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I have a nice flat ten mile commute, mix of tarmac and gravel. I've used my cotic roadrat for the past six years and it has been great. My only issue is that the front end has always been harsh, I have pins through my left scaphoid and I get numb fingers on the commute on that hand but never on the mtb. I've tried foam grips, maybe I could get some flexier bars and bar ends to vary the position? I don't want to go bigger than the 32mm tyres I have due to the amount of tarmac. I've found myself looking at new bikes recently but seems daft and a bit wasteful for what the problem is. Any ideas/recommendations?
Why not go bigger on tyres? I (occasionally) have a 30 mile commute and I've done it on anything from 23mm to 50mm tyres; they all roll just fine. That said, if you're looking to reduce numbness in your hands then a good supple carcass can be as much a factor as width.
These days, though, I find I get quite a bit of numbness, soreness and nerve issues with flat bars but I'm pretty much fine with drops (mostly riding on the hoods, but not always). Maybe worth considering those if you can raise the stem a bit or get a higher-rise one.
If you don't want to take that route, you could maybe try rotating your bars slightly to see whether a change in wrist position eases the symptoms.
Or Tranz-X make an affordable (~£50) flexible stem. Might be worth a punt.
Before splashing too much why not try a pair of Ergon GS1, 2 or 3s? If they don’t work out sell them on they tend to keep their price used. This way you may only invest £10-£15 overall after (say) a month’s trial. Keep the packaging.
I recently bought a touring bike that came with straight 650mm carbon bars and Ergon GS1 grips. Found the combo to be immediately very comfortable with numbness after 5 miles or so. The numbness went after adjusting the grips minutely. Turned out to be a great find. Ended up also trialling it with loop bars, cork tape on the loop, Ergon GC1 grips. Again, very comfortable once setup well but miss the bar-ends grips tbh. Thinking of one day investing in some GS3 for another trial. Either way, try some with bar-ends.
Other option is a trekking bar with some ESI silicone grips.
I’d try either some flexier carbon bars or spank vibrocore that some people recommend.
On One used to sell the Knuckleball bars in Chewy which I’ve found have helped but I’m not sure if they still do?
+1 also look at yr tyres and pressures
Higher sweep bars. On One Mary or Fleegle as a cheap starting point. Change of hand position makes a massive difference. Couple with Ergon grips for supreme comfort.
100% tyre pressure.
What are you running?
To expand on the above this is an excellent guide and really helped me to reduce the buzzing in my hands post ride.
My ultimate solution was to buy a Whyte Glencoe with 47c tyres, it's a dream and still quick enough.
What foam grips did you try, the ESI ones are quite different to others imo. Ergon grips are also good, and unlike the ESI's I've found that the generic/copy ones work just as well. You'd definitely benefit from grips and tyre choice over bars imo.
I use Ergon grips with those little stubbby bar ends integrated into them.
Sorted any numb palms/hands for me. Plus the bar end things have save my little fingers from the occasional bump into something.
Could the saddle be tilted too far forwards, or bars too low?
I would entertain the idea of drops. The variety of hand positions can be really helpful for numb hands.
Thanks for all the replies, loads of good ideas
Tyre pressures wise I set them higher than that chart and article, they are the lowest I can go without tyre hitting rim through one bumpy gravel corner on my route! I'll try a little lower and a slower line choice.
My grips are esi, I've always thought the ergons looked awful but like the integrated bar ends. Can anyone recommend copies as they're a lot cheaper? To be fair they're a lot cheaper than a new bike so will give some a go. If they nearly get there what carbon bars are the flexiest?
I had drops before the roadrat and overall preferred them but wanted hydraulic discs and six years ago that didn't work with drop bars. Now there are lots of nice options but it seems a bit extravagant for a shortish commute.
Something else worth adding in to the mix from the suggestions above is your shoulder position... I'm not a fan of drops myself for this kind of riding and use flat bars with stubby ends on my winter commuter, my main road bike and also on the tandem. However, before making a drastic change I'd cover those easier changes first. I get hand buzz, some numbness during rides and white finger afterwards quite frequently but have found that for me, it's mostly associated with the relative position of shoulders, elbows & hands. I have variations in bar height and layout across the different bikes but each has been the result of trial and error. Mine is a nerve pressure problem, as a small shift in shoulder position can usually make it disappear almost instantly.
Don't write off the Ergons on looks, I got some for my missus and they are great, I'll be getting some for my commuter.
Incidentally, I do 7.5 miles on a Kona Dew, I don't think 10 would be a big difference. The step from my old Aether to that was night and day in terms of comfort and the commute time didn't really change. Flat road bikes are nice as a fashion statement but we have it all wrong in this country in terms of the right tool for the job.
Ergon gp3s ordered! Will update, hopefully later this week.
I'm currently running Easton EC90 flat carbon bars and ESI grips on the skinny tyre beast and have replaced the super flexy chinese carbon bar that broke on my commute trail bike with a Slecof carbon bar from the usual suspects.
With ESI grips it also seems spot on with just enough flex. It is a wide bar though.
https://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/HBSECFFH/selcof-carbon-flat-handlebar
So carbon and ESI works for me. If I even do get sore hands it is always on the BMC with its low bar. Maybe try a riser bar to try to get some weight back a bit?
Switching to On One Mary bars completely eliminated my hand numbness issues on my commuter.
Lol, according to that graph I should be running about 210psi in my road bike tyres! Don't think that's right somehow.
I’ve gradually adapted my Roadrat(s) since 2010 to cope with changing use and also to improve comfort. Main things I’d suggest:
Grips: funnily enough GP3’s were recommended to me, but I use old-skool barends and wasn’t keen to lose them (I know there are other more normal Ergons without the barendy bit). I’ve used nothing but ESI Extra Chunky over the past few years and think they’ve helped greatly.
Tyres: wider tyres can still be fast-rolling. I’m at the other end of the scale in using 47c front tyre (CX Comp or Spesh Trigger Sport depending on season) and difference between those and the 35c Schwalbe’s on my wife’s Roadrat is remarkable. Can’t run 47c with full length guards on a standard Roadhog fork though which brings me on to…
Fork: eXotic carbon monocoque on mine (had their normal carbon-legged, alloy-crowned fork on previous Roadrat which was flattened by a car…). Definite improvement over the standard steel fork. I use the 26” model with 425 a-c so has raised front end a little compared to the standard 400mm a-c fork.
Bars: I’ve resisted carbon so far but even the megalight FSA alloy bar I use must give an improvement over the standard heavy Cotic-branded bar.
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a Slecof carbon bar from the usual suspects.
With ESI grips it also seems spot on with just enough flex. It is a wide bar though.
https://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/HBSECFFH/selcof-carbon-flat-handlebar
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Dammit, why did I click that link?! My only worry would be losing some of the carbon 'flex' if I cut them down to the 670mm I've settled on.
Is your saddle fore-aft position correct? Could it be leading you to put too much weight on your hands?
Lol, according to that graph I should be running about 210psi in my road bike tyres! Don’t think that’s right somehow.
I initially thought the same, then noticed the horizontal axis was per-wheel weight*, not total weight 😉
* which makes sense because typically a rear wheel will see more (static, at least) load than a front
*erratum: Ergon GP1, 2, 3, don’t know why I wrote GS sorry.
Good luck with the GP3s. I found the best way to adjust/rotate for palm-fit (as well as following instructions in the box) was to fit and then go somewhere safe (garden, quiet off-road path etc) and then undo the clamp ‘just’ enough so they can move/be rotated more naturally into place as you began riding*, but not loose enough to swivel when you removed your hands. Should only take 3-4 metres of riding for them to settle in the ‘right’ position. Once happy then carefully brake and dismount (being careful not to move them from this optimal position) and re-tighten the clamp to lock them in place, first making sure they are fully on the bar. Once tightened properly then fit the end-plugs.
*Disclaimer - This advice could end in death, even fiery expiration etc
Cheers, good advice on the gp3s and I'll definitely try lower pressures.
I don't want to go higher on the bars as its bad enough into headwinds as it is, wider tyres will mean new mudguards and once I've managed to work out how to spend a couple of hundred I'll use man maths to instead buy an escapade on cyclescheme, in mercury with orange bits, not that I've thought about it. Or a Vernon Barker so I get custom fit and a handmade in derbyshire headtube sticker, although maybe something in titanium would be nice.... I hope these grips work.
100 percent tire pressure
well i guess it will mask a poor position and weak core yes your right.... but if it was all in the tire pressure then those of us that do would be crippled from running 95psi in 32c tires.
Get the position right get the core strong and you wont be colapsing on to your hands for them to go numb.
bigger tyres, swoopy handlebars. with the grips you've ordered or ESIs. Look at the On One OG bar as well as the others recommended.
Bigger tyres needn't be slower on road, and might even be quicker overall. You'll have more grip and control on the gravel, at higher speeds.
Schwalbe Marathon Supreme get good reviews, and post some of the lowest (best!) scores in rolling resistance tests.
I don’t want to go higher on the bars as its bad enough into headwinds as it is
You don't need to. Fleegles are flat, just high sweep. Or, if you fit one with a rise, you could lower or flip your stem and still get the benefits of sweep.
Get the position right get the core strong and you wont be colapsing on to your hands for them to go numb.
Couldn't agree more. The classic test is to see if you can support yourself with your hands clasped behind your back.
If position is not right, changing bars, grips and tyres is a fool's errand.
If position is not right, changing bars, grips and tyres is a fool’s errand.
Changing bars IS changing the position, if you choose a different shape.
I'm pretty scrawny but don't think its my core as I've been using a trx twice a week for the last year which has fixed my lower back but made no difference to numb left hand on the commute.
I'll see how the grips go and try the bars if still suffering. The bb to bar distance is more or less the same between my mtb and commuter so think my saddle is in the right place. Sure the bars are slightly lower but the mtb is hard work into the wind!
Thanks for the advice, I don't want to look like I'm ignoring it, I just want to try one thing at a time.
Higher rise stem & Mary Bars here.
Looks truly, truly ghastly, but very comfy.
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I have used the same set up as takisawa2 and it is indeed very comfy.
So basically what you're saying is that if you want to be comfy you need the right bike for the job. Which in this case is a city bike.
Is there an echo in here? 😉
I fitted the grips and rode in this morning, as per normal lock on grips they took seconds to fit. They don't have the initial soft feel of foam and it feels odd to weight your whole palm so I was unsure as I set off. I had also dropped the pressure in the front tyre.
I was surprised how much I used the bar ends. The front felt like I was going to roll the tyre on the tarmac corners. Obviously comfier though if still a bit harsh feeling. I think the shape of the grips rotates your hands very slightly giving a touch more effective sweep.
Big thing is no numb left hand, well maybe a slight numbness but nothing like before. So thanks for the help all, I might get the carbon bar recommended above to try but think this is enough to stop me buying a new bike.
While a city bike looks good for popping to the shops isn't the aero awful? I'm know I'm not quick but I still average 16mph on my commute and can't see how a city bike wouldn't be significantly slower?
While a city bike looks good for popping to the shops isn’t the aero awful? I’m know I’m not quick but I still average 16mph on my commute and can’t see how a city bike wouldn’t be significantly slower?
Just gone from a cx bike to a flat barred commuter, same tyres, no slower. 15.2mph average this morning with a bit of a headwind lots of the way, and I certainly ain't quick. 🙂
Replacing the supplied alloy fork, alloy bars and grips made my Wazoo much more comfy when using the 29er wheels with 27-40mm tyres, but I could still notice the improvement with 2.35" and even using the fat 26" wheels with 4" Jumbo Jims.
The steerer on the alloy forks was quite low and upset my weak lower back after 30mins or so when I first got the bike, but swapping the 80mm 6 degree stem for a 100mm 35 degree stem raised the bars by ~5cm really helped.
The replacement forks had a longer steerer, plus my back is stronger than it was, so I've been using a 110mm 8 degree stem with just a 5mm spacer under the top cap for a while now. This really helped make the front end feel far more stable on steepish, sweeping corner descents.
The added bonus was that the On One Fatty Carbon forks, On One "chewy" Knuckleballs and Half Bob Foam Grips also reduced the bike weight by over 1Kg.