[Closed] First Road Bike - Help Narrowing Down

i have a 54cm Litespeed alloy/carbon frame/fork that cost a grand new, that i'm going to be moving on shortly as i may have purchased an S-works in the not so distant future. but it will be cheap (circa £200)

Sounds nice mate, but definitely want to go new this time. Dont think you'll have trouble selling that at that price.

Just buy the Giant TCR or Defy, I can guarantee you will not regret it, end of thread.....

tragically1969 - Member
Just buy the Giant TCR, I can guarantee you will not regret it, end of thread.....

which one? TCR, TCR Composite 0,1 2,3, TCR Advanced?

Whichever one is in your budget !!

I ride a TCR Advanced 1, have had Giant for years now, they all have sorted geometry, good components and ride really nice.

At the end of the day you have to be happy riding what you buy, but the Giant has had more than enough recommendations on this thread now.

From personal experience of many years as a mountain biker, and being anti road riding for a long time (basically cos I could never get on with being really hunched over even when on the drops), I bought a Defy earlier this year.

Absolutely love it. If its a first road bike, I'd probably go for the slightly more relaxed geometry (it's not just a taller head tube, it's slightly longer and slacker too) as it is less of a shock and you'll probably enjoy it more initially as a result.

As for which model, well mine was only a Defy 2, at £700 (inc £125 off) with Tiagra but it's still more bike than I need. Get a carbon one by all means, if you have the readies, but the alloy version is just brilliant too!

At the end of the day you have to be happy riding what you buy, but the Giant has had more than enough recommendations on this thread now.

it's slightly longer and slacker too) as it is less of a shock and you'll probably enjoy it more initially as a result.

If i were you i would go Defy with Ultegra for a first bike, the 2012 stuff is really nice, the frame is the most important thing to consider but so are wheels and groupset, tiara is a bit low in the range. The TCR Advanced is a lot stiffer ride but still fairly compliant, its more of a race frame but thats all i have ever ridded so am used to that sort of feel.

tragically1969 - Member
If i were you i would go Defy with Ultegra for a first bike, the 2012 stuff is really nice, the frame is the most important thing to consider but so are wheels and groupset, tiara is a bit low in the range. The TCR Advanced is a lot stiffer ride but still fairly compliant, its more of a race frame but thats all i have ever ridded so am used to that sort of feel.

what is the sizing like on the Defy ? say for a 5ft 10 height ?

from Giant Website 5'10 is at the top range of Medium and bottom of Medium/Large.

I am 5'11" at a push and ride a M/L TCR with a 12cm stem and its perfect, the M comes up too short for me.

Not sure if the TCR and Defy sizing is like for like though ?

And to complicate things, I'm a smidge under 5'11" and I ride a Medium Defy with the stock 100mm stem which fits me perfectly, the M/L was too long for sure... But I have got long legs and short torso (like a woman!) for my height, so always errr on the side of a slightly smaller frame rather than slightly large.

thanks Stevo - I didn't see the sizing on their site

If i were you i would go Defy with Ultegra for a first bike, the 2012 stuff is really nice, the frame is the most important thing to consider but so are wheels and groupset, tiara is a bit low in the range. The TCR Advanced is a lot stiffer ride but still fairly compliant, its more of a race frame but thats all i have ever ridded so am used to that sort of feel.

Don't worry about Tiagra appearing to be low rent. I'm a bit of a snob on mountain bikes, certainly everything I own gear wise is XT or above, for a while everything was XTR. With road bikes the groupset seems to make much less difference, but even tiagra shifts very sweetly and crisply compared to the equivalent Deore say. Personally unless I was sponsored and got given the kit, I wouldn't bother with anything above 105 level, not when you can save the money towards something else that's going to make more difference in the long run (wheels, saddle, food/rent/mortgage payments etc)...

Tiagra v Dura Ace - worlds apart. I have the former on my commuter, the latter on my Planet X. The Tiagra is 2011 spec, the DA is 2009 spec. The shifting, finish and smoothness of DA is markedly better. Don't get me wrong - the Tiagra works fine, but it's not really comparable (thankfully) to the much more expensive stuff.

Are you completely not considering the Planet X RT-57? Top of the range SRAM Red, a really nicely finished carbon frame, decent spec hoops and good finishing kit. For £1600. It would be a shame to just run with a Spesh / Giant / Trek and not even look at it. I much prefer the Planet X Nanolight to the S-Works Roubaix it replaced.

Are you completely not considering the Planet X RT-57?

Stevo - we should have a 'well which one did you pick' thread in a few days time... 😆

I am sliding towards the Spesh..

Dont panic calling in to On-One/Planet-X tomorrow also

LOL stevo! I'll be over there in the morning too - need more bits for the fixie / singlespeed build (and a letch at some of the new stuff too...)

Have fun! 🙂

the TCR is racier geometry than the Defy - this means lower centre of gravity, longer top tube.

A defy will be good if you've never had a road bike before and need to get a bit fitter to get more flexible. A lot of people start on "sportif" geo bikes, like Defys and move on to TCRs which are more agressive afterwards.

I'm 5ft 11 at a push, with quite long arms, and would ride a medium TCR with a 120mm stem, or an M/L with a 100mm stem. i prefer the feel of a medium with the longer stem personally.

I am sliding towards the Spesh..

the TCR is racier geometry than the Defy - this means lower centre of gravity, longer top tube.

" Of all the bikes you've chosen for your shortlist, the Giant will have the best frame for definite. Giant, as has been stated already, makes half the frames in the world for other manufacturers anyway, but they always reserve the latest and best technologies for their own frames."

That really is just bullshit of the highest order . Sure Giant make frames for other manufacturers but they have no input into the design or specification of anybody elses frame . So their frames may or may not be better than the Specialized frames that are being built in the same factory but it won't be because of where they are being built .

Stevo - no, i am thinking that being a bit older and used to comfort the Spesh is going to feel best. off to try a few on wed though.

Also going to have a test on Boardman carbon pro as an outsider....

Well, feedback your findings. Wont be buying till after the weekend unless somebody gets carried away 🙂

I got my bike fit done as part of a Planet X deal. As it was my first road bike and I had no clue, it really made all the difference.

My PX SL Pro Carbon is just so much fun to ride, and really comfortable. And I put a lot of that down to getting the fit right.

One thing about groupsets - I have Tiagra on my commuter, and SRAM Rival on my PX. I really like the double tap system of SRAM. Also Tiagra cables come out of the side of the lever, whereas the SRAM and the higher Shimano are routed along the bars under the handlebar tape. Much neater.

Have a nice morning Rotherham 😀

Have a nice morning Rotherham

That really is just bullshit of the highest order . Sure Giant make frames for other manufacturers but they have no input into the design or specification of anybody elses frame .

Except that they do... It's not like a designer miles away just sends a drawing, and says to Giant to make a hundred of them, as it would be with the likes of small UK based manufacturers. The likes of the big boys getting frames made by Giant are going to have to work with them very closely, and all the machinery and tooling will be bespoke.

It's like in Formula 1 where Ferrari and Mercedes make engines for other teams too, but there is always a 2-3% advantage having a Factory unit rather than a customer unit power wise. Same with Giant frames, the difference might only be very marginal either in weight or stifness terms, but if they're making frames for the competition then they know what the standard is they have to beat themselves. You seen the frame weights and stifness claims on the 2012 Giant road bikes? They're topping the mainstream Carbon pile once again anyway... Now unless someone who actually works in the Giant Factory and has empirical evidence to the contrary would care to chip in, you willing to accept you have little knowledge of how engineering and manufacturing works in relation with continuous improvement, and how competition drives this?

Or are my comments falling on deaf ears?

Or have I just ignored the fact that "best" is totally subjective when it comes to bikes anyway, and as a result engineering and design doesn't matter a jot and we really should all ride whatever the latest offering from Yorkshire is...? 😉

IGMC

aaargghhhh 8)

just so much info, I have been piggybacking this thread (sorry Stevo) along with my own one and I am left with a choice of Giant Defy Composite 1, Spesh Roubaix Elite and Trek Madone 3.5.

I guess the main thing is that they are probably all so close and similarly priced that it comes down to a personal choice. Not helped by the fact that most bikes shops only let you ride for 10 mins round the car park....

personally I suspect that the big upbent toptube on the Spesh might scupper my short legged undercarriage which hangs low after 3 kids 😆 then the Trek is too racy for my ****ed old back, and I end up buying the one that wasn't on my list - the Giant.....

"It's like in Formula 1 where Ferrari and Mercedes make engines for other teams too, but there is always a 2-3% advantage having a Factory unit rather than a customer unit power wise. Same with Giant frames, the difference might only be very marginal either in weight or stifness terms, but if they're making frames for the competition then they know what the standard is they have to beat themselves."

That comparison does not work , it would only work if Giant built a giant frame and rebadged it as a Spesh or Trek or whatever .
Also don't you think the big manufacturers will buy some bikes from other manufacturers to see if they are doing anything better or new and innovative that they could copy.

Ramsey Neil +1

Mboy your analogies don't work - as stated manufacturers don't send over a pencil drawing and say they want Giant to build them a frame. Giant provide premises and people and not a vast amount else. People really do get far too hung up on the 'made in the same factory' thing. For a start they are not the sole manufacturer. Trek do all OCLV stuff in house in the US. Their TCT carbon comes from Taiwan, but do you honestly think they'd use a facility who wouldn't do things to their exact specification!?

By what measure are Giants the best?

They're not the best selling. They don't have the most pro victories.

They don't really have a new aero road bike, which is where the focus is going. The Foil, Venge, etc are faster bikes. Surely Giant wouldn't have let a more aero bike be built?! What about TT frames? They do cheap, but they're a way off the top end stuff. They've just started doing wheels, why are they not lighter than anything else out there?

They make good bikes for sure, but to state they are unequivocally the best and they don't release any of their best technologies to other manufacturers is showing a total lack of knowledge about bikes and how the industry works!

I've picked up a Boardman Team Carbon for £1k yesterday, think its the best bang for buck deal out there at the moment

njee20. I was told by someone who had it direct from Giant, that they aren't persuing the aero bikes just yet, as they believe that rider comfort is the way to go and that aero doesn't deliver any real advantage on road bikes as opposed to TT bikes ect. Or something like that.

I wasn't disputing the reasons behind it - my point was that mboy is saying that Giant are unequivocally the best, because they don't offer any of their better technologies to other brands - which is just bollocks, and a good example of that is the entire branch of frame building they don't even get involved in!

had a first look at Spesh, Trek and Giant and testing them tomorrow - at the moment the Giant is edging it 😆

Isn't all this like saying that a Merida is definitely a better bike than than a Specialized, coz they own the factory 😉

I had a bike fit done at Dales cycles and based on that now looking at a sectuer

thegman67 - do you mind me asking how much the fit cost, as I am trying both the Spesh and Giant there ?

I would demo different bikes, fit and comfort equals function.

I have a coast 105 / sram mixed bike.999 pounds. Use it up tak me doon, glen lyon, col de forclaz and col de colombier.

Have fun - strong core makes drops riding more enjoyable.

Picking up my first road bike for 20 years on Friday.
My selection process was pop into LBS, have a look at a few bikes, ask the shop guys "what do you ride round here" answer TCR - got last years (ie 2011) for £450 off RRP.

No idea if it's going to be "the best bike for me" or even if it's "the best buy" but it looks and feels better than I ever remember road bikes and it's going to be fun finding out.

At 178cm tall a M with 100mm stem was spot on, M/L was noticeably too big, wheels are indeed DT/Giant hubs, rest of gear 10speed Ultegra with Giant post/stem/bars/saddle. Road pedals seemed significantly harder to clip in/out than spds so first few rides will be with spds & mtb shoes, might even keep the peak on the helmet, oh the shame 😳

...pics and first impressions later this week 🙂

so first few rides will be with spds & mtb shoes, might even keep the peak on the helmet, oh the shame

LOL. Don't forget the Camelbak too!

😀

...pics and first impressions later this week

I managed to get to ride a couple today, not super conclusive but this is what I thought. Bear in mind I haven't ridden a road bike in a long time.

[b]RT-57 Carbon Small[/b]
First off ridiculously light. loved the look of the bike the drivetrain kit was superb and the machined billet calipers could only be appreciated by a blokey bloke who tinkers in his shed.....I loved em. Stopped well too.
Got up to speed really quickly and felt stable, turned well and as said stopped great.
My only reservation was when standing and putting the power down, the front end for me felt very twitchy, and I felt uneasy throwing the bike side to side to get the momentum up.

[b]2011 Giant TCR 0 (Alu) Small - Stem 80mm[/b]
Felt really nice and as the RT-57 wizzed up to speed with ease. Felt a lot smaller than the Planet-X ride but still felt ok. Standing up and powering was a totally different story, it felt great and controlled. Didnt get to do any high speed cornering but what I did manage it felt very stable. Full Ultergra kit, was easy to use would be second nature after a few rides.

[b]2012 Giant Defy Composite 1 Medium - Stem 100mm[/b]
From the off although similar to the TCR it seems a much more compliant ride, It was a little more stretched out (slightly but didnt feel big)and it felt like it would be a more comfortable middle ground from a racey frame. The super helpful shop guy swapped the step for an 80mm and lowered the stack by 10mm to try and achieve a similar riding position of the TCR. This was much better for me, bars a little closer and a little racier, but still with the forgiving frame.

Its really hard to pick between them as there were too many variables to compare, namely the frame geom, material & frame size. To be honest Id be happy with either of them, with a few tweaks to the seat position and stem length etc.

Ive yet to try the Trek 3.1/3.5 as they were too large and the Specialized Roubaix was the same. I'll grab my friends Roubaix this week to rule this one in or out as the case maybe, but I'd imagine it'll be a bit too high at the front for me.

Im in search of trying a TCR carbon Small and Medium back to back with a Defy Carbon Small and Medium, then I'll report back.

Stevo - good feedback - I will try and do same tomorrow. Cheers

the most interesting part for me is that you are a bit less in height and felt ok on a Defy medium, yet I am unsure whether at 5ft 10 to go for M or M/L...

'the most interesting part for me is that you are a bit less in height and felt ok on a Defy medium, yet I am unsure whether at 5ft 10 to go for M or M/L... '
Unless you are really short in the leg, the 13mm extra standover height wont make much difference. An extra 15mm in the top tube however is pretty significant if like me you've got long arms.

My Lynskey is a M/L and is only a 52cm seat tube, but has 55.7cm effective tt length which combined with a 120mm stem gets me somewhere close to my correct position.
Before i had this, i had a Trek 1.5 and had to have a 56cm frame that was borderline to tall for me just to get a top tube long enough, as the 54cm frame was way too short and cramped.
The madone 3 series have these same measurements, so i couldnt get one even if it was 'the best'.
Giant TCRs and Defys would fit me much better on paper with the M/L being a 53.5 with a 56tt
Spesh would also seem to fit me with the tarmac 56 actually being a 53 with a 56.5tt and the roubaix 56 being a 51.5 with a 56.5tt.

p.s. i'm 5' 10" with 30" inside leg and monkeys arms!

You do realise though that as none of the bikes you are looking at have campagnolo on them that they are all crap, dont you? 😉

Stevo - update from me - I have just ordered a Defy Composite 1 having been into Dales and Alpine and looked at Spesh Roubaix Elite, Trek Madone 3.5 and the Giant. Unfortunately none in stock and 15 week delivery BUT I got it at the Christmas Sale price which is 20% off 😆

iainc - Member

...just ordered a Defy Composite 1...15 week delivery BUT I got it at the Christmas Sale price which is 20% off ...

😯

You'll be getting it almost around the time they're reducing the 2012 ones!

Have you looked at [url= http://www.cyclestore.co.uk/rangeViewer.asp?categoryID=960 ]Cyclestore[/url]? 2012 model already with 10% off and 10% free goods (plus they price match too). They may just have stock as they're a proper bike shop as well as a warehouse - got to be worth a shot versus waiting 'til Easter!

gtth - I did have a wee look there, there is a supply problem apparently with some sizes all over the place. I'm buying from Dales in Glasgow who are a pretty big dealer, so they said they will speak to distributor when they are back on 9th Jan and try and jump the queue...... I think(hope) they were giving me worse case - they also reckon that they probably have some in that size coming (for stock) anyway, but apparently can't find that out till 9th. If so I will get one of them.

iainc - Member

Stevo - update from me - I have just ordered a Defy Composite 1 having been into Dales and Alpine and looked at Spesh Roubaix Elite, Trek Madone 3.5 and the Giant. Unfortunately none in stock and 15 week delivery BUT I got it at the Christmas Sale price which is 20% off

Cool - roll on the 9th (but not too fast as I don't really want to go back to work anytime soon!) 🙂

😀

I'd forgotten that I know someone who has done the Trek bike fit training and passed. I don't dislike the guy but he is one of the most useless individuals to ever mechanic a bicycle this side, and the other side, of The Carpathian Mountains.

I've also met at least two fellas who wander around looking for bikes with a bike fit type printout suggesting crank lengths that don't exist and other borderline achievable measurements that come nowhere near any stock bikes and which would be very difficult to recreate on custom builds.

I've also known at least one example where you hit the exact spot their printouts say they need, and the customer then finds in very short order that they are major league uncomfortable.

[url= http://www.dalescycles.com/ ]Dales[/url]

Stevo - I rode the 2012 Defy Advanced SL in a medium, which was a bit small, and a M/L Defy 1 2011 (geometry is unchanged) which fitted well, so I got the sizing sorted, although not actually rode the composite frameset. The overall fit was good in M/L. They do have a L one they are going to build up next day or 2 so I can actually have a prod at it 'in the flesh'.
On teh back of GTTH post I also spoke to a couple of other Giant Dealers, who all said same thing re delivery times, but you could be lucky with the sizing you are after. The Dales sale runs for another few days and does include mail order bikes.....

Cheers for the link, I couldnt see the Composite 1 listed on there but I could give them a call.
That's great news on yours, quite jealous now. If you rode the Aluminium version (Defy1) then the Carbon will be just so much more lush. I'm sure you'll love it!!!

Stevo - it's not on their website, but the 20% off applies to all bikes they sell, even if not in stock, as long as ordered during the sale. Can't wait to get it !!!!

The boss put the foot down on the n+1 rule, so my Cannondale BadBoy is now on the classifieds 😥

Righto. 'n+1'? whats that mean. You mean you have to a one bike household?

Ive a Cannondale Carbon rush, but there's no way that's leaving the house 🙂

'n+1'? whats that mean.

The correct number of bikes one should own is n+1, where n is the current number of bikes owned.

what njee said ! I had to compromise to keep close to 'in the goodbooks' and I don't use the BadBoy much, even less once I put my Jake the Snake back to cx mode, so punting 1 bike keeps my overall number the same at 4

Ah I see!! this will be my first +1 ever! Divorce would follow even the mention of +2 I'm sure.......4???? good work!

Well the saga has finally come to a conclusion.... hopefully the right one 🙂
As said I had a organised a test ride on the Defy Comp 1 and a TCR advanced 3 as they were a similar price. but when I turned up the weather was awful so we got them set up on the trainer to see how things measured up.
[IMG] [/IMG]
I was surprised to find that Im actually a Small not a Medium as in the other shop. This would explain why I wanted to try the shorter stem.
On looks alone I was settling on the TCR, the internal cabling and the frame shape was a piece of art. But I was reserving judgement till I had had a ride on both of them. Well yesterday I got to ride both and although they were both great to ride, I felt a little uncomfortable on the TCR, its definitely a much more focussed ride and I think I would really struggle to relax and 'settle in' to that on longer rides.

So I have opted for the Defy and if I wish to lower the bars in the coming months there's a good 30mm of spacers on the steerer so hopefully this will allow a little bit of flexibility.

Nice one. How tall are you BTW?
I'm 5'8" and ride a small TCR. I did buy medium SCR ltd once, but that was too big. The compact frame does make them look tiny though.

Im 5'7" and the small was pretty perfect after I knew what I was looking for.
Looking forward to picking it up on saturday 🙂
[IMG] [/IMG]

hilldodger - Member

...pics and first impressions later this week

....well, no pics yet but first impressions are all good 😀

Bike (TCR 0) is pretty much all I could hope for - light, taut, fast and the sort of ride that makes you just want to do another lap.
Tyres had me kacking a few times, don't know anything about current road tyres but the one's fitted (23mm Michelin Dynamic) don't look like a winter tyre and do skip about a bit on wet surfaces (ie just about everywhere in the current conditions)
The Ultegra kit is perfect, but then I guess anything brand new would be, and the Giant bars/stem/post/saddle don't do anything other than what they should.
Other than that it's too early to say, but the overall impression is that when you get off thinking you've done a half decent ride, the bike kind of sneers at you and says "is that all you've got punk" and to be honest, the bike's right - it's certainly not for pootling about on 🙂

Well picked up the Giant this weekend and managed to go for a swift 20 mile run on Sunday and a couple of commutes to see what I thought.
I definitely made the right decision in going for the Defy over the TCR, the TCR would have been too aggressive for my first bike, but I guess everyone is different but this at this time suits my needs perfectly.

The steering is very direct and pin sharp, took me by surprise to start with riding a MTB for so long. As said above the tyres were a little sketchy in the wet conditions (Giant P-SL2) under braking but Im sure I'll get used to that.

Also pleasantly surprised with the weight at 7.9 kgs (without pedals) don’t know how that compares to other bikes in this class. My friends Roubaix is 660gms heavier. weight weenie alert 🙁

Overall couldn't be happier with the purchase so Id better get racking up the miles and make the purchase pay for itself.

Poorly taken falling over pic below 🙂
[IMG] [/IMG]

Hmmmm.....can I ask how much you got it for?

Yeah you can ask 🙂

A smidge under £1500 with all the Xmas offers applied 🙂

Decent deal. Must. Resist.

Enjoy 🙂

BadlyWiredDog - Member

When I bought my first road bike a few years back, it cost me 350 quid - Giant OCR2 second - because at the time I'd never really ridden a road bike and I didn't know whether I'd enjoy it or not and it seemed to make sense to buy something entry level to start with, and then, if I found I liked road-biking and once I had a better idea of what worked for me, invest in something a bit nicer.

Which is what I did. And I enjoyed riding the OCR and, if anything, its shortcomings, helped me when it came to working out what I really wanted to buy when I upgraded.

I've known a fair few keen mountain bikers who've tried road riding and hated it.

I guess if 1600 quid or so isn't a lot of dosh to you, then you might as well splash out on something nice, but I do think you'd have a better idea of what that might be if you actually got some experience on an entry-level bike.

Here's the thing, once you're used to a super-fast, super-slick tarmac burner, yes, entry level bikes do feel a little sluggish, but if you're straight off a mountain bike, you won't know that, you'll think any half-decent road bike is a rocket-ship, full stop...

This is what I ended up doing. I tried a couple of bikes out in shops up to about £1600 in value but in the end my inner tightwad won the day. I got a 2nd hand Wilier La Triestina off eBay for a smidgeon over £500. Pretty much as-new condition as the guy I bought it off had bought it to try out riding with his roadie mates and never took to it.

Bought primarily for aesthetic reasons, as it's a gorgeous looking bike, but the fit etc was still a punt, albeit an exhaustively googled and researched one. It's taken a bit of tweaking (new ergo handlebars and tyres) but I'm surprised how comfortable it is now it's set up to my satisfaction. Think I've been pretty lucky with the suitability of the fit and geometry as it compares favourably with the bikes I tried out in shops.

I was expecting an uncompromising filling-loosener of a ride compared to an MTB or even my steel-framed Roadrat but it's actually incredibly smooth.