[Closed] Fear of jumps and drop offs!

Come and visit me on your Stanton at Preston fella and I'll sort you out with some nice drops and gaps to play on

That looks good fun.

Happy on tables but doubles / gaps mess with me!

Theres a slope leading into them, just let off your brakes and follow me over a few sets 🙂

I'm OK on some biggish tables / step downs but as soon as it becomes a gap, I struggle even if its smaller than another feature!

I'm less fussed by drops.

You are not alone!

Don't fret about it OP, Jedi won't make you do anything you don't want to and I reckon you'll be surprised how easy it'll turn out to be.

You nosedive when your front wheel starts to fall whilst your back wheel is still on the ground.

So if you have enough pace the time that the front wheel is in the air is short enough so that your front wheel dips slowly enough that you land perfectly on the down slope. Man-made jumps are designed so that the ramp matches where they expect your wheels to be.

However I don't like just riding off drops. I strongly feel the need to unweight or 'pop' if that's what it's called, so the attitude of the bike is always under my control not simpy gravity's. This allows me to go over them far slower than simply hitting them, which feels safer to me.

I also discovered that by pulling the rear wheel up towards my bum it let my centre of mass start falling early, and I could then land earlier. When there's a big downslop this compresses everything and I end up landing earlier. Used to do this on the planks at Cwmcarn.

I am not an expert jumper of course, but I am an over-thinker. I think that people who naturally get it say stuff like 'oh just hit it you'll be fine' when those who don't naturally get it won't be.

I realised how forgiving FS bikes are when going fast around Swinley on my fully rigid bike. Re-learned the technique of adjusting attitude in the air to plant the bike neatly on the downslope. It's a great feeling when you can jump a rigid bike smoothly.

A lot of you over think. I can only think this makes you tense, and once you start your roll in you won't remember it all.

The best way to learn is to start small and build up gradually getting more comfortable.

Also riding with someone who can do what you want so you can get a tow in for a speed check is very useful

Of course. The over thinkers are the ones talking about it on forums. The ones who do it naturally are the ones who have less fear and hence don't need coaches or thinking.

The ones who are "natural" usually can't describe what they do, so they're not worth listening to. Someone who has analysed how to do it correctly is far more worthy of your attention.

I agree to an extent, I was stating the obvious. There is some useful advice we can impart on here. but going into detail is probably the least useful. Key pieces of info such as 'stay relaxed' etc are about it.

The best advice is to get one to one coaching as its the most effective and quick learning route. Youtube is ok. We could write down the technique but when anyone tries to put it in to practice its probably long forgotten.

If you don't want coaching or just want to hit gaps at your local.
then starting small and build up, building confidence and technique naturally. Your body will learn what does and doesn't work in relative safety of smaller jumps.

The 'natural' ones don't have any particularly special skill - well, not all of them. They just start off without worrying too much about crashing 🙂

Starting young helps.

I remember a while back me and a mate looking over the edge of a drop and he said 'i'd have happily done this on my raleigh boxer when I was 8 years old, now I'm 40 and have a 4 grand full bouncer I'm petrified'

He was correct...he use to be able to jump about 6 of us on a ramp made of bricks and a plank of wood on that old raleigh

Other night we were out riding and came across this rather big, chest high, drop off on a broken road. Mate tells me a few months back he had demo'd a guci, very expensive, full susser and the first thing he did was bring it to this drop off to see if the best bike would allow him to ride it. It didn't. He went straight over the bars. 😀

My advice would be to not take advice from people who do tiny little 2 foot steps and call them drops. You need to find somewhere to ride with big jumps and learn from the people doing the big stuff. Although the theory is the same you need the balls and confidence to just try them. You won't get this from some one on the internet who is just about comfy on the small stuff on the pictures on this thread excluding those ones on stevet1's picture. The saying that If you can drop of a curb you can do a 10ft drop is nearly true.

By all means learn by watching good riders hitting big drops. But I wouldn't expect them to be able to coach you - some will have the knack of being able to communicate the truth of how to do what they're doing, but most won't.

Watch. Copy. Feel. Practice. Start small and get it feeling right. Then work your way up larger. If you feel good just before you get air, good in the air and good when and after you land, then repeat, consolidate and go bigger.

Earlier this year I sessioned a local drop that's one of those smooth yet intimidating ones because you come around a flat corner, across some off camber roots and it looks like you're about to jump into the abyss, with the fairly steep downslope only visible after you're almost at the lip. It has a low side and a high side - the low side is possibly rollable but more like an 18" step, whilst the high side is almost 3' with a load of bushes to clear below the lip. At a very controlled pace it's about 5' vertical from lip to landing on the low side, 8' odd on the high side. I'm not used to being in the air that long but I knew I could do it, so after going off the low side a few times I did the high side ten times in a row. If I'm honest it got almost boring pushing back up to repeat it but it's what you do when learning to play an instrument or a with a martial art - why should riding a bike be any different?

I've yet to see a video or hear any feedback about any coach other than Jedi @ UK bike skills that makes me trust how they teach jumps and drops. They all seem to overcomplicate and distract from the core skills. Teach yourself by putting in the time or go and see the best!

I definitely agree about doing a jump over and over again after you have done it once.
Even big gets boring and easy after a few goes but you learn more and more every jump ready for the next bigger one.

In my opinion you have already done the correct thing by booking a day with Tony Doyle at UK Bike Skills. He is not known as Jedi for no reason. He keeps it really simple. I would tell him of your anxiety over drops and jumps and he will cure it. The only thing I can say about a day with the Jedi is go with an open mind and You will leave with a huge smile. And practice what he teaches you.

What I need is an uplift day at BPW, given I live nearby.

My XC credentials prevent this from happening though, which means I'd only get in a few runs by riding up I think.

molgrips
What I need is an uplift day at BPW

My XC credentials prevent this

EH? One thing i note from numerous days at BPW, is that the uplift is open for all, no matter what, or how you ride! I've never seen or heard a single person say anything, they are all there to have fun riding their bikes, no matter 😉

(not to mention plenty of the BPW trails are just perfect for shorter travel bikes )

Being driven to the top of a hill is anathema to me!

You can ride up too. I usually do.

Must get up there then. Perhaps over christmas period.

So I went back to Jedi today!

This morning I was massively tense and nervous, so much so I could hardly ride! Tony did what I asked and it was an XC skills based session, he never once mentioned jumping! I just worked on the skills he suggested! I took my HT specifically so I wouldn't have to do any drops or jumps!!!

This afternoon so much had changed, I was relaxed again and trusted my skills, so much so that I started jumping the lines Tony was sending me down! The man is a genius I tell you!!!!!!

Found the fun again

😀

The man is a genius I tell you!!!!!!

Standard.

😉

phil40

I took my HT specifically so I wouldn't have to do any drops or jumps!!!

if you have legs that bend, then that's ^^^^ not a good enough excuse!! 😆

molgrips
Must get up there then. Perhaps over christmas period.

Seriously, book an uplift. You'll enjoy it, get more runs, have more time to session the stuff you want to get better at riding, and be less knackered, so more able to concentrate on technique.

They'll be loads of lycra warriors in half lids with 100mm racey HT's on the bus, you'll be fine 😆

phil40 - Member 
So I went back to Jedi today!

Saw your pics on Facebook, looks like the session went very well 🙂

Well...

Thanks to you guys, I decided to go out and play on some drops last night.

Promptly wiped out on some slippery boards, blue hip and a derailleur hanger that looks like a banana! 🙂

Nevermind, I will return to normal hue in a couple weeks, and now I have an excuse to give myself a hanger alignment tool for christmas.

When life hands you lemons... 🙂

This thread prompted me to check if Tony had any capacity this week.
Spent the day with him yesterday, can really recommend. Really friendly, gets points across well and feel like I learned a lot, while still having fun the whole time.

Points earlier in the thread about Tony not coaching manualling and unweighting the wheel, but actually keeping your weight central in the bike and more popping the bike off (probably bad wording on my part) are definitely true. It's very different from what's contained in the videos posted in this thread.

Felt weird at first, as I'm used to hearing and seeing people talking about manualling off, and couldn't see how it would apply for where you just want to roll off something and not add height. But after doing it over the drops (nothing massive for me!) it seems to be working for me, felt a lot more in control yesterday. Will see what happens when I try and apply it across my riding, and what happens if I progress to bigger stuff in the future.

Awesome day hey.

Will see what happens when I try and apply it across my riding, and what happens if I progress to bigger stuff in the future.

progress to bigger stuff in the future.

Felt weird at first, as I'm used to hearing and seeing people talking about manualling off, and couldn't see how it would apply for where you just want to roll off something and not add height

Hmm but manualling off allows you to be going much slower and you have a lot more leeway with speed. To me anyway - I'm no Jedi, but I know the force. Well.. forces.. Physics and that.

Hmm but manualling off allows you to be going much slower and you have a lot more leeway with speed. To me anyway - I'm no Jedi, but I know the force. Well.. forces.. Physics and that.

If you think physics says that, then you're oversimplifying the physics and/or don't understand drops and/or manuals. You can ride slower off a drop with more control doing it Jedi's way - watch any videos of him doing big north shore drops from less than walking pace and you'll see how it works.

Manualling slowly off drops makes for horribly wobbly landings.

Manualling slowly off drops makes for horribly wobbly landings.

For me, it helped me land much further up the down slope which meant I was falling much less far and hitting the ground with less force.

But I'm an awkward sod, which is why I don't get coaching for things.

For me, it helped me land much further up the down slope which meant I was falling much less far and hitting the ground with less force.

How soon you hit the ground is a corollary of your velocity as the bike leaves the lip, nothing else. You can pop lightly and slowly off a drop and land early if you prefer. If you do a proper manual off the lip then your weight will be unbalanced on landing, unless you're going off a huge height with plenty of time to re-centre in the air.

How soon you hit the ground is a corollary of your velocity as the bike leaves the lip, nothing else. You can pop lightly and slowly off a drop and land early if you prefer.

That's what I am saying, I did prefer it because falling less distance felt easier at first.

If you do a proper manual off the lip

Ah yes, I think I see what you mean.. I'm not talking about an actual manual.. I meant lifting the front to keep it flat so it doesn't fall and you don't land nose first.

Somehow, I feel much more in control if I've physically done the jump rather than just rolled off something. When I was messing about doing this a few years back I'd pre-jump the lip sometimes too. I found it easy enough to get the rotation right to land smoothly, but I simply couldn't bring myself to just ride off the edge even though I knew it would work.

Jumping off the lips at Swinley on a fully rigid bike was fun too. You have to learn to nail your angle in the air to land with both wheels on the slope, otherwise you hurt your wrists. I imagine this is what BMXers have to do.

I meant lifting the front to keep it flat so it doesn't fall and you don't land nose first.

And the best way to keep the bike level as it leaves the lip is the 'pop' or 'push', not the faux manual.

Somehow, I feel much more in control if I've physically done the jump rather than just rolled off something. When I was messing about doing this a few years back I'd pre-jump the lip sometimes too. I found it easy enough to get the rotation right to land smoothly, but I simply couldn't bring myself to just ride off the edge even though I knew it would work.

That's because you're just rolling off a drop and trying to lift the front with something like a manual. If you popped/pushed off the lip then you'd feel just as in control as if you were doing a jump.

I have a feeling we're talking about the same thing.

And the best way to keep the bike level as it leaves the lip is the 'pop' or 'push'

so how, in simple terms, do you 'pop' or 'push' ?

Get the timing wrong with the pop method and you're f****d! I'll stick to the way most pros do it thanks.

[img] https://flic.kr/p/PsVoic [/img]

I'll go off up to about 8' max on rare occasions but only onto a fairly shallow'ish transition. I hate steep transitions and I am much more comfortable regularly at 4' to maybe 6'.

Is part of this the way I do it? I only have one photo (above) easy to hand of me going off about 2' about 7 years ago. Does this look right or wrong?

[img] https://imgur.com/a/X3LY3 [/img]

[url= https://imgur.com/a/X3LY3 ]Bloody embedding image not working.[/url]

here you go

[img] [/img]

You look a bit extended on that before you've even left the ground?

I'd agree.

Thanks for posting it properly!

phil40 - Member
...has anyone else had a moment where they just decided that jumps etc were for other people? I want to develop my riding but at 43 and still a bit sore after the crash I just have no desire to push my riding in a vertical direction!

Yes, about 40 years ago. I noticed that my mates doing jumps on motorbikes were getting crippled. It doesn't matter how skilled you are, it just needs one bad landing, or a series of them, and you're out of the saddle for keeps.

Downhill bikes these days are doing even bigger jumps than we were, but the rocks and tree stumps haven't got any softer.

I'm not saying don't do it, but consider is it worth it? Do you still want to be riding when you're 70? Or do you think you have to stop before your hair goes grey?

I went on youtube to see if I could find out what 'popping' meant, and I saw a mountain bike network one abour learning to jump, and they were at BPW.

I'm quite inspired, the jumps looked great, long and easy but with low cost of failure. Must get out there.