[Closed] Frame damage - told the frame needs binning/replacing

Looks like it needs some touch up paint

I think it needs replaced. If you went to rent that bike, would you accept it as is?

I'd expect/hope it to be painted, but not fussed about marks & scuffs on a hire bike.

if it were mine I would paint it.  If I had to hire it out to someone else I might think differently

Been asked to cough up just under £1,000 for it 😭

I’d expect/hope it to be painted, but not fussed about marks & scuffs on a hire bike.

In which case you'd be in the minority of bike hire customers. Especially roadies.

Thats really looks like paint damage only, someone's taking the piss with you

Do companies who hire bikes not have insurance to cover damage whilst they're out on hire?

If not, then they should have!

Do companies who hire bikes not have insurance to cover damage whilst they’re out on hire?

Just like car hire?

Scotroutes, that could be it, I don't ever usually ride road bikes. It's not like it was a new shiny bike, but appreciate it needs sorting out, I just thought a brand new frame was OTT when is was just the paint damaged.

I could have just bought one rather than hire it 😂

Is this your bike, your bike that you hire out or a bike that you hired and damaged when you had it?

No insurance? Unlucky.

Yeah car hire ropes you in buying insurance you don’t need but then that just covers excess.

Looks like a knock and not even primer left.

Would you hire it?

Ask for an opinion and quote from a company that repairs carbon frames, agree to pay the cost of that if the opinion is bin it, they pay if the opinion is repair it, but you will pay for the repair costs.

Anyways, look at the contract - unless it says you are liable to replace with new, you should only pay the value of the (secondhand and well used) frame, not replacement as new.

Plenty to negotiate about here.

Its hard to tell, but that looks like impact damage to the paint and not a rub.

So with enough impact to damage the paint locally, i wouldnt hire that carbon bike.

Tbh I would hire it still (and appreciate I wouldn't have to be too careful with it myself) but then I also appreciate others have higher standards than me too.

I will look for some repair businesses and scrutinise their hire terms. Thanks

Paint & lacquer - that’s all. Purely cosmetic. I very much doubt the carbon is compromised. I’ve got/had dink’s like that on carbon before & lived.

Lots of folk happy to be magnanimous with someone else's property and liability.

to be fair there could be delamination there as that has been caused by a knock.

Was the rear wheel against the side by any chance? Looks like it could just be cassette teeth or something which I doubt would cause any problems.

As Mr L says. Cosmetic only. Nip to Superdrug and get some nail polish.

Oh, and I'm a windsurfer. We use highly stressed 100% carbon masts and clamp them up till you hear the cracking noise. And then they get battered in the shorebreak. And last for years and years. No damage to that top tube.

Definitely new damage is it?

paint chips plus gel coat .
trip to Halfords for a touch up pen will fix that .
Think you might be being taken for a lttle ride . If you do get forced to pay try and get the frame , as there is basically nothinh but cosmetic damage on it.

Anyways, look at the contract – unless it says you are liable to replace with new, you should only pay the value of the (secondhand and well used) frame, not replacement as new.

Dunno about that. Our hire contracts (not bikes) say if the equipment is damaged then the client is liable for the repair or replacement cost, and the hire cost until it's fixed. So if you hire something for a week, and drop it on day one, and it takes a month to get the replacement then you pay a weeks hire + months hire (because you have effectively got two items for that week) + the value of the kit.

So I can imagine the hire company is thinking ~£1k for a new frame is a lot cheaper than charging the OP for the repair cost, workshop rate to strip and rebuild it, shipping etc and the hire charge whilst it's there.

If you pay for it I would be sure to ask for the damaged one for yourself

Been asked to cough up just under £1,000 for it

Seems to be fairly typical for a rental road bike unfortunately :(.  Some folks seem to offer their own insurance to cover it, others don't.  Damaging the frame is unfortunate really, it couldn't be worse apart from being stolen

The bike hire company may well rely on the sales of ex-hire bikes too and damage like that will affect the resale value.

Flesh wound, I've hammered carbon frames with far more wear!

If it were a result of damage from an impact, I’d say just paint and lacquer, but as it was caused by rubbing, I’d say it was difficult to say for certain that the matrix isn’t damaged on the outer ply(s).

If it were my bike, and it came back like that, i’d Be taking it to the NCC for inspection. Only after CT would I ride it again.

If it is ruined then I would expect to pay cost price for the frame and a bit of labour for the rebuild.
If it is just the paint then I would expect to pay for the repair/touch up and maybe a small amount against the potential loss in the re-sale value.

you say in transit - expand on this stage. who organised it?

Flesh wound, I’ve hammered carbon frames with far more wear!

Was this damage to your bikes sustained by someone else using it and returning it with these flesh wounds

I too have carbon frames with similar damage how ever I caused it in crashes -not a hiree returning it damaged.

It does make a difference

It looks perfectly safe, but also, not surprised they want it replaced. Can you not keep the damaged frame once you’ve paid for a new one?

Email someone like target composites

If a shop had done similar damage to one of your bikes whilst in their care I doubt any of you would be happy with them telling you a bit of touch up paint would be fine.

Can't you buy full bike from them and either keep it or have it repaired and sell on. Better than coughing up a bag of sand for no return if that's the case !

If a shop had done similar damage to one of your bikes whilst in their care I doubt any of you would be happy with them telling you a bit of touch up paint would be fine.

That's the top and bottom of it really. Whilst it may well be safe, the shop are IMO 100% right to ask for full cost of replacing. If they were nice, they could do the repair place thing, but why should they, someone damaged their bike and now they can't hire it out again. It's that simple.

I agree it's a bit harsh and over-cautious potentially... but 100% correct still.

You shouldn't be acting as new for old insurance for the hire company.

If you end up paying it should be a discounted rate reflecting age and condition pre damage. I would also expect to get the frame.

Tbf would you be happy if a new bike arrived like that and the shop just said ah its nowt just touch it up

It's a couple of stone chips to the paint ffs. Tell them to get an opinion from the manufacturer and see what they say. They will know what tests to carry out to show whether it's safe or not.

Looks like nothing to me and you are being scammed.

What ever happens if you do end up paying make sure you get the paint chipped frame and tell them not to bin it or it will end up as a free frame for some one who works there.

Harsh, but if it is in the hire contract I’d just suck it up and see if you could keep the frame. I’ve never owned a carbon bike and don’t know much about the material, but if they (potentially) damage that easily I’m never going to. It seems like one bad OTB on a carbon MTB and you’d need a new bike 😱

See that white sticker that looks a bit rubbed? I’d be adding a bigger one. If you hired it, what does the agreement say? No way is that frame a write off. Couple of blood of touch up, which they ought to have if they have a fleet of hire bikes anyway, and good as new.

100% if you are paying to replace it you get the old one.
Or, as mentioned above, someone in the shop is getting a brand new frame for free, as that one will be touched up and hired out again.

@spooners

Dunno about that. Our hire contracts (not bikes) say if the equipment is damaged then the client is liable for the repair or replacement cost, and the hire cost until it’s fixed. So if you hire something for a week, and drop it on day one, and it takes a month to get the replacement then you pay a weeks hire + months hire (because you have effectively got two items for that week) + the value of the kit.

So I can imagine the hire company is thinking ~£1k for a new frame is a lot cheaper than charging the OP for the repair cost, workshop rate to strip and rebuild it, shipping etc and the hire charge whilst it’s there.

This is my point, your lot clearly had the wisdom to deal with this issue in the T&Cs. If those are silent, then basic legal principles apply. If there is labour cost and downtime involved, then that would need to be proved (were they operating at full capacity?) and claimed on top of the cost of repairing/replacing the frame. And the latter would take account of the actual value of the frame written off (if it was). Plus, if that frame is repairable, it can be repaired without stripping and rebuilding I would think.

I would certainly be paying if I damaged a hire bike. Although the question of whether it requires a new frame replacement is obviously up for debate. Was the frame brand new? - if not then it's not a new frame replacement. If the shop wants a new frame then I'd be asking for a video of them sawing up the damaged frame at the exact point of damage (to make sure they are destroying that specific frame). Personally I'd ask for an independent frame repairer to look at it before agreeing what needs to be paid.

Unless damage is covered in the rental agreement then I think it's fair enough that they ask for it to be replaced. That said unless they gave you a brand new bike, that price should reflect the value of the frame you collected not a brand new one.

I trashed road frame by dropping it and the replacement cost of the frame was nowhere near full retail price as the dealer usually gets a substantial discount from the manufacture for crash replacements. It was in the region of 70% of the retail price.

Looks cosmetic, probably fifty quid max to touch up and polish? As others say, an independent assessment of the damage and repair cost would be helpful. Maybe they're just chancers and seeing if you're a mug?

I'd expect a hire bike to have some wear and touched up areas or even the odd chip. I would not be surprised if they rehired that frame without any issue. If they're operating a 'you broke it then you bought it policy' then they should be sending you the damaged one.

However, if you have unwittingly contracted to pay for a new frame you may be a good distance up shit creek with only your hands as paddles. On the other hand, even a small claims court action is a lot of work and there's probably a much more reasonable settlement to be made to avoid that.

What does the contract say?