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Tragic, something monumental needs to be done by the government.
during the snow on Friday night a Toyota 4x4 squeezed itself between the road barrier and a stationary HGV taking half the side of the HGV cab with it, they just carried on motoring
there are too many people around driving cars that shouldn't who don't care anything for anybody else
What the f? This is either reporting of something unrelated or the driver has previously tried to mow someone down, then suceeded? If so, that's not tragic, it's murder."Eyewitnesses said police were investigating several separate incidents in and around the Hanham area. There were also reports that the person involved deliberately targeted people."
Watching out for the facts on what happened ... Who to blame? Serial bike murderer? Awful. Condolences to all.
I live in this area and sadly aggro from drivers is nothing unusual. It's a typical car-dependent suburb of a city, too far from the city centre to walk, the buses are crap (and expensive) and the main route into the city is hilly and busy enough that most "normal" people would never think of cycling.
The result is that hardly anyone cycles, and the crapness of the cycle provision is such that it often creates conflict between drivers and cyclists - for example the cycle lanes are all non-mandatory, and are frequently blocked by parked vehicles even during rush hour, so you have to pull out into the road. Driving into town is maddening as it can take anything from 20 minutes to upwards of an hour to get the same distance, depending on traffic conditions.
There are loads of schools and a good proportion of the population is elderly, but there are no 20 limits and traffic calming solutions are about as unimaginative as you can get, i.e. speed bumps and flashing signs.
If you throw someone with a short fuse into an environment like this then chances are they will be getting positive reinforcement from people around them about what a pest cyclists are, how speed limits stop them from going about their business, and the usual toxic rubbish that we're all familiar with from the comments section of local newspapers. To be honest I'm surprised there aren't more incidents like this.
The b'tard has handed himself in.
Eeek. Thats about a mile or two from where I am at the moment!
simple and unpopular answer is people who kill with cars should lose their license. Forever. Driving is not a right it is a priviledge. People claim that they need cars for work/socialising/living normally. Tough.
If I legaly owned a rifle, with appropriate license and training, then ook said firearm to a shopping centre a released a few rounds into ceiling, would the courts let me have my license back in 6-12 months?
Terrible news. was really worried for a bit that it could be a couple of mates. Was very relieved to get a txt back but there's still a couple who won't be returning home tonight.
I'm in Bristol too. Terrible news. I wish I knew what the answer was.
Loving the advert for bbc.co.uk/autos with the slogan "Passionate about car culture" just above the story.
How ****ing incompetent and insensitive can you be.
Tragic and infuriating event.
Even if it was a total accident out of the drivers control they've left the scene possibly before they were dead. Only to hand themselves in when they've realized that they can't get away with it. They have to come down pretty hard on this incident.
Very sad to here things like this, can't imagine what it's like for the families and friends.
Murder - Manslaughter --same result -- Awful --
apparently they were on a tandem 🙁
This is very sad.
FOR ME IT'S VERY CLOSE TO HOME
It's happening all the time and the same issues come up...dodgey drivers, weak laws etc. We all carry some fear when we ride on uk roads, and we all wish this country would move faster towards becoming a safer place for us to ride.
I'm speaking from cruel and bitter experience...in 2008, our son, a wonderful 25 year old and club rider, was hit by a van.
From that day, our lives changed forever, we'll struggle until end of our days to make sense of life without him.
No amount of imagination by someone it's never happened to, can ever hope to reveal what it's like to lose a loved one in this way, especially a child.
From the heart I want to say this....if we really want to do something, then we can do much worse than supporting organisations that strive to bring an end to this endless stream of intolerable events, and that directly help those who are unlucky enough to have their lives torn to shreds as ours were.
http://www.roadpeace.org/about/
Roadpeace helped us and I cannot praise them enough.
They helped us through some unimaginably agonising times, and it lifted some of our feelings of isolation knowing that there are people who dedicate themselves to help people like us, and who pressure governments very effectively to do something.
They are very cycling orientated and occasionally you'll see people from Roadpeace entered in cycling events that support them.
Rome wasn't built in a day, and we all know the issues, but it's better to do something. Eventually, even though too late for some, things Will get better.
I'm nothing to do with Roadpeace, only that I support them and am incredibly grateful for their existence.
Dave
This is terrible news. I caught something of it before I went off to sleep with the radio on.
Dave, sorry for your loss and the memories that stories like this bring back. As you say Rome was not built in a day. Lets hope that something is done now to reduce the loss of life on our roads.
The riders in question have now been named and there's a little more info - relieved to see it's nobody I know, but then they're somebody's friends/son/daughter (I'm just hoping they're not also somebody's mother/father) so it's still a tragedy. RIP Ross and Clare.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-21226126
"Mr Lovell is due to appear before North Avon Magistrates' Court on Wednesday charged with two counts of causing death by dangerous driving.
Mr Lovell, 38, of West Street, Oldland Common, has also been charged with driving while disqualified, driving with no insurance and failing to stop at the scene of a collision"
Scum.
wasn't this guy being chased down by the police, thought I read somewhere else
either way see too many idiots on the road who think they own the road
wasn't this guy being chased down by the police, thought I read somewhere else
The car was speeding, Police saw him and indicated for him to stop (usually a flash of the blue lights i think) he ignored them and charged off, out of the Police cars sight, he crashed into the other car and then into the tandem.
Mr Lovell, 38, of West Street, Oldland Common, has also been charged with driving while disqualified, driving with no insurance and failing to stop at the scene of a collision"
I had ssumed there were other factors dtermining his decision not to stop bar speeding alone....
[url= http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/s_to_u/sentencing_manual/death_by_dangerous_driving/ ]Sentencing guidelines[/url]
So what do we think he is going to get!!!
I have a feeling not enough!!!! but i hope i am wrong.
Indeed mrmo.
Surely going to be looking at Level 1: 7-14 with a start at 8, aggravated by at least 6 out of the 7 factors listed. Mitigated by none other than handing himself in.
Was the Sun shining - any chance he was blinded by glare?
Just before Christmas, the wife of a mate of mine was crossing the road at some lights in Manc city centre. An uninsured driver went through on red, mowed her down and drove away. She died the day after.
They have a 1 year old boy who, due to the actions of this rodent, will never know his mother.
Thankfully tthe police caught the driver.
IMHO - after spending a long time in prison, the **** should never be allowed to drive again.
IMHO - after spending a long time in prison, the **** should never be allowed to drive again.
I agree. But it's seemingly impossible to enforce.
Mr Lovell, 38, of West Street, Oldland Common, has also been charged with driving while disqualified
Horrendous news, really hope the driver gets a long time in jail. It's been said that uninsured/licensed drivers should not be allowed to drive again. But if they have never had the licence/insurance anyway what's stopping them driving again? In my eyes If you kill somebody- like this chap has done in Bristol then you get life in prison. Not 25 years or 6 weeks and to play on a Xbox all day etc. life you come out in a box.
Last Xmas I lost my Nephew and my Nieces Fiancé in an RTA, a Van driver was speeding through some flat country lanes near their home in the Fens and the driver hit them hard and killed them both. It’s taken a year to get this to court and the Driver has been jailed for 7 years and banned from driving for 7 years and also has to take a retest before having his license back.
I don’t know if this is justice or not but I suspect that the Driver will serve only half that sentence and then be released. It’s ripped my Sisters family apart, totally. It’s the devastation that’s left behind which is the most disturbing factor.
Just awful 🙁
It's manslaughter, and high time the courts started sentencing appropriately.
My guess is that this case will see a stiff custodial sentence, meanwhile, less well-known cases will continue to receive a slap on the wrist.
you seen the stuff about the foam in australia, the news showed this [url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-21247815 ]vid[/url] for a chuckle at the end of the program. utter onanist driving completely unseen with presumably naff all visibility narrowly misses 4 pedestrians, oh how we laughed. you're not helping here you know BBC 😯there are too many people around driving cars that shouldn't who don't care anything for anybody else
100%. Accidentally killing someone with your car is a serious offence and should be treated as such. Lifetime driving ban a possibility, but certainly a ban and retest later, at the moment offender can drive away from court in many cases.It's manslaughter, and high time the courts started sentencing appropriately.
OTTNot 25 years or 6 weeks and to play on a Xbox all day etc. life you come out in a box.
If you throw someone with a short fuse into an environment like this then chances are they will be getting positive reinforcement from people around them about what a pest cyclists are, how speed limits stop them from going about their business, and the usual toxic rubbish that we're all familiar with from the comments section of local newspapers. To be honest I'm surprised there aren't more incidents like this.But this is no excuse for this type of scum ,who was
"Mr Lovell is due to appear before North Avon Magistrates' Court on Wednesday charged with two counts of causing death by dangerous driving.
Mr Lovell, 38, of West Street, Oldland Common, has also been charged with driving while disqualified, driving with no insurance and failing to stop at the scene of a collision"
Scum
What sort of sentence will ring reason with idiots like this who have NO repect for the law or anybody else for that matter.
Tragic news.
I am constantly astounded by how socially accepted death and inury by RTA somehow seems to be, why it is not acted upon more effectively? and how many road users behave is a disgrace.
This is a matter of public safety that is lacking attention IMO.
sadly this is not an isolated incident..
source gov.uk:
The number of people reported killed or seriously injured has also increased by 2 per cent to 25,023 from 24,510 in 2010
TWENTY FIVE THOUSAND!!
Clearly what I wrote above was based on a large pinch of assumption, based on initial reports that someone in the area had been deliberately targeting cyclists.
I wouldn't dispute that this guy is clearly a total idiot who deserves whatever punishment is coming to him. However there is more going on here than just the actions of one irresponsible person. I live in this area and it is genuinely hard to get around if you don't drive. It's not a leap of the imagination to say that even if people lose their licences, under these conditions they may well decide to carry on driving. We need a major change in the way people view private transport and the way they live their lives if these sorts of incidents are going to cease.
There's also the less headline-grabbing aspect of dangerous cycling and walking conditions - the number of people who lead sedentary lives and die prematurely. This should be a national scandal.
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those stats dont make sense --1 in 84 chance of dying in a motor vehicle-- there are about 3,500 a year --multiply by 84 that gives less half a million-- surely there are more people in cars than that ?
Aside, the killer of the bristol couple, until these 'offences' are treated accordingly, human life on the road will continue to be regarded as expendable. There needs to be a sea change in attitudes and punishments for disregard of others whilst driving-- starting with the portrayal of it as 'fun' !!
Driving is a privellage not a right, poor skills/behaviour should be ruthlessly sanctioned-- i know it will not prevent all deaths/injuries but it will decrease them, and alter peoples perception of responsibility whilst in control of potentially lethal machinery .
As for the 25,000 number mentioned above, a KSI includes things like having a cut which is dealt with at the scene of the accident. I'm not condoning the number, as it needs to be lower, but KSI stats lump everything together so even the most minor or injuries is counted.
I cannot believe that chart - death by firearms assault at 1/314.
In the UK?
Are you sure this is UK statistics?
those stats dont make sense --1 in 84 chance of dying in a motor vehicle-- there are about 3,500 a year --multiply by 84 that gives less half a million-- surely there are more people in cars than that ?
I read it as out of all of the ways people died, 1/84 did it in cars.
not everyone died...
Well it can't be a uk statistic as it includes death by legal execution.
It's obviously based on US or worldwide statistics but it illustrates a valid point - walking and cycling are dangerous but not doing regular exercise is more dangerous. Imagine if that headline wasn't "2 cyclists killed by car in Hanham" but "50 people die of heart disease in Frenchay Hospital"
When you start thinking about this, you have to ask why people in some countries don't, and others do. And time and time again - [url= http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/avoiding-traffic ]even in this seething puddle of testosterone [/url]- [url= http://www.lec.lancs.ac.uk/research/society_and_environment/cycling/Understanding_Walking_&_Cycling_Report_WEB.pdf ]dangerous walking and cycling conditions come up as a factor[/url].
killed or [b]seriously[/b] injured so not minor cuts and bruises. IANAStatisticianbut KSI stats lump everything together so even the most minor or injuries is counted.
quick google [url= http://www.plymouth.gov.uk/homepage/transportandroads/besafe/roadsafety/roadsafetystatistics.htm ]plymouth council says[/url]
Serious - injury including fracture, internal injury, concussion, severe shock, severe cuts, detention in hospital
And you can see "slight" figures are a LOT higher than KSIs for their region.
I've starter writing to my MP every time I see one of these crappy sentencing cases reported.
I urge all of you that are offended and bothered about it to do the same, it dead easy and everyone is a step in the right direction to change.
Well it can't be a uk statistic as it includes death by legal execution
of course it can.
[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21137649 ]Brit on Bali death row[/url]
really depends on whether it is about how you die in the UK, or how UK residents die.
It might not be the UK, just pointing out it could be.