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Well Froome needs to find some form out there somewhere or he might be better off heading somewhere nice after the next rest day!!
that was some final kilometre, for a 5% hill
I wanted the break to stay away, but when Carapaz span off the front it looked like might even pull a wheelie he powered off so quickly..
Glad Sky didn’t last long on the front, they tried thier old tactics of the rolling roadblock but they were blown to bits in the end. Good to see Froomie in trouble every now and again, didn’t really see Aru but he seemed happy enough at the finish.
Long old stage that.
Tomorrow looks like a cracker!
Yeah, that’s “bumpy”
🤪🤯
when Carapaz span off the front it looked like might even pull a wheelie he powered off so quickly..
Yeah, very impressive. Surprised that they got back to within 7 seconds; thought he'd be maybe 20 up
Do you think Froome is deliberately not going for wins /jersey to avoid the media? That said he doesn't look at all comfortable. Great that Yates is still there but 16s ahead of dumoulin looks very fragile. On that subject commentators said dumoulin. Had only raced 12 days prior to tour? Very strange to then come to a Giro and be a contender?
Do you think Froome is deliberately not going for wins /jersey to avoid the media?
Nah, he rode like shit today (they kept replaying bits of footage of him wobbling & banging into folk as well as his fall) and I thought he looked rough on the line. May still come good but I think tomorrow will be a big day for him.
He certainly looks rough but he's a tough cookie. If he can hang in there then don't write him off yet. As said, tomorrow is another day.
Nothing will stop me wanting Esteban Chavez to win this bike race.
This ^
Another Chavez supporter here, but I’d be equally happy if Dumoulin won again. (As long as it doesn’t turn into another Sky boreathon!)
Froome always looks rough. Stages so far havent suited him, he needs multiple climbs. Having said that if he was on form he'd be doing better. It was a heavy fall he had before the tt. I wouldnt rule him out yet.
Bloody hell Yatsy 💪💪💪💪💪💪💪💪💪💪💪💪💪☄️
Froomidge lost 1’06 🤪
2.30 back, tough choice ahead risk his chances in the tdf trying to drag it back or wave the white flag and save something for the tour
Awesome, Yates.
Can't help thinking Froome has come in a bit undercooked on purpose with the TdF in mind and will get stronger throughout the race. He'll need to get going soon though otherwise it's pointless - that didn't look good.
Quintana, Landa and Valverde must be enjoying this (though I think Roglic is a good outside bet for the tour)
Can’t help thinking Froome has come in a bit undercooked on purpose with the TdF in mind and will get stronger throughout the race.
though he's had more race days so far this season than Tom (Tom did manage a showing in the spring classics which probably helps with getting into the cut and thrust of road racing quite well and definitely looks lacking in Froome)
Perhaps he's just getting old then!
Is Simon Yates the one who has a drug ban? Or is that his brother ?
thiinking about it, it's a tough position for Froome now he 1.50 ish behind the WC TTer so will have to attack him in the mountains to gain time but he'll be up against a Chaves Yates Pinot Pozzovivo Carapaz tag team.
Is Simon Yates the one who has a drug ban? Or is that his brother ?
First hit on Google: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cycling/36564327
I wonder if some of the problems for froome is he can't handle the cold very well.
I wonder if some of the problems for froome is he can’t handle the cold very well.
He's just not hit form, no other excuse.
could be a combination of cold induced asthma and staying off the puffer, just in case like.
In general, when you talk to them you can see they really want to win. I don't think they will switch off but, for sure, I this is not great news. They will keep fighting, they have strong morale - and that's what it is like in this sport. But we are not so often in this situation.
Nice to see a statement from Nic Portal (Sky DS).. the opening “in general” says it all really.
Still think Sky are pulling the funding soon, £20 says it’s after the TdF.
Well well well, that's it for Froome if you ask me in the Giro.
However, Yates is looking damn good along with having Chavez as his team mate. Very cool performance from him today out there.
I don't really understand why Froome hasn't come in at peak form, I thought previously he said his main aim this year was to win the giro to win all three grand tours.
Don't remember seeing Froome have consecutive bad days in a tour. I still wouldn't rule him out. Yates could easily have a bad day and lose the whole thing. It's early days, lots of tough days to come!
There are some tough days to come but the top 10 is still packed so he needs 3 or 4 guys to have bad days
Whats up with Froomes taped up knee?
It's pretty scary that Mitchelton Scott have a 2nd very similar variant warming up ready to lead the TdF team. In a way it would be good to have them riding together but sure how it would work unless took turns to ride for each other. They deserve to become a household name as a proper British pair of hard hitting tough brothers a bit like the Brownlees in triathlon.
It’s pretty scary that Mitchelton Scott have a 2nd very similar variant warming up ready to lead the TdF team. In a way it would be good to have them riding together but sure how it would work unless took turns to ride for each other. They deserve to become a household name as a proper British pair of hard hitting tough brothers a bit like the Brownlees in triathlon
Which one of them is generally the better ?
If you also throw Chaves in there for discussion, then you've got a very strong trio there. Their Domestiques are doing a cracking job at putting them in the right places too.
Was interesting to see y'day that when Froome was struggling, he still had cover from Sky, in the previous days he's been last man standing, but yesterday he had backup but still didn't quite have it at the end.
Bernal to the TDF phone !
Which one of them is generally the better ?
Faff all in it tbh
I don't think I've seen Froome blow up quite like that before, seen him struggle on the super steep and Quintana take 1.30 out of him on the alpe but he always had the "wherewithal" to push for the line and mind the seconds but yesterday he was completely gone.
cloudnine
Whats up with Froomes taped up knee?
See post 1 of this thread
Is there anywhere online you can watch extended highlights? There's only 3 minute clips on YT.
Quest show a one hour programme at 7pm. I saw a mention of on demand?
yes - https://www.questtv.co.uk/video/giro-2018
Stage 8 is the last one there though so looks like you may have to wait a few days for the exciting stages
I don’t really understand why Froome hasn’t come in at peak form, I thought previously he said his main aim this year was to win the giro to win all three grand tours.
A potential ban looming over his head and the constant stream of negative feedback directed towards him? He can repeat over and over how professional and focused he is, but that is going to affect you.
I hope he fights on and comes good in the TT. Still a good chance at the podium, but he just doesn't look on it. He's not had one good day.
He's riding into form so that he doesn't peak before the Tour de France, plus there's still snow on the mountains - Froome doesn't perform well in the cold. He likes it hot - that's why he favours La Vuelta.
He’s riding into form
I see this a bit of GT threads, do people actually pick up fitness on these Tours then ? I'd have thought you'd struggle to due to the fatigue levels you end up with ?
That's what the team coaches, journos and the commentators say. I've seen it with other riders in GTs over the years where they haven't looked special in week 1 but have come on strong later. Having said that I'm not sure they've been 2 minutes behind like Froome is.
I don’t really understand why Froome hasn’t come in at peak form, I thought previously he said his main aim this year was to win the giro to win all three grand tours.
Maybe he needs to eat more... joking aside, the cumulative stress of all those three-month GTs combined with maintaining an artificially low weight can't be good for you long term. And he reportedly did a series of huge rides over the close season, potentially in an attempt to reproduce the impact of a grand tour effort on his Salbutamol levels.
If that's true, it may have seriously screwed over his recovery from last season's efforts. At the least, it won't be what he's done in previous years.
As far as coming in 'under cooked', it's pretty much what he did at the Tour de France last year. The theory is that he improves throughout the tour rather than going into it at the redline already and having nowhere to go but down.
He doesn't look great so far, but if he improves and the likes of Yates and Pinot fall off over the next two weeks, it could be interesting. Yates looks bonkers strong, but he can still have a really bad day and lose a bunch of time on a single big climb.
Edit: 'fall off' was a bad choice of words, but that can happen too...
I think he's found out that week 1 of the giro is more stressful than france
he's possibly mentally switched already to building form and going for pink next year
I have not heard much comment about what he was doing through the winter that may affect his performance now. He must have been doing a lot of work to replicate the stresses and dehydration that could potentially have led to the adverse finding. If they are doing it is a systematic way then he would have to have replicate the stress that could lead to the high values found in his sample from the legal dose of Salbutamol. I think I read that this was seen in some of the training he was posting and it may have impacted his performance coming in to this season. As it was not a normal training regime and something different it may not have been as good preparation as he wanted. Add to that crash before the prologue and he has admitted he has been having a lot of treatment for it then his performance is where we may have expected it to be.
Having said all of that then I still think that Yates looks far better than many of the others and the team looks stronger as well so it may all have been academic. It will be a tortoise and hare moment with Demoulin trying to gain all the losses back on the TT and it is still a fascinating race.
As far as coming in ‘under cooked’, it’s pretty much what he did at the Tour de France last year. The theory is that he improves throughout the tour rather than going into it at the redline already and having nowhere to go but down.
The problem is that the first week of the Giro - and arguably the whole of the Giro - is more difficult than the first week of the TdF. The Giro doesn’t tend to have a week of stages designed by Cavendish where riders can get used to the pace. 😁 I’m sure Froome/Sky would be aware of that.
I see this a bit of GT threads, do people actually pick up fitness on these Tours then ? I’d have thought you’d struggle to due to the fatigue levels you end up with ?
I think its more if you come in "peaked" you lose it faster.
I think its more if you come in “peaked” you lose it faster.
You can't maintain absolute peak form for more than about 10 days at a time so the trick is to come into a 3-week Tour slightly "under-par" and ride yourself into it. Well, that's the trick for a GC contender, if you're really good you can build a team of riders around you who are slightly shifted along that axis - some of whom start super strong and then fade towards the end, others who start really weak but finish super strong - everyone is somewhere along that timeline of the 7-10 days of top form to protect the team leader throughout the race.
Go George Bennett! - a bit under the radar in all these conversations but generally keeping out of trouble and still well within reach. He admitted he attacked too much a few stages back but seems to have learned his lesson in this last stage. The TT will be his weak point unfortunately but great to see him playing amongst the big boys in the mountains!
Some interesting comments
chavez off the back apparently,
2,24 back at the moment there's going to be some tired legs riding like they are (not letting them get back on)
chaves 10 minutes back from the pink jersey (there was some issue but I didn't catch what whitey said) it's now raining just what bambi didn't want 😉
(there was some issue but I didn’t catch what whitey said)
Hay fever apparently
you can get a TUE for that! according to mr wiggins 😉
does tom have a back issue ?
Chavez can still win. He's just riding himself into form.
meanwhile, over in California ....
another stage for Yates, Tom second and Froome 40 seconds back!
Yates wins again, 47 seconds up on GC, it's not looking bad for him at all is it? Is there much TTing left? Enough to allow Dumoulin to pull him back?
1 Simon Yates (GBr) Mitchelton-Scott 47:08:21
2 Tom Dumoulin (Ned) Team Sunweb 0:00:47
3 Thibaut Pinot (Fra) Groupama-FDJ 0:01:04
4 Domenico Pozzovivo (Ita) Bahrain-Merida 0:01:18
5 Richard Carapaz (Ecu) Movistar Team 0:01:56
6 George Bennett (NZl) LottoNL-Jumbo 0:02:09
7 Rohan Dennis (Aus) BMC Racing Team 0:02:36
8 Pello Bilbao (Spa) Astana Pro Team 0:02:54
9 Patrick Konrad (Aut) Bora-Hansgrohe 0:02:55
10 Fabio Aru (Ita) UAE Team Emirates 0:03:10
froome 12th 3.20 back
I hate to be the one to ask, but, are we accepting this from Yates?
Nice work there.
34km flat time trail to come - he could easily loose 47secs and more sadly. I reckon he needs to be 1min 30 up on Dumoulin as a absolute minimum to stand a chance of the over overall in Rome. Maybe more.
I hate to be the one to ask, but, are we accepting this from Yates?
He has been progressing to this point for a while now or are you referring to his inhaler issue a few years back - which anyone would sensibly put down to administration/cock up rather than actual doping.
I hate to be the one to ask, but, are we accepting this from Yates?
Yeah, I didn't want to be the one to write it, but... I mean his performance is exceptional, but is it "not normal"?
I'm not aware of anything historical with him, so just a genuine question really. He's battering everyone day after day, which could be seen as slightly well, dubious? I'm aware he's been at the pointy end, but not in a dominant context like this race
I hate to be the one to ask, but, are we accepting this from Yates?
I have given up caring and just take is on face value and leave the suspicion to those paid to be so. The alternative is just a waste of time to watch.
34km flat time trail to come – he could easily loose 47secs and more sadly. I reckon he needs to be 1min 30 up on Dumoulin as a absolute minimum to stand a chance of the over overall in Rome. Maybe more.
fortunately there's the high mountains to come too, though Dumoulin is a much improved climber he rides to power (huge power 🙂 ) so struggles to stay with the explosive climber types hoping to wind them back in over the whole climb ala sky & froome unfortunately (for tom) his team looks a little lacking.
Yates does seem to be smashing it every day. For all he's a young man, you have to wonder if it's going to give him a really bad day sooner or later
Yates does seem to be smashing it every day.
he does seem to be gauging his efforts well though, more opportunistic taking of the time bonus on offer than "smashing it" 3 well timed efforts have paid big dividends !
besides there are 2 pan flat sprinters stages up next before the Zoncolan saturday will give him (and his team) a chance to sit in let qsf do all the work.
I know what you mean klunk but, say, on the day when Chaves was dropped and the peloton rode at full whack pretty much all day, was it worth 3 seconds to take a hill sprint ? (answer: Yes, seems so - for now anyway). Today a bit different, since DuMoulin had to race him head to head
It's great to watch an' all, and I hope he makes it but I just wonder about energy conservation, esp if he's now having lots of media duty instead of sleeping it off whenever he can.
(Looks like light winds for these 2 coastal stages too, so no likely quickstep shenanigans to worry about)
Interesting to see what sky do now ? is Froome a busted flush yet ? or is it all in over the weekend and smash the race to pieces (though the sky train hasn't looked that good either)
Froome a busted flush yet
See the video above? Does that looked like a motivated, energetic rider ready to smash the Peloton?
though the sky train hasn’t looked that good either
And this may be why reducing the teams by one is a good thing
I'd prefer to be getting more time on Tom. He was really chasing me all the way to the finish there. He looks better than the other day on the steep finishes there. I think he's getting better as the race goes on, and that's not good news for me.
I think for a young lad Yates is proving that you don’t have to be Italian or Colombian to be able to climb. If you’ve followed his progress over the GT seasons past he’s always been up in the front Testing both skills and learning how to measure outputs.. he’s simply putting that all into practice now.
Granted he’s not TT’er, but then his closest rivals are not climbers either, and that’s a significant point. The Giro is always hilly, RCS have an Italian outlook when it comes to building a fairly balanced GT.
Also, he’s part of the new generation coming through. He’s won white jerseys in previous GTs and that experience is paying off handsomely.
Will he carry Pink to the end, sadly I doubt it but that’s not to detract from his exceptional riding so far. 2 wins whilst in Pink is folklore in Italy and he’s already being seen as a Demi God. Italians love a fighter, a fighter and winner in Pink is the stuff of legend.
Fabulous riding from him and the team, I really thought Kruisinger had hung up his shoes, but even he seems to have found some spirit of old.
Its great to see a fresh smiling face on the podium.
I hate to be the one to ask, but, are we accepting this from Yates?
I think there's a point, that a lot of self-styled 'real cycling fans' have reached where it becomes a sort of ongoing truism that anyone who wins or simply performs well must be cheating. Some of it seems to come from a slightly flaky idea that somehow we're all about equal, all pro cyclists train really hard and thus, if you win, you must have gained an unfair advantage.
That ignores genetic factors - some riders are born with a higher VO2 Max, muscle composition or whatever. Like it or not, the raw material, even among elite athletes is not equal. There was a fascinating documentary a few year back where they analysed the physiology of the legendary hurdler Colin Jackson. It transpired that he actually had an incredibly rare tyre of super high-twitch muscle fibres, which in turn explained his extraordinary explosive power.
And that's before you look at other factors like training programmes - no, no all elite cyclists train to the same level - motivation, psychological toughness - 'resilience' - the quality of nutritional and logistical back-up and more.
That doesn't of course mean that elite sportsmen don't ever cheat, of course some do, but there's nothing in Simon Yates's career progression that suggests anything weird or disproportionate. And even when you do get outliers, Valverde's performances in his late 30s for example, it doesn't necessarily mean he's cheating currently. Elite athletes, almost by definition, have unusual physiologies. It's part of why they are elite athletes. And in the case of GT cyclists, they're operating under prolonged, extreme workloads.
Anyway, to cut a long story short. It's a shame that whenever anyone wins anything, the first question seems to be 'is he or she a doper?'