[Closed] DD to Exo - Dare I?

Absolutely

don't run stupid low pressures though.

Is it worth the loss in grip from having to run higher pressures, though?

Cheers,
JP

I've only had grid/exo casings. Similar weight and ridden and raced Alps, Slovenia, Italy, lakes, Wales. Had 1 puncture in Tuscany, but that's all. It's not just your weight, it's what you ride over and how you pick your lines. What's good for one person might not be for another of same weight.

Uplift riding = No worries Shirley?

I wouldn’t, I really struggled with punctures with exo casing on the rear. With young kids my biking time is precious and I don’t want to waste a second with punctures.

It's not all uplifts, though. Most of my riding is on the Mendips and at Wind Hill, where there's a fair bit of riding uphill involved.

JP

How about Exo+? 🤗 or Exo and a pool noodle?

I can't see any Exo+ tyres for sale yet, but yes, that might be an option.

JP

I'm running a DD DHF 2.5" on the front of my bike.
I got a pair cheap so was giving it a go as I thought I'd keep them for uplift days.
It's a 3C MaxxxxGrip but still rolls well so will be staying on for the foreseeable.

Hi
I run Exo casing on all my bikes for all of my riding at the Dales, Lakes, NYM, trail centres etc and can’t remember the last time I had a puncture never mind ripped a tyre!
That said I’ve bought a DD tyre for the rear wheel for my first Ardrock but just to limit the chance of ruining the day for the sake of a few quid and grams in weight. A few people who’ve done it said it was a good idea to do it
Sticking with Exo on the front and will be sticking with them after Ardrock
Cheers
Steve

It'll be fine until you put a hole in the rear.

Then you might rein it in a bit so you don't do it again.

I can recommend the new Supergravity Hans Dampf 2.35 FWIW - fast grippy tyre and you already know how tough they are.

loss of grip?

do you honestly really need all that much grip for trail centres n bike parks?
I wouldn't even be using a soft compound tread for BPW.
Overly soft exos squirm like **** when pushed hard cornering.

Windhill (from what i've seen) I'd be running 40psi+ and as fast rolling rear as I could.

Ive got Exo+ (You can get them). They seem good. 50g or so weight penalty, no issues so far. Of course that could just be luck.

Never had an issue with exo in maxxis or snakeskin with schwalbe. Run tubeless at BPW / BMCC (albeit it’s not very rocky there) / Flyup 417 (some rocks and rock drop offs) / FOD (mostly roots) / Cwmcarn / Afan / Windhill / Brechfa / Brecon Gap etc

Touch wood I’ve not even had a puncture let alone ripped a tyre. Is the mendips that rocky? I’ve ridden near cheddar and I don’t remember anything massively rocky.

Pressure wise I tend to run 20f / 25r on mellow stuff but if uplifting I’ll go a few psi higher at each end.

loss of grip?

do you honestly really need all that much grip for trail centres n bike parks?
I wouldn’t even be using a soft compound tread for BPW.
Overly soft exos squirm like **** when pushed hard cornering.

Windhill (from what i’ve seen) I’d be running 40psi+ and as fast rolling rear as I could.

The Mendips aren't a trail centre or a bikepark and that's where I ride the most. Your impression of Wind Hill is probably warped by watching videos of the jump lines - it's not all like that.

JP

Don't think I'd ever run an MTB tyre at 40+ psi off road.
What was everyone running before DD casings then? Maybe if I were racing DH in very rocky conditions, but general riding, not needed for me.

I only run Exo/grid casings on all bikes. I’m 110kgs and running reasonable pressure 23-25psi have had no problems with pinch flats. My local area is not rocky, but even on my Alps bike/trips, I’ve not flatted.

Other than uplift, I’d not run DD casings.

I holed 3 exo rear tyres in pretty short order, sure, it's impossible to say that any tougher tyre would've survived, but I'm not wishing to spend another 40 quid or whatever to test that theory out. 😂

I'm about 90kg all in, and like around 30psi in the rear, as the 2.3 slaughter grid I've had on for the last year isn't the biggest, so wee bit of air gives me more protection.

When I run 40psi+ it's not for rock protection. It's for rolling speed, sidewall support and pop.
I tend to run higher pressures anywhere hard pack n bermy/jumpy.. Even if there's a mix of technical terrain too. Eg I ran 50/60psi (DMR moto rt on a dirt jump bike and that's just what I always run them at) at Glentress and inners last week and ended up riding a few off piste Enduro descents and steep loose trails (as you do) . Grip was fine. Just need to nail your line and it's a bit more harsh. But I still preferred the rolling speed of the higher pressures over moar grip. But yeah I haven't ever seen footage of anything natural/technical at Wibdhill.
Is there a lot there?
The mendips is fairly standard SW XC terrain. No? (only ridden there a couple of times) I'certainly don't remember it to be Dunkeld, Glencoe or Ft William or anywhere North of Stirling sort of terrain anyway.

Wind Hill has 3 more technical, less jumpy lines - one red and two black. Plenty of roots, step downs and some slippery corners in the wet.

The Mendips as a whole is quite XC, but I ride specifically in one place - Rowberrow - where there are loads of off piste tracks that have been created over the years. Most are very rooty and very slippery in the wet. I want as much front end grip as possible here, as they don't dry quickly.

You're right on the jump trails at Wind Hill - low pressures aren't needed and high pressures help speed.

JP

I tried exo on the rear a few years ago and put a hole in it almost immediately, fixed that, then holed again , rinse and repeat for the entire ride, binned the tyre after that ride , And went back to specialized grid , and no issues ever since. Its quite rocky where I ride.

I fancy trying maxxis again, but will go doubledown this time.

My experience is that EXO tyres dont last on the back if you are riding rocky, hard enduro or dh type trails on a big bike. They can be ok on the front. It does depend on how and what you ride, but for me the extra weight and support is woth it.

My experience is that EXO tyres dont last on the back if you are riding rocky, hard enduro or dh type trails on a big bike.

They can last just fine on the rear. but as you say (with fronts). it depends entirely on how you ride. if you're clumsy, a biffer, a stiff brake dragger or take mental/shit lines slapping straight into rocks with no finesse yeah you're probably not going to get away with it for long.
FWIW I run 2.3-2.4 Exo (SS, HRII & DHRIIs) on all of my 170mm bikes and regularly ride lots of enduro/DH tracks.
had one sidewall tear from a glanced rock in the last 3 years (Stuck a tube and tyre boot in it and it was fixable at home with a car patch) and one edge knob rip a hole behind it as it cracked but that was a rear SS that had done 1500 miles of enduro/DH on a 50lb 170mm Emtb.

Too many EXO or equivalent failures for me to ever go back. Ran DD rear all last year and now on a DH casing Assegai. I don’t need to worry/nurse the back end anymore and that’s worth much more than the few 100g weight saving...

I’m 100kg and clumsy for reference. Ride lots of rocky, rooty natural trails, hardpack trail centres and race a few enduros.

I'm an absolute mincer who can run normal Bonty XC (XR) tyres without issue but the EXO Maxxis I've had in the past seem fragile by comparison. Also the comment above about them being floppy at pressures you actually want to run them at holds true. Overall a nay from me on EXO

😀
if any tyre's sidewall is too floppy/vague/foldy you are clearly not using "pressures you actually want to run" with that particular casing.

Fair point 😉 I'll rephrase. EXO sidewalls cut and wear easily and must be at higher pressures than just stopping rim dings in order to give them the stability required whereas other tyres are available with better durability for the same weight and rim dingability is the limiting factor in choosing an appropriate pressure as they have far better lateral support from more supportive sidewalls. Is that ok 😀

Hahah... You're getting there.
but...

other tyres are available with better durability for the same weight

Just isn't true.
A higher level of sidewall toughness/durability/stiffness/puncture protection generally adds weight to the sidewall
Exo is somewhere towards the weaker lighter end of the scale but by no means the lightest/weakest casings around.
Choice is a good thing and that's why we have are various levels of sidewall protection available for tyres of the same tread.

#Chooseacasingandbeadickaboutit 😉

<div class="bbp-reply-author">benpinnick
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Ive got Exo+ (You can get them). They seem good. 50g or so weight penalty, no issues so far. Of course that could just be luck.

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Where can you get Exo+? Not seen them advertised for sale online anywhere? Can LBS's get them yet?

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Bikester has them

Exo toughness varies depending on the tyre. A Shorty 2.5 Exo is tougher and stiffer than the same tyre in a 2.3 - and the more XC tyres are less tough than that.

which one of those would be heavier with more rubber/tread holding it's shape?

A very nice gif an all, but there are different ways to distribute the rubber in the overall design of a tyre. Other manufacturers seem to do a better job of getting more out of a given weight of rubber in a similar size/ expected use tyre, Bontrager being my personal favourite but I'm sure others will of course disagree 😉 End of the day Exo has left me disappointed despite tending to get on with many other tyres in a range of different versions without a second thought.

fair enough i'm just messin'

you might want to take a look at who actually manufactures Bontrager tyres though.

Jeez 😀 Ok, "other brands...". I hope the OP appreciates the required pedantry in this thread to best help select a future tyre

OK - interesting stuff - thanks.

Still not decided what to do, though.

JP

I don’t puncture that often, I use a variety of casings. However the few times I’ve cut a sidewall I’ve been going quick enough that the rim is dead by the time I’ve stopped. I’ve never ripped a Supergravity or WTB tough sidewall which works out cheap insurance when riding somewhere rocky. I tend to offset the weight by using something fast rolling like a Rock Razor on the back and not going too nuts with the sealant.

If I’m just riding any casing will do, if it’s a race or uplifts I’ll go heavy duty. Plenty of cheaper option than maxxis too.

How about just buy the Exo of your choice in a sale and make your own mind up from actual experience as to whether you can manage to ride it fitted to either wheel without instant death?
Just don't run stupid pressures and come back here moaning 😉

Exo front and DD rear works for me.

Tyre choice is a very personal thing. I tend to ride maxxis dual ply 60a rear and Grid or DD front. I am only about 74kg but tend to take a fairly direct line through rocks (read zero finess). Some mates ride similar stuff at similar speeds on exo without problems. Horses for courses and all that.

chestercopperpot

Exo front and DD rear works for me.

Works for me too

Front - DHF 2.5 WT 3C Maxx Terra EXO TR running 24psi

Rear - Aggressor 2.5 WT DD TR running 28psi

I do find the side wall threads start to show through quite qick on the DD but doesn't affect the tyres performance that I've noticed.

Ride all over The Peak. Lakes, Wales and others, 99% natural riding 1% Trail Centre. Been to Spain a few times, France, Morocco and off to Maderia with same set up

I'm a serial tyre killer. Ran DD all last year including a week in Finale and Ard Rock etc without a single puncture despite running an Aggressor completely into the ground.

Fitted an Exo on the rear for one single day day last year (Tweedlove International - it had forecast rain which never arrived) and put a big cut in it at the start of stage 4 (waterworld).