[Closed] Do MTB riders make better roadies?

MTB riders that go roadie have excellent bike handling skills.

I bet you find you get your arse handed to you by proper roadies on descents. The speeds some of those guys hit (and maintain) are mad

I bet you find you get your arse handed to you by proper roadies on descents. The speeds some of those guys hit (and maintain) are mad

not necessarily. as somebody who went from mtb-road and seen a few others go that way they have terrible posture/position on a bike, no group riding skills and definitely a lack of endurance/fitness, something that comes with saddle time and if you dont ride with other good riders you will never become a proper roadie.
i see a lot of chubby riders with their stems too short and too high noodling around on their own or in similar groups (spread across the road not a nice tight group). i presume a lot of them are mtb’ers.

Most mountain bikers would get left for dead by "proper" roadies. The speeds and constant level of effort those guys can maintain are hard to replicate on a mtb. Also descending is a different ball game on the road.

Someone who was an excellent roadie could transfer pretty easy to mountain biking I'd have thought. Good fitness would mean more energy and concentration to improve on the techy bits. Unlikely they'd be trundling round the Glentress red in 4 hours stopping for a fag break at the top. More likely doing hill reps and smashing the downhills.

Getting speed wobbles at 39mph the other day did give me the willies

Pah, wait till you're had it at 55mph, 150 miles into a 220 mile ride, I was nearly in tears...

griffiths1000 - Member

i get the feeling all that pumping up twisty single track and fast gnarly descents give you a good kick start to the world of roadie......

if mountain biking was really like that, then maybe this would be an interesting idea.

but back here in reality, most mtb rides stop for a nice rest at the top of climbs; get the sandwiches out, take some photo's, check facebook, faff with bike, talk shite for 15mins, etc.

(repeat at the bottom of the hill)

which is all great fun, and very sociable, but not a great fitness-foundation for road riding.

terrible posture/position on a bike, no group riding skills and definitely a lack of endurance/fitness

I went roadie for a bit, no problems with the endurance (lots of commuting), but the fine control of pedal inputs needed to stay 4 inches of someones wheel was something that needed a bit of practice.

In crit races, I found I made up significant amount of time in tight corners, but this only worked if i had an uninterrupted run through the corner, i.e. being at the back or the front.

However, this failed to work in the Crystal Palace crits, which I found very very hard, because everyone had pretty good bike handling skills AND fitness.

If you want to be fast, on MTB or road, you need both.

[i]Do MTB riders make better roadies?[/i]

Depends,it's all about yir average speed init 😛

Pah, wait till you're had it at 55mph, 150 miles into a 220 mile ride, I was nearly in tears...

You must have a massive Penis.

ahwiles - Member

griffiths1000 - Member

i get the feeling all that pumping up twisty single track and fast gnarly descents give you a good kick start to the world of roadie......

if mountain biking was really like that, then maybe this would be an interesting idea.

but back here in reality, most mtb rides stop for a nice rest at the top of climbs; get the sandwiches out, take some photo's, check facebook, faff with bike, talk shite for 15mins, etc.

(repeat at the bottom of the hill)

which is all great fun, and very sociable, but not a great fitness-foundation for road riding.

So your a roadie then? 😆

I seem to remember Paul Sherwen mentioned it once, when referring to an Alpine descent.

You must have a massive Penis.

do they cause speed wobbles?

jam bo - Member

You must have a massive Penis.

do they cause speed wobbles?

No but excellent for willy waving 😆

@ Jam bo, They can be a contributing factor. 😀

Mostly fitness.. I reckon an average MTBer would have his arse handed to him on a plate by even the most average of club roadie.

fasthaggis - Member

Do MTB riders make better roadies?

Depends,it's all about yir average speed init

Of course 😉

Getting speed wobbles at 39mph the other day did give me the willies

An MTBer would simply manual their way out of it 🙂

Seriously though - there are MTBers and MTBers. Not all MTBers faff about all ride long.

It would be interesting to compare the MTBer committed to pace on rides (possibly even wearing lycra) to a roadie. I suspect that a roadie who isn't used to singletrack would suffer more MTBing than an MTBer going road racing. But an MTBer might struggle with the constant effort of road riding, with less time to give your legs a rest.

Six and two threes innit, decent riders make decent riders. I never really had much of a problem riding in a tight group from the off, it felt rather natural and much more relaxing than riding down a techy trail in a big train like tends to happen on the DH bike. Saying that though I do sometimes struggle when the MPH'z get high and you start cornering at 30-40mph, some of the guys I ride with are insanely fast and smooth and I reckon given a bit of time would be as comfortable off-road. Never underestimate an old racer though, they can still throw down a huge amount of power that will def embarrass a lot of mountain bikers, at the same time don't expect all roadies to be insanely fit, a lot of 'em aren't, indeed on my first group ride they thought it'd be funny to stick me on the front and try and make me suffer...I wasn't doing much of the suffering that day 😉

as a part-time roadie from mtb roots, i've never had a speed wobble. Top recorded speed is 62mph so far, so my conclusion is mtbers are better at riding down hills.

monkeyfudger - Member

Six and two threes innit, decent riders make decent riders. I never really had much of a problem riding in a tight group from the off, it felt rather natural and much more relaxing than riding down a techy trail in a big train like tends to happen on the DH bike. Saying that though I do sometimes struggle when the MPH'z get high and you start cornering at 30-40mph, some of the guys I ride with are insanely fast and smooth and I reckon given a bit of time would be as comfortable off-road. Never underestimate an old racer though, they can still throw down a huge amount of power that will def embarrass a lot of mountain bikers, at the same time don't expect all roadies to be insanely fit, a lot of 'em aren't, indeed on my first group ride they thought it'd be funny to stick me on the front and try and make me suffer...I wasn't doing much of the suffering that day

Well said monkeyfudger 😉

[i]decent riders make decent riders.[/i]

true dat

as a part-time roadie from mtb roots, i've never had a speed wobble. Top recorded speed is 62mph so far, so my conclusion is mtbers are better at riding down hills.

My noodly Carbon Planet X road bike might have had something to do with it 😉

i see a lot of chubby riders with their stems too short and too high

As someone with a legitimate* need for a relatively high stem (handlebars pretty much level with saddle) I'd be interested to know what the criteria for 'too high' is. Fashion? 8)

*legitimate as in I can't/won't do the god knows how many hours of pilates is required for me to ride 5 hours without any discomfort from a herniated L5/S1 disc.

Do MTB riders make better roadies than what? Pastry chefs? Barristers? MTBers get pretty fit and might be able to climb ok, but even XC racing is all about short hard bursts and periods of recovery. That doesn't prepare you well for sustained hard efforts.

*legitimate as in I can't/won't do the god knows how many hours of pilates is required for me to ride 5 hours without any discomfort from a herniated L5/S1 disc

T4/5 for me and one in the neck, the chin 2" off the front tire and eyes on the road in front definitely the best position for dodgy backs. 🙄

I've MTB'd for 20+ years and after a few mates went to the dark side, I went for a bike fit for a new road bike a couple of years ago at the pedal precision place in the cycling centre.

After analysing my pedal stroke and complimenting it the guy there said that MTB'ers pedal more efficiently than cyclists going straight onto road bikes. Roadies tend to mash the pedals, whereas MTB'ers, (particularly clipped in ones), pull and push round the stroke.

This is one of those "how long is a piece of string" type questions to which the answer is "it depends".

The top guys in either discipline will be able to transfer many of their skills and fitness over but things like DH take a while to build up the skill set and even within MTBing itself not everyone does pure DH courses.

Riding in a fast group on the road takes a while to get used to and a long while to get good at, sitting at 50kph a few centimetres behind the wheel in front takes quite a bit of concentration.

If you're the type who moans because they've missed the up-lift bus and will have to ride uphill then you'd really struggle with the amount of effort needed for a typical club ride. Similarly if you're a roadie who freaks out at the merest hint of gravel or lumpy roads then you aren't going to like a typical trail centre route.

For me the two disciplines complement one another.

There is a lot more scope for messing about off road, more shits and giggles and it is more difficult to assess and compare your fitness level (average speeds mean nothing given the range of terrain). Road riding is dull and therefore attracts the types who get obsessed by performance. Speed / endurance are also the only real measure of performance where as in off road or even trials or bmx bike skills are the key i.e. If I could land a back flip I wouldn’t care how I looked in lycra or what average speed I could achieve over x miles!

Sagan and Chuckles spring to mind, both of them started out off road and have done alright.

Once you get to the top echelons of either sport its a different world though,
Lots of very specialised and focused training.

Would it be the same comparing a sprinter to a long distance runner as its all just running, putting one foot in front of the other isnt it?

I reckon MTBing gives you good bike handling skills and explosive power.

No

They're probably more likely to say "Hello" as you pass, so on the strength of that...

yes.

[quote=jam bo ]as a part-time roadie from mtb roots, i've never had a speed wobble. Top recorded speed is 62mph so far, so my conclusion is mtbers are better at riding down hills.

ooops. looks like a did gatsby. 62 mph cherry picked rogue reading.

56.4mph will have to do

Sagan and Chuckles spring to mind, both of them started out off road and have done alright

But countless others started on the track, or racing cross, or were just roadies.

It really is just that good riders are good riders.

Look at the womens where the Marianne Vos or Pauline Ferrand-Prévot who are multiple world champions accross track, MTB and road.

Based on reading this......still no

Back to the op..
From what ive seen id say it depends if you have a natural inclination to take everything far to seriously.

Ryder started as a mtber, however for ever good 'un there is a duff one Miguel Martinez springs to mind. Never really made it as a roadie despite his dad being okay.

Plenty of current roadies do mtbing in the winter, so as others have said its complementary.

mountain biking helps with cross and maybe very short sharp road climbs but otherwise unsuprisingly roadies make better roadies.

When I was seriously into my MTB racing I would get dropped easily by a Cat 2 rider on the road. Switch it the other way around though and off road I could drop him. I think if you have focussed solely on one type of racing you can't really transfer between the two readily. If you are a good mountain biker who has also road raced for many years, though, you'd be fine.

Define better... Faster? Safer? Better at avoiding getting off when you get out of shape?

I'm a life-long roadie that started riding mountain bikes around 20 years ago during the 1990s boom. At the time, I remember noticing how much slower most new cyclists went down hill - I put it down to the fact that I was just more comfortable riding a bike at speed.

I'm not sure there are many mtb skills that benefit road riding - possibly pedaling technique can be improved... Bunny-hopping grids etc is just riding and it winds me up to hear cycling commentators attributing "bike handling" on road to experience off road!

I think MTBers can learn more about technique, energy saving, efficiency and group etiquette/safety from road riding...

But really, this is an utterly pointless thread with no definitive answer, so I'm not even going to post a comment... 😉

Did a flat-ish Gorrick once with a guy who was much faster than me on road, and lighter too. We finished very close, because despite being a decent bike handler by road standards, and having MTBed off and on, he just didn't have the technical skills. I made up loads of time on the singletrack bits.

Had it been a course with big climbs he'd have wiped the floor with me I'm sure.

MTB riders that go roadie have excellent bike handling skills.

I thought that too until Chris Froome single handedly blew it out the water with his innate inability to remain vertical when the road gets moist.

As someone who is 'half chips half rice' I reckon that if you want to build decent base of fitness it's easier to do it on the road bike. You're also less likely to stop at the top / bottom of hills and time lost to faff is also minimised.

I remember reading an interview with Cuddles about how long and hard it was to change his body from a short burst power type to an endurance type athlete required for road racing.

I also recall that Schuter (?) spent a chunk of the end of last year competing in road races to help with training & endurance?

In a real world, bogo weekend warrior type rider (as in the majority on here) I don't think there's a lot of difference fitness wise; as there are plenty of 'roadies' who are happy to plod along at 14-15mph on their rides, just like the MTB'ers who like to stop and chat and 'live' for the down hills. Those who put in more time / effort and ride a few times a week the skills separate, the regular MTB'er will be better off road, the roadie will invariably climb better and be able to maintain a constant effort for longer. IMHO of course.

As someone with a legitimate* need for a relatively high stem (handlebars pretty much level with saddle) I'd be interested to know what the criteria for 'too high' is. Fashion?

Stem height and aerodynamic position have a relationship. A good road rider can hold a reasonable aerodynamic position for protracted periods of time with a good power output. If you can only do one and not the other (or neither) you are likely not a good rider if defined by ability to get from A to B quickly or hold onto a group. As I slip into middle age by ability to do this for the exact same reasons as your are diminishing quickly.

Plenty of road bikes are slammed to look fast leaned against the cafe wall but I reckon for most 8-10cm is a 'fast' bike in real life. Level doesn't make you one of the cool kids but if it gets you out then why not.

At the pro level I reckon it's of little relevance - a good committed rider could handle pretty much any discipline that suits their psychology and physiology.

At the participant punter level no way would any casual mtb-er cope with a half serious road club run - they'd be blowing out their ass after 1hr and gagging for a litre of "sports drink".
Hobbyist mtb really is the lowest level as regards handling skills and fitness, however many gadgets and add-ons you may have most are still just bifters on bling bikes 😛

Definitely better from a personal POV; my road cycling buddy is faster than me but badly lacks confidence on descents where I usually pass him. 22 years of mountain biking has given me more confidence in the bike, though not necessarily more skill!

I do road and mtb roughly 50/50.If you take out technical descents I find it much easier to get a Strava front page result off road.

Road riding is dull and therefore attracts the types who get obsessed by performance.

Hmm, silly me, there was I enjoying road riding and yet not being obsessed with performance.

By dull do you actually mean 'requires a slightly longer attention span'? 8)

Stem height and aerodynamic position have a relationship. A good road rider can hold a reasonable aerodynamic position for protracted periods of time with a good power output.

Yeah fair point, I realised this after I'd posted. I guess I'm just touchy having finally conceded defeat and flipped my stem up!

I thought that too until Chris Froome single handedly blew it out the water with his innate inability to remain vertical when the road gets moist.

the skills are different though, being able to pick a line through a rock garden or BigAir won't help on a road bike - the only thing that does transfer is cornering

the only thing that does transfer is cornering

Dya reckon? I've introduced a few MTBers to roadbiking and it takes them ages to get the confidence to load the front wheel.

Mountain bike cornering is more about distributing weight to get the most out of any available grip, and being able to control drift/slip etc.

I wouldn't even say line choice is particularly transferable as the 'racing line' isn't always the best on a mountain bike...

It's taken me a long time to get comfortable going fast around corners on a road bike. The speeds you build up to can be quite daunting but they get easier as you get used to it. I'm a having a mental flap at about 50mph at the moment and comfort braking.

On the MTB it's similar but usually based on the surface. Coming down off the top of the Mosettes chairlift in the snow a few years ago scared the crap out of me at a fraction of the speed it'd bother me on the road and it took a day or two before I was comfortable getting off the brakes on the loose rocky fireroads in the alps too.

I'd guess that a rider at the very top of their game would do well in both disciplines. Nino Schurter did a great job in the two races he did for Orica-Greenedge last year and was part of the lead group on the biggest mountain stage until a mechanical dropped him off.

I've been MTBing for the past 20 years and road biking for the last 10. The only advantage I reckon I had moving to the road was being more comforable on descents. I'm constantly surprised how afraid some roadies get by high speed descents becuase compared to blasting down the side of a welsh mountain most road descents are quite tame.

But really, this is an utterly pointless thread with no definitive answer, so I'm not even going to post a comment...

....ahh my cover is blown 🙄 .....but isn't being utterly pointless the key to a good thread?? 😆

I'm constantly surprised how afraid some roadies get by high speed descents becuase compared to blasting down the side of a welsh mountain most road descents are quite tame.

It's a confidence thing.

I'd grown up as a mountain biker and always loved decending. And as comes with the teritory of being a relatively slow crap mountain biker you fall off a lot but when you do it tends to be fairly low speed and you know it's going to happen. Any you generally get up and you and the bike are fine. You also nearly crash a lot where you lose it a bit but manage to save it.

When you start road biking you suddenly start going very fast down hill but it seems easy because there aren't any rocks. Then you fall off the road bike and realise how little warning you get, how much it hurts and how much expensive kit you trash. You don't nearly fall off a road bike very often, one min it's ok and then you are lying on the floor clutching your shoulder. Then it takes a long time to get confidence in the front wheel back.

I had my first big road off this winter, lost the front wheel on a patch of ice while decending. Ouchy. Took warmth and dry roads before I stopped decending like Bradley Wiggins.

there are plenty of 'roadies' who are happy to plod along at 14-15mph on their rides

I averaged 10.4mph on my road ride yesterday. I'd have loved to average 14-15 mph.

In my defence the 79 miles had 2500m of ascent (including a few 1 in 5s that I just can't seem to do more than a few tens of meters on) and twisty poorly surfaced 1 in 4 road descents freak me out.

I'm also a mediocre MTBer though.

compared to blasting down the side of a welsh mountain most road descents are quite tame.

Only if you mince. Road descents are scary because of how fast you can go, and how quickly the wheels let go. I have done lots of both, and I back off on the road bike when I get to the point where an impact would kill me. On the mtb the harder trails are rocky and steep, and that keeps your speed down so if you hit a tree it's only at 17mph rather than 50.

This thread is useless without 'him' (thank gawd for kill file 😀 ).

compared to blasting down the side of a welsh mountain most road descents are quite tame.

What a ridiculous statement. The most scared and adrenalin fuelled I've ever been was descending Col Du Joux Plane in a rainstorm on a road bike. Utterly terrifying.

Oh dear, not another one!

Do MTB riders make better roadies?

Once they've finally ditched the camelback, baggies and helmet peak, sorted out their riding positions, got the miles in... etc.

As has been said though, really depends on the individual, plenty of people in both categories happy to pootle around between coffee and cake / beer stops.

About the only thing I've found personally that I get from mtb that benefits on the road is being comfortable when the bike gets out of shape. So heavy breaking, two wheel slides, sketchy road conditions, etc. (But then I know mtb riders who aren't comfortable with that sort of thing!)

I read an article once that said MTB(xc) riders put out higher power due to the terrain but roadies avg higher due to the constant peddling. What's the cliche as well, MTB'ers that don't ride road have no legs and roadies that don't ride MTB have no soul 🙂

When I coach roadies, the single most transferable skill from mtb is cornering. Good myb riders corner confidently and are used to looking far beyond the immediate apex.

Good bike handlers will do fine in any discipline. There isn't a huge difference between a cross race and an XC race to be honest.

I've been on mtb rides with my road club before and it's true than some fast ones on the road aren't so off road as they can't cope with the constant acceleration and have poor bike handling.
However the fastest 2 road riders I know are also the 2 fastest off road as they have both have amazing fitness and bike handling.

I get my arse handed to me on a 17 / 18 club run by one guy who has bought a decent mtb this year.

On the 2 off road rides I have done with him I have managed to return the compliment. He is now looking at new kit , what tyres for.... etc , when alot of it is down to confidence and time on the bike.

On a road ride I struggle to keep a steady output,I like going banzai on the steeper climbs then pay for it later on high speed flat sections ( 20+ ). Still don't entirely trust the others I ride with as some calls dont get passed back and there can be some swerving around manholes. Seem to struggle when on the front to keep the pace similar and either split the group or back everyone up .

Also on the road I am quite polite and do drop off to ' pull back ' others who are dropped out the group. I find that hard to slow to let them get on my wheel , then steadily accelerate to overspeed the main group and get everyone back together .

Decending , nothing in it. Although the roadies who ride sports motorbikes tend to be pretty fearless on the fast decents .

FWIW I have a roadie mate who will leave me for dead climbing on the road and scares me trying to hold his wheel downhill on a road bike.

He's had a boardman full sus for 18 months or so. On non technical climbs he's capable of kicking my arse, downhill it's a different story, I can lose him with ease on my hardtail when we're descending and twice he's hurt himself pretty badly trying to follow me down stuff (and I'm not Sam Hill by any means!)

My 2 cents is road fitness translates better to mtb than the other way around but good road descending/ bike handing means little for mtb. It takes time (& a certain mindset) to be comfortable with getting loose like mtb descending requires!

My 2 cents is road fitness translates better to mtb than the other way around but good road descending/ bike handing means little for mtb. It takes time (& a certain mindset) to be comfortable with getting loose like mtb descending requires!

That's the conclusion i was leaning towards.

FOr me personally I've done road rides and MTB rides with a bunch of 7-8 lads locally. They're active roadies and minor MTBers.

Out of the bunch, I'm one of if not the slowest roadie... but I'm one of the faster MTBers. I even seem to climb and flat better than the roadies when on the MTb, so it's not all about skills/handling... I don't know the reason in all honesty.

I think someone said it above somewhere. Road fitness is often about long steady efforts, they talk about getting in a rhythm when climbing, mtb is often lots of little spurts of energy, if a climb is rough it's hard to pedal a steady rhythm the whole time because you're lifting the bike up over roots and rocks etc plus off road climbs are often far steeper in sections than some road climbs

If you mtb more then your legs might cope with this sort of effort better (along with better handling and probably line choice!)

Back on the MTB today after a couple of weeks of road only. Amazing how quickly you adapt from one riding style to another, felt strange at first, different riding position, muscles and technique. Must say i would prefer log slow climb and a 25mph max decent down a piece of single-track any day to a sprint and 40mph on a bit of tarmac! Fine to try the dark side for a change though. 😉

are all these comments still based on your 4mile almost flat commute griffiths1000? 😉

amedias - Member

are all these comments still based on your 4mile almost flat commute griffiths1000?

Some nice flat bits but not this [url= https://www.strava.com/activities/290474575/segments/6820855530 ]Burray Bends Rising[/url]

Do it 4 times a day and managed second to top time on wednesday,just the fastest lycra clad speed shoes wearing roadiie in the area ahead of me- a balding 40+ shirt, trousers & shoes wearing MTBer, KOM next time maby??? 😆

amedias you ever re-build that Kona A?

amedias you ever re-build that Kona A?

Built it as an almost exact copy of my original one but with discs, but then sadly not fixed after it [url= http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/stw-group-hug-required-frame-snapped- ]snapped[/url], I gave the back end to someone else who had one for spares as I couldn't find a spare front end anywhere, really miss that quirky old bike!

It had a good innings though and got ridden hard!

Bummer, at leas it died doing what it was made for!

yeah, it's joined a long list of frames KIA under me 🙁

Most times these comparisons aren't comparing like with like though.

I reckon a 'full-on' XC mountain biker is going to be a fitter rider than a 'full-on' road cyclist. You only have to listen to the incredulous comments from ex-roadies when commentating on XC mtb races on the TV, about how high and sustained the riders heart rates are, etc.

If that was the case, then why are they not hitting the roads for the big bucks?

http://www.nicolecooke.com/index.php/en/sponsors

Macavity, try as I might I can't quite work out what you're trying to demonstrate with that link, care to elaborate a bit as I'm clearly missing something obvious 😳

If that was the case, then why are they not hitting the roads for the big bucks?

maybe they don't enjoy it as much ?