teams' riders in the break the other day? Phil Gilbert was passing energy bars around like Willy Wonka. To my mind, that's giving someone a competitive edge rather than making up for a mechanical. 2 minutes just killed the Giro for Porte and will make the last week a procession for Bertie once Aru either gets popped or loses too much in the ITT.

The rule...

[img] [/img]

Though I don't know if the penalty is specified in the rules or at the discretion of the race director.

Race Director..

#unduinfluence

Got to ask where the rest of his team were though

I saw David Millar and Chris Boardman tweet that of course rules are rules but so many rules are openly and routinely ignored by the commissaires.

So Richie, can you tell us what happened out there on the road?
The peloton was going super fast to try and catch the breakaway and get ready for a bunch sprint, and I picked up a front wheel puncture as we were going around a roundabout. I'd gone around it on the left but my team-mates went around the other side. I stopped, and by the time the guys had got back to me Simon (Clarke from Orica GreenEdge) had already stopped and offered me his wheel. It was a spur of the minute thing. Alberto (Contador) summed it up last night - all you are thinking about when something like that happens is 'how can I make sure I lose the least time possible'. I didn't even give it a thought that it might be breaking the rules. Everything was happening so quickly and I was just acting on adrenaline.

Would be ace if the GC contenders/peleton gave Porte 2 mins today if the racing allowed for it by 10k to go!

Thanks Mrblobby. With all that spare time Porte has in his motorhome, maybe he needs to have a proper read. Got to feel for the fella though. His season has been built around the Giro and thanks to a puncture and a poor decision making after 4+ hours, its looking pretty unlikely.

All Porte can hope for is an on the road alliance between Etixx (I think Greg Henderson isn't an Aru fan 😯 ), Orica and Sky, perhaps persuade Vaughters too, against Astana

Henderson's at Lotto Soudal who aren't a team of climbers really (Jurgen VdB excepted). Porte's promised to go on the attack which I think will only wear Astana down enough for Contador to retain pink all the way to Milan.

Very much enjoying the wildly xenophobic and partisan ranting

Does seem somewhat inconsistent to penalise Porte while citing the letter of the law when the railway crossing incident at Paris-Roubaix had/has potentially much more grave consequences and went without any similar application of the relevant laws (race regs and criminal laws).

The idea doing the rounds on twitter is that the top GC riders all swap front wheels early on in the race to receive a 2min penalty.

I am interested to see what happens - the peloton is getting more vocal in recent years, objecting to decisions made by race organizers when they consider them wrong.

Very much enjoying the wildly xenophobic and partisan ranting

I've not really seen any (well almost!) comments that warrant this sort of response. Mostly just frustration and disappointment that a seemingly inncouous event has potentially ruled out a GC contender to the detriment of the race. Was equally disappointed at the prospect of Contadors injury potentially eliminating him.

Unless your comment is directed at Giro race officials 😉

Very much enjoying the wildly xenophobic and partisan ranting

I think partisan is allowed; this is STW not the BBC. As above though, not seen any xenophobia. There's a long established tradition of the Giro organisers being "creative" in order to hamstring non-Italians.

There's a lot of that going around, seems like an English speaker isn't aloud to support an English speaker when a decision goes against him 'cos xenophobzzz, for me (although I'm a massive Porte fan) this isn't the case at all, I'm disappointment the race has been decided by a puncture and a commissaire. I was equally (maybe even more) frothy about last years Giro.

Does seem somewhat inconsistent to penalise Porte while citing the letter of the law when the railway crossing incident at Paris-Roubaix had/has potentially much more grave consequences and went without any similar application of the relevant laws (race regs and criminal laws).

Do you really think that other races should follow the example set by P-R ? Plus, even if they had tried to identify the riders, by then the race was over

The idea doing the rounds on twitter is that the top GC riders all swap front wheels early on in the race to receive a 2min penalty.

Would love to see how Vino, Aru and everyone one else at Astana react to that suggestion !

Do you really think that other races should follow the example set by P-R ? Plus, even if they had tried to identify the riders, by then the race was over

I'd expect 'em to show discretion, let's use PR and last years Giro and as an example, clear rule breaking in PR and a massive safety issue, nothing done, nada, brushed under the carpet. Last years Giro was a complete cluster **** with red flags that weren't red flags but we're but weren't, nothing done, race decided. Then we look at this, the rule is clear as is it's intent but Porte wasn't trying to gain an advantage, he was just doing his best to limit a disadvantage. The UCI could have just fined him and allowed the time he lost to stand. But na, let's go balls deep and **** him!

As others have said, Italians in the Giro are allowed to get away with a lot more than non Italians.
Its not jumping forward, go to 6:13

While Cav was pissed off with being deliberately blocked twice (you're not allowed to move from your line in a sprint), he said the main issue was if the roles were reversed and he was doing the blocking, he would've been relegated.

I'm no oil painting but that Aru's hard to look at isn't he. 2 minutes for that. Minimum.

Do you really think that other races should follow the example set by P-R ? Plus, even if they had tried to identify the riders, by then the race was over

yeah you're right, no one could possibly have figured out who the guy dodging the barrier in the French National Champs kit was at the time....

[img] [/img]

monkeyfudger +1

Lightman, love the video. Comedy weaving there.

How's about this for a bit of casual xenophobia.

There's been 9 stages (not including TTT) and five have been won by someone in the break. Apart from Inxausti, all have been Italians or Italian teams. When you look at the sprint teams esp. Orica and Lotto Soudal making no inroads on the break of 4 or 5 riders, you can only conclude that the dedicated sprint teams aren't up to the job or the breakaways are stronger than in other years. I can only conclude that this years Giro is 'unusual' to say the least. 🙁

In unrelated news:

[url= http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/bardiani-csf-ignore-mpcc-cortisol-regulations-at-giro-ditalia ]Cycling news link[/url]

Nah, it's just Sky holding back until week 3 which is making everyone else look good.

years. I can only conclude that this years Giro is 'unusual' to say the least.

Nothing controversial about today's winner either 😆

Nothing controversial about today's winner either

What? Being in the break, holding off a speeding peleton and then attacking the break? Oh yeah, on a super smooth racetrack. Nothing to see here.

He's probably referring to the 2yr ban he served when he was 19..

Quite enjoyed today's stAge. No theatre. No drama, just a slog in the rain.

Nice to Gilbert get a win.

GC. Meh. Let's hope the time trial shakes things up a bit. Could be tough on Contador and his shoulder but I suspect he'll do fine.

Yup I shouted at the telly when Gilbert went.. Great win for him.

I can't think of that guys name the Lotto Jumbo rider, begins with a K.. You know the bloke.. Well I'm kinda hoping he'll go all out for a win, he's been at the front attacking and breaking free to be taken back all week..

However I've kinda settled to a Bertie Win, relaxed after Portes 2min addition, sort of taken the edge off, certainly with the race organisers backing Aru.
But in his defence he looked knackered today after the finish.

Intxausti's looking pretty in the mountains jersey, suits him 8)

Get on there, I do love a Gilbert win!

Aru looking like he suffered in that one, that weight loss must be taking its toll in he rain...

Betancur coming back!

Gilbert is always class.

That FDJ rider descending off the front had me clenching a few times, fair play for keeping it upright though!

Today's stage looks set to be a thriller 🙂

[img] [/img]

What's the point of stages like today's? Just seems like a bit of a procession

Congrats to the Italians for handling a level crossing without a full meltdown happening!

Shame for Gerro not making the start (OGE fanboi here) I assume he's cripped after the crash yesterday?

#transitionstage
#sprintersflyhometonight

What's the point of stages like today's? Just seems like a bit of a procession

I guess even the pros need a "rest" day in a month of solid racing. It is interesting looking at the Pro power files for these days- NP is somewhere around 180W or something ridiculously low so it seems to be a bit of a Z1 day for them. There was an interesting interview with a pro from the 70's (I forget who) who said these easy days really threw his rhythm and he much preferred hard days from start to finish and really grew in to the race, which although sounds nuts, does makes sense

Lifer - Member
Gilbert is always class.
That FDJ rider descending off the front had me clenching a few times, fair play for keeping it upright though!
POSTED 15 HOURS AGO #

He seemed completely out of control, makes you wonder though as there were a few spills yesterday.

interesting interview with a pro from the 70's

He seemed completely out of control, makes you wonder though as there were a few spills yesterday.

It is interesting looking at the Pro power files for these days- NP is somewhere around 180W or something ridiculously low so it seems to be a bit of a Z1 day for them.

Wiggins said something similar about the TdF too - that sitting in the peloton spinning along at 25-28mph was so easy that you'd actually LOSE fitness by doing it!
Basically that you needed the hills, the hard stages, the attacks just to keep things interesting and keep your fitness up.

And this is the reason we need live telemetry from the riders so we know who is where. "Something has happened, we don't know who is involved" is the summary

Oh dear, not watching it today but sounds like another chunk of time lost for Porte. Did Contador lose 30 seconds to Aru too?

All change again. Not the end of the world for Contador but certainly the final nail in Porte's coffin.

Looks like it's being debated whether the crash happened inside the last 3km... if there's a chance of Aru being in pink then I'd assume it'll be judged to be outside!

Defo outside the 3k it seems.

Meh.

Meh indeed. Game over for Aru and Porte.

Don't think it's quite game over for Aru. Big chunk to claim back, and Contador does not like getting dropped once he's got the lead...but you never know, plenty of racing to be done yet.

Porte on the other hand... Shame, but he just doesn't seem to be able to finish a grand tour without having any problems. Who knows, maybe he'll take himself a stage win.

great ride from Bertie today, result was always going to be so

meh indeed

#imgoinghomesheila

Did Porte just give up. There's no way he should give up 4m to the leaders given his pedigree as an ITT rider.

Australian media suggests that his head wasn't in it after the last few days. Guess it's not much fun to come to a grand tour as the leader of a team that is capable of a podium (at least) to be chasing for a top 10 because of a wheel change and a crash

No official notice yet but he's already commented on going home and also made comments as to talking to Dave about it too.
I reckon he'll not start today.
Bloody shame IMO, if he goes it sends a strong enough signal to the rest of the Sky team that it's all about him. Contrary to his persona this just could become the unraveling of Sky as a team and set a period of instability within.
Sky have some fantastic team riders, whilst they've been held back in support of one (or two) team leaders it's a great way to give the rest of the guys a chance to ride in the manner they really want to, rather than be told not to.
#kiri
#koing
#nieve
Let them ride Dave, give them free rein to show the talents they have, too late for a Giro win but stages can still be clawed back without #imgoinghomesheila.

if his head isn't in it, his head isn't in it, its easy to get demoralised after the week he's had

what id like him to do is take todays stage, lay down a marker, then quit if he wants,

I don't know if the Giro is the cost of Porte riding for Froome in the Tour but it's probably time he stuck to being a super domestique with stage race wins in the smaller races. He's like Uran, good but not great and not a team leader for a grand tour. They should throw in behind developing their other riders especially now Wiggins is gone.

Great ride from Bertie. He's a classy combination of climber and TTer.

I'd be very disappointed in Porte if he goes home. You never know what can happen in a big race. There have been surprise grand tour winners in the past and there are also individual stages to go for. Look what Bertie has overcome to be where he is in this tour and you can see why he is a multi tour winner and why (IMHO) Porte will never win a big tour.

Great ride from Bertie. He's a classy combination of climber and TTer and dodgy beef supplies

As for Porte if you come ot win something and you cannot most folk would lose something in the motivational stakes.

perhaps does say he lacks mental toughness but not so sure. Personally i just think he does not have enough talent [ or the correct steaks]

Hadn't heard the rumours of him going home. Makes sense in a practical Sky sort of way though if he's not ok physically (after crash) or mentally. An extra week of recovery and training before putting everything on Froome for the Tour. Let the rest of the team go for stage wins and maybe back Viviani for red.

Is a bit of a shame to feel like the Giro is already over despite what was meant to be a thrilling final week showdown with 5 summit finishes still to come. Bit like last years Tour really.

All over bar the shouting now. Shame. I started watching it on Eurosport in the first week but a combination of Bertie being dominant and the commentators being annoying has turned me off.

Commentators annoying on Eurosport? Blimey. Well avoid ITV at all costs then!

Porte supposedly has a knee injury. If so, it must be crushing to know the world is calling you a wimp for throwing in the towel for being "not mentally strong enough".

Eurosport has chosen the wrong commentators, agree with that. Matt Stephens and Dan Llyod should do it 😀

I'm with RCS on choosing shorter routes/stages. Think this has been the right choice for a mix up Giro, despite the team(s) quite predictable tactics in shielding Lead Riders there has been opportunity for rouleurs to pop off the front and not just be there for TV advertising either. For that RCS have to be applauded, but that's about it.
In one instant they've killed the Tour, chosen to play the "rules" when it suited them by backing an Italian for the win only for it to flat when Bertie, predictably, slammed it into the big ring and rode off. If one person stands out in all of this its him and his strength and sheer ability to overcome mental and physical knocks, on and off the bike. Whilst Aru has been showing great depth of aptitude and ability, turning himself inside out most days, he's still got a great few years coming to him. When Nibbali drops a cog Aru will be there to glide past whilst at the same time wondering to himself if it's the new generation of now 23,4,5 yr olds about to flourish. I think so.

Back to Sky for a moment, a team rammed with class riders. A team that has both talent and ability in at least 5 of the current 9 in the squad to be set free and each have their own personal wins. But for me it's Dave making limiting decisions imposed on them. No wonder they lost Cotaldo last year, wonder if Kyri stays another year. Heano and Neive astonishing climbers in thier own right seemingly held back in a net cast of support roles. That can't last for very long.
As for Richie, I really do feel for him. The decisions RCS made last week in enforcing a rule that forbids Sportsmanship,respect for other riders and commeradery typifies, for me, a "self, self only" culture. I don't really like that.

But it's ok for me to sit and ponder like I'm in charge, I am afterall just another Fan of road racing.

I hope Ritchie does start today. I would like to see how he goes in the big hills. He could yet move up the standings.

Eurosport commentator is a bit wearing - I know he's probably correct but the over-pronuciation of names seems more important to him than the riding

Porte ?

I reckoned he was a solid bet for second place but the ruling and then the crash must've been a right kick in the guts

Sky should definitely just enjoy themselves for the rest of the race - and TBH Richie doesn't really seem one for the breakaway or even towing a team-mate around, though the hills coming up will be good training for most things I'd have thought.

Is he due to ride the TdF ?

Porte continues

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/team-sky-confirm-porte-will-continue-giro-ditalia

Up until the puncture that cost Porte seconds he didn't look out of place with Bertie in the first week. I was sure after the ITT and the mountain stages he would finish 2nd overall to Bertie. I'm still looking forward to todays stage.

Porte finish 28 minutes down today