do 'results' influence your bike/kit buying choice ?

Nope

...and yet, Trek, Specialized, and GT are all brands with fairly prominent race teams. Makes you think, eh?

I suspect almost nobody goes out to buy a bike just because Rider X won Race Y on that brand's bike at the weekend, but if you follow e.g. the DH World Cup, it's probably likely that you're influenced in how you think/feel about brands based on what you see on the live streams and the surrounding media (YT, Insta, etc).

Results - probably not. But I'm sure the image of a brand has in the past. My first proper MTB was a Specialized - not doubt influenced by the profile of Jason McRoy at the time.

And an bit OT...

My first packet of fags in the 80's were John Player Specials - I watched a lot of F1 back then and had models of JPS Lotus F1 cars as a kid. Coincidence!? 🙂

(They were rank BTW - I 'smoked' 4 and never touched fags again!).

I suspect almost nobody goes out to buy a bike just because Rider X won Race Y on that brand’s bike at the weekend

I suspect you're probably wrong. The kids who pester their parents for a bike are doing so partly for this reason. I'd bet money sales of Specialised went up in Canada a couple of weeks ago.

If it didn’t, they wouldn’t do it.

Maybe not so much for people who have been riding for years, but for kids and people new to the sport, definitely.

Different industry, but Mercedes Benz sells a lot more cars since the F1 team has won a race or two.

Weirdly for me, my lad has no interest at all in a Commencal, despite it being pretty awesome in terms of results in DH... A Canyon Sender.... for some reason, he'd LOVE a Sender..

Nope, none of the MTB brands I own have won anything big as far as I'm aware.

A little bit, yes.
For example the Trust Message linkage fork was interesting to me. The first reviews were far from amazing, but if they'd have been used to get some proper results in racing it would have been a real eye opener.

Yes, but not in the way you mean.
I do race, and at races I look at other people's bikes and talk to them.
"He's fast, he knows what he's doing. What tyres has he got on?" and then next time I need tyres I consider those for that type of course.
Works both ways. "He's broken his rim, what rims are those? Let's avoid those kind then"
.
But in terms of advertising, media etc, no, mostly because I don't really read it

Results in themselves no, but the marketing yes.

No idea who won what on what brand of bike. So that's a no from me.

The question we all want to know is, what are you buying now, and what event was it in 😂

Weirdly for me, my lad has no interest at all in a Commencal, despite it being pretty awesome in terms of results in DH… A Canyon Sender…. for some reason, he’d LOVE a Sender..

Sender is the best looking of the current DH crop by far. Went and drooled over it on display at Ard Rock.

I suck at racing, but as an armchair fan, I have a lot of respect for those who are out-and-out racers, rather than lifestyle/youtubers. Troy and Luca seem to fit the bill perfectly.

Commencal - can you actually buy the new bike (as ridden by Pierron, Nicole etc) yet? Also many supremes seem to be cracking, with a questionably long wait for replacement. No good for the aspiring DHer on a budget.

Team presence at the races quite likely seeps into my brain but results I don’t think so. I watch all the World Cup downhill rounds and know who wins but if you quizzed me on who rode for which brand I think I’d be lucky to get 50% right. I guess being in the highlights and on the podium means the brand name is waved in front of me more.

Plus I’m not a downhill rider so there isn’t any direct link to me thinking ‘I want one of those’

i would say no, as there are some brands i like and some brands i dislike, some brands i like but wouldnt own, some brands i would never buy, mostly for no reason at all.

Equally i like certain riders for who they are, rather than what they ride. Jack Moir... what a geeza, but i would be hard pushed to buy a Canyon.

Oddly i supported Laurie Greenland more when he rode a Mondraker than now he rides a Santa Cruz.

And even if they won every race going, i still wouldnt buy an Intense.

Some bikes i would love to own and the results of the EWS reinforce my want, but i just cant/wont spend that much on one (Rocky Mountain Altitude being a prime example).

Advertising/influence is a bloody clever tool. You might not be in the market for something, but when the time arises certain brands are already lodged in your head, from hearing 'Commencal' 150 times a DH race is on TV, its a brand you would subconsciously go and check out.

I think Weeksy Jnr needs an Atherton DH and Enduro to keep him going in the coming months, forget all this results malarky and get over to Dyfi!

The question we all want to know is, what are you buying now, and what event was it in

Me, nothing... If someone wanted to swap my Trek for a Slash, i'd likely go for it... but i'm not actively looking for anytihng currently.

but if you quizzed me on who rode for which brand I think I’d be lucky to get 50% right.

Are you the target audience though? I don't mean, do you watch DH, I mean are the from the demographic at whom the advertising is pushed?

I suspect you’re probably wrong. The kids who pester their parents for a bike are doing so partly for this reason. I’d bet money sales of Specialised went up in Canada a couple of weeks ago.

Fair point, and I agree. I was thinking more along the lines of an adult making a purchase, although even then I'm sure there are fully grown people who think "I'll go get whatever Iles won on".

But what I was trying to say was that if you see a brand being successful, or looking rad, or having cool riders, or whatever -- that will influence your thinking in less direct ways, but which may still encourage you to buy from that brand. So even if you don't *think* you're buying e.g. Specialized because of Iles/Bruni, it's quite possible that, indirectly, subconsciously, you are.

@ayjaydoubleyou - the green and white Sender was an absolute stunner. I dont know if it comes it that colour to us mere mortals... but would pay good money to have it on my wall to look at 😀

Edit.... uh oh... https://www.canyon.com/en-gb/mountain-bikes/downhill-bikes/sender/sender-cfr-29-tld/3207.html?dwvar_3207_pv_rahmenfarbe=GN%2FWH

When Steve Peat was winning, Morzine was full of V10s, then Sam Hill came along and the place was full of Iron Horse Sundays, now it is full of Commencals, so it must be working!

But what I was trying to say was that if you see a brand being successful, or looking rad, or having cool riders, or whatever — that will influence your thinking in less direct ways, but which may still encourage you to buy from that brand. So even if you don’t *think* you’re buying e.g. Specialized because of Iles/Bruni, it’s quite possible that, indirectly, subconsciously, you are.

This +1

I haven't followed the racing since the Peaty, Minnar, Hill, Atherton era.

Would I still want an Orange if Steve Peat whipping a Patriot sideways over the jump into the Arena at Ft William wasn't etched into my memory from a hundred magazine articles and adverts? Same with Sam Hill on Specialized, or an Intense* because of the Atherton's. Whereas brands that weren't around back then just don't have the same pull. I'd quite like a Jeffsy, or a Spectral, but not in the same way I'd like a Five.

*yes, I know it said Muddy Fox on the side.

Any cafe frequented by roadies on a Sunday morning is pretty much chokka with bikes, clothing, shoes, pedals, glasses and helmets featured in the TdF coverage.

 it’s quite possible that, indirectly, subconsciously, you are.

Wait, are you saying that I don't look rad and cool on my Enduro..? 🤣

Dunno, but lack of results do.

When you see a good rider being held back by his or her machinery.

Someone mentioned Mondraker above, their male DH racers should be doing better than they have been and there are suggestions that the bike is an issue. Wonder how well Eleonora Farina might do if she was on a Commencal, V10 or Atherton?

Atherton's a good example I suppose, the word is it rides really well and Kolb & Hatton have done superbly this year... so if I were in the market for an expensive carbon DH bike I'd put it on the list now when I wouldn't have before TBH.

Intense are clearly doing something right with their bikes as well, if they get their high-pivot design to market I expect they'd sell quite well in the US at least with Gwin & Dak flying this year.

But of course hardly anyone buys DH bikes now, so it's another question as to whether DH race success means trail and enduro bikes from the same brands are going to offer the same advantage?

Results definitely sell bikes. The DH tracks and bikeparks have always been packed whatever bike was winning at the time from Orange 223's, to Iron Horse Sundays, to Demo 8's and Session's. You might not want a Commencal but there are hundreds of the bloody things at the races these days. There would probably be even more if availability wasn't an issue and everyone didn't know the new version was imminent.

Personally, I'd have a Sender. Not because of results but they're the nicest, cleanest looking DH bike out there.

I think STW is the wrong place to ask this question. It's full of beardy bridelway botherers who are all unique, contrarian renegades.

It wasn't a DH specific question.

I wonder if in this day and age, results in DH, Enduro, XC, Gravel, Road or whatever influences the decisions we as consumers make in terms of what we purchase.

My answer was DH specific because that's what I know and the fashionable bikes always massively outnumber anything obscure or unusual. I've never been a 'cyclist' so I've got no idea what the dirt roadies are up to.

And even if they won every race going, i still wouldnt buy an Intense.

May I ask why? I remember the release of the M1 way back when and wanted one soooo bad! Still do when I’m reminiscing to be honest.

I think STW is the wrong place to ask this question. It’s full of beardy bridelway botherers who are all unique, contrarian renegades

😂😂😂

Current elite mens top 20 overall:
Commencal (not available to buy yet)
Specialized (prototype, not available yet)
Trek
Santa cruz
Atherton
Cube
Pivot
Santa Cruz
Commencal (is Benoit coulange on the old ie current model?)
Saracen
Commencal (mucoff team again, so think its the new one)
Intense (prototype)
Atherton
Commencal (Suarez, old model?)
Specialised (Bruni on the old model, winter injury meant he didnt have time to test the new one)
Scott
Mondraker
Propain
Canyon
Canyon

Benoit and Angel are both on the new Commencal. I hope Max has ordered a hell of a production run for that one.

Answering the question at the top of the page, no. I don't really follow XC or DH cycling events and the bike I want is more of a general purpose one than a specific task job.

I bought a Stumpy FSR because it was XL, fitted well and did everything better than I could. I wanted a Bronson because it was an object of beauty and was more bike than I would ever need, rather like my lust for a Ducati 1098.

@doomanic - Intense... a totally irrational dislike for them. whenever i have looked at their bikes they seem to have out of date geo, awful colours and are pricey. I mean never say never, but as it stands, i wouldn't spend my cash on one.

My buddy hates everything about Privateer bikes... just says they look cheap and agricultural, which has some irony as he rides a Starling Murmur.

They aint nowt as queer as folk!

Current elite mens top 20 overall:

The Canyons would be higher if not for injury.

It's arguable that some of the other brands would be lower if not for the riders aboard them.

It wasn’t a DH specific question.

Not sure people care who's on what bike in any other discipline. XC is just the strongest legs (with good skillz), enduro the coverage is too shit to care, road bikes all look the same and brands only seem to matter in TTs or sprinting.

The Canyons would be higher if not for injury.

Quite a big IF in DH racing. Only 10 of the 18 people above Troy have managed to finish every race so far.

Quite a big IF in DH racing. Only 10 of the 18 people above Troy have managed to finish every race so far.

It's Troy though, come on.

I doubt results influence people's purchases much, on a conscious level, but brand image does subconsciously. Let's say you want to buy a gravel or adventure bike. Which brands do you associate with that genre? Salsa? Or Scott USA?

Salsa sponsor people to gravel race, and to ride around the place taking photos and writing inspiring blog posts about bikepacking trips. This creates a strong association in people's minds with that kind of riding and therefore people are more likely to consider that brand. It'll be the same for fast riders on Enduro bikes, but particularly road bikes. We may not actually think say, Pinarello are faster than anyone else, but we do consider them a serious performance brand of road bikes. Probably more than, say, Ribble Cycles.

We may not actually think say, Pinarello are faster than anyone else, but we do consider them a serious performance brand of road bikes. Probably more than, say, Ribble Cycles.

Dunno about anyone else but I consider Pinarello a triumph of sponsorship marketing over quality.

They look revolting, they're known to be heavier than the rivals and they have a certain ATGNI brand identity.

I'd take a Ribble any day.

Any other major road brand and I'd agree with you though 🙂

I’ve always wanted a Bianchi, and I’m sure a big part of that is romantic images of Coppi flying, and Fignon looking so icy cool

…and Pantani’s completely clean whoosh up the Alp.

One day.

No, but I do support brands who put money in to keep events going. Brands like Exposure and upgrade bikes have put loads of money and time into local races.

So no, but yes...

I'll also join the list of people who would never buy an Intense. I've seen so many people have grief with them. I've seen too many brand new frames that aren't straight. I've seen all the broken frames and lack of back up. As a company they always seem like a cowboy operation who are just winging it.

They've got the kind of heritage that money can't buy but that was luck more than anything. They had a dedicated DH bike built for racing when everyone else was riding their rigid XC bikes in every discipline. They made some iconic machines in the early days of a new sport but that hasn't translated into a desirable line of reliable bikes for me.

Oh and I almost forgot, let's name every frame after a gun and paint it like Ronald McDonald.

The last two bikes I bought new were a Planet-X Free Ranger and I'm pretty sure there are no sponsored riders using them. Also an Orbea Orca and there aren't any World Tour Teams riding Orbea bikes at the moment.

I got into Nukeproof bikes through being a Sam Hill fan, and the fact that I had a go on a mates 2012 Mega....
Now on my 3rd Mega so make of that what you will - oh and have a Nukeproof Scout too.
My Gravel bike is a Cannondale - I got it because it was a decent spec cheap gravel bike.

Racing and results of no interest

Bikes are bought on the basis of budget/value and being vaguely appropriate for the intended use.

I'm not sure I ever really bought much because it was "race winning" in any area of life.

I'm not a very competitive person in most respects. I like going fast, I like scenery, I don't care if I'm last to the top or bottom of the trail.

If I'm obsessed by anything it's by value/function/reliability/fitness for purpose. I ride a Specialized and Planet X and drive a well maintained but old diesel Ford. Profile probably fits 😂

Results influence me after I've filtered them by price low to high.

Edits on youtube have more influence, but usually they leave me dreaming about bikes I can't afford to buy, Chris Akrigg, Danny Macaskill, Ali Clarkson, Fabio Wibmer, etc.

Results influence me after I’ve filtered them by price low to high.

😂 In fairness I think that also works for me.

I’ve never seen an Intense bike that I’ve liked the look of. Even in their winningest days I always thought they looked fugly. If they were back winning every week, I’d still be out. Also, that Sender in toothpaste green looks… meh.

Nope. Not in the slightest.

yes, but not in the way you think.

If daughter gets her A level results today and heads off to University, with me being firmly in the squeezed income / not rich but also getting minimum loan and needing to top up fully - my buying choice is going to be severely influenced. Like - whatever is cheapest, do I really need to buy it, can't I fix it from the spares bin / zipties!?!

I think STW is the wrong place to ask this question. It’s full of beardy bridelway botherers who are all unique, contrarian renegades

And to prove the point I have just bought a 2007 Giant track frameset to build up a very light tracklocross bike. Never seen anyone riding a Giant track bike off road and don't even know what the riders rode at any tracklocross races.

at any tracklocross races.

at a what now ?

Results don't influence my purchasing but they can sometimes help. I think brand awareness is the bigger thing about racing.

Think of YT who were just a slightly niche direct sales brand who a lot of people weren't sure about. Having Aaron Gwin riding for them made them seem a far more legitimate company in many eyes. I think Nukeproof were similar with their race team, they went from CRC own brand (cheap and cheerful) to proper manufacturer who people will choose not just because they're cheap.

I don't think individual results will be a big influence but as mentioned with Commencal, if there's a clear trend of a specific bike being that good then people will notice and start buying. If it were just Amaury Pierron winning on it then I don't think it would have had the same effect, he's so fast he'd likely win on any bike.

I think Nukeproof were similar with their race team, they went from CRC own brand (cheap and cheerful) to proper manufacturer who people will choose not just because they’re cheap.

I had the first Mega 290 and it was good geometry but pedaled shit and was a bit unrefined. Seemed like Sam Hill was winning a little bit in spite of the bikes at that time.

Their current bikes seem a big step up and the Mega and Giga are right among the top of the class.

Innes Graham getting a podium at the EWS as a privateer on his Giga defo helped keep it on my wishlist TBH.

For me it sometimes works the other way round. Despite a teams success and how nice the bikes are I don't want to be associated with that and seen as a crazy fan boy.
For example, Trek Road bikes, during the Armstrong era the increase in sales was massive for that company and everyone seemed to have one and for that reason there was no appeal for me despite them making some nice bikes. But clearly it worked on many others as their sales increased.

I'm a strictly, 'Sort by Discount first' purchaser so my answer would be no. If I can get a 70% discount on a model that's 2 or 3 years out of date I'm happy with that.

However, I like to think that if I ever moved somewhere where the trails were on such a level that each and every ride was really pushing me technically I'd think very carefully about my next bike purchase.

It's not really results that catch my eye but a bike that shows signs of being a really good all-rounder. Forbidden did this recently when Eric Olsen bikepacked between EWS rounds, not to mention the fact that Connor Fearon was riding the same bike at World Cup DH events.

So yeah, it's on my radar thanks to racing but the other two bikes I'd consider (a Nicolai G1 or a custom Starling Sturn) I don't really associate with racing although I'm sure people are competing on them.

Not really. But Degenkolb won Paris Roubaix on my bike (Defy Advanced SL in a medium), so it's a keeper for that reason alone.

Given the unattainability of motorsports equipment for ordinary drivers, I think it is surprising that one can basically ride a pro bike (albeit with significant expenditure) without issue. Two of my bikes are pro-level frames which have won tour stages or classics. My car isn't going to win anything 😀

I'm trying to think which bike I would buy if I found a suitcase full of money and had to spend it today. That bike would be a Geometron G1 and I'm not aware of anyone who races one. They have enough positives (for me) to outweigh any marketing or race results.

I got my first Yeti in 2012 because of the race results they got in the late 80s and early 90s. So "yes" I guess.

Given the unattainability of motorsports equipment for ordinary drivers, I think it is surprising that one can basically ride a pro bike (albeit with significant expenditure) without issue. Two of my bikes are pro-level frames which have won tour stages or classics. My car isn’t going to win anything

That's an interesting one.

I'd say us punters can actually have superior equipment than the pros, as they're bound by sponsor deals - so my bike with an EXT shock might be more capable than a pro's bike with Fox or RS.

Jared Graves said in a podcast that he was basically uncompetitive when Spesh made him ride their hard compound or thin carcass tyres in the EWS. I've owned some of them and I absolutely believe him. Lethal ****ing things.

Bit theoretical as I still ride much slower, but y'know.

I remember when Gwin won MSA few years ago on some new Onza tyre they were sold out forever!

I think for DH bikes, the UK is the wrong place to gauge this, as someone else said, you wanna check what bikes are in the queue at the lifts in Morzine, Chatel and Morgins.

Enduro Bikes is an odd one, the Specialized Enduros are everywhere but their team isn't really successful. I have no clue on XC, Marathon, Gravel or Road!

I’d say us punters can actually have superior equipment than the pros,

Up until not very long ago you could have vastly better brakes than the road pro teams. Shimano even had an ad campaign around it.

You can still have significantly lighter bikes.

I’d say us punters can actually have superior equipment than the pros, as they’re bound by sponsor deals – so my bike with an EXT shock might be more capable than a pro’s bike with Fox or RS.

For the truly nerdy, there is an extra level to delve into - who is sharpie-ing the logos off their tyres, forks with the wrong stickers on, and the occasional rider who is at least partly unconstrained by sponsors, like Pidcock's XC bike.

If someone has gone to substantial effort to avoid using the pile of sponsor correct free stuff, that speaks volumes.

The last two bikes I bought new were a Planet-X Free Ranger and I’m pretty sure there are no sponsored riders using them.

Marketing comes in different flavours to appeal to different types of people. There are those who are attracted to bargains and cheap stuff, and that's the market Planet X is after.

Other brands are considered aspirational, and they sponsor race teams because other people are attracted to prestige and 'desirability'. And you often don't want one brand to cross those two groups because it dilutes the image. Take Saracen for instance - I'm sure it made business sense at the time to become a Halfords brand, but whilst it may have shifted units it tarnished the brand image for a long time. Now that they have a DH team, you must surely appreciate they are not racing DH on Halfords BSOs - and this is how they get their message across.

In motor racing this has of course been big forever. Take Honda for example - they make the Jazz, famously the old people's car, and the Accord, about as boring a car as you could get. If they slapped an R badge on a Civic just based on that you'd think they are try-hards. But they also have a boy-racer/car modding/Japanese hot-rod thing going on, and sponsoring race teams is a big part of that. So then suddenly the Civic type R is a cool car. Image is very malleable, but not always by the brand themselves.

Enduro Bikes is an odd one, the Specialized Enduros are everywhere but their team isn’t really successful.

Doesn't necessarily matter. The number of people who follow DH racing is tiny. But the number of people walking into a bike shop seeing a huge poster of some pro clearly at a race on a Specialized is much larger. Most would not know if that rider had mediocre results or not - I don't think I would even recognise them.

No.

Can't even begin to think how I would afford some of the overinflated, overhyped stuff, which a lot of folk seem to think they need, even though the kit outweighs their riding abilities.

eMTB bros at BPW comes to mind!!

Budget and value rule.

The Spesh Enduro is arguably a genre-defining product and a brand in itself.

And I guess they're spending all their racing money on Loic, Finn and the XC lot.

Pidcock's wins did lead me to browsing the BMC Fourstroke out of curiosity as I'd never heard of it or seen one before, so I guess that did influence me to some extent in that it became something to consider.

That said, I have no budget for a new bike let alone FS so it's all a pipedream anyway!  & that model seems to be restricted to using their own 80mm dropper.

No, it's price, availability and ability to demo before purchase for me.

You could probably swap all of the pros onto each others bikes, and with a bit of adjustment, they'd all perform similarly.
It's more so the person, not the bike, dictating performance at the very top level.

If anything, this is quite cyclical and just pushes up prices further - winning or losing at competition.
Having to pay for a pro team throughout the season has to be paid for somehow by the brand.

A Canyon Sender…. for some reason, he’d LOVE a Sender..

perhaps there is a rider he admires who rides a canyon.

perhaps there is a rider he admires who rides a canyon.

Nah, we both enjoy watching riders like Finn Illes and Daprela, just because of how they ride and their edgey riding all the time.

@doomanic – Intense… a totally irrational dislike for them. whenever i have looked at their bikes they seem to have out of date geo, awful colours and are pricey. I mean never say never, but as it stands, i wouldn’t spend my cash on one.

Blimey! I bought my Sniper because it felt pretty modern and was one of the less garish colourways! And because they are direct was a lot better value than others with similar components.

It hasn't snapped yet either, which is a bonus. Had a bit more niche appeal than my Spesh.

This is what I think when I hear Canyon Sender...

And yes, yes I would.

I'd say Canyon who might otherwise be seen as cheap catalog bikes, have legitimized themselves through racing more than any other brand. YT too, went big on Gwin and their prices climbed soon after. That said, Nukeproof will forever be a cheapo CRC brand in my mind, despite having maybe the most series wins of any bike on the EWS

Not for me. I dont think shand have a race team