[Closed] Getting back on the horse... (zwift/fitness/fat loss)

You'll get conflicting advice about the Zwift training programs, so I'll offer none as I'm not qualified to comment 🙂

But... get yourself signed up for the Zwift races Robbo organises. Great motivation.

First of all, good on you.
I think zwift and smart turbos are ruddy brilliant - one of the 'best' (not necessarily most fun, mind) bits of biking kit you can get..!

For workouts, there's a few plans you could follow.
Have a look on the zwift workout plan section, and commit to a plan that lasts 8-12 weeks.

I'm currently doing the build me up workout, but it' might be a bit advanced as your first one..
Once issue with zwift workouts is they somethimes ask for 4-5 workouts a week. Just do the 3 you've planned - no-one will come and arrest you!!

Also..join some of the STW club rides and training workouts for social bants.

DrP

If I have 45m to an hour going spare I either take a complete free ride, join the pace partner in Watopia or use a custom workout…essentially it’s varying intensity inside Z2, broken down into 2 or 3 minute chunks and ridden in ERG mode.

Focus on some cadence drills to keep it interesting.

edit: if it’s a full plan you’re asking about I’d probably start off with a sweetspot base plan (not sure which these are in Zwift). Not convinced they’re sustainable longer term but they’ll get you up and running if your fitness is off?

I found the Dirt Destryoer and Gravel Grinder plans good on Zwift as they did more of the low(er) cadence stuff that suits MTB.

Regardless, thats less important than just committing and doing "something".

Be very wary of just Zwfiting/riding. My biggest fitness gains (that make me a better rider) have by miles been the off the bike stuff, such at that Matt Mooney 12 week MTBFitness program, which I highly reccomend.

227W at 83kg looks pretty good to me for someone worrying about being unfit - its low-sh for a keen cyclist but I bet many of Joe public would of similar stature/weight struggle to hit that.

get yourself signed up for the Zwift races Robbo organises. Great motivation

1000% this. You'll be in the same group as me and a few others with those stats, you've got a few weeks to get your eye in a bit over Christmas and then we start again in January. Its excellent.

I've missed the back half of the last series through injury but almost back to health now and I can't wait.

+1 on the stw race series.
New one starting in the New Year.

There's plenty of workout options but when I did the Zwift 12 week ftp builder a couple of years ago I didn't get on with it & barely improved.

I'd look on whatsonzwift.com at workouts and filter by the kind of think you want to do. Perhaps one threshold and one v02 max per week.
If they aren't specific Zwift workouts you have to download them and stick them on Zwift but that's easy to do.

I've been trying (and failing) to get one long ride in a week as well to help with base fitness and better stamina but it's tough to find the time.

threshold and one v02 max per week

Not knowing where the OP’s fitness is but I wouldn’t be doing this without some decent aerobic conditioning under my belt

Once you know you current FTP, Brad Wiggins' "ultimate warmup" followed by Emily's Short Mix is a decent combo for 46mins riding, maybe twice per week.

Cheers all, will join the zwift club and maybe just maybe a race...

And yeah obviously my fitness is still well above the average 40 year old, but when you're on a lakes 5 day trip covering 90 miles and about 14k ft of climbing, with 2 ebikes, 2 ultra fit retired xc whippets, and a 20-something who can literally ride up anything, you tend to notice the lack of fitness! 😁

The FTP was set via a ramp test so it's possible that it may not be 100% accurate.

18 months ago I was running sub 26 minute 5k and doing 10 or 12k runs without much thought.

The MTB single-track plan (the intermediate one, dirt destroyer?) appeals as that's what I want to build fitness for so may go for that one.

Not used the training plans in Zwift but really rate the Pace Partners and routes. Time goes pretty quickly with them.

I'm in a similar boat to you, riding outdoors has just not really happened for me the second half of this year. I'm similar stats to you too (40, 84kg and FTP of 207) but that's after a decent time on Zwift this autumn and trying to lose weight!

Last year I did the Fondo training plan and the Absa Cape Epic one too, made a big difference. At our level it's more about following structured training rather than specific training for X event or targeting a specific thing. Just having something that you need to do is motivation enough to start with. Having something to aim for is a good idea too, means you can focus on a 'prize'. I'm again going for doing the SDW in a day again, preferably in under 12 hours. I did it back in 2017 and want to do it again, preferably without blowing up on the last 2 hills. I've had that goal for 2 years now but various things have meant I haven't either been fit enough to attempt it or it wasn't practical to do it. Hopefully 2022 will be the year!

But… get yourself signed up for the Zwift races Robbo organises. Great motivation.

That's a given!

I’m also in similar position as haven’t been able to ride much at all last few months and plan to use Zwift over winter to get me back on it.

Checked my profile the other day and my ftp was only c150 which seems low and hoping ramp test will show I’m better than that?

Interested in group rides mentioned here - are they road rides and can anyone point me in right direction?

Also trying to get back on horse after core and body rebelled against too much neglect!

Little and often is my goal, lots of short Z2 rides on rollers and outdoors. Just trying to build volume before hitting turbo in 12 weeks time! (coaches advice).

Also lots of time in the gym, have learned the hard way how important that is as approaching 40...

I guess I don't feel guilty now for not Zwifting by just doing a ride for 30-45 minutes. I don't know where to start with all the training rides.

My average power is like 150W, and I'm 80kg. Is there a suitable STW group for me?

Snap. Moved in Feb ridings just evaporated. Can't seem to find time which is utter bollocks as I've loads...

But think work, house jobs etc just made me break the habit and I'm struggling to get it back

Also lots of time in the gym, have learned the hard way how important that is as approaching 40…

Core strength is another thing I need to work on, really doesn't help that I spend 8+ hrs a day sat at a desk.

For those with seemingly low FTP figures, zwift does calculate them as you ride but unless you've gone really hard on a ride you probably won't have triggered an improved FTP value.

At the end of the ramp test I wasn't sick but I wasn't that far off... The 'proper' FTP test is meant too be harder!

Sounds like there needs to be sub-groups, within the STW Zwift rides.

I'm 86kg, with an FTP of 150, and aged 59. I've never been fast (unless you coun flat out, downhill, with 86kg of 'gravity assist') but feel that I'm really not firing on all cylinders, lately.

Would be good to find a group with a similar pace.

I’m currently doing the Back To Fitness training plan after a similarly crap year fitness wise

It’s 2 workouts per week 30-45 mins each. Each one is quite strenuous but not murderous, it also leaves time to do other things - races, group rides a ride outside whatever.

The thing about workout rides is that you ALL ride together, at a percentage of your FTP... I.e you are all working as hard as each other..relatively....

No one breaks away as you have the 'elastic band' keeping you together...

If I can get the STE club working on my android companion I'll organise arrive group workout rides.....
Things like the unicorn workouts are really good...

DrP

I'm in exactly the same boat. Had a really crap 2020 with lots of time off the bike due to poor mental health so blasted into 2021 with loads of enthusiasm.

Made a point of riding every day regardless for a minimum of 1hr and saw some decent weight loss (86kg -> 80kg) and an FTP boost from 220w -> 270w. Cycled every day until mid May. I followed the "12 week FTP Booster" on Zwift and took part in various group rides and events, no racing, and rode with the pace partners a lot.

I don't ride outdoors, just on Zwift/turbo trainer. I don't have the confidence to ride on the roads round here and there are no local trails for mountain biking or gravel riding.

I then totally knackered my knee (very poor technique) in a sprinters event on Zwift and lost all my enthusiasm. My weight has now gone back up and in my last FTP test (half monty on SYSTM as part of the free trial) I had dropped to 240w. Really struggling with the motivation for it all. Think I've ridden 20 times since May. Lost a lot of sprinting confidence too.

The frustrating thing is I am ACL deficient so need the cycling to maintain the knee joint but so often the phrase in my head is "I can't be ****ing arsed" so I sit on the sofa drinking tea and staring out of the window.

When I first got Zwift, about this time last year and after barely touching my bike for a year, I did a bit of random just riding round and a couple of races, but then did the Beginner FTP Builder. I found it really good; the sessions were varied enough to keep some interest and the fact that each session has to be done in a certain timeframe (i.e. once you've finished one, the next one has to be done in, usually, the next 48/72 hours or it disappears) gave me a little kick up the arse to keep at it regularly. Really made a difference to my fitness too, although my FTP is still a weedy 200ish.

Now, after a summer off Zwift, trying to get back into it again. I've started the Cape Absa thing, and have been doing some group rides. I'd do the STW races but they're at an inconvenient time for me.

Yeah I think I need something in the diary, whether it's an event or a workout session that has to be done by a certain day - or else it's faaaar too easy to have had a busy day at work and just keep on saying 'oh, I'll do the ride tomorrow'...

Think I'll start off with an easy Zwift plan like the back to fitness, mixed in with some STW events/group rides which are NOT going to be easy. 😀

I might be wrong, but I think that when I looked at starting the Back To Fitness plan was reeeally easy, like aimed at people who essentially no fitness beforehand. If you're starting from a base of 'some but not brilliant' fitness, something like the Beginner FTP Builder might be better, and that's why I picked it. I think...

**EDIT** - just realised that your FTP is about the same as mine, at about the same weight, so I think the Back To Fitness will be far too easy if I'm honest.

I've never really got on with the Zwift training plans - as the ones I tried didn't have any rest days. Back to Fitness looks pretty good, as it starts with just 2 per week. But there's still a couple of rather spicy intervals in there - 170% FTP for 20s is going to feel tough if your FTP is way off. I'd make sure this is close enough before starting a plan - spend a week or two doing group rides or routes to make sure that your setup is OK and the fan is strong enough, then do a ramp test or 20 minute FTP test before starting the plan.

Some of the group ride series are fun too - I think there's a Garmin one on at the moment. They're only around for a limited time so it pushes you to ride.

As well as group rides and the training plan, you can also start ticking off the Zwift route badges. Some of the routes (Paris/Yorkshire) are really short so you can choose the route for the time you have available. It gets harder once you've done all the short ones though.. There's a list you can print out here https://zwiftinsider.com/route-ride-schedule/

There’s a list you can print out here

It tracks them in the route selection screen now too! I can get rid of the scrabbly printout from the garage wall now.

Knocked a few shorts ones off on my "easing back in from covid" ride the other day.

A couple of thoughts:

* A plan, even a crap one, is a good idea. Print it out and stick it on the fridge, and cross off the sessions after doing them. It's a simple trick but there's nothing like seeing it in black and white to help motivation.

* Mark birthdays / Christmas / whatever on the plan, those days you're allowed to miss the session. Other days? No excuses 🙂

I have a Zwift set up in my office with a set up time of about 5 minutes so no excuses there,

* That's about 5 minutes too long. Ideally the only set up is to fill your bottle, switch the computer on and hang the towel over the bars.

* If you don't get on with Zwift then Systm also has training plans, and I really enjoy the videos. It's a different way to train, a bit less of a social game and a bit more of a tool to get the job done.

I don’t use Zwift (yet) but I use Trainer Road. If Zwift has similar training plans I’d just input a fictitious target event in for 2 months away and see what it suggests.

I’ve just programmed one starting 4th Jan aiming for an ‘event’ mid March. It’s put in a ramp test on the first day then weeks of sweet spot base workouts. Halfway through there is a week of zone 2 workouts that let things recover a bit, then another ramp test and off on another load of harder workouts before a final week of zone 2 just before the end date.

I think I started last year at 84kgs - a month or 2 of turbo dropped that to 82kgs and then I downloaded the ‘lose it’ app and started eating better - with a calorie deficit. Start to end of the year I only gained maybe 15 watts but I dropped from 84kgs to 75kgs in that time. I’m broadly in the same area - due to illness I’ve gone back up to 76.5kgs ish but I’ll have that off in no time come January back on a stricter diet and turbo training schedule.

I do quite a few weights usually too - so I doubt I’m ever going to make like 70kgs or even close.

Have a split of:

Chest / tri’s

Back / bi’s

Shoulders / core

Legs

I don’t do all those in a week - normally weight training maybe twice a week so just work through them one after the other.

On downhill sections of rough stuff and in terms of short bursts of power up tricky climbs I think the leg workouts have really helped things.

The big lifts like barbell clean and press, deadlift, squats seem to be doing a good job.

I might be wrong, but I think that when I looked at starting the Back To Fitness plan was reeeally easy, like aimed at people who essentially no fitness beforehand. If you’re starting from a base of ‘some but not brilliant’ fitness, something like the Beginner FTP Builder might be better, and that’s why I picked it. I think…

**EDIT** – just realised that your FTP is about the same as mine, at about the same weight, so I think the Back To Fitness will be far too easy if I’m honest.

Yeah it may be - I rode the STW group ride up Alp Du Zwift last night, was slow at 1hr 54 but I did it - also set a 20 min max average power of 212w in the 2hrs (basically the first 20 mins) so with another 1hr 40 riding after that, I think my ramp test FTP of 227 can't be far off. 20 mins at 212 at 95% puts me at 201 ftp for last nights ride, and I wasn't maxxed out in the first 20 mins.

However... whether I'd be able to put out that level for a full hour is another matter!

That’s about 5 minutes too long. Ideally the only set up is to fill your bottle, switch the computer on and hang the towel over the bars.

Haha, that's the best I'm going to get unfortunately, basically it involves rolling up a rug, pushing a sofa back a few ft, laying down the training mat, then moving the bike/trainer into position.

Similar situation, wondering wtf happened to my fitness!! Went for a solo 20 mile gravel ride after 3 months of no riding (albeit I was still running a bit and SUPing in summer). The 20 mile ride was significantly harder than it should have been!

Last week hauled my arse back on the turbo.

Going for TrainerRoad this time. I’ve used both that and Zwift, but when zwifting I just watch the numbers anyway. Few years ago when I was TTing I had good success with TR. The plans are far better than Zwift, but it boring I’d agree. I see it as a tool to get back to fitness.

Speaking of a few years ago.. I looked up my career history in the app. 2017 best 20 min power - 356w and I was around 76/77kg!!

Did the ramp test, 258w at 82 kg now 😫

Older, fatter and weaker. Such is life I suppose

Habit and routine. I’ve been riding enough, but a soft tissue injury means I’ve been resting since last Wednesday.

I feel like I’m already out of routine now and don’t think I’ll be back on until Sunday - already dreading how much I’ll feel like I’ve lost in nearly two weeks. Realise how nuts that sounds but it’s true.

I think habit and routine is everything. When I’ve been off for a long time I just aim to get on the turbo for 30 mins with a 5 min warm up/cool and moderate 20 in the middle - no plan whatsoever. I do that for a couple of weeks and don’t try and kill myself, then go from there.

It’s amazing how quickly it comes back from week three but I don’t try and sicken myself with the numbers at first. I’m not being paid to do it, after all… 🙂

Right then, have enrolled in the dirt destroyer plan, to start tomorrow. This week's weather looks rank so an ideal time to get this started.

Did 40k following one of the pace partners today (D. Deisel, the 1.5 w/kg one) and luckily I checked my FTP before doing the workout plan as somehow it had been set at 385w! There's now way in hell I'm anywhere near that! The 227 on the ramp test is touch too high I think so have set it to 210, hopefully that works out right for the workouts.

I'm doing the dirt destroyer at the mo. My FTP is 260 on Zwift. I found the other training plans pretty hopeless for MTB fitness, but this one is actually okay. Lows of low cadence / high torque stuff. Finding it reasonably tough so defo a good one to help when you're back on the trails.

There's always the "Make it easier" slider in the app. No shame in that if you're not feeling it. Better to get to the end of the workout rather than stop. Once you've quit once, easier to quit again (in my exp).

If it helps, I'm always my lightest at the end of a Zwift winter. Aim for 76kg end March and hit it the last 3. However much I ride in the summer, beer always means I've 2-3kg to loose come November.

Yeah low cadence stuff is something I'm weak at so this should be a good plan.

First workout of dirt destroyer done with my FTP set at 210. Tough, but a 'nice' tough if that exists! Had to dig a bit on the 5 and 3 min @ 95% and 100% FTP but I reckon it's about the right level for me.

2 more workouts on dirt destroyer week 5 to go, so I need to look for a new plan soon before the last week arrives.

The workouts are getting properly hard now, the 'two timer' workout on Wednesday night was brutal!

Thighs have definitely gotten bigger, and I started tracking my calories a week ago, down 0.4kg this week so a good start. Seeing the fitness improvement when riding outside too.

So, any recommendations for a plan to go to next after dirt destroyer? 4-5 workouts a week is nice but a bit longer would be good to get the load up a little. I've been doing the 4 zwift sessions plus an outdoor ride at the moment. I would add a 90/120 min zone 2 ride each week if needed.

I'll do a 20 min FTP test after I've finished with the current plan.

Nice stuff!

I stand by the gains i've gotten from the "Build me up" programme... it's a 12 week course, and at times goes up to 4 (or ? even 5 later on) workouts...

It's a good one

DrP

I'm literally just looking at that one @DrP - seems good with 3 phases and a couple of rest weeks. Wk5 on DD is 372 SP and build me up has 4 weeks above that (peaking at 522!) so should be a worthwhile increase.

Really looking forward to seeing what my FTP will be in a couple of weeks time.

The last two weeks of Dirt Destroyer are brutal 😉 I was so glad to finish it. I actually didn't do the very last one as my legs were toast from the night before.

I've done build me up as well. It's a fair old commitment but it does what it says on the tin.

Nice....
Give it a go.
And...don't beat yourself up if you can't do ALL the workouts every week! I certainly couldn't!

I'm going to restart it again teh week after next... my FTP went from 277 to 312, so will restart at the higher level.. I know it's going to be HARD GOING later on, but will see if I can hold onto the horns and ride it out!

DrP

I'm reading pretty much all good things about Build Me Up, apart from the big ramp up in the last few weeks 😁

6 bombs to drop done, last workout of week 5 tomorrow. Felt quite pleasant actually, and spinning along at 85-90 rpm @ 230w for 2.5 mins at a time was pretty comfortable, should bode well for the FTP test, I should be able to increase from 210w by a decent bit.

And I've increased my VO2 max according to my Garmin, that's a 3 point increase since starting the plan, 47 to 50.

Luvvley! 😁

+1 don't think much about skipping a session, the plans get quite intense, especially of you are doing rides irl too.

What happens if you do be skip a ride, does it just mark it as not completed for that week and then it carries on with the next week?

Nuffin' happens... you carry on.. choose the ones you want to do... it just doesn't get a tick!

When are you thinking of doing the build me up programme?

I might make a new thread here seeing if there's a bunch of people interested in starting on FEB 7TH 2022....

you up for that?
We could chat about the pain...challenges...and do group workouts too!

DrP

That sounds a great idea, Feb 7th would mean I'd be going straight from dirt destroyer into build me up, but it looks like the first week has a couple of very basic sessions which aren't needed, so I'll be able to fit in an FTP test with a couple of days rest 👍

Count me in!

Fab... you'll have to sign up NEXT week..as otherwise it'll start you on Monday!

It'll be good to do some group workouts for it too! A sin..everyone working out together!

DrP

Yeah I'll complete the 4x dirt destroyer sessions next week and then enroll in build me up, as I'm guessing any new plan you enroll into replaces the current one?

Fab… you’ll have to sign up NEXT week..as otherwise it’ll start you on Monday!

I'd be up for that. Off for a big MTB trip in 12 weeks so would be perfect.

1 down, 3 to go in the last week of dirt destroyer.

Max o'clock was today's workout, and my that was good fun!! 30s high power intervals, at 140% FTP, then 20s at 160% and 10s at 170%.

After the first block I upped the bias to 110% as it was a bit too easy going hitting 295w for 30s 8x in a row with 30s rests, meant I was hitting 395w for 10s in the last block, really enjoyed that!!

And apparently, according to my Garmin (probably due to the day and a half rest) I'm now 'peaking' for the first time ever.

I'm very confident of a decent FTP increase from my 210w at the start.