[Closed] Enduro bikes slowly turning into freeride bikes?

It used to be that a Enduro bike was just an all mountain rig. But the emphasis is squarely on the downhill side of things. that sanction is really a small dh rig which uses a remote lockout so you can haul it to the top!Not a lot of use to the averagerider

Doesn't seem much different to a freeride bike then, just lighter. Much preferred it when the "enduro" bikes were more trail focused with lower, more aggressive geometry than usual.

I don't think the Sanction/Capra will be any better than my old 180mm SX Trail on UK tracks, despite the 5/6lb weight loss.

I thought that.

A year ago the Bronson was sooooo enduro. Now everyone wants a nomad, and the Bronson is gay.

What's the Bronson for now?

**mountain bikers in being fickle over terminology shocker**

We've got a bike being described as a 'rig'. Can we have someone say "gnar" for a full house?

Think I'd prefer the Bronson, with a works components headset to take the head angle to 66 degrees. The Nomad seems a step to far for uk riding. Even Dan Atherton prefers 150mm travel bikes, so part of me thinks the Sanction got 165 for marketing reasons.

What's the Bronson for now?

You take it to trail centre cafes.. looks good in the bike rack. Also looks pretty cool on an Audi roof rack.

EWS rounds are all quite different but certainly bikes like the new gt seem designed for the fast alpine stuff like this weekends at vallnord, lift assisted with dh descents

Its all just marketing though so I wouldn't worry about it

Its all good if you ask me, my enduro rig 😉 is about 5kg lighter than my freeride/ dh bike and only slightly less capable on the descents , I'll take that if it means I can ride 50k of welsh mountains up and down !

PS lol at cloudnine

The thing is that UK Enduro courses aren't as long as other places(only Tweedlove has achieved the technicality, albeit low speed technical as opposed to high speed rock gardens etc like in Europe) and lack the elevation/severity of other places. Bikes are designed to handle the biggest and wildest terrain their discipline presents, so an Enduro bike will always end up being built for bigger terrains and bigger markets like Europe to ensure the bike works and it is viable as a saleable product.

Here's an idea - buy a bike with travel and geometry that suits your needs regardless of its label.

Still think the SX Trail was no better than my 150mm Mega on Alpine descents when it came to ploughing through rock gardens

Here's an idea - buy a bike with travel and geometry that suits your needs regardless of its label.

There is that, but marketing plays a part in how strong a frame is built. There aren't that many bikes with the combination of travel, geometry and frame strength which makes them suitable for UK enduro racing/dossing around at chicksands.

As has been mentioned, most companies are building bikes for America and mainland Europe.

Really? Spitfire/Rune/Covert/Bandit/Mega AM & TR/Rocket/Process 134 & 153/Ariel/Meta AM/Spectral/Fritz/Heckler/Bronson/Five/Alpine at the top of my head. Then again I'm not in the UK and have never attended a race there so I might be way off in terms of what you'd be looking for. 🙂 It just seems to me that segment is pretty much overflowing with good bikes with small but distinctive enough differences in travel, geo and toughness to suit a lot of riders. Again, I might be wrong. And apologies if I came off like a bit of a dick.

Funny, we were talking about this earlier. When this whole enduro thing kicked off in the UK, the big sell was that it was the sort of riding we already did, and it demanded the sort of bikes we already had. Perfect!

But now it seems like there's a lot of work going on to change that perception, and now you should buy an enduro bike, because your bike's wheels are the wrong size, and you probably need less chainrings, etc. Cynics might be cynical about that.

prolly to do with marketing terms. cannot blame them though, that's life.

It foes seem to be going that way, but then again if you can build a light enough bike with that much travel that pedals well, why not? Not saying that it's right....it's more human nature. We want more of most things.

The slack angles and longer wheelbases do make sense though. Until last year I was still using an original SX Trail which was a great bike and was fun to ride. The Rune that replaced it isn't a million miles away on paper (10mm more travel, similar weight etc) but the slacker head angle does make for a more confident descender which let's face it is the fun bit. The steeper seat angle means that it climbs better than the SX did too.

The term freeride evolved though...I remember when it was used to describe what most people did, just ride around with an emphasis on fun but over the years it became more about big drops etc. So are Enduro bikes just a return to what freeride used to be?

No-one builds "freeride" bikes anymore 😀

Enduro became All Mountain, Freeride died and became Enduro. DH still sits at one end while XC then Trail still sit at the other end... unless you count Cannondale's branding of "Over Mountain" in there somewhere... along with a dozen other daft buzzwords to sell the same bike year after year while appearing new and different

Freeride (what I thought it was)
[img] ?lastmodified=1363788050[/img]
What is freeride now?

The future of enduro definitely lies in one timed run downhill, served by an uplift. Its going to be huge.

You can't buy a "freeride" bike. The FMB style stuff is either done on a DJ bike (more "slopestyle" events) or DH bike (more "big mountain" events). The rare time they ride a slightly shorter travel big bike it is an "Enduro" bike.

Events like Rampage are few and far between but everyone I can think of was riding a DH (race) bike. Can't think of any bikes marketed as "Freeride" off the top of my head

i want an overdrive-freeridelight-overpark-but-underground-duel-mountain-mincing-bike please. Someone make one please i do not think there's anything on offer.Not when I searched google anyway.

My 6 year old S-Works Enduro has a 1210mm wheelbase, a 66 degree head angle, weighs 30lb and has 170mm front/150mm rear. OK, I stuck the forks on, but maybe you're overthinking things OP?

Just for the record - it rides like a dream 🙂

Can't think of any bikes marketed as "Freeride" off the top of my head

YT Industries still has a couple of freeride bikes though but yeah, exception to the rule I guess.

I suppose it really should all be a balance thing if the bikes are truly aimed at competitive Enduro riders (are they really though?) then the whole efficient pedaling climbing angle should come into the equation...

I guess more travel doesn't strictly exclude efficient climbing, but its sort of intuitive for many of us that more bounce, makes for a shitter on the ups and will the payback be there on the way back down?

If 20 odd years of DH bikes have taught anyone anything about bike design its probably that the way a bike handles any given track is not simply about how boingy it is...
The number of millimetres the wheels move up and down is a nice little metric for the marketeers to segment bikes by, but I think riders have become a shade more savvy, that people look at the angles and wheelbase rather than the "headline" numbers and consider what those might actually mean in use, suggests the marketing gibbons might have to do a shade more than up the travel figures to get buyer's attention...

Ots also worth considering that alot of what is sold as "Enduro" kit isn't necessarily designed with the UK take on Enduro/Gravity Enduro in mind... We are a peculiar little island prone to doing things a bit differently...

It's not just the UK that is particular in what it calls Enduro, the EWS stages seem to vary from race to race and extreme to extreme with 17min stages in the Alps this weekend to shorter stuff elsewhere.
The Santa Cruz guys seem to show that in Enduro simply because they seem to travel with an entire Fleet/Quiver/Stable/Van Full of options to all these races pulling out LT29'rs bronsons and nomads depending on how they feel, Enduro still doesn't have a boundary which is great as racing a broad spectrum means you have to be even better to win.

The DH world always throws up some surprises, watching won't back down reminded me of all the fuss the Spec guys made about Stromlo and brought SX trails because shorter travel trail bikes made more sense and other running superlight air setups only for the old fella on the 10" DH bike to romp home for the win. Graves throwing down the run on the 26" trail bike (or probably what people are calling Freeride here) in the Worlds and again to be beaten by the 26" 10" travel DH bike.

Making use of the travel and finding a way to let you pedal it has always been the holy grail of Full Sus, look at Kona and the magic link ideas, 2 stage with the 2 shocks, funky shock tunes and all that stuff just to make sure you can take the hits and the pedal out of it.

"Freeride" as a concept of gravity fed big jumps & drops is great if your into it and lets people sacrifice weight and pedalling for a more stable & stronger bike that sucks up the bad landings and all that. It's just a very limited space in the market these days. You could push the bigger travel "enduro" bikes up there, they will take the big hits and all that just set all the suspension to open, but if you want to take hit after hit then out go the nice light wheels and the nice finishing kit and in comes the heavy duty stuff which hinders the pedalling.

My 6 year old cannondale prophet is according to strava faster than my 29er uphill and my mega am downhill. I would be interested to know just how knarly enduro is as if there is a bit of uphill and not many rock gardens the prophet seems to be faster. The tank like mega starts shining when you need its slack angles.

Oh for goodness sake, svalgis had it right, buy a bike and ride it. Regardless of the marketing and words attached to these machines we get so passionate about they are just wheels and gears and they rely on our ability and fitness. Just be thankful that we have the time, money, health and freedom to ride a bike.
My bike has 200mm travel front and rear and weighs 38 lbs ish. I rode it to the finish of the dyfi this year and wasn't last, not bad for a 17 stone middle aged bloke who's had cancer twice. The bike was superb and the feeling of achievement incredible.
Just ride your bikes people and stop worrying about unnecessary marketing sh1te.

Moar travel is faster, right?

I think these kind of bikes are ideal if you live in the mountains, dont own a DH bike, but still want to get awesome, ie, not your general MTB market in the UK.

These kind of bikes aren't very freeride, no? -

http://www.pinkbike.com/video/259790/

Maybe these sort of bikes simply don't have enough travel mind, was forgetting for a moment that if you're tackling anything bigger than curb height atleast 180mm of travel is very necessary.

These kind of bike now are so stable, slack and strong whilst still being light, they are dh bikes that pedal more favourably than a dh bike.

Same shit, new marketing.

The Enduro races are won on the downhills, so naturally we're ending up again with bikes that are winch up, bomb down, if this is what you enjoy then buy one of the new 'Enduro specific' (loler) bikes, for me I'll stick with something that's fun to ride for as much of the time I'm on the thing as possible. I can't imagine that I'd do with an extra 50mm of travel over what my blur has.

I think its terrible, affordable lightweight bikes that are tolerable to pedal up a mountain and a riot coming down. Why did it all have to change?! It was all so simple and then people started thinking and having ideas on how to make things better and it will only end in tears.
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Where will it all end?

Don't agree at all. I'm riding the new Orbea Rallon having changed from a Cove GSpot as my last bike I actually owned. The Rallon is low, really low and I find it climbs really well. It's efficient. In the super right stuff you feel the length a bit but it is so low and stable that you can really push it through the corners. Very different from the "freeride" bikes I have tried. The GSpot is great in a winch up and fly down way and I still love riding it. The Rallon can be pedaled up and along all day and is fantastic for that. Downhill it's faster than the big "freeride" bike too. The whole travel thing is a fraction of the story, the Rallon has 10mm more than the cove but they couldn't be more different! Ignore the labels, enduro is different things to different people, but the bikes nowadays are amazing and we should all be happy about that!

More to the point when are going to get proper paint jobs like the ones in tomaso's post back?

The Orbea is a fair bit shorter in the top tube and the wheel base, the geometry can also be set steeper than the YT or the GT. It also has less travel front and rear and shorter chainstays than either of the other two bikes (great for UK riding not so great for Alipine downhills) - it's almost perfect. The Orbea with 150 at the rear would be perfect.

Basically IMO I think that Enduro is evolving into DH lite, or a downhill feeder categatory like the Moto 2 races in Moto GP. With slightly smaller jumps and lower speeds due to the reduced travel, not a sport that is supposed to mimick what most riders do...ie ride trails.

Spitfire

Yes

Too heavy.

To steep.

Bordering on being to much bike.

Too short in the TT.

Maybe

Yes

Yes

Ewww

 

doug, old Gspot??? As much fun bike as they are (I to have one), they are a pig for riding a round without braking your back. They are good in the old sense of freeride (playing in the trees, some north shore stuff, super techy tight twisty shit), but on the downs, the rear end chatters like mad! Compare it to my new Spitty, less travel, but OH SO DIFFERENT design, and the Spitty wins on the typical open space "Enduro" style trails (i.e. what we've all been building and riding for the last 15 years). However, the the longer slacker bikes are hard work on really twisty stuff IHMO, though maybe that's me not having 100% got used to the new bike..?

Basically IMO I think that Enduro is evolving into DH lite, or a downhill feeder categatory like the Moto 2 races in Moto GP. With slightly smaller jumps and lower speeds due to the reduced travel, not a sport that is supposed to mimick what most riders do...ie ride trails

so why are 2 former multiple world DH champs riding it, one 10 time, one double? Plus a lot of other DHers? Can't see Valentino Rossi lining up in moto 2 somehow...

You can't buy a "freeride" bike.

4 realz?

http://www.konaworld.com/entourage.cfm

http://www.canyon.com/_en/mountainbikes/bike.html?b=3272#tab-reiter2

http://www.yt-industries.com/shop/en/Bikes/Gravity/Noton-2.0-Comp

http://www.commencal-store.co.uk/PBSCProduct.asp?ItmID=12501812

etc

so why are 2 former multiple world DH champs riding it, one 10 time, one double? Plus a lot of other DHers? Can't see Valentino Rossi lining up in moto 2 somehow

Err.....because Rossi made tens of millions whilst old dogs like Nico have to make a living by moving over to enduro to make themselves relevant to marketing departments.

This thread is coming across a lot like a 'Review by Numbers' style discussion with bikes being dismissed based on a few mm of travel here, a couple of hundred grammes there, a degree here etc.

Unless you've had significant ride time on all of them then making judgements is a bit meaningless, comparison by catalogue numbers will never tell you how they actually ride and as so much is in the setup and personal preference it seems a bit academic.

'Enduro' is the new buzz word and depending on where you're from and what riding you do it means many different things to different people, it's already been alluded to above but the courses vary so mcuh from location to location that it's incredibly difficult to define, but I really don't think it's heading towards the 'Freeride' that we saw around the late 90's early noughties, but again Freeride varied by location and disposition as much as Enduro does!

I think we will see the discipline continue to develop as it is still in early days really, personally I would like to see it move more towards the longer stages and become a proper XC/Trail/DH hybrid style event where technical riding, mixes with balls out flowy riding throwing in the occasional really tricky short ascents and tight bits as well, not so much 'DHlite' as 'SuperXC', that's where the interesting battles will develop when courses mix and match to challenge different skillsets.

As with all sports as they develop the gap between the pure race machines and the everyday bikes will widen, sure we'll still see non-racers buying bikes designed for racing and it will lead the marketing but the best thing to come out of it is that actual trail bikes are just getting better and better, but

"Hey buy our mid-travel, mid-weight, mid-angled bike for normal riding!"

just doesn't have the same ring to it so the manufacturers will always shout about the new and exciting extremes as it sells bikes and pulls at the aspirational heartsrings of a lot of riders, whatever their discipline may be.

Good post. That's how I'd like to see the races go and that's what I would enjoy racing at an amateur level.

Can't take too many risks because of work these days, can't really justify doing big gap jumps etc.

Err.....because Rossi made tens of millions whilst old dogs like Nico have to make a living by moving over to enduro to make themselves relevant to marketing departments.

Ha, I doubt Nico is short of money, being the most winningest DH rider of all time in an era when they got paid a lot of money to race DH.

Clearly not Rossi amounts of money, but he's a clever guy, and if a party boy like Gracia had his head screwed on enough not to spunk all his cash, I'm sure Nico didn't have a secret coke & bookers fetish that bled him dry...

I think he will have less money than you think and I thought there was less money floating around in the sport back then.

Err.....because Rossi made tens of millions whilst old dogs like Nico have to make a living by moving over to enduro to make themselves relevant to marketing departments.

What about 'old dogs' like Peaty and Minnaar? Even Gee Atherton has been around for a few years now?

Ha, I doubt Nico is short of money, being the most winningest DH rider of all time in an era when they got paid a lot of money to race DH.

Not to mention being the IRC rally champion after getting bored of DH.

It does seem that DHers go to Enduro though, rather than tother way like in Moto2/MotoGP

I think he will have less money than you think and I thought there was less money floating around in the sport back then.

not in the nico vs peaty vs palmer era, $300,000 salaries not unheard of

Yeah, did this part of the conversation not start out with the idea of enduro as a downhill feeder? I really don't see it... Don't really see it happening the other way round either, yeah you get people swapping from dh to enduro but they're not stopping dh to do enduro- they're stopping dh because they're old or otherwise done with it, then doing enduro.

Or in some cases, just doing everything because they're riding gods 😉

I think Gee is on silly money but imo DHers going to enduro is similar to ex moto gp riders retiring to superbikes. Dan Atherton could never cut it in DH so he's had to move to enduro after 4x went tits up.

There are some young enduro riders who look like they will jump across to DH.

The two bikes that won last weekends EWS race were pretty normal trail bikes.
Tracy Mosley's Trek is hardly a DH bike with 29er wheels and steepish angles.And Graves won on a SB66.

Geometry is evolving and 140mm trail bikes such as the Foxy have 66.5 degree head angles that were once the realms of DH bikes

Coming back to the original question... Enduro bikes slowly turning into freeride bikes?

I agree with Tomaso, the bikes haven't turned from one thing into another, just the marketing used by the industry. Bikes have constantly evolved over the 20yrs I've been riding with technological developments, new composite materials and the trickle down of the high end stuff.

If you ride an "Enduro" event on your three year old weekend trail bike, enjoy it, and do well within your ability and fitness range, then isn't it a perfectly fine Enduro bike for you??

As Tomaso said, with the mens being won on a Yeti SB66 and women's on a Trek Remedy 29 it sounds like the bikes most of us rag around the woods on with our mates every weekend are all we'd need anyway.

Its the new GSpot! Great bike IMHO. Don't you really think that riding in general is morphing into downhill lite? We regularly ride old DH courses and how many "XC" riders now ride DH tracks, for example at inners? I am also seeing the due hard off roadies out here starting to ride techy singletrack. I think the evolution in bikes is driving it, for example XC FS bikes are so capable people are redefining their limits.

Out here enduro is giving a middle ground and the off-roadies and dh'ers are all moving towards it. It's fantastic because previously overgrown tracks are being used and there are do many new tracks getting built.

tomaso - Member

Tracy Mosley's Trek is hardly a DH bike with 29er wheels and steepish angles.

67.5 for a 29er isn't steepish

Its the new GSpot! Great bike IMHO. Don't you really think that riding in general is morphing into downhill lite? We regularly ride old DH courses and how many "XC" riders now ride DH tracks, for example at inners? I am also seeing the due hard off roadies out here starting to ride techy singletrack. I think the evolution in bikes is driving it, for example XC FS bikes are so capable people are redefining their limits.

Out here enduro is giving a middle ground and the off-roadies and dh'ers are all moving towards it. It's fantastic because previously overgrown tracks are being used and there are do many new tracks getting built.

It's weird how it's merging towards a middle ground. The guys I ride with started out as bridleway bashers with a 4hr circular route covering 30 miles being a normal ride. Now their trail bikes can do so much more its become a search to puts routes together that focus on the tricky, technical descents with ascents just a necessary evil. Shorter rides in terms of length and distance that fit into their family lives better but are higher on adrenaline.

At the other end of bike riding 160mm+ travel bike now ride uphill pretty well, its almost a pleasure. I can see this crowd all switching to longer travel bikes sooner rather than later.

I guess enduro riding is just an a more colourful, competitive version of what a lot people just consider mtbing to be these days.

Northwind - Member
67.5 for a 29er isn't steepish

Yep. But all the point I'm making there is that the Remedy in particular's not a steep bike, it's one of the slacker 29ers. (remember the greater trail of a 29er means that in some ways they behave like they're slacker) Obviously it's not a downhill bike.

When Aaron Gwin's winning a downhill world cup round on an Enduro, is it a downhill bike? 😉

[i]I guess enduro riding is just an a more colourful, competitive version of what a lot people just consider mtbing to be these days.[/i]

Last five years at least, but yes.

When Aaron Gwin's winning a downhill world cup round on an Enduro, is it a downhill bike?

Nope, it's just a bike being ridden in a DH event. Too many people seem to care right now about whether a particular bike and it's wheel size, geometry etc make it right for a certain type of event. Who cares? ... the international bike authorities maybe as they're hung up on rules and tradition, the bike brands definitely as it's in their interest to sell bikes, but aren't we as riders beyond all this by now?? It looks to me that Enduro style events are giving talented and fit all round riders a fighting chance of doing well, and the bikes they're riding well are the same bikes many of us mortals ride every weekend.

At the other end of bike riding 160mm+ travel bike now ride uphill pretty well, its almost a pleasure. I can see this crowd all switching to longer travel bikes sooner rather than later.

Exactly, the 160+ bikes with slack angles which are 'too downhill/freeride orientated' actual climb uphill better than many of the older trail bikes for the whole freeride period. They are lighter,accelerate/pedal better and are more planted. What's not to like?

Exactly, the 160+ bikes with slack angles which are 'too downhill/freeride orientated' actual climb uphill better than many of the older trail bikes for the whole freeride period

This, my nomad climbs [i]almost[/i] as well as a 5010 of the same vintage, yet its 'too slack with too much travel to ride uphill'. Apparently.

Tom_W1987 - Member

Dan Atherton could never cut it in DH so he's had to move to enduro after 4x went tits up

And yet over in enduro, current world cup riders have tried and failed to compete- just one example, Affy beat Greg Minaar by something like 30 places in Punta Ala, and a whole stack of other current dh competitors. It's not just "downhill light" or an easier option, it's a pretty different discipline with a different skillset that seems to suit him better than downhill did.

If you look at it solely from numbers you'll find that "Freeride" bikes were GENERALLY heavier, with steeper head angles, slacker seat post, angles taller stand over and shorter wheel bases. And emphasis was on absorbing big hits rather than pedalling ability.
Apart from increasing the travel to match the bigger more gravity orientated (often) Alpine tracks the new longer travel bikes are worlds apart. The Enduro race series' here in the UK tend to be on smaller tracks so a lighter short travel bike can make sense. Although bikes like the Capra are light, pedal well and long travel so they're probably good for them as well. Santa Cruz admit that the Nomad is for the bigger gravity orientated races/tracks and reckon the Bronson is better suited to things like the UK has.

But as said before buy the bike you like that you think is best for your riding. Don't buy a bike based on 2 weeks annual holiday.
And rejoice in the fact that we have 170-180mm bikes that pedal well. I remember a time when forks were so crap some hardtails sucked to pedal!
Tom KP.

Not heard enduro as being a feeder series for dh. Dh feeder would be the junior wc series.

Maybe a retirement sport for a few dh'ers but it has its own following too.

Never got free ride bikes. Shit at going up, pretty shit at going down. Compromised in every way... There was this free ride thing like nwd films showed but that never really caught on here.

This new generation of bikes are far more superior.

4 realz?

http://www.konaworld.com/entourage.cfm
> http://www.canyon.com/_en/mountainbikes/bike.html?b=3272#tab-reiter2
http://www.yt-industries.com/shop/en/Bikes/Gravity/Noton-2.0-Comp
http://www.commencal-store.co.uk/PBSCProduct.asp?ItmID=12501812

etc

- Entourage is listed as a "Gravity" bike with a DH frame but a loose reference to "freeride fun" in the description...
- Canyon make no reference to "freeride" but "for DH and pike park use"
- Commencal has "FR" in the name but that's a hangover from when "Freeride" was a cool term. They describe it as "Made for bike Park but ready to shred with no problems". No reference to "freeride" in the description.
- YT is a rare one actually describing the bike as for "freeride" but they can get away with being so far behind the times with marketing due to the specs the roll out 😀

Point is, it is all just marketing words and people think "Enduro" is cool but "freeride" is hucking to flat on a steep, heavy, high BB, poorly pedalling bike that we are all clearly far too awesome and sophisticated for now 😉

CFH has the right idea!

Same shit, new marketing.

It's weird how it's merging towards a middle ground. The guys I ride with started out as bridleway bashers with a 4hr circular route covering 30 miles being a normal ride. Now their trail bikes can do so much more its become a search to puts routes together that focus on the tricky, technical descents with ascents just a necessary evil. Shorter rides in terms of length and distance that fit into their family lives better but are higher on adrenaline.

At the other end of bike riding 160mm+ travel bike now ride uphill pretty well, its almost a pleasure. I can see this crowd all switching to longer travel bikes sooner rather than later.

I guess enduro riding is just an a more colourful, competitive version of what a lot people just consider mtbing to be these days.

^^This.

My 170mm enduro bike climbs at least as well as my old 140 bike from about 4/5 years ago. It's also slacker, more stable and a ton faster on the downs. And while weight isn't the be-all and end all, it is also half a pound lighter.

My 170mm enduro bike climbs at least as well as my old 140 bike from about 4/5 years ago. It's also slacker, more stable and a ton faster on the downs. And while weight isn't the be-all and end all, it is also half a pound lighter.

Interested to know which bikes you're comparing. And how's the new bike go on flatter trails?

Just starting to think about next buy and getting tempted by 160mm-plus travel bikes under 30lbs.

I remember a MBUK article from about 10 years ago titled "this is freeride"

I think the bikes were a couple of steel kona's and a DMR switchback.

Having recently ridden a Scott Genius LT 710 I would have to say that the 'enduro' craze is driving the development of some seriously capable bikes. If I had the cash I'd be tempted to buy one. The GT Force was another great bike, but I'm not so sure I'd want one for general riding... great fun downhill, but maybe too much bike to be useful to me.
But I'm very happy people are making these bikes, whatever they want to label them.

Ten years ago, I bought my "one bike to rule them all" machine, a Spesh Enduro noless. Since then things kind of diversified...you had your 35lb freeride rigs, 100mm xc Bantamweight machines, mid-travel do it all machines and now the wheel is turning full circle with Enduro bikes with plenty of strength, useful geometry and a reasonable length top tube to permit all day rides.

I'm certainly considering replacing my 120mm full suss and 160mm AM bikes with just one bike. Current favourite is a YT Capra.

Hands up of your everyday riding necessitates a 160-170mm monster?

Im not buzzing these bikes being at the forefront, i want more fun bikes.

If i want to go trail riding and have fun, 120-140, tough/slack is ideal, if i want to ride on seriously rough stuff flat out or carelessly hucking big stuff to flat i'll take my DH bike.

These kind of bikes kill the fun of general trail riding, they're almost as capable as a DH bike, but still a compromise, not just in terms of travel and strength but geo/having a steep SA putting the seat right in the way.

I'm not trying to be intentionally offensive, maybe a little tongue in cheek, but these are the sort of bikes lusted after for pretty childish/caveman reasons, "it's got more suspension so it must be better". They'll inevitably be ridden with 50%+ sag to get full travel on trail centre reds by some sweaty man in knee/elbow pads, sunglasses, massive garmin, urge helmet and a massive camelbak wondering why that last climb was so hard and wondering why they can't get off the ground/ massive horrendous generalisation.

Hands up of your everyday riding necessitates a 160-170mm monster?

But if your riding consists of a mix of AM/blasting it in the woods/uplift days (as a lot of me and my mates do) and wife/kids/storage space reduce n+1 capacity, then a 160-170mm Enduro bike is ideal.

Interestingly, a mate has a Mojo HDR (160mm setup, 29lbs) and reckons it rides better point to point than his old Mojo SL from a few years prior.

I too would say that hand on heart, my 170mm enduro bike climbs better than it's 140mm single pivot predecessor, so coupled with being stiffer, lighter and then also better descending, is a superior all round bike.

The tech has developed so fast in the last 2 years - and unless you're an XC racer or perhaps someone into those massive epics, then a modern 160/Enduro bike is probably perfect for most people's riding.

They also have much more betterer colorways too (see what I did there?!?!)

I too would say that hand on heart, my 170mm enduro bike climbs better than it's 140mm single pivot predecessor, so coupled with being stiffer, lighter and then also better descending, is a superior all round bike.

The tech has developed so fast in the last 2 years - and unless you're an XC racer or perhaps someone into those massive epics, then a modern 160/Enduro bike is probably perfect for most people's riding.

It's gone in a circle though, 8 years ago when the 6" travel enduro came out MBR fawned over it, declared 5" travel bikes obsolete, that "The tech has developed so fast in the last 2 years - and unless you're an XC racer or perhaps someone into those massive epics, then a modern 160/Enduro bike is probably perfect for most people's riding.
"

About 2 years later after all their staff long term bikes had been 140-160mm FS bikes they decided they were actualy crap and made anything short of a DH run boring and went back to stuff like the camber, trance-x etc.

I'm not saying MBR is right, I'm saying you're just as wrong as they were.

Yes 170mm bikes might pedal as well as a 140mm bike from a few years ago, but the 140mm is even better, and if you've not tried a 100mm XC bike in the last few years, you should, they're mindblowingly quick.

If n+1 isn't an option, then the best bike for most people would probaly be much more towards the XC end of the spectrum, on the simple basis that most people will live near Swinley not Innerleithen.

There's a massive gap between something that climbs well enough, and something that goes like a rat up a drain pipe as well as making so much more of every lump and bump on the flat and down.

Then there is the whole debate over "what goes downhill better", what if your DH is at a trail centre red standard, is a 170mm bike really going to be better down it than a similarly evolved 130ish bike?

Fair play to these bikes if you're climbing up to come down fort will, or live in the mountains with some proper stuff, i'll take these bikes over trail bike any day, i somehow think the UK market who wants these things aren't really hitting DHs on this level.

I've been there before with the one bike to do DH and XC, always at the back puffing, limping along the flats, missing upteen opportunities to get rad, to then get to a DH which was flattened to the point it wasn't worth the hassle. I see lots of people about on rides with faces describing my experience above. Since getting a trail bike, im flying up the hills, making the most of the flatter bits and not being held back one bit on the downs and i dont shy away from the steep, technical, big gaps stuff.

deanfbm - Member

Hands up of your everyday riding necessitates a 160-170mm monster?

Necessitates, no. But necessary's never the thing. I was out on my enduro-poon at the weekend at Glentress, by rights it should be overkill but it was a great laugh. I'd have been perfectly happy on my hardtail too so not necessary, just fun.

Hands up of your everyday riding necessitates a 160-170mm monster?

That's kind of it though, the 160-170 mm bikes of today aren't monsters, they are as light as the 130-140mm trail bikes of a couple of years ago (sub 30lbs) yet loads more capable over the rough stuff. Win/win IMO

What Ive noticed is that all the enduro bikes seem to be designed to be carried up hill. Watch any of the videos in mis week moves etc and they all seem to involve carrying rather than riding a bike up hill.

Now Im all for each to their own but I want a bike to ride up and down the hill, not carry up it.

All the tech of these 150-170 bikes but scaled down to 120 would suit me just fine

chrismac - Member

What Ive noticed is that all the enduro bikes seem to be designed to be carried up hill. Watch any of the videos in mis week moves etc and they all seem to involve carrying rather than riding a bike up hill.

Now Im all for each to their own but I want a bike to ride up and down the hill, not carry up it.

I suppose you can get wrong ideas easily when you base your opinions on videos rather than actual experience 😉

Seriously though, sometimes a push or a carry gets you places you wouldn't get to otherwise- not a bike specific thing that, it's just a way to access more cool things.

tomhoward - Member
Hands up of your everyday riding necessitates a 160-170mm monster?
That's kind of it though, the 160-170 mm bikes of today aren't monsters, they are as light as the 130-140mm trail bikes of a couple of years ago (sub 30lbs) yet loads more capable over the rough stuff. Win/win IMO

Yes, and many of the 120-140mm trail bikes of today are just as capable over the rough stuff as the 160-170mm bikes of a couple of years ago, but also now sub 25lbs in some cases. 😉

Bikes have got better in the last few years, particularly if you've embraced the middle or big wheel sizes where the R&D budget has been spent. Call it Enduro if you like, but it's what most of us have been doing with our mates every weekend for years.

chrismac - Member
What Ive noticed is that all the enduro bikes seem to be designed to be carried up hill. Watch any of the videos in mis week moves etc and they all seem to involve carrying rather than riding a bike up hill.

Now Im all for each to their own but I want a bike to ride up and down the hill, not carry up it.

Phrases like 'enduro' are just marketing hubris to me.

A bike is labelled properly with a description of it's engineering, facts like wheel size, gearing, frame material, rigid/hardtail/full suspension, travel at each end, frame angles.

It may be long winded that way but at least it's not bull****!

I think for the people that have several bikes, then these #enduro gnarpoons are too compromised. Ie you have a trail bike for most of your riding, and a downhill bike to use when you have a chairlift/uplift. You dont also need a mid ground enduro rig.

But for people who only have one bike , these #enduro bikes are a great thing, these days they really do allow you to cover nearly all spectrums of mountain biking with a single bike.

I'm in the one bike camp, cant be bothered maintaining/storing two bikes, My mojo HD is great, does exactly what I need it to do. Long XC rides,UK big mountains, UK Uplift, alps chairlift, spain big mountains.

chrismac
What Ive noticed is that all the enduro bikes seem to be designed to be carried up hill. Watch any of the videos in mis week moves etc and they all seem to involve carrying rather than riding a bike up hill.

What i suspect you are seeing is that modern "enduro" or "AM" bikes are so capable and yet light, you CAN now carry them to the top of a mountain and actually ride down it! Before, you couldn't ride down it, and NO ONE carries a bike to the top of a mountain to then carry it straight back down again 😉

Tomaso that looks like a fun descent!

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