[Closed] Dear Hope Technology,

I think youve sent your email to the wrong place mate

It wants to go here 😉 info@hopetech.com

you got the address wrong. this is singletrackworld, not hope technical support...

Christ

Did you ask them if they would sort it still laced up?

Things to note;

1. Pawl springs are rubbish, replace with pieces of high density foam rubber.

2. Use stainless steel bearings.

3. Learn how to repair the hub yourself. Not that difficult.

Dear Billybob

We at Hope can assure you that as long as you remain within the northern hemisphere you will be fine, it turns out that the bearings were installed in the wrong direction leading to the fault you have encountered.

However should your foreign land of choice be somewhere in the southern hemisphere such as Australia we can offer no such guarantees of your safety, not just because of the intolerance of the locals to whinging pommes, but because the bearings rotate in the other direction down there and your hubs are at risk of explosion

yours faithfully

Hope

Pawl springs are rubbish, replace with pieces of high density foam rubber.

I like that idea...do they still make the characteristic clicky noise though?

I've three sets of Hope hubs ranging in age from two to six years old and all are performing faultlessly. I did have a rogue Bulb a few years back that kept going wobbly but that was sorted under warranty with a heavily discounted ProII Evo.

Otherwise, I'm delighted with all of my Hope kit.

My hubs are now a year old three enduros and out twice a week in Scottish weather and I've not even had to look at my Hope pro2 Evo hubs yet. You must have been unlucky with that hub

I did enquire in the covering note I posted off with the hub, asking what the problem was, but they did not respond to my question.

I think it would be in their interests to answer the question because it is a matter of public confidence in their products. My confidence has been shaken, I was just seeking to restore it by getting an explanation from them. I have always found them to be a good company with decent helpful staff but it is no good if they are selling something that causes everyone grief.

I got a manky grape in my punnet from sainsburys at the weekend, my confidence in the entire chain is now shaken

Can i ask why you unlaced the wheel to send the free hub back?

they are selling something that causes [s]everyone[/s] you grief.

I've many Hope products I have no complaints about any of it.

What do you expect them to say? "Sorry, sometimes bearings fail before they should." Or do you want them to do a full metallurgical analysis of the bearings?

What they'll do is make a note of it, and if they get a suspiciously large number of problems then they'll change bearings or investigate further.

Just a thought, but when Hope replaced the ratchet pawls in my (very well worn and abused) singlespeed hub, at very minimal and reasonable cost, I sent the whole wheel over to them, thereby sidestepping faff with spokes. HTH

I like that idea...do they still make the characteristic clicky noise though?

Disappointingly silent.

Three years after the disintegrating bearing problem and two sets of broken springs, the foam rubber is fine and the stainless bearings are running sweet.

Dear Hope,

Thanks for that.

Is that, wrong bearing in wrong place, wrong way round?

Or are these bearings directional? Can you only insert them with the one designated side going in?

Kind regards,

billyboy

PS. The journey I was intending is northern hemisphere, so no worries mate!

Bearings fail, sounds like they've sorted you out quickly. Nothing to get hung up on.

Why on earth did you unlace the wheel?!

Only had to use Hope customer service once but they were excellent.

Cup and cone might be best for hubs for touring rides in foreign countries if you are ham fisted.

Things to note;
[s]1. Pawl springs are rubbish, replace with pieces of high density foam rubber.
2. Use stainless steel bearings.
3. Learn how to repair the hub yourself. Not that difficult.[/s]
4. Don't but Hope unless you like sending stuff back for repair 🙂

Speshpaul

Hubs fit in the post easier and cheaper than wheels do!

And to the others...I have always been a Hope fan, but my confidence was shaken by this premature failure. I just wanted an explanation.

Try dealing with a company such as Pace on warranty, who weld broken frames or when they were the warranty centre for DT Swiss, would ONLY replace the exact part that had failed (and even then it had to be proven 101%!).

Hope are exceptionally generous plus you can also deal direct with them unlike many other manufacturers/distributors.

Hubs fit in the post easier and cheaper than wheels do!

After the time and cost involved in dismantling and rebuilding a wheel, I think paying to post the wheel is a no brainer.

'Dear Mercedes, my wife bought a 2nd hand CLK320 CDI which had one previous owner & 58,000 miles on an 06 plate & FSH. After she'd had it 2 months the auto box developed a problem which cost £1600 to repair. As the vehicle cost in the region of 34K when new I find this unacceptable & would like to know why this happened & as an act of goodwill could I be considered for any recompense? The vehicle was purchased partly on the grounds of the solid reputation of the Mercedes brand. Blah blah blah... Regards, Mr G.'

Reply, 'Dear Mr G, shit happens, & no. Regards, Mercedes' (or words to that effect)

Dunno why you unlaced it to send it back, they don't need unlacing to be fixed.

might have been even cheaper to have just posted the free hub.

I'll be telling my customers in future that any freehub work requires a full wheel rebuild. 😉

All very funny but I've had a lot of Hope rear hub components crack, Shells, Axles and Freehubs. I know of many others that have cracked aswell.

Yes they get sorted under warranty but how about not cracking in the first place?

Ive never cracked anything on Shimano or Novatec hubs .

This unlacing seems to have offended some folk. I build my own wheels, it's a relatively simple job to me because I was trained to do it. I did not know what the problem was with the hub. The bearings had obviously failed but I had no idea why. It could have been faulty machining or similar on the bulb itself leading to movement that destroyed them. In the which case Hope would have had to unlace the hub. It wasn't one of their wheels, it was one I built with parts I sourced separately so I didn't reckon they'd be wanting to do that for free.

And looking at Kimbers profile...he's in London, not Barnoldswick, so that was probably a spoof reply and I'm still waiting on an explanation.

If I've blopsed on some job, I say sorry and give an explanation to the customer.

Is that not the way it should be?

Dear Hope Technology,

I love you, your wheels [XC/Bulb/Pro2/Pro2 evo] have made my world spin for the last 10 years with little or no maintenance or maintenance work completed by the inept monkey that I am. You've fixed stuff for free that no other manufacturer would have even accepted a warranty claim on [worn out XC ratchet ring & cracked Pro II freehub over 12mnth old], I am grateful beyond words. That said I'm still tempted by DT's lesser weight if I do go for some carbon rims 😳

Love

z1ppy

Dear Customer,

We did extensive testing on the product both here and in Moab and it works fine. Apparently you live in somewhere called Europe. I've asked around the office and it seems you get a lot of rain over there and go riding in muddy conditions. Frankly we find this a bit strange - we only go out when it's nice and sunny, which is most days really here in California. As a result I'm afraid that I have to inform you that repairing this product is outside our warranty so it looks like you are up mud creek without a bike. Sorry about that.

Return shipping for your product via our preferred carrier will be $100.

As a gesture of our appreciation of your custom we'll put in a few stickers for you.

Thank you for your enquiry and have a nice day.

Some American Corp

And looking at Kimbers profile...he's in London, not Barnoldswick, so that was probably a spoof reply and I'm still waiting on an explanation.

You think?!

so if i go to the southern hemisphere I just need to pop my bearings out and turn them round 180* yes?

😆

Cant believe you unlaced a wheel when it takes about 5 mins to pull the freehub off and knock those bearings out

Wow

It would have taken more than 5 minutes. The bearings had disintegrated leaving the outer casings stuck inside the free hub. The rest was just mangled wreckage.

I just want to know why a hub that cost me £140 (rrp £155..I think) failed after less than 5 months use.

I think it is a reasonable question.

Wear prone component wears out Shokka!!!

Bearings (an off the shelf part) are not infinitely reliable, they will all fail eventually...

I think what surprises me the most though is that the OP actually unlaced the hub from the wheel just to get hope to replace the bearings... Why would you choose to do that? There's no need to other than convenient postage, but for the time saving unlacing/rebuilding the wheel I'd rather spend more on postage (or add it to your warranty claim against Hope)...

Is worn bearing replacement even a RTB "repair" surely Hope would have allowed an LBS to do the work and verify the warranty claim by inspecting the bearings/sending them back to Hope for inspection? They'd probably have been OK with you doing it yourself TBH...

Seems like you found about the most complicated/inconvenient way to sort a relatively straight forward issue...

Bearings wear out sometimes. Stop whinging, you have annoyed me on my tea break.

I just want to know why a hub that cost me £140 (rrp £155..I think) failed after less than 5 months use.

I think we all got that you want some information from Hope. What I can't figure out is why in the hell you're repeating the question over and over on this forum when you could have spent the time actually sending the question to Hope themselves.

Because consumers drive for lighter and lighter products, lighter means less material or less seals. Which leads to more fails. If people weren't bothered about weight I guess there would be virtually zero failures.

All my wheels have and always have had BULBs. Failure rate after 15 years of thrash. 1 12mm axle.

My god, what a fanny.

Did you bother to give them a call and DEMAND an explanation before taking to the forum or was the simple fact that they didn't hand write a humble apology and explanation at the earliest possible time for having to repair your hub send you in to such a RAGE that you had to tell us all ASAP?

And looking at Kimbers profile...he's in London, not Barnoldswick, so that was probably a spoof reply and I'm still waiting on an explanation.

50/50 I reckon.

And looking at Kimbers profile...he's in London, not Barnoldswick, so that was [b]probably[/b] a spoof reply

[img] [/img]

Lol at the futility of trying to drum up a bit of ill will against Hope in [i]this[/i] crowd.

[img] [/img]

Flippin' ek is it really that hard for people to pick up the phone these days... ffs.

Dismantling the wheel may be easy if you're a wheel builder and you've got the time but then to send the whole hub when only the freehub needed attention is a bit odd. I'd have just done what I did last week - take off the freehub, clean it all up and regrease and get my friendly LBS mechanic to knock out the bearings and fit new, only because I'm too lazy to do it and the hammering gives me a headache. All sorted in 5 minutes for £8.00.

Yes, rear hub bearings and freehub bearings aren't Hope's strongest area but then Hope don't make the bearings. I have a pair of original Ti-glide hubs and have replaced the rear bearings numerous times; my belief is that standard ball bearings don't cope very well with lateral stresses and they certainly don't like British weather and mud.

If the OP thinks the Hope OEM bearings are crap, he'd best avoid the cheap fleaBay copies. 3 months I got on the front wheel of my (not very heavily used) DH bike.

To be fair to hope their customer service is probably the best around, but it has to be as no one would buy their products because it does keep breaking.

To be fair to hope their customer service is probably the best around, but it has to be as no one would buy their products because it does keep breaking.

My bikes must be freak examples - Hope parts are two headsets, two bottom brackets, four hubs, two sets of brakes, between 1 and 4.5 years old. Frequent riding in all weathers. Only thing that's been changed is brake fluid, pads and one disk because I wore it so thin.

That reminds me - must moan to Chris King because their ring drive lube freezes below -4 and it just spins out.

Wait a minute....

[img] [/img]

I've had the same thing happen - half a brain and a quick google or search on stw told me it is a common problem so just sent the freehub back (and got a full new one by return post).

All the issues with Pro 2 are down to "progress". The innards of the old XC hub used to last a lot longer (my eldest kid is now running one that has just turned 19 years old) but(some)people wanted big diameter through axle hubs.

So the axle is bigger and everything else has to be packaged to suit. So the bearings are smaller, and leaf springs take up less space than the old coils. The only inexcusable bit is that it is now just a plastic face "seal" behind the freehub rather than a proper full radial contact seal - so the problem often begins with muck and moisture getting in. I don't like having to do it, but pulling the freehub off every few months and checking for broken springs / cleaning and lubing inside stops future major failures.

My bikes must be freak examples - Hope parts are two headsets, two bottom brackets, four hubs, two sets of brakes, between 1 and 4.5 years old. Frequent riding in all weathers. Only thing that's been changed is brake fluid, pads and one disk because I wore it so thin.

Lots of Hope stuff does last forever. I've never had any problems myself.

But, I worked in a bike shop for a couple of years that was a major Hope dealer and I did see a lot of kit being sent back. Mostly rear hubs. It's nice kit but it's not invincible. Then again, they're a pleasure to deal with.

QR could be too tight, causing premature wear?

Maybe you give your drivetrain a hard time..

maybe you are a samurai with the jetwash.. who knows.

Not wanting to side with the OP but... Hope hubs are okay but they aren't as bulletproof as people make out IME. I've had maybe ten sets of Pro2/Mono/Pro2 EVO now and maybe a third of them wore pretty quickly and needed their bearings replacing after less than a year. Not a big deal but there you go.

QR could be too tight, causing premature wear?

The QR does not load the freehub bearings - just the axle down the middle. My failure was with a bolt in ss hub.

I'm 99% certain my failure was fractured leaf spring(s) plus general muck and moisture trashing the freehub bearing - the problem bit is usually a bare needle roller in the middle that relies entirely on the (lack of) external sealing.

With a bit of care they are a good hub (we have 4 sets in the houshold).

Just flipping this round a bit:

Hope receive a hub that is broken. Takes a few minutes to fix and send back. job done.

Time taken to enter in to conversation/write to tell customer that shit happens/ bearings rubbish/you did not service it/many other unknown reasons* (delete as appropriate) takes as much time as it did to fix the issue.

Customer receives feedback and starts to talk/reply/converse with Hope.

Time is money for a small British industry that actually makes things. If you fix the issue and have a good rep for that then your name holds good. If you start to waste time on a multitude of non profitable work then you start to have to cut margins in actually making stuff. Downwards spiral and ffffffut there goes another manufacturer. I think that they have got the balance right and you can still phone them to see if the guy doing the repairs even thought to investigate why it happened.

just a thought....

[img] [/img]

[img] [/img]

I can answer this!

Commercial bearings are type tested. This means they are made in very high numbers, and only a percentage are taken out and tested. in short, this keeps bearing costs down. They fail sometimes, and not all bad bearings can be caught at the manufacturing stage.

So basically, it happens, get over it.

And before you suggest they should use better bearings, no bearing company tests every single commercial bearing they manufacture, maybe the one offs they make for special projects, otherwise your hope hubs would cost a few hundred pounds more.

Mick r

Thanks for your tendered explanation. Your theory does make sense, I guess. Trouble is that if that is the true reason this free hub disintegrated in such a short time, it makes their product far less attractive to someone who wants a degree of long term durability between servicing, or bearing replacements.

Maybe think yourself lucky?

A mate had a similar issue with a pro 2 Evo that came on the back of a brand new Alpine 160 and ended up paying LBS to replace bearings as neither vendor, Orange, nor Hope apparently wanted to look at warrantying it and claimed fair wear and tear. Again on a sub six month old bike...

Will balance that though that apart from a cracking freehub on a very old and sh pro 2 my experience of Hope hubs has been excellent.

Bearings are consumables, most manufacturers give 3 months warranty. Anything more is goodwill gesture.

"Trouble is that if that is the true reason this free hub disintegrated in such a short time"

See, this is your problem, you are making a mountain out of a mole hill.
The free hub didn't disintegrate, did it.
Two of the bearings in side failed.
Hope offered to warrenty it, you unlaced the wheel (?) and sent them the whole hub not just the free hub.
They replaced a load of stuff for free fedex'd back to you for free and you are still not happy.
You wonder why they haven't replied to you?
Because they have figured out that nothing they say will make you happy.

[i]Trouble is that if that is the true reason this free hub disintegrated in such a short time, it makes their product far less attractive to someone who wants a degree of long term durability between servicing, or bearing replacements. [/i]

You're relying on the law of averages making it so it's not you twice.

At least you can service a Hope freehub - when Shimano ones fail it's often cheaper to buy a whole hub than just the freehub.

In my experience it's the freehub to hub body seals that are the weak link on Hope hubs. It also depends on what the soil is like where you ride. New Forest sand is very fine and seems to get past those seals particularly quickly. Rebuilds are an annual occurance for any bike used regularly through a New Forest winter.
Hope's customer service is very good but they appear to prefer not to waste time getting into debates.

daveatextremistsdotcouk - Member
That reminds me - must moan to Chris King because their ring drive lube freezes below -4 and it just spins out.

Strip the hub and fill it with oil as recommended by CK for subzero use.

Mostly Balanced : No need to replace the oil, you just need lots of incontinent friends able to pee on the hub to make it work again.

I offered to help only once on the ride that it happened on, but the rest of it was too funny. At the start all I had heard about was why I was riding my geared bike in the snow and not a far more suitable single speed with the superior CK hub. Now I had obviously forgotten that and never mentioned it again. Much..... 😀

Yes Manton, I learned the oil lesson the hard way. We'd all been in the pub a couple of hours for our Christmas curry whilst the temperature outside dropped. My CK wasn't the only hub to freeze but being by far the most costly I got the most grief and the most offers of liquid help from beered up mates.

My pro2 pawl springs disintegrated after 7 years of abuse, I was outraged.!

I've said this before but if you ever visit the Hope factory and see the mind-boggling amount of stuff lying around in trays waiting to be assembled you'll understand why it's really no skin off their noses to nip down and grab a couple of spare seals or bearings or whatever. They are big enough not to need to worry and still small enough to be able to do the small un-productive jobs.

My freehub has cracked after 2 years use I told them laSt week they said they'd replace it. Can't argue with that really

OP, I've had this problem as you know (I posted my link on your previous thread), and I'm yet to return my freehub to Hope, but it will be going soon. I hope (no pun intended) that they warranty as quick as they did yours, although to get out riding I have bought and fitted a new one, but having a spare would be good!

One thing I've learnt is to service more often. You tend to forget about the freehub until its too late, but having bought the right tools to seal it properly I shall be removing them from both my bikes every few months to clean and lightly lube up, hopefuly by doing this I will get many years use out of them, but should they fail and it's a genuine warranty issue, as opposed to poor maintenance I'm sure Hope will look after me.

Also, I get to keep an eye on the main hub bearings too, and spot any problems before they get beyond a minor service.

I used to have to deal with customers, and one thing that is super annoying is this perception they have a right to an "explanation" for everything. No, you [i]might[/i] have a right (although touch and go) to a replacement wear part like a bearing or whatever, but they don't have to explain themselves to you. It's not school.

Bearing in hub failed, hub fixed free of charge. End of story. No explanation or further discussion needed. And definitely not yet another internet moan on the site. Jesus wept, STW seems full of this shit these days.

If you need to vent your feelings in writing, use a notebook.

My problem is that I don't want a hub that fails in less than 5 months. It's no use to me, so I want to know why it failed then we all know where we are. If they don't want to tell me then I can't force them, but I'd suggest that that behaviour stretches the goodwill between them and an already disappointed customer. It's not an isolated early failure, there are other folk on here who have experienced the same thing.

You are all consumers of these products.

Are you saying you are happy buying stuff that is not fit for purpose and breaks early?

I've Hope hubs on two of my bikes, on the road bike I've done around 20,000Km, in 2 years no servicing and it's are fine. On my hardtail I've done 1600Km in 9 months. Again no servicing and it's fine.

The above is anecdotal evidence as is yours and both are essentially meaningless. Without knowing the number of freewheel hubs sold and the number of returns it's not possible to know if the unit is fit for purpose or not. Even the best production facility will have a percentage of returns. Products have a MTBF (Mean Time Before Failure), it doesn't mean that *every* single unit of that product will last that long and some will last a lot longer. If there were any systematic problem with the units then Hope would be issuing a recall.

With MTB products there's also the difference a rider can make - we all know people who are for whatever reason hard on their gear while others hardly ever seem to break anything.

Are any other make of hubs more durable or without problems?

Makes mental note never to sell anything to billyboy, unless I suddenly possess the actual moon on a stick, and then decide to sell it.

It's no use to me, so I want to know why it failed then we all know where we are. If they don't want to tell me then I can't force them

I know why it failed. It failed because as a lot of people have said 'shit happens' What do you want from Hope apart from an explanation? You've had spot on service FFS!
Your'e getting on my wick now you are.

He IS a special boy is'nt he?(I got told off for calling someone a dick earlier but seeing as he's already been called a fanny I reckon I'd be ok....).
Although if I hear

My problem is that I don't want a hub that fails in less than 5 months

I think you said in your other thread that you found the problem after a month of creaking noises. That might explain why the axle was knackered and the bearings shredded rather than a bit notchy.

For what it's worth, some things do just fail early. It's why reviews sometimes include a 'we had a problem but there are no obvious reasons for it and no one else has had one' comments. Anecdotal evidence here suggests hope freehub bearings going (at least to that degree) is not a widespread problem. Hope have fixed your problem, so only if it happens again would I suggest you remount your high horse and go demanding answers.

I'm on my second set of wheels with Hope Pro 2 hubs, the first set last 5 years without a problem at all and I also have a set of 8 year old M4 brakes on my bike that have performed faultlessly over that time.

Hope make good stuff that lasts IME, if for some reason something doesn't then their warranty service is second to none, what's your issue with having used the service?

Big deal something failed it happens get over it they basically gave you a new hub for nothing.

I've had my Hope Pro 2 hubs since 2007. The bearings have been replaced both front & rear once. The abuse they've endured includes full submersion in Mendip Hills mud on many occasions, jet washes and a shockingly neglectful lack of care or maintenance by myself. I have to say as a 'fit and forget' component that does its job well they've been legendary - I was under the impression Hope service and warranties were up there as well.

stuff that is not fit for purpose and breaks early

I think the general consensus is that Hope have sorted you out even when the failed item is classed as a consumable and you appear to be trying to create ill feeling.
Suck it up buttercup.

They would not tell you even if they knew its the way of the world.Going back bit brought a new 1987 Honda CR125 motorcrosser seized while I was running it in.Only had 30mins use.It turns out the tooling for the barrels were out so they were made oval.World wide problem Honda never admitted it but got a new barrel under warranty but took some hassle.Yet this was a very common problem that year.I was luckier than some they had gearbox problems as well.Only time this problem was mentioned was in a mx magazine two years later.The 1988 bike was brill.