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So my plan to get a Marino custom frame isn’t working out too well right now. Ordered at the start of July and I still don’t even have a 1st draft frame plan yet. Keep promising they’ll get to it and then radio silence and no timescales.
So I’ve been investigating other options - emailed several Chinese to companies to get quotes (Waltly Ti had a very detailed form to fill in and send back) and zip back from them either. Guess Covid maybe the issue although most of China is said to be up and running ok.
I’ve spoken with Curtis as an alternative and I’m on the verge of ordering an AM7 from them but the cost is a LOT more even with blingy candy paint with a layer of spectraflare on the Marino. Obvs the Curtis is 853 and beautifully braided rather than welded and all done in the U.K.
Just mulling a few cheaper options over and aside from Stanton (switchback is closer to what I’m after than the Slackline and the fancy steel version of that is 631 and not actually much cheaper than the Curtis) I’m looking at the Ribble Hardtail.
https://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/ribble-ht-725/
I wanted a 445mm reach / 395mm seat tube / 65.5 degree headangle / 125mm headtube / 45mm bb drop / 425mm chainstays and ideally some internal cable routing. This with a 140mm Pike ultimate.
The small Ribble has a 338mm reach and a 64 degree headangle (medium is too long and would get even longer with a shorter fork) - if I stuck an angleset in to steepen the headangle - it’s a straight 44mm headtube) and then ran a shorter fork than it was designed for am I going to get close to 445mm reach and a 65.5 degree headangle?
Chainstays are still a touch longer than I wanted but I’d have a short seat tube for a long dropper and internal cable routing (Curtis would all be external).
Clearly this is a much cheaper option but I like the grey frame colour with the shiny decals on the Ribble.
You can’t consider reach without stack height too. The Ribble head tubes are shorter than your hypothetical design so if you’re using the same headsets that’ll shorten the reach by 11mm on the small with your bars at your preferred height.
Ah, the headtube is 20mm shorter on the small Ribble - although the external lower cup presumably slightly lengthens that compared to a tapered one where the power bearing is in the headtube?
Stack on the Ribble is showing as 599mm with the 150mm fork. My design on bike cad is showing a stack of 590mm with a 140mm fork (a2c 524mm).
I like high bars so I guess with loads of spacers under the stem that effectively shortens the stem (and reach)?
Short HT means longer reach, rather than shorter?
That’s what I thought - but I think there’s more to it than that possibly. Trying to get my head round it!
The Ribble isn’t ideal but the wallet is trying not to open quite as far as a Curtis right now!
Thought about the following steel hardtail and ruled them out either for geo / material / being a 29er when I’ve just built some nice 650b wheels:
Bfe
P7
Both Stantons
Genesis Tarn
Signal Steel
18 bikes (hate the image and logos)
As someone with short legs who needs a 15.5" seat tube to run a maximum 120mm dropper I think you'll struggle to find a frame with a 395mm seat tube & 445mm reach without going custom.
* happy to be proven wrong though.
What wheel size?
650b wheel size.
My full suss has a 395mm seat tube and comfortably fits in a 180mm dropper - at a push I might fit a 210mm in it. Reach is 457mm.
Looking for shorter reach on the ht but the seat tube could be a little longer and still fit in a 180mm dropper.
I’m 5’9 with a 32”
Inner leg but short arms.
PS: if your prepared to open your wallet to go UK custom and are in Bristol your within easy reach of a face to face with builder Ted James to discuss your needs.
I don’t really want to spend more than I have to - how would I even find the details of Ted James - failing to find a website or fb page?
How big a bike is is really the diagonal between the BB and the top centre of the headtube - in other words the hypotenuse of reach and stack.
If you’ve got a long headtube then you’ll need fewer stem spacers and less bar rise, which means your effective reach will be longer. And the long head tube moves the lower cup further forwards which pushes the front wheel out.
Hopefully you’re comparing sagged geometry when referencing to your full-sus, or your hardtail will be longer and steeper than you want!
I hope your bike design is better than your googling.
https://www.tedjamesdesign.com/
If you need any specific dimensions off the Ribble, I can send my lad in with a tape measure and angle gauge (he does weekend customer services stuff).
Hopefully you’re comparing sagged geometry when referencing to your full-sus, or your hardtail will be longer and steeper than you want!
The 457 on my full suss is sagged. The 445mm I’m thinking of on the hardtail is static. I’ve got to this figure from my previous hardtail having 432 static and wanting to go a little bit longer but with a shorter stem. It had a static 66 degree headangle and I liked how lively and poppy it is.
If you need any specific dimensions off the Ribble, I can send my lad in with a tape measure and angle gauge (he does weekend customer services stuff).
Thanks for the offer - I think everything I’d need is on the geo chart probably.
Emailed Ted but my suspicion is he’s going to be more expensive than Curtis....
If you put a shorter fork on a small ragley blue pig, it wouldn't be a million miles off what you want. The medium would have a 25mm longer seattube but longer reach than you want. They quote their geometry unsagged. They even quote the A-C. If you plug their numbers into https://bikegeo.muha.cc/ e.g. you could play with fork length and see the effect.
There's a couple of places in the states (Waltworks is one) that do custom work. No idea of cost though.
Have you tried Luke at Marino UK? Mine was all sorted from first email to being ridden within about 5 weeks.
edit- it may be that they're making frames that have already been finalised with deposits paid from agents rather than direct.
Could be that I guess - they haven’t actually asked me for a deposit yet. Apparently they take a deposit once the frame design is finalised - which they’ve made no progress on yet.
I’ll try Luke on Tuesday and see what he says.
You ordered custom geometry I think?
I thought Marino UK was effectively off the shelf not custom.
From what I understand demand has gone up for Marino but he is still only a small operation. I waited maybe a month and a half for him to start building my frame but it happens pretty quickly once it's started. I think you only get the geometry sorted etc once you're next in the queue.
Yes, custom geo, 26".
I thought Marino UK was effectively off the shelf not custom.
And yet here I am, going out for a ride later today on my custom frame ordered through Marino UK 😉 (that's a 'wink' emoji in case you can't see it in your browser 😉 )
There are links on page 2 of their products page with the custom hardtail and FS options. I should point out I have nothing at all to do with them, I was just chuffed with the service I got and the frame I ended up with-
[img] 
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If you go through Marino UK I would still assume you go to the back of the queue for custom frames so doesn't really make much difference
If you go through Marino UK I would still assume you go to the back of the queue for custom frames so doesn’t really make much difference
Im going to say this possibly isn’t the case as it sounds like Kayla ordered after me (but he went U.K. and I ordered direct) and he already has his frame delivered I believe - mine isn’t even on the drawing board yet.
Sent Luke a message on Facebook messenger and he’s got straight onto it (Replying on a Sunday which was unexpected). Just a bit of communication goes a long way. See what happens this week I guess! Would prefer to save £400-£500 on the frame really as that means the bike gets a better fork and probably fancier cranks (want a Pike Ultimate and ideally dub X01 Carbon cranks)
The thing with Curtis is they are are expensive, but when you have it in your hands you will be pleased you spent the money in one.
I’d love the Curtis frame and it would be better - but it might come at the expense of either the Carbon cranks or The quality of Pike I get (select vs ultimate). I think I’d benefit more from a better damper in the fork than a slightly better tubeset. But I’m going to see what occurs this next week - the Curtis would be beautifully made clearly.
Try 'she' instead of 'he' next time, eh? 🤣
Sorry, my bad!
Chinese Titanium- avoid!
Used to have one of those Setavento(?) Custom titanium frames, where you gave them your measurments and they took em to China then brought your custom frame home, or so the story goes.
Now I had a Rock Lobster Ti for 12 years, absolutely hammered it, drove it at great speed into a tree on Afan ZigZags,did thousands and thousands of miles on it,looked like new when I eventually sold it.
That Setavento broke into two at the seat stays dropping off a dropped kerb whilst riding home from work.
Now maybe the Rock Lobster was Chinese, it was certainly value for money, so maybe not all Chinese Ti is the same, but I would avoid a custom frame again.
If you are still considering Waltly, then it may be worth your while ignoring the form and emailing direct to amy@waltlyti.com
Her comms with me on three frames have always been prompt. Usually next day, maybe two when they are really busy.
I've had three frames done by them now, and love them. I am not a designer and have no access to CAD, but I know what I'm after in a bike.
This is my initial email for my most recent frame -
29er
Fork will be 490mm with 55mm offset
46mm PF30 BB, 73mm wide. Drop 65mm.
Seat tube angle 75.5, 480mm long, for 31.6 seatpost
Head tube 44/56, 180mm long. Head tube angle 69 degrees.
Reach 500mm
Sliding dropouts. Chainstay length 450mm with slider in central position
Chainring clearance 36T at 55mm chainline. (Rohloff)
With the sliding dropouts you use, is it possible to have inserts for 135 QR, and 148x12 Boost on the same frame? Or would it only work with 135 and 142x12?
I'd also like some rack mounts added to the seatstays, the hourglass bolt through type as pictured in the attachment. Can you supply this type?
She will come back with questions about cable routing and tyre clearances, then the designer will send out a drawing. You can then tweak cable routing, mounts etc.
Thanks Bedmaker - if I’d had her email address a week or 2 ago I’d have tried that route. Marino U.K. are now all over this and nearly at the stage where the bike design is finalised - within a day of contacting them via messenger.
This was my bike cad attempt:
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This is the one Marino are going to work with:
[url= https://i.postimg.cc/PNs4s0bV/97-EE8862-9-DAC-421-C-9-E6-D-0-F5839346293.pn g" target="_blank">https://i.postimg.cc/PNs4s0bV/97-EE8862-9-DAC-421-C-9-E6-D-0-F5839346293.pn g"/> [/img][/url]
This is the approximate looks I’m going for:
[url= https://i.postimg.cc/HsyZZ90P/808-C1-E50-41-ED-4354-ADA4-E26956-C3-AC23.jp g" target="_blank">https://i.postimg.cc/HsyZZ90P/808-C1-E50-41-ED-4354-ADA4-E26956-C3-AC23.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
Try Bike Mielec.
Similar price-point to Marino but aluminium and Polish.
His English isn't great so best bet is to get a Polish pal to translate for you.
Some scary looking stuff on there.
Try Bike Mielec.
Similar price-point to Marino but aluminium and Polish.
His English isn’t great so best bet is to get a Polish pal to translate for you.
Marino U.K. have been so efficient since I contacted them yesterday my final frame design is now in and I’ve paid the initial deposit now. Excited for it - even designed myself a custom head badge (albeit just drawn in pencil on a notepad in 5 mins - going to try and render it a bit better on the computer tomorrow) and picked paint already.
That aluminium bike frame maker above wouldn’t have worked for me as I wanted steel or possibly Ti (if the budget would stretch - Waltly would have been do-able if they’d replied). Also, none of the mtb’s really look very good - most look quite clunky to me.
The Ted James 853 Trail looks lovely!