Local league races you can ride anything. I'm on a 3 speed hub and flat bars this season, and have occasionally ridden a singlespeed radiator at Christmas races....
If it is truly muddy then forget all rounder tyres. If you are having to change tyres anyway, then just get full mud ones (X one bites are popular in the grim NW).
I think you'll be pleasantly surprised at how not-slow a decent wet tyre feels for all round use, I'd just leave mine on all the time if I weren't concerned about tread wear.
Vittoria Terreno Wet would be my recommendation but am not sure anyone has stock!
I’ve done a couple of training sessions with the local team whilst my son has been doing his Go-Ride sessions.
I am struggling with grip – I’m doing it on a gravel bike with completely inappropriate tyres.
If I want to have a go at a race later in the season I can do this on a gravel bike right? If it is a local race.
Are there any restrictions on tyres? All I could see was a reference to plugged bar ends.
Either way what all-rounder tyre do people recommend? Gravel Kings are not good on damp grass and will be a nightmare on slippery mud!
You can absolutely do your local league races on just about anything, lots of people turn up on their MTB and TBH I don't see much distinction between a Gravel bike and a 'proper' CX bike.
Technically under the proper BC/UCI rules tyres should be a max width of 33mm, but that's really only a concern if your troubling the front of the field or taking part in national races
I'm just using my Gravel bike with skinnier "compliant" tyres, half the field seem to be doing the same and many aren't bothering with CX specific <33mm tyres, at least earlier in the season, as it only really matters if you're podiuming/in a points scoring position and a commisare takes an interest (not a problem I'm ever likely to have 🙂 ).
If you want some more grip you can invest in some knoblier tyres, I've been using Vittoria 'Terreno Mix' tyres and they've been OK for me, similar treads are available from all sorts of manufacturers in both tubed and tubeless flavours, Grip is affected by pressures a fair bit (as with MTBs). Ultimately grip is always going to be somewhat limited, it's half the point of the format skinny tyres, muddy, grassy, sandy surfaces with tight, flat turns during winter months.
But yeah, don't obsess over optimal bike/kit/tyres it's a great racing format if you to just "race what ya brung" and lots of fun whichever end of the field you're at.
@tpbiker I think I might be in your team of volunteers for Sunday with my wife Sarah!
Sorry I missed your earlier response. Yep that was me, thanks for your help on the day. We had a great team and received some great feedback about the day
Still struggle to see the appeal of cross racing myself, looks miserable!😂 but lots of folks seemed to have a great time which is what counts.
Thanks all. Not looking to spend a fortune so something on the gripper end of the format would be good. Feels like the complete opposite of the TTs I was taking place in earlier in the year when I was just worrying about RR!
I was thinking something like this might be quite good - still has uses outside the CX as well for winter gravel. I have two sets of wheels so can have something faster rolling on one set and something like this on the other set.
https://www.merlincycles.com/schwalbe-g-one-ultrabite-performance-tle-folding-tyre-700c-261165.html
Currently on Gravelkings and they are awful on grass.
Yep I had previously gone to the trouble of building a cheap second set of 700c wheels so I now have 2 wheelsets for the bike, a heavier set with ~40mm Gravel tyres, the other set Now with these: https://www.merlincycles.com/vittoria-terreno-mix-tnt-g20-folding-cyclocross-tyre-700c-186958.html Cheaper, still Tubeless Ready, Skinnier but the 31mm come up at 33mm for me on 20mmm internal rims.
I've done a couple of extra rides on the Terrenos to get a feel for them outside of racing.
They're obviously not as plush and much more sensitive to lower pressure due to that wee bit less volume but they spin up and roll nicely.
TBH I would swap back to the other wheelset for winter rides now.
One guy was getting a bit indignant as he was trying to pass around the outside, but the passee drifted wide and effectively shut him out. Whether the passee did it deliberately or just naturally it seemed perfectly legit to me?
Also a guy after the race complaining that someone didn’t let him past when he called ‘coming through’. I suppose this is trickier if there is an obvious disparity in speed, and it can be tricky to know who’s lapping and who isn’t, but there’s definitely folk who seem to think that people are obliged to move over even when not getting lapped? I was a bit annoyed that I gave the line to someone then realised they probably weren’t much faster than me and I could have legitimately made them work for the pass at the very least?
Drifting wide to close the door if racing for position is perfectly ok, so long as it's not elbowing people or sudden line changes.
"Coming through" is utterly meaningless and if I heard it when commissairing would be having words with the rider to explain so as it confers no information. If lapping riders this needs to be made clear, if just racing for position then there's no obligation at all to move off line.
Sorry I missed your earlier response. Yep that was me, thanks for your help on the day. We had a great team and received some great feedback about the day
Still struggle to see the appeal of cross racing myself, looks miserable!😂 but lots of folks seemed to have a great time which is what counts.
No worries, enjoyed it and the event seemed to be well received as you say. Nice to meet you.
Yeah, not sure CX it’s for me either but enjoyed watching!
No worries, enjoyed it and the event seemed to be well received as you say. Nice to meet you.
Yep, great course at the weekend guys, fast and fun!
Apologies for some of the damage to the course markers, I was so knackered at one point I just sort of pedalled straight through the tape before straightening up, found some melted blue tape on my chain after the race 😎
double post
I don't think I'm going to race at all this year - COVID (or something) has left me unfit and feeling shite after even moderate efforts, so our Sunday afternoon races are no good for me
If you pm me yr address I'll send you some testers !
Good racing at the weekend?
The NW round in Burnley yesterday was excellent - beautiful sunny autumn day. Course was a fairly heavy lower field - completely rideable just had to be a bit careful on some corners, a lot of riders on their arses. Spiral was cool as always. Then a hard-surfaced loop up a hill gave some merciful respite on the descent back down.
Had some good ebb and flow battles - last race was fast wide and open and if you passed / got passed that was it pretty much. Heavier technical course yesterday created more of a dynamic, riders would come back at you - finished midfield but felt a lot better.
My 9 year old boy is really enjoying his CX racing this season. He's done 2 and I have signed him up for another 6. He's keen to do his best and has even been training on the rollers in the evenings. His next race is at Callander House this weekend and its at night 😳
He's looking forward to it, should be an experience to remember.
Was scoping out the course at the weekend for the CX race in Etal on the 6th December. Could be a muddy one as it looks to go through a farmer's field. The back drop of the castle should be cool. Might convince the wife to come along then I can have a post race pint in the Black Bull 😉
Only just seen this thread, first year of any CX racing for me after owning a CX bike for years! Mid-week or saturday races suit me best, does anyone know of any through the winter? Did the Supermarine series at Swindon in September, great fun. Based in oxfordshire but happy to travel a bit 🙂
I really enjoyed Burnley as it's a great mix and plays to everyones strengths and weaknesses. It was a definite 2 bike job if you've got a spare as the pits alone were quicker than fighting through the mud adjacent to them. Finished just outside the top 10, reasonably happy with that but still suffering from having covid a few weeks ago. My daughter was 4 seconds froma podium in the U12's, so she's say she's going to try a bit harder next time!
I will be riding Terrino wets all season as they are my only tyres and they don't feel to slow to me. Infact they are quicker on the more technical sections then the boys on semi slicks. I did have a close call with a thorn !
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I was on terreno wets on one bike at the weekend - good tyres. The tread is visually not very convincing for the mud but they work.
@rapidrob95
Wessex leaguer here. Sunday races though. We get nice big fields so you'll always get good racing.
A few every year nearish to you (you've missed Reading & Swindon but still Andover, Popham and Dalton Barracks)
Shock to the system yesterday. First race of the year and first time riding with any pace in a long time too. It showed 😂 I was wrecked after doing two practice laps!
Last year I had done similar amounts of riding but managed to keep up ok, I guess the residual fitness from my last full cx season in 2019 has now all seeped away!
Practice laps are overrated, the bike gets dirty and it isn't like there aren't 50 people in front of me to keep an eye on for the best/worst lines
Falkirk course looked a tough one...the kids race at night was amazing - I got a bit carried away with my cheering the clubs in the club - 1 of them told me even at the far end of the course he could still hear me cheering him on - clearly no escape for them!
@didnthurt, how did your kid get on?
Each kid who entered got a free set of handlebars - the race starts all looked like the parents were about to draw battle swords and raise them high!
Watched the female and male races yesterday - they were all giving it some serious Welly...course didn't look easy but did seem to get faster as the races went on.
Was great to watch.
I only got along to Callendar Park briefly on Saturday afternoon to watch. Was too late getting back from a morning escapade to head along on Sunday to watch more. Course looked brutal and fairly horrible conditions - watched a (I think) U14/16 girl have a nasty off at the transition from final slope onto the flat, too much speed and thudded down at speed.
Think the club were happy with how it went!
Rode the West Midlands series at Aldersley and I was glad of my Terrino Wets as it was very muddy but a great course
I've raced SCX races at Callendar Park, its a great course, very MTBer friendly. Selfishly hoping it turns into a SCX race again in future
Shock to the system yesterday. First race of the year and first time riding with any pace in a long time too. It showed 😂 I was wrecked after doing two practice laps!
It was good to see you. If you need any help with Singleton give me a shout and I'll see if I can rally some Pigs!
Yeah good to see you too. Thanks for the offer of help! I think we should be Ok but might need a marshal or two. Got to double check everyone that said they'd help still will ... and double check everthing esle for that matter 🙂
He loved it, he really tried. He came in towards the back the field but was still in the mix during the race.
I'm loving my new bars 😂
We had a look (and a walk up) 'The Wall!' looked tough, he was glad it wasn't in the under 12's race.
On the Sunday morning he then went on to score his first goal of the season. This was his teams first win also. What a weekend!
Any predictions on how Stadt Moers will be running tomorrow in the NW? Usually one of my fav courses but had some back problems since last time out, if it's any sustained running I'll need to swerve it.
I'll be there anyhow with my daughter racing U12s, so can make a decision on the day - parcours inspection. Good luck to anyone else racing in their respective leagues.
Muddy, there's usually a quagmire through the woods and round the back of the course. Won't be there myself as I'm on a BC Coaching course in Marple. Good luck!
Was meant to be organising our clubs round on Sunday but the council cancelled our booking on Tuesday because of all the rain. Pretty irritated to be honest, a lot of wasted work and the bit we use wasn’t hugely boggy. While it would have undoubtedly got badly cut up, it always recovers.
Busy trying and currently failing to find an alternative venue for a back up date at the moment.
I kind of wonder if the way people got in the habit of using their local parks during the lockdowns (which is obviously a good thing), has made finding CX venues harder.
Start Moers? I'd go for medium muddy with a copious smearing of dog poop. Moderate mud rather than the wall to wall sea of grassless slop we had the other year (which actually suited me).
We've had a few weeks ill and then just back from a saturated 7 Stanes week so have unfortunately neglected to enter 🙂
If anyone is racing NDCXL at Chetwynd tomorrow, remember to be nice to the marshalls!
I kind of wonder if the way people got in the habit of using their local parks during the lockdowns (which is obviously a good thing), has made finding CX venues harder.
The venue thing is frustrating, one we used last year want £3k which is ludicrous and ain't gonna happen, another wanted £5k.
That is a ludicrous amount of money! I think people just don’t want venues getting churned up anymore… which kind of defeats the point of ‘cross!
Fantastic day marshalling the NDCXL at Chetwynd barracks - 300+ riders across all the age groups, everyone seemed to have a great day, even if many new riders hadn't ridden a sandpit previously, only a few came off! Shame that the sandpit was only a third of it's normal length after 3 years not being used due to covid.
Nikki Brammeier looking stupidly quick and very focused in the womens race
Thanks @morecashthandash My son was racing in the under 9s at Chetwynd today
Hope he enjoyed it, the kids races are great to watch. Did you treat him to frites from the van afterwards?
No - he is strange - he doesn’t really like chips! 🤣
Even stranger, he rides CX! 🤣🤣
Stadt was really good today - bit of a course reroute from previous year made it less variable but way more rideable. It was wet, muddy, and absolutely tanned it down at times today but was all 100% rideable bar the short pitch with the steps that is always there.
Had a solid race (18th) but twas a bit no mans land - couldn't catch the guy in front, wasn't being caught from behind and it was like that for most of the race. Pretty heavy conditions - head down grind it out and don't fall off.
Belter of a course at the Welsh League round in Builth Wells yesterday. Not as muddy as I'd have hoped for after the weeks of rain, but probably a blessing with only one bike. Slippery in places and a great lay out with a fair bit of offcamber and some fun hairpins. Much less climbing than is traditional at Builth, made for more of a cx course and evened the balance out between skills and fitness at bit.
Happy with my mid pack result, definitely felt better than last race, and and some fun close racing in parts. Most gratifying part of the day was going round one offcamber corner and hearing someone say 'that's the line, he's nailed that' as I went past 🙂
We had a dry one in the NW - fast field course in S Cheshire nearly Staffs. Kinda had a disaster in snapping my chain on the first hill - trundled my way to the pits thinking that's the race fked, may as well ride round seen as I'm here. Jumped on the spare bike and ended up finishing only a couple of places down where I might have done without the mechanical. One of those race interruptions that feel like half an hour but was in reality two minutes.
Bit of a break in our league now, although there is the N of England champs in York in two weeks which I'll prob enter.
I had a double pack cross weekend. One race on Saturday and one on Sunday. This is the first season I have been able to get a German racing license and am racing with people my own age (50+) rather than the open race which is always hectic with a lot of overly ambitious people wíth no idea about racing that I had been racing in previous years. The race on saturday was on a course I know well and after starting my first race last week on the back line and finishing 7th I was able to move up to the third row on Saturday for the start. Finished 4th which meant I was even further up the start grid on Sunday which was on a brute of a course on the side of a hill(think the steepness of the Koppenberg) and usually used as a MX track. A lot of very slick off camber grass turns which caught a lot of people out and some serious climbing and decending (300m of climbing after 6 laps)and managed the first podium of the season! Got 3rd. Still a long way to go to beat the first and second riders ; they put a good minute and a half on me over the 45min races.
I had a go at the cyclocross race in Castle Douglas today and just took a mountain bike not really knowing what to expect and was a real eye opener, kind of wish had read some of the earlier comments on here about tyre recommendations in advance but now curious how much bike style matters in mud?
Was only a couple of people on mountain bikes and noticeable that was a lot harder going, a combo of mud jamming the wheel and sliding a lot more than everyone else on proper cross bikes. I get that skinnier tyres will cut through the mud better and slide less but is there something about cross bikes that means they don't collect as much mud compared to a mountain bike? or are less affected?
It got so bad the rear wheel would not turn unless stopped regularly to clean it out but no one else seemed to be as bad. If I was to do another event and put skinny tyres on the mountain bike would be better or is there just something am missing out on not riding a cyclocross bike?
Everyone was nice about it and glad I tried it even if was a real slog!
It's not really a bike thing. Cross bikes aren't designed to be the optimum bikes for the races but rather within the rules and history of the sport. But regular racers will be doing things to make them better.
Within the rules modern bikes are designed to shed mud so have relatively big clearances.
The riders will be running mud tyres, designed to shed mud and be run at low pressures (tubs or tubeless?).
Riders will know how to ride the mud, spot the lines etc.
They might have two bikes and a pit crew depending on race level?
When it's muddy I've only got one bike so I do certain things to improve the situation.
Run. Yes I can ride it but is it better over the hour to run the worst section and have a working bike for the rest? Studs in shoes helps.
When you are running try and scrape some mud off.
Oil, everything! Except the brakes ;). Baby oil on my legs, tops of shoes, frame, pedals, rims and tyre side walls. Anywhere where mud sticks. Drive chain liberally oiled also to prevent mud build up on cassette and mech.
Never back pedal! Ever. If you like your rear mech.
Run pressures as low as you dare. Watch auddy pro race and they look like they've got flat tyres on tarmac.
Grip is a state of mind. X-one bites help. The fastest line is the one with momentum and grip to get the power down. Wide corners with a big radius, not always clipping the apex. Green is grip. Weight on the back wheel.
That said they cancelled our race this weekend because it was too muddy! Venue wasn't going to be happy with us destroying the school fields. We've lost venues over the years so people are cautious.
MTBs are bad in the mud though - exhausting trying to drive bigger tyres through heavy mud with little bite. And then when you need to run or carry it they're awkward relative to a cross bike. You can race them no prob up to a point @tom7044 - just when the courses start getting heavy they'll suffer.
The world cup was a really great race yesterday if anyone caught it - v hard course that ended up in a head to head battle between Pidcock and Vanthourenout. That's despite TP getting marooned at the start like a stalled F1 car - some problem with his gears.
Thank you for the insights, has been so long since deliberately rode in mud had forgotten the trick of spraying down everything with WD40 in advance.
In the heat of the moment wasn't sure if was something to do with a bigger chainring giving more space for mud to clear from round the bottom bracket whereas in reality is just me blaming my bike for skill shortage. Watching the earlier race categories was definitely impressed by the commitment and skills of the riders in the mud on the off camber corners and ramps.
The top guys did all seem to have two bikes too and were changing to a cleaned bike twice each lap.
Have already seen some comments about the mud in the park after which I guess is inevitable in a small place but hopefully will not put off doing again in future.
I had the pleasure of a slippy Wessex league in Andover this weekend. Total disaster on my part-total lack of skills on the bike and an equal lack of running fitness off it. I definitely run my tyres too hard but being a big lad I’m always worried about a pinch flat if I go low-especially as I’m lacking in finesse.
The giant man-made sandpit they created was a treat. I’d heard there was going to be sand so had a little practice on the sandpit at local field which is about 10ft long and 1inch deep. Hadn’t really prepared me for the race which was about 100ft and at least 6inch of soft sand.
Lots to think about and work on skills wise-I’m not sure I’ll have time to make significant fitness gains this season.
"In the heat of the moment wasn’t sure if was something to do with a bigger chainring giving more space for mud to clear from round the bottom bracket"
No but they do take mud shedding into account. I know 1x was a revelation as there was less stuff to collect mud. I'm assuming you are on a hardtail? A full suss might be a nightmare as there are more places to collect.
Sand is ace, except it brings tears to my eyes listening to the drive chain grind away. Sit back light steering and POWER.
Svenness videos still good for tips.
The world cup was a really great race yesterday if anyone caught it – v hard course that ended up in a head to head battle between Pidcock and Vanthourenout. That’s despite TP getting marooned at the start like a stalled F1 car – some problem with his gears.
Pidcock was phenomenal the way he rode through the pack, and I think would have won until he binned it on the transition from that muddy descent onto the cobbles. Brilliant course too, amazing skills in evidence... I'd have been on my arse about twelvtysix times every lap!
Yesterday’s Welsh champs was the first race this season that I’ve felt good at. TBF to myself I wasn’t expecting to race any of this season after a shoulder op to put a synthetic ligament in place back in July. Still recovering from it, and the attached weight gain due to alcohol consumption along with minimal cycling. The course was very similar to last years layout at Pembrey and the weather was suitably bitter. There was less sloppy mud this year though which allowed the off camber sections to be ridden much easier. Other side to this was the course was running very fast. Four tree trunks had been lain across the hill climb as another addition.
Due to only a couple of races prior I was gridded almost at the back of the V40s grid. A quick start along the tarmac and then into the main course. Had a good few laps tussling with @ferrals and then a couple more with a racer from Chester/Shropshire way. Finished 20th, so ten places down on last year but I’m still pleased, and enjoyed it very much.
Good to see you @shedbrewed - it was a shame those offcambers werent really coming into play they way they did last year but I enjoyed the course, though i blame those logs for the way my legs are feeling today! Unsurprisingly, my current lack of interest in riding a bike outside of occaisional racing, led to me blowing up at the half hour mark but it was fun chasing you while I could. Stuttered in somewhere near the back of the field as i was expecting but like you thouroughly enjoyed. The course map shows lots of corners for next week so hoping to hang on a bit longer in Newport, though I have a feeling it will be even colder next week
Highlight of my day (week actually) was my daughter doing her second ever race and riding really confidently to get on the U6 podium in 3rd - which she hasnt stopped talking about since... and was practising her hairpin turns on the way to school this morning.
That’s mega, mate. Great work by your daughter 👍
Cheers 👍 I was just chuffed with how much she enjoyed it.
Haven't raced all year, and not going to (I'm claiming it's due to CO-viddley but probably just inertia now)
Anyway, in answer to the poster above asking about cross bikes and mud, hrere's one I stole from our league's facebook last year:
Did my first muddy one on Sunday. Managed on one bike*. It wasn't too bad and a couple of runs gave you opportunity to pull lumps off. It was nice to have something that wasn't a grass crit. Line choices that weren't obvious, easy or required a bit of luck.
Missed too many so need to do the last two for a league place. Currently feeling grotty so bit worried I won't make Sunday 🙁 Form is best it's been in years.
*Managed = won the seniors!
Well done @jonba - suprised at seniors though, for some reason I had you pegged as an old bloke 😆
39 1/2 so at the old end of young. Vets next year.
Anyone catch this evening's pro race - superprestige at Diegem? Absolute classic, best race I've seen for years - defo worth a look if you can catch a replay.
No spoilers for the result, but each of MvdP, WvA and TP looking like the strongest person in the race at different times, and some proper shoulder to shoulder racing on the last lap.
Yes, tonight’s race was a classic with shoulder-to-shoulder racingright up to the last corner
Yup, rewound and re-watched the whole last lap again, brilliant racing.
Just catching up on it this morning, what a race!
Epic racing. The cyclo-cross stuff can ba fantastic to watch.
Backstead did really well!
That race just epitomises why I love MVdP. He races the same way everytime, 100% all in for the win. Feeling good, make the race hard, attack early, feeling bad,make the race hard, attack early, feeling so so,make the race hard, attack early, shit or bust for the win. WVA is far more considered and happy to follow but it's not as much fun to watch. Pidcock is also pretty good at firing his shots when he gets the chance.
I thought Pidcock was done and dusted 3-4 times, showed a lot of grit.
I also thought Wout was done at one stage.
WVA is far more considered and happy to follow but it’s not as much fun to watch.
Controversial! 😎
Wasn't it MvdP having to defend himself against accusations of making racing boring after an entire season of attacks off the front followed by 55 minute solo time trials to victory?
Plus WvA is probably tired of doing all the leading out after a season of towing the JV team (and half the peloton at times) up and down the road at the TdF 😂
Wout doesn't have the ability ( in this cross season at the moment) to drop those watt bombs that MVdP can, although MVdP doesn't seem to have the legs to hold gaps he creates (at the moment). When MVdP attacked through the sand last night it was a proper raise a glass and cheer moment.
Tom said in an interview that the road climb was a head wind that kept neutralising everything yesterday.
Another race another series of beast mode attacks from MVdP
Great race again - superb to see them so closely matched. Probably some tired legs there after this week's racing.
Big shame Pidcock won't commit to the worlds - he's shown a superb level so I was kinda hoping he'd have a wild change of heart. But postrace interviewer gave him a chance to talk about the remaining races and he just said he'd show his face in Benidorm for the WC race as he was training in Spain anyhow.
