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Bought a bike for my FiL a couple of months back and it went in for its first service yesterday. I've done my first job of the day in the area so I can collect it this morning on my rounds.
The sign outside says 10 am opening on a Wednesday.
There's at least 4 staff I can see through the window sat on their arses drinking coffee and playing with an iPad.
The guy that was at the service desk/till yesterday has seen me but refuses to let me have it 30 minutes early.
So I've stood outside whilst they have a catch up.
Do they not want any repeat business?
I work for myself and I regularly go out of my way for customers, at all times of day and night.
If loads of LBS are moaning about lack of custom why not go that extra mile for people. I do and I know other bike shops do.
Just got in and collect it and they've done a shonky job to boot.
Great start to my day.
I've had this experience multiple times. What I find bizarre is that the worst and best customer service examples I've had are from bike shops. Some seem to go out of their way to help whilst others do less than nothing. I've not had this experience in any other industry.
They weren't open til 10. It said so on the door. What did you expect? They may use this time to set the shop up for the day, get some repairs out the way, get some orders for parts done on the iPad. If I had my own business and it said "Hours- 10-5pm" I'd not work much outside them, certainly not half an hour, unless there was a real need for the customer to get their bike back- maybe if they had a race on Sunday and something broke at 4.30 on Saturday.
what he said ^
What baffles me is bike shops with opening hours 9.30-5.30 weekdays, with only 1 serving staff after 5. It's like all the people queuing after 5 to drop off, collect or buy something after work are an inconvenience.
The busiest period in the shop may well be 12-2 so the staff don't get a lunch break until well after that. This may be the last chance of a coffee, catch-up for the rest of the day.
Did you knock on the door? If you just stood outside then what would you expect!
I'd have knocked and had a quick word and asked if I can come in early.
FWIW I always try an accommodate customers we're usually open half an hour before official and half an hour afterwards and if people ask to do outside that i'll always try, so I don't think it's unreasonable to ask to come in a bit earlier if they've finished putting stuff out etc. They may well have insurance restrictions though.
What baffles me is bike shops with opening hours 9.30-5.30 weekdays, with only 1 serving staff after 5. It's like all the people queuing after 5 to drop off, collect or buy something after work are an inconvenience.
Nothing to do with bike shops, that's just retail. How many shops just do 9-5 and close sundays? I think shutting Sunday is just bonkers, it's half of the weekend gone. To me if you want to do a 5 day week close Monday & Tuesday. Same for hours - if in a town i'd say 10:30 till 18:30 made much more sense.
They did a shit job as well, no doubt they will be scratching their head when they go out of business and lamenting the day theonline shops became king.
If you want to stay competitive in a difficult industry then surely doing a decent job (the minimum expectancy) and being at least a little bit flexible is a good idea?
A little flexible is ten minutes. Not half an hour.
The owner had 3 different bike shops repossessed by the bank about 18 months ago due to lack of custom, has he not learnt anything from this mistake?
Lost another customer today.
Surely the definition of flexibility would not allow a time limit? If you have a customer outside - open the door!
Maybe having a slash through the letterbox would have got their attention? 😀
I used to quite frequently see the lady who owned the shop opposite mine turn customers away at 9.50 or 5.00 and tell them to come back another time. She also refused to open Sunday's and bank holidays ... She blamed the customers when she eventually closed down.
Personally I'm always happy to serve a customer as long as I'm at work and if they request that I stay an extra 10 minutes or come in 10 minutes early so they can pick something up then I'm equally happy to do that as most people appreciate it, if I was made to feel like an inconvenience then I wouldn't return to a shop so I wouldn't want my customers to feel like this.
If they were working on bikes for collection at 10am or a team meeting and doing 'something' like training etc then I can totally see it. But if they've seen a customer outside waiting and it's even 30 mins early, then I'm pretty damn sure they should open the door, ask what they can do and see if it's viable to give him 5 mins of their time for the sake of customer service.
I see it sooooo many times in motorbiking circles too, lack of communication with customer, poor workmanship, etc... It means they don't get my money ever again.
This amazes me too. There is a recession and loads of small businesses are going under, but they want to turn away paying customers ?
I suspect the whole thing is a front for laundering drug money. Call the Police.
If there are employees where is the incentive to open the door for you early? They will get no extra pay. I get into work early most days but if the phone rings I ignore it until I get paid, likewise if it rings whilst I'm on lunch. I'm not getting paid so I don't work, the call could turn into a nightmare and I'd have to give up more time than just a minute to answer the phone. Would be different if i was the owner though.
We have a bike shop in the village. Used to be good, now so so. Thing is they are at the foot of one of the best road climbs in the county. When I lived elsewhere I'd pedal miles to ride around this area. It is awash with lycra clad solos, groups of friends and club rides......
And they are closed on Sundays.
Won't work everywhere mind but here a bike shop open on Sundays that sold coffee and cake would not only make money on the day but the awareness of the shop by local riders would go up exponentially.
No - that's just inflexible.
I completely sympathise with bike shops that take the torrent of penny pinching mountain bikers - but this scenario I'm in 100% agreement with the OP.
I run my own business, and the one thing we can do well is what the big establishments can't do and that's flexibility.
10am opening midweek, and staff being in half an hour before doors open is almost guaranteed to have been a staff training session. I wouldn't have interrupted it because someone turned up half an hour early either, and I consistently didn't when I was in that position and customers tried to interrupt the only solid 30 minutes a week I got with my staff. That shop is still there 15 years later, it didn't seem to do them much harm.
Maybe they were getting training on their first service skills? Shame they didn't get the training session yesterday 😉
Maybe they need a training session on how to let a customer through the door? Maybe there is an app ...
If they were there and knew the OP was waiting they should have let him in, taken money handed over bike and they'd now have had someone who was telling people he rated the shop.
jekkyl - MemberIf there are employees where is the incentive to open the door for you early?
The incentive is that in 3 months they're not looking for another job as the shop they worked in has closed down.
[i]The incentive is that in 3 months they're not looking for another job as the shop they worked in has closed down. [/i]
Enlightened self-interest.
While I'd prefer it if everything revolved around my convenience, a shop being open only during the hours of business written on the door is actually pretty standard.
Many businesses have survived despite this practice. 🙂
Nothing to do with bike shops, that's just retail. How many shops just do 9-5 and close sundays? I think shutting Sunday is just bonkers, it's half of the weekend gone. To me if you want to do a 5 day week close Monday & Tuesday. Same for hours - if in a town i'd say 10:30 till 18:30 made much more sense.
This still seems odd to me too. I, like most people I suspect, tend to work 9-5, M-F, ish, so why open when most people are at work? Sunday's, as many hours as you can, same Saturdays, have at least 2 late night openings (1 so I can drop the bike off, 1 so I can collect). That way the LBS, not Halfords or Decathlon, will get my business.
Delta bikes in Dursley Glos - guy says even if were not open just knock and if we can we'll let you in. Have done this before, he let me in, bought a tyre which he even price matched with CRC (unprompted) so I also bought some more Stans. Loads of bike shops round my way, but I'll always go back to Delta as their attitude is great
The solution as always is go to the shop that gives you close to the service you need.
This still seems odd to me too. I, like most people I suspect, tend to work 9-5, M-F, ish, so why open when most people are at work? Sunday's, as many hours as you can, same Saturdays, have at least 2 late night openings (1 so I can drop the bike off, 1 so I can collect).
Speaking personally, I'm open the hours I am* for a couple of reasons - people expect it, and that's when couriers work.
Many years ago I tried Sunday opening, late evenings etc. Didn't increase business, just moved it, and meant I was working much longer hours for no more money. I like my business, but I also like my family.
*10am-5pm, Tues-Sat. Usually. Unless I'm on holiday.
It's easy to say bike shops should be open on Sundays and Bank Holidays - and they might get more trade on those days, but bike shop people have families too. It's interesting that the 7-days-a-week shopping culture is shifting our expectations so much. I'm not sure it's a good thing.
Wonders if the OP would be having the same [s]tantrum[/s] issues if the staff turned up 2 mins before the shop opened.
The OP doesnt actually state what time he arrived at the door. If it was before ten then why? They knew the opening hours before they rocked up.
The same scenario applies at the end of the day. There has to be a cut off point when people are not admitted into the shop, otherwise someone will rock up an hour early and expect service.
5-10 minutes fine, but more than that is taking the mikey.
[i]Wonders if the OP would be having the same tantrum issues if the staff turned up 2 mins before the shop opened. [/i]
I suspect not as the issue was reported as being the staff looking out the door at him while he stood waiting?
The OP doesnt actually state what time he arrived at the door. If it was before ten then why? They knew the opening hours before they rocked up.
The sign outside says 10 am opening on a Wednesday.
The guy that was at the service desk/till yesterday has seen me but refuses to let me have it 30 minutes early.
There's a clue there somewhere. 🙄
Every other day of the week is 9am just like when I dropped it off on Tuesday morning.
I get into work early most days but if the phone rings I ignore it until I get paid, likewise if it rings whilst I'm on lunch. I'm not getting paid so I don't work, the call could turn into a nightmare and I'd have to give up more time than just a minute to answer the phone.
As an employer, this sort of attitude would drive me up the wall. I don't see how it's any different to the scenario in the OP, and if that happened in our shop I would be horrified. We'd always deal with a customer who arrived before we were officially open, and regularly do deal with customer after we've officially closed. That said, I'd hope that those customers don't take it for granted, and would understand if for some reason we weren't able to accommodate them out of hours.
OP, did they know you were there to just collect a bike? In retail you see a hell of a lot of faces, they guy who recognised you might not remember what you're actually there for.
They may not have their systems set up 30 minutes before opening, they may have been having a team briefing (even if it's passing round an ipad or whatever). If they don't know that all you need is to collect something, then they can assume you'd be coming in to browse and ask questions, disturbing them from their setting up time.
They may also have rules about letting people in before their cash is sorted into tills, or there may be the takings from the night before to take to the bank. Or any other security risks.
Really it's not their fault that they're not letting you in 30 minutes before they should, it's yours for not finding out what time they open.
Nothing to do with customer service. You set an opening time and that is when you open.
You want them to open at 09:30, next person at 09:25 so they may as well then start opening at 09:30
Guess what, someone then turns up at 09:00 and around we go.
Bad customer service is not to be open at 10:00 when stated.
I get folk arriving early quite frequently, I always accomodate them, even though I may have other work to do in that time that's made tricky when we have customers in.
The staff above may have been having a meeting - their only one of the week. They may have been having a chat.
I'd knock on the door, you might have got your bike more quickly.
As an employer, this sort of attitude would drive me up the wall.
Do you pay your staff for all the time they work over what's in their contract, or do you freeload off the extra ten minutes in the morning, ten minutes in the evening (80 hours, or over 2 working weeks a year) at a great benefit to your business?
One guy was polishing hubs on a stand, not really a security risk i'd have thought, I may be wrong though.
If their money's out, it doesn't matter who's polishing what.
What, like nobody ever spent 10 minutes at work on a personal phone call, checking FB on their phone, taking a very large magazine to the toilet with them for hours ? Give and take people !
At a place I once worked, there are several people who went on a tea break in 1985, and still haven't come back.
I think shutting Sunday is just bonkers,
Do you like working weekends? No. I thought not.
What, like nobody ever spent 10 minutes at work on a personal phone call, checking FB on their phone, taking a very large magazine to the toilet with them for hours ? Give and take people !
Yesterday I serviced 8 bikes. I get paid from 9.30 to 6.00. I'd finished my first easy job by just after 9.30 after arriving at about 9.10. I managed a 15 minute break but ate my sandwiches standing up working. I got cleaned up and left just after 6.10. I didn't even look at my phone from a distance!
Is that the 'give and take' you're thinking of?
Where is this crap shop ? I need to add it to the list of shops to avoid.
Seems there are a few people who don't understand the connection between their job and customers feeling happy.
So did you actually knock on the door OP and tell them what you were there for?
If you did and they told you they can't help, then that's crap service and I can understand your frustration.
If you just stood outside, looking in the window expecting them to come out and ask you inside then you really only have yourself to blame.
Seems there are a few people who don't understand the connection between their job and customers feeling happy.
And it seems there are a few people who think their happiness is the most important thing in the world, ever 😉
You were owed 5 mins then .gov.uk says 20 minute break in a working day
Do you pay your staff for all the time they work over what's in their contract, or do you freeload off the extra ten minutes in the morning, ten minutes in the evening (80 hours, or over 2 working weeks a year) at a great benefit to your business?
No - we treat them like adults, and expect them to behave like adults to, as in
What, like nobody ever spent 10 minutes at work on a personal phone call, checking FB on their phone, taking a very large magazine to the toilet with them for hours ? Give and take people!
If a member of staff needs to leave early or come in late, or has a doctor's appointment they need to go to during the working day - that's absolutely fine. Should I deduct ten minutes' pay each time? If they want to borrow a bike to go for a ride - that's fine too. It's not in their contract, but I don't consider them to be "freeloading off" me. If a non-mechanical member of staff needs a hand fixing their bike, I won't charge them for it. Again, neither party considers it to be freeloading.
If the 'phone rings at half eight, and someone's there to answer it, they'll do it. If it's busy and someone has to put their lunch to one side and help out, they'll do it. I hope they don't feel exploited. If they didn't feel happy doing that, would it still be OK for them to make personal calls on our time/dime, borrow bikes for free, leave early or come in late when they needed to, etc?
Back to the OP, if a customer was outside wanting serving before we officially opened, I'd hope we could serve them. But there are lots of good reasons why it's not always possible and I think it's a bit harsh to judge the shop/staff for not being open before they say they are.
In the OP's example if they really were mega busy, team meeting etc. all they had to do was open the door explain that and suggest a suitable time for him to could come back later. It's all about being polite and managing expectations.
Our opening times are 9:30 to 5:30.
I dont think we have ever opened and closed at those times.
Though one of the lads did get in to the habit of being out the door and done at 5:30. When he was doing that we very nearly went bust.
Now we are open late and early every day/night.
We notice a lot of customers come in between six and half past.
had customers pick up race bikes at midnight when we were preparing them for an event. (They dropped them in last minute as always)
However, we dont open Sundays or Bank Holidays.
We advertise when we are closing and we get a massive rush the three weeks beforehand.
Personally I have been to bike shops on Sundays and Bank Holidays and everyone is just browsing because they are bored.
Our staff have families and ride with our customers so why have them at work away from the customers?
But customer is king as long as they are not an obnoxious t**t, then they can go to another shop. But then they will miss out on the coffe and cake and chocolates and biscuits, and pizza. (We are a bike shop btw) just the local pizza shop gives us free pizza some days at 5:30
They weren't open til 10. It said so on the door. What did you expect? They may use this time to set the shop up for the day, get some repairs out the way, get some orders for parts done on the iPad. If I had my own business and it said "Hours- 10-5pm" I'd not work much outside them, certainly not half an hour, unless there was a real need for the customer to get their bike back- maybe if they had a race on Sunday and something broke at 4.30 on Saturday.
Outside of the retailshop world everyone is expected to turn up before their contracted hours and not leave on the dot.
Now I admit bikeshops don't pay fantastic wages for the thousands they are expected to sell so there is some leeway.
OP- the shops opening hours are an issue with the owner not the staff.
Just an observation, but most of the "I work in a bike shop" types here seem to have little problem finding time to elighten us with their mutterings'n'musings, guess their shops aren't that busy..........
This is a funny one. People expect bike shops to go the extra mile by opening early, doing a quick repair for free etc, we wouldn't expect this from Tesco, Starbucks or any other shop.
Saying all that, if that is a customers expectation and it is not met, people will vote with their feet and the shop will close down.
The Customer pays your wages - happiness is a wage.
Its quite simple.
We run a successful business because non of the staff need to be reminded of that fact.
Just an observation, but most of the "I work in a bike shop" types here seem to have little problem finding time to elighten us with their mutterings'n'musings, guess their shops aren't that busy..........
Whereas all the people who don't work in bike shops are far too busy to post on the forum. Oh, hang on a sec...
With a thread titled "Do bike shops want repeat business?" I don't think it's surprising that shop owners, and people who work in shops, might chip in with an opinion.
(To answer the OP's question - and I think I speak for most shops in this - yes, we do very much value repeat business).
To answer the OP's question - and I think I speak for most shops in this - yes, we do very much value repeat business
Yep.
I had coffee in a bikeshop on Monday. The coffee was warm- not cold enough to mention but it went down fairly quickly.
Chappy came across and said 'be honest, it wasn't hot enough was it'?
He brought over a steaming hot cup and a stamped up card for another the next time I come.
Guess what, I'll be going back- he knows customer service that bloke 🙂
I wasn't talking about you personally Peterpoddy, on that day, it was more of a global observation. You will at least feel guilt free when you do need some Me Time on working hours, probably for some help getting that last nail in your cross.
If the shop regularly has requests from people to collect bikes on a sunday or at 0900, well kill me, but maybe the owner should adjust the hours ? I guess it depends if they are running a business or a hobby.
The same applies to butchers, bakers, cafes etc. You need to be there when it suits your customers or you will have less, pretty simple, and that might suit you as bencooper says.
When I get out of the pub at 11:30pm the LBS should be open to service my biking needs, the alternative is just to go home and order from Wiggle etc and have it delivered to my door 😀
This is a funny one. People expect bike shops to go the extra mile by opening early, doing a quick repair for free etc, we wouldn't expect this from Tesco, Starbucks or any other shop.
No. What we expect is a small independant bike shop to offer something 'more' than the chain or online stores everyone insists are the death nail for their type of shop, be that flexible opening, great enthusiasm, helpful attitude etc, but a proportion of shops seem to have little interest in doing anything other than the bare minimum for customers (or potential customers).
Its obvious many shops do see this and there are often threads on here promoting certain shops who did a job well or went the extra mile to help a customer. These shops will no doubt get more or new custom due to their attitude (i know i always seek to visit good shops when in new areas), the others will get bad reviews and might lose some custom.
hooli - Member
Saying all that, if that is a customers expectation and it is not met, people will vote with their feet and the shop will close down.
A shop that will service bikes quickly (empty workshop) and give discounts may not stay in business.
we get lunch breaks too, though, the term mental busy, is how we refer to every day these days.
Tesco's (****ers) sell you something that you need to survive..
Bikeshops sell you a hobby item..
You can survive without one ^
A group of 4 of us asked a shop to stay open for us to buy snowboard kit
We said we would be spending around $6k between us. We had exceptional service
We spent around $7k in 30 minutes and received a free board bag each plus a substantial % reduction.
There are reasons for an owner to stop open for you. I don't think the OPs was one of them
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Agree with Hooli. You don't expect John Lewis to open early just because you got there before they open do you and I would say their customer service is near the top.
There has to be a set time otherwise how would you actually know when they open?
Do you just expect this of small businesses, business with less than N shops (no chains), business with less than N people?
The customer expectation is wrong here not the customer service. If you expect shops to do that and they don't then don't shop there but don't expect others to join you as they understand the boundaries of opening times....
Tesco's (****) sell you something that you need to survive..
I am not sure how that is relevant as I'm pretty sure most us could just about survive if Tesco opened 30 minutes later 🙄
My LBS is one of the goods ones: competitively priced for a lot of things, discounts for regulars, open all-day Saturday, late opening 3 days a week, free events with goodie-bags, beer, BBQs, etc. They have a good reputation far outside just us locals and it's well-deserved. I don't envy the owner the hours he has to keep, but he loves what he does and, more importantly in the end, it's his livelihood. He still gets abuse (at least they will quite often say it to his face) about not being open or available at such-and-such a time, or for not being able to magically make a product appear that the distributors just can't deliver. You just can't win everything.
you mean you don't have your LBS owners mobile number?
I think there was a thread on here a while back about being asked to do unpaid overtime/work through lunch etc. A vast majority thought it was a very awful thing and should be stopped, people should only work their contracted hours. Unless of course they work in the bike trade or need to work around the most important person in the world. I reckon Obama could get the shop open early though...
Just maybe I have this wrong, but.....Isn't the LBS a business run by the folk who own it ?
You know, ordinary, real people who need to make a crust, feed themselves, have time with their families, need to do DIY , fix the car, go see their friends and when all that's done, maybe find time to go riding, perhaps with their mates .
They set their stall out , advertise which days and at what time they are open. The rest is down to their customers to decide if they are worthy of repeat business ( after all, the word customer derives from custom, i.e , something which is customary, in other words you are a regular patron.
The bike shop which gets a lot of my bigger purchases, isn't actually all that local, or the one owned and run by my mates, ( they didn't have a shop when I began using the first one).
The reason that I have probably spent £7000 with them over the past 8 years, is that from the very first time I went in, which was to see if they had a suitable jacket, as I'd left mine at home and needed one, was that they were really helpful.
Since then I have bought two bikes, wheels, forks , other clothing , lights and all manner of stuff.
Back on Track bikes at Malvern, by the way, they close on Thursdays and Sundays.
Honest, fair and helpful. When they are open. As they advertise.
You don't expect John Lewis to open early just because you got there before they open do you and I would say their customer service is near the top.
If necessary then in some cases John Lewis will stay open past closing hours to do a sale.
Just maybe I have this wrong, but.....Isn't the LBS a business run by the folk who own it ?
Unless you are a masochist, you will employ some staff and not be there every waking hour. Most reasonable size LBS's will employ people who are paid very little for the hours they are there.
4 recent experiences of novice friends:
1) Their teenage daughter’s bike (low-mid range mtb) goes in for work, diagnosed with seized brakes, “but they don't sell them any more so we can’t get spares. You’ll need a new set. That’ll be £350.” 😯
2) Colleague snaps chain on a recently serviced ~£400 mtb. Goes into the shop that serviced it for a new (9spd) chain. Is (only offered and) sold a PC991 with a £45 price tag.
3) 5'6 and 5'10 friends buy Btwins from Decathlon. sold a 54cm and a 57cm respectively. Oddly me doing bike fits to try make them comfortable has involved slamming seats forward and fitting shorter stems. 🙄
cycling seems to be booming [i]despite[/i] the efforts of some people in the trade...
1) Their teenage daughter’s bike (low-mid range mtb) goes in for work, diagnosed with seized brakes, “but they don't sell them any more so we can’t get spares. You’ll need a new set. That’ll be £350.”1) Their teenage daughter’s bike (low-mid range mtb) goes in for work, diagnosed with seized brakes, “but they don't sell them any more so we can’t get spares. You’ll need a new set. That’ll be £350.”
Giant MPH? Does sound expensive, did they ask for cheaper?
2) Colleague snaps chain on a recently serviced ~£400 mtb. Goes into the shop that serviced it for a new (9spd) chain. Is (only offered and) sold a PC991 with a £45 price tag.
As above.
3) 5'6 and 5'10 friends buy Btwins from Decathlon. sold a 54cm and a 57cm respectively. Oddly me doing bike fits to try make them comfortable has involved slamming seats forward and fitting shorter stems
Those sizes sound about right - you fitted them, are they too big? Not uncommon to swap/slam a stem & play with saddle.
1) and 2) Presumably that sort of scamming actually works on some more naive customers, but I'm sure most must realise what is going on when they are presented with prices like that, and never darken the door of the shop again.
Just reminds me why I won't go near most bike shops. Have had at least 3 who can't even get a set of gears to index properly. Brakes incorrectly fitted. Have had salesmen lie straight to my face. At least 2 shops who couldn't be arsed even discussing what I wanted despite over £1k to spend. And been told that the only track pump they sell was £70 and they'd have to order that in with a minimum of 2 weeks wait!!
Luckily there are a few decent shops out there if you search around.
Giant MPH? Does sound expensive
you mean when I can get XTs for 99 quid?
did they ask for cheaper
no, they bought a whole new bike, probably what the shop was after 🙄 and sadly before I had found out and been able to give some more balanced advice.
did they ask for cheaper?
no, because
and 2) Presumably that sort of scamming actually works on some more naive customers, but I'm sure most must realise what is going on when they are presented with prices like that, and never darken the door of the shop again
sadly naive consumers sometimes think that professionals will try to serve their needs without exploiting them, and that they are being offered a suitable product at a reasonable price. As a shop guy you can no doubt argue "well they paid it so they thought it was reasonable", but so do pensioners who pay pay thousands to have their drives tarmacced and we lock people up for that.
Those sizes sound about right
Really?! Or does "about" mean "within a few inches?
Not uncommon to swap/slam a stem & play with saddle.
of course its not, but making a 57cm frame fit a 5'10 rider isn't fine tuning a fit. The 54 would have fitted the 5'10" rider (as you would expect).
Cynic-al you may well work in the trade but pick your battles, you're trying to defend the indefensible in these cases. Not all bike shops are crap or rip off merchants, but I sometimes despair.