[Closed] Do i need to dish this wheel?

Spoke tensions will be markedly different on either side but should be broadly similar round the wheel for each side unless major truing has been done.  Don’t let that give you too much headache.

What are you trying to do?  Unless you have an asymmetric frame (rare) then if the wheel is not dished you will see why it’s a problem as soon as you try to but it back in the frame after fitting the tyre...

If all you’re doing is truing then forget all about dish and just establish the centre of the problem and work on that and maybe a spike or two either side if necessary. You’ll want to release a little tension the side it’s kinked toward and increase on the side it’s kinked away from.

Thanks so much.

I took it to my lbs to get relaced but 4 or 5 spokes came lose after 3 rides.

I bought a tension meter and they were all very low so i tightened them all to about 1100n.

But i think thats ruined the dish and despite all spokes being equal tension theres still a distinct wobble.

Your advice will be very gratefully received!

Thanks again

I'd take it back to the shop as a first option.

Equal tension is a bit of a unicorn. It never really exists when everything is new, and certainly not after damage has been trued out.  When new, it’s like most mechanical things, you want pretty close but spot on is unlikely to happen.  Say, 10% tolerance.  Think about how you repair damage with truing.  Essentially you are increasing tension locally to pull a dent out.  Releasing a little on the other side first should help it even out but it’s not going to be as close as it was.

The two sides of the wheel will be fundamentally different tensions to each other to begin with.

If I understand what you’ve done correctly and you’ve gone round and tightened every single spine to the same tension, you’ve got a problem.  How did you arrive at the ‘1100’ number?  If DT have published a tension number for the rim, that is the maximum limit.  It’s common practice to build the tight side close to the limit but it leaves you no where to run if you need to correct.  So, you need to get the hub over to the non-drive side to get the centreline of the hub+cassette under the centre of the rim.  Start releasing each non drive side spoke a turn at a time going round the wheel. You’ll probably need to go quite a few times round.  Once the dish is fixed, if you’re going to use a tension meter check where you are now and note it.  Then check how true the wheel is.  Make adjustments as necessary.  Check you’re stull reasonably happy with tension and then get some good thick gloves and go round the wheel gripping handfuls of spokes ans squeezing as hard as you can. You should get some notable pinging noises.  This is called ‘detensioning’ and is probably what your LBS missed out.  Once you’ve been round a few times and you’re not getting any more creaking or pinging, check dish and true again. They may need fixing. Repeat until it’s stable.

This isn’t a quick job until you have the hang of it which usually takes quite a few wheels.  It would almost be as quick to dismantle and rebuild from scratch in this case which is probably what a good wheel builder would do when presented the scenario.  The tension gauge you’ve bought can speed things up a bit but it’s not really necessary.  A stand and a dishing stick are both more important than a tension gauge, and they can be managed without, too...

In the first place, taking it back would have been a good option but if you’ve substantially altered the tensions then it’s now not possible unless you’re going to pay them to rebuild it...

In your case I'd back all the spokes off until you can see 2 threads out of the nipple. Go round the wheel repeatedly 2 turns first, then one turn until the spokes are lightly tightened. If the wheel was built with the correct length spokes this should get the dish very close, note you've not touched the tension meter yet. Get the rim true at this stage using vincienup's suggestion then do the final tensioning. Don't forget to do some stress reliving a couple of times otherwise you'll get the same problem with the spokes loosening off.

If the rim is actually bent a bit, you'll not get very even tension all around the wheel, I believe that pro builders aim for about 10% variance over the spokes on one side with new components, you'll be unlikely to get this close, use the tension meter more to make sure that nothing is too damagingly tight. The Wheelpro spoke calculator gives an estimate of the different spoke tensions for the dish, IIRC the last one I built was about 66% higher on the drive side to get the right dish. Also Sheldon Brown has quite a decent page on wheelbuilding which is worth a read.

You're staring with one of the harder wheelbuilding jobs in my experience, sorting out someone else's cock up and making repairs is much more difficult than starting with fresh new bits I've found. You should probably be prepared to accept defeat on this one if necessary without being too disheartened, but once you've learned to build wheels its very satisfying and quite therapeutic. My commuting bike has a home built/hand built set  that are 3.5 years old now, and I've never had to touch them in all that time.

edit - seems like me and vincienup are on a similar page, he's obviously a faster typist than me! 😂

😂 doesn’t say much, I was typing one-thumbed ok my phone!  Been ages since I last thought about words per minute. Maybe this could be STW’s new Strava sport?

Seriously though, tthew is spot on. This is probably the most ticklish bike repair there is short of frame repair.  Spoke replacement is a doddle but fixing a wheel that someone else has buggered up already is not simple and unfortunately you’ve upped it to the nth level by equalising tension on both sides.  Doing the even release of tension on the NDS will get the dish back at which point you can fix the original problems.  It’s manageable if you’re very methodical but if a wheel in this state was presented to a pro wheel builder I’d expect the to insist on stripping and starting from scratch as if you can build this will be quicker.

All this is making me think of making another pair for one of my bikes, but realistically that'd be the road bike which barely gets ridden, would be a bit of a waste.

Maybe I should get myself a new commute bike frame, possibly with rim brakes so they wear out a bit faster. 🤔