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So, I sold ,y set of X0 brakes on eBay this week, both seller and buyer have long standing 100% feedback.
I literally removed the brakes from my bike, gave them a clean up and sent them off - I'd been riding on them with no hassles (the odd bleed required) for 6 months, and they were unmarked.
Now, the buyer has contacted me saying,,,
"Hi,
I've tried fitting these today but they are not working correctly. There is a piece missing from the lever body so you can wind the contact adjuster right off & they pull right to the bar. That added to the fact they are far from "perfect condition" as described in the listing I would like to send them back for a refund.
I already own 2 other sets of these so I know what they should be like. These are incomplete & are not working correctly. I was prepared to accept the condition for the price I paid as they are far from battered but they are not "perfect" as they were described..."
Now, I'm not a d*ck, and would genuinely never send something out that's not as described - these really were spotless, and were photographed as such, the missing part but does concern me, because I can't picture what it is? Any time I've had issues with brakes I simply got the shop to bleed them, and they were fine again. If truth be told the only reason I sold them, and my Elixir 5's too, is because I'm sick of having to bleed Avids so often and have gone for some XT's instead.
So, what are your thoughts? I'm inclined to give the guy the benefit of the doubt, as I say he's got a long and good feedback score, which suggests he's a decent enough sort. But, I don't want to end up being stuck with something that's potentially been poached for spares / swapped out for an older/bashed set that ill get back I stead.
FWIW, they sold for £100, way less than half what I paid for them last year.
Cheers all
Oh, its also worth adding all my listings are marked as no returns accepted, but I don't want to see someone stuck with something that's not right. If anyone knows what the 'missing' part might be, do you know if they can be bought separately?
I'm unconvinced anything IS actually missing, but I'd be happy enough to say cover the costs of that to keep the peace.
Mistake to describe them as perfect. Anything like that is very open to interpretation. With eBay's policies you've got little option but to refund. You could offer a discount to save hassle.
Tough call, but if the buyer escalates the dispute with ebay they almost always side with the buyer.
See if he'll send them back and refund once you've examined them. Just relist them if thiwr all ok.
"If you are unhappy with the item then please return them"
Its just not worth the hassle either way.
just wait for him to return one of his knackered pairs....
yes that would be my concern - they have a set of knackered ones and now you will- did you mark them before you sent them - tell the seller you have and see what they say?
If he returns them, under ebay rules they have to be sent recorded delivery (possibly insured iirc), this may put him off sending them back. It sounds like they have been badly installed.
Yeah, lesson learned on the wording I suppose - too ambiguous and open to interpretation. That said, they really were spotless when I sent them out, otherwise I wouldn't have listed them as such. I've sold loads of bike & snowboard bits on eBay and always list things as accurately as I possibly can.
12 years worth of 100% feedback should testify to that.
I'm keen to learn more about the bit that's claimed to be missing - if anyone has any idea what this might be, I'd really appreciate a link/image?
I have to say they look in good condition: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Avid-Sram-X0-Brakes-Complete-/141020541528?pt=UK_sportsleisure_cycling_bikeparts_SR&hash=item20d57ab258&nma=true&si=mLE3aE2CULRvYHePq%252B0638QIaoo%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
Ask him to point out the missing part on the diagram:
Just take them back.
End of, anything else is just a waste of time.
If he sends you a crap pair report him to e-bay and raise a claim of your own.
In my experience if they have extensive good feedback this is normally a good sign.
Tip - read the comments in the feedback, dont just rely on the score, they dont always tally.
Some good pointers here folks, thanks.
I've got to give the lad the benefit of the doubt I suppose, he's clearly bought and sold a lot on there without any hassles so what else can I go off?
So, anyone want a set of X0 brakes then...? ;0)
Not really, apparantly there's bits missing and they've had multiple owners... 🙂
May sound obvious, but don't refund until you've received them and checked to make sure he's not swapped/pinched bits off them.
Offer to take them back, but poiltely point out that a) your listing clearly stated "no returns", and b) make him aware that you won't give the refund until you are in receipt of the goods and are certain that they are the ones that you sent.
If the buyer is being truthful he should have no objections.
The No returns bit is a load of rubbish. If they are not as described the buyer will almost always win. Take them back, make sure they are What you sent him and then re list.
For one thing, you only got £100 for them because your listing photos are shocking! If you want to sell something decent and list it as "perfect", surely it's better to take some good close-up photos and link to them on photobucket (other hosting sites are available)? Then there's no room for argument.
Anyway, for your own sanity, accept the return - I'll tell you what will probably happen if you don't - he will raise a case against you (even though "no returns accepted" means he has no case).
Ebay will stop your seller account and freeze your paypal funds for 8-10 days, while they "investigate", before finally deciding that you have no case to answer to and finding in your favour.
If you can stand that hassle (I know I couldn't go through it again!), then tell him to do one.
No returns does not mean he has no case at all. Distance selling regs and the simple fact he is stating they agree not as described means eBay will side with him.i don't know why they have the No returns option as then you could sell anything at all on eBay and whether it be as described or not there would be no come back.as said above take closer detailed pics and state in working condition.
But as it's a private sale via an auction site, distance selling regulations don't apply? Only eBay shops would have to comply with DSR.
Thanks for all the pointers above folks.
Well, surprise surprise... Got the package back this morning and he's sent me back a scuffed up tatty old set, not the ones I sent out.
What a bell-end.
To say I'm a tad miffed is putting it very mildly indeed.
Why would he even bother putting [i]any[/i] brakes in?
He could of just sent an empty box......
Get in touch with Ebay straight away.
I can't see why he'd bother though. He runs the risk of not getting refunded, and giving you a set of brakes for free, albeit a tatty set.
Well, surprise surprise... Got the package back this morning and he's sent me back a scuffed up tatty old set, not the ones I sent out.
That's really rough, is it obvious from your pictures that they are a different set?
Do people really do this 😯
I would be furious especially given the propensity for eBay/PP to side with the buyer.
I raised a dispute a while back re a damaged frame. I received a refund at confirmation of postage stage rather than confirmation of goods received stage.
Its almost as though a stage is required for the the seller to confirm they have received the right goods back in the condition they were sent.
Hope you get this sorted dude 😀
Have you spoken to him about it?
Well, you've got his address & he's got your brakes. Can you rustle up an angry mob?
What a complete cockweasel.
Awsome... genius .... i can't wait to see how this plays out 🙂
I'm getting angry just reading it! Hope this gets sorted. He should really be reported for deception.
PS - Does his history show him buying a different set in the past?
Does his history show him buying a different set in the past?
I haven't checked (yet), but he did let slip in a message that he already has 2 sets of these, so that's how he knows they're 'incomplete'.
Certainly the ones I've got back match his complaints - the rear's got no bite (needs a bleed I suspect) and are a bit scruffy, but they're sure as sh*te not what I sent out.
eBay have already concluded he's in the right, have given a full refund and are now chasing me for the full refund.
All-in-all, a stinking horrid mess and almost certainly the tipping point for me in using eBay again. I've heard plenty of horror stories but it's only been this last few weeks that I've had any problems.
First this a-hole, and then someone else who won a bid then vanished without paying for it.
Ouch this sucks, big time. And he gave you a 'Best Avoided' negative feedback too, I'd be absolutely tampin mad mate. Did you refund him before he sent them back?
EDIT: just saw your post above
Ouch this sucks, big time. And he gave you a 'Best Avoided' negative feedback too, I'd be absolutely tampin mad mate. [b]Did you refund him before he sent them back?[/b]
Nope - I offered him a refund on the condition that he sent the stuff back and between me and the LBS we'd confirm that they're what was sent and in the same working order that I sold them in.
He was a week late in returning them, during which time he opened a case with eBay, who because I didn't refund him in time (err, because I hadn't received anything back by then) awarded it in his favour and refunded him directly.
Now eBay want their cash back and I've got someone else's set of brakes.
[b]And he gave you a 'Best Avoided' negative feedback too, I'd be absolutely tampin mad mate...[/b]
You certainly [i]could[/i] say that, yes.
If you can prove they are not the ones you sent out; would there be any joy in using small claims court ?
I hope you get it sorted mate, that idiot is on my best avoided list not you!
Ach, possibly. But, it'll cost more in court fees and time out of work than it will to just clean these up, get them bled and re-sell them.
Just a bit of a warning to all I suppose - be aware! It's not just thieves nicking bikes/bits and selling them on eBay you have to keep your wits about you for.
EBay should sort them out once they see all the evidence.
They should also get your bad feedback removed too.
But what an asshole.
Hope you took lots of pictures!
Name, shame and address.
STW has pretty much nationwide coverage.... 😉
Report him for fraud.
This sucks big time !!
EBAY are tossers and should have waited until all the evidence was in.
Hope you get the right result!
Also a good idea to take note of serial numbers, preferably in photographic form at the same time you take listing photos.
bigyinn - MemberName, shame and address.
What a shame the buyer's username is now easily found a couple of clicks away from this thread. And ebay makes it so easy to 'save favourite sellers' and watch their listings whether you think they are good ones or bad. It would be truly terrible if this karma came back to haunt him via disappointed buyers of the bike stuff that he sells on ebay.
Afraid ebay / paypal will now just keep chasing you fof the cash.
Id go down the small claims court route - worked for me a while backwhen I was defrauded out of a bike ebay some years back. Its not a garenteed method of getting the cash back (as they can just refuse to pay you even after you win) but its good to send the b'stard court summons in the post.
This is such sad news.
I think what we all can take from this is like Nexie said, take pictures of serials numbers where possible. But I would also mark your items with a UV pen for good measure.
Really sorry to hear this, what a grim tale 🙁
Good luck with getting it resolved - I too would now be heading down the small claims court route - and naming and shaming.
eBay - officially the shittest way to sell something online.
Bloody Hell! I am far too trusting when it comes to selling stuff on eBay. Would never consider that someone might do this.
I will be marking up items from now on & taking more detailed photo's even if I don't include them in the auction gallery.
Sorry to hear about this, but at least it's given others a heads up so it might not happen so frequently. eBay do seem to be very one-sided with this kind of thing.
Next seller to become a victim of the fake eBay account thatsomeoneIknowquitewellhasaccessto... http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/stug_moore
Quite an active member on more dirt forums too http://www.moredirt.co.uk/users/Stug/
Firstly - this guy is an utter t0sspot
I had a pretty unsatisfactory ebay selling experience about 18 months ago
Basically I sold to a buyer who then changed the goalposts, behaved like a complete bully, left me spiteful negative feedback after his bullying didnt get the discount he thought he should have (FK why) and then refused to confirm the sale had been voided so I could reclaim my ebay fees
Which was all nice!
My saving grace was I only communicated with him through ebay and was calm and rational with all my messages
You can phone them, in the Philipines I think, and speak to a person
Its not easy but if you press the codes for "my account has been hacked" you get a human pretty quickly 🙂
I spoke to this guy, immediately had the neg removed and got my fees refunded
The buyer has tried the same stunt many times since looking at the amount of negative feedback he leaves, its just grim that Ebay are so fast to side with buyers
Best of luck, thinking your reply to his negative feedback may have been a little premature.....
The scamming ****
Hope he gets his just desserts and you get it sorted.
Good luck.
[i]thinking your reply to his negative feedback may have been a little premature.[/i]
Nah, he's a bell end!
OP do you have pics of what he returned?
thinking your reply to his negative feedback may have been a little premature.
Agreed. While we can all agree he is a bell-end, probably best to wait till you have your goods/money back first.
EBay should sort them out once they see all the evidence.
Funniest thing ever on STW.
I bought a bike on ebay that turned out to be stolen. I handed it back to the Police.
EBay and Paypal refuse to refund me on the grounds that the Police didn't contact me within 45 days.
Needless to say neither GAS. Why will they in this case?
While we can all agree he is a bell-end, probably best to wait till you have your goods/money back first.
Thats not really gonna happen its it, the way ebay side with the seller.
Thats not really gonna happen its it, the way ebay side with the seller.
The guy is in Rochester, Kent. Surely we can raise up a posse of STW vigilantes?
What a complete knobber! People are obviously thinking of new ways to steal decent kit. Hope you get it sorted...
Funniest thing ever on STW.I bought a bike on ebay that turned out to be stolen. I handed it back to the Police.
EBay and Paypal refuse to refund me on the grounds that the Police didn't contact me within 45 days.
Needless to say neither GAS. Why will they in this case?
Did you raise a dispute? Ebay always sides with the buyer, i thought.
should read:
Thats not really gonna happen its it, the way ebay side with the [s]seller[/s] buyer.
🙄
I'm angry just reading about it! I had this done to me in the very early days of eBay, got sent something back that I had never seen before. I lost out.
Hope this works out better for you op.
Did you raise a dispute?
Yes, and it was also closed instantly and automatically.
Contact ebay via the phone option and advise you are doing the below..
Report this as theft/fraud to the police, provide them with all the buyers contact details, photos etc.
Contact ebay via the phone option again and provide them with the crime ref number and request the case is left open for investigation of fraud.
Advise that you are planning to take the buyer to the small claims court or via the police route and request ebay provide you with an official copy of all emails sent between both buyer and seller.
Then update the ebay case with facts only, detailing the persons full name address and item number.
Take new photos of the received parts with compares to the items you sent.
The reason the seller has sent back a duff item rather than an empty box is that you can use the postage weight as evidence compared to your receipt when you sent the item back.
This is a known scam and has been going on a while.... (chances are its a young kid with no idea of what can happen next.) -- therefore the threats may scare them... but ebay cant normally reverse a refund. (you had a time frame to update the case saying item not received back.)
Good luck
eBay must have experience of this type of fraud given the other examples just on this thread...hopefully they have some sort of process to decide how to verify who is being deceitful. Good luck
What a tool box.
I had something similar a few years ago...a kid bought some Hayes Mags from me that were perfect. Then emailed me to say they were leaking and that the hoses were too short (if forgotten to add the lengths but he never asked) and aksed for a partial refund. In the end end I couldn't be bothered with the hassle so gave him some cash back.
I only use it as a last resort now. Sold a few bits this week and an still waiting fir one guy to pay...
Hope you get it sorted (although knowing what eBay are like, as the seller you'll be left high and dry).
Sounds like good advice from rickt.
ps.. dont forget that email address and name you have will more than likely be linked to a facebook account, linked in, twitter etc if would you like a photo of the person too...........
also... I cant see that there is anything wrong with arranging for someone to knock on the said persons door and ask for a swap of items due to their mistake in returning the wrong ones... 🙂
No returns does not mean he has no case at all. Distance selling regs and the simple fact he is stating they agree not as described means eBay will side with him.i don't know why they have the No returns option as then you could sell anything at all on eBay and whether it be as described or not there would be no come back.as said above take closer detailed pics and state in working condition.
As already pointed out, DSRs do not apply to private sales.
I know this is pointless now, but another way to protect yourself from the 'not as described' is to always state that 'viewing/inspection is welcome'(obviously not at your home address though).
This totally sucks for you and I hope you get it sorted. I have given up selling bike parts online these days.
update?
Update?