[Closed] Croix de Fer 2014 ?

It's got lighter wheels anyway... ah, from Evans site

(TL:DR lighter wheels, disc brakes inside the triangle so you can use normal racks. Other things a bit better)

"Genesis Croix de Fer 2014 Cyclocross Bike. The irrepressible Croix de Fer returns for another year. Visually similar to last years’ model but with some choice tweaks to improve versatility, everyday use and overall ride characteristics. For starters, the new inboard disc dropout moves the calliper mounting position to between the stays, meaning no more faff to space out mudguards or a rear rack to clear the calliper. They’ve dropped weight from the Wheelset (via some lighter rims and double-butted spokes), upgraded to better sealed hubs and added Continental’s Cyclocross Speed semi-slick tyres into the mix for better rolling performance on a wide variety of different surfaces. Gearing has been widened via a 12-30T cassette out back to give a really low climbing gear to aid fully-laiden adventures into the unknown.

Everything’s brought to a shuddering halt by Hayes excellent new CX Expert (formerly CX5) mechanical disc brakes – the stiff, one-piece forged aluminium calliper offering brilliant power and modulation. There are integrated barrel adjusters for on-the-fly adjustments and we’ve offset the slight weight increase of the calliper with Hayes L1 lightweight rotor. Oh, and we’ve also added a 50cm frame size, meaning more of you can now enjoy the closest model we have in our range to that fabled ‘one bike’."
[url= http://www.evanscycles.com/products/genesis/croix-de-fer-2014-cyclocross-bike-ec052633#features ]Evan's product page for it[/url]

The stock wheels were always pretty poor so that is a decent improvement. I have the 2010 version. Seriously tempted to upgrade to the new 931 version though, it looks mint!

Ah, that does look fancy!!
http://shop.18bikes.co.uk/products.php?plid=m1b0s442p2037

I read the description stuff too, and it does look good. I wonder hwo much it weighs though now ? and how do the Hayes compare with BB7's ?

The 2014 wheels are half a pound lighter than the previous wheels (not sure on frame weight as never weighed the previous frameset) and definitely a good step up. The Hayes brakes also seem pretty decent and compare very favourably with the old Avids. They look much better imo. All in all the new model is a very nice improvement over the previous model.

Matthew - useful info, thanks. I reckon it's down to this and the pinnacle arkose 3. With some LBS discount prices much the same, Pinnacle 105 and carbon fork, vs Genesis comfy steel and tiagra. I don't race CX, so its for winter road, light off road and the odd summer touring weekend.

I'm in the same dilemma as you OP. Pinnacle Arkose 3 vs Croix de Fer look the best options out there for around £1k.

I think on the genesis website, in the comments there is a weight quoted around 24lb for the 58cm. Quite heavy, really. But it looks lovely though doesn't it?

Other potential options I'm looking at are boardman cx and saracen urban hack series, but they aren't lighting the fire so much as the pinnacle and genesis from idle internet browsing.

el b - it is an nice dilemma though 🙂 the arkose is 23.6 pounds so sounds like the genesis has certainly been on a diet !

fwiw Arkose weights on the site are around 1/2lb or more than what we've found bikes coming in at - we get a complete bike weight from the factory after assembly including reflectors, bells, whistles etc. 2012 Arkose 2 was 10.35kg in the C+ test.
Tricky decision tho since I wouldn't worry about the weight much.

Jameso - good man, thanks for that. Must say, you have been great with helpful impartial info on this and the other thread, much appreciated indeed.

Cheers

any daytimers got /seen the new 2014 one ?

I can weigh a 2014 Croix De Fer later if you'd like.

mattew - that would be ideal - a 54 if possible 🙂

Cheers

I've got the 2014 Croix De Fer and love it. I do about 150 miles a week commute on road and canal towpath. It's my first road/CX bike so I was a bit worried how it was going to be on the unmade paths but it's so comfortable and surprisingly fun. I obviously can't compare it with anything else but I'm very happy with it. I also thought about the Orange RX9 but glad I went for the steel frame.

It's a 54 and weighs about 25lbs with pedals.

nippy - useful feedback, thanks, esp the weight, as that is the size I'd be after. Cheers

In relation to the differences in the 2014 Croix De Fers:

- No price rise vs. 2013 (£1149.99srp)
- Carry-over colours and graphics
- New smaller 50cm size added
- New inboard mounted disc brake dropout (no longer need to space/bodge mudguards and rear rack to fit).
- Upgraded, lighter wheelset with Alex XD PRO rims (-30g per rim vs. 2012 XD-Lite) & double-butted spokes
- Upgraded Shimano Deore M525 hubs (vs. 2012 M475) – better sealed for longer life
- Hayes CX Expert (formerly CX5) cable disc brakes (w/ L1 lightweight rotor) replace Avid BB7
- Wider ratio 12-30T cassette added
- Faster rolling, semi-slick, Conti Cyclocross Speed 35c tyres
- Sealed cartridge bearing M:Part Elite headset
- Madison Prime road saddle
- New compact bend handlebar.

- [url= http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/genesis-croix-de-fer-2014#post-5021768 ]Sauce[/url]

Thanks for link Jamie. As you know from other thread its down to the pinnacle arkose 3 or this one. I currently have a Jake the snake and reckon the arkose is probably most similar to what I have. The genesis may be better suited to my needs - light off road, touring, winter trainer.......whilst it is a bit heavier it will likely be more comfortable I think.

I think the Croix De Fer, which I would love to abbreviate to CDF if that wasn't their other model, is more than 'a bit' heavier? I could be wrong.

As it goes, I may be in a similar situation to you, hence stalking you on all these threads :wink:, and would say the Arkose appeals more.

Jamie - I had a look at the Croix De Fer at LBS yesterday - lovely in the flesh, but not a light bike by any means. Am going to try and get a look at the Pinnacle too, but none around till mid Nov.

looking at the weights, and for a 54 frame, I think the difference is about 2 pounds.

So far I can't decide !

I'm usually the first to witter on about how great "my" bike is. I've had a Gensis Vapour (the alu version of CDF) for a couple of years....honestly, I wouldnt. Looks nice and all that but its just too heavy....I just dont think you need disc brakes. Upgraded the wheels to Crests on Pro II and that helps a bit but being mostly a roadie these days its no great pleasure throwing my leg over it.

mcboo - A fair point about the weights and discs for road use. I have a light carbon road bike for the majority of road duties, so this is more for touring/light off road and manky winter on road stuff

it's important to remember that the Croix de Fer is NOT a road bike.

i have a road bike, i also have a Cdf - i would NOT ride my road bike down a downhill track, i would not try and hoon it over jumps at the bmx track, i would not bounce it down steps, or hamfistedly bunnyhop up kerbs on my commute.

my Cdf has done all these things, and come out the other side with barely a scratch.

if you're worried that 25lbs (or whatever) might be too heavy, then you've completely missed the point.

The frame weight (56) for the 2011 CDF (725) is 5lbs with the fork weighing 1.75lbs...so almo

The frame weight (56) for the 2011 CDF (725) is 5lbs with the fork weighing 1.75lbs...so almo

Oh no! They got Daffy!

Right....thing is I thought I'd be doing all of the above and havent. I commute on mine and its fine for that. But I could really do with commuter I can use as a proper winter road bike, knock out 100k on a Saturday morning with my pals.

I'm not knocking Genesis, I really think they're a good outfit and make nice looking bikes. Am actually thinking of selling the Vapour and buying an Equlibrium. Anyone know what an Equilibrium 10 weighs?

mcboo - i do get your point, and probably my current 'in between bike', which is a rim braked Jake the Snake and more along the lines of a racier cx bike, fits the bill for what you are after.

But what I am after is something do it all, comfy, good for the stuff ahwiles talks of, plus summer touring weekends, gentle off road stuff with the kids etc. It will need to do winter road rides, albeit usdually sub 50 milers, round my local hilly back roads.

The Jake does all this quite well, but I fancy a change. I've got it down to this and the Pinnacle Arkose now, so getting there !

I have a 2013 Arkose which is my commuter - used on a mixture of road, cyclepath and towpath etc. It seems to be solid and not too lardy (alu frame/carbon fork). I've got it kitted out with full length guards and a rear rack/panniers.

I'm planning to do some touring on it and it will also get used for more sedate winter road rides when I don't want to take my shiny road bike out.

I do like Genesis bikes though!

addy - thanks for feedback. No one seems have a negative feedback really on either Genesis or Pinnacle 🙂

I guess it comes down to 1) Price 2) Components and 3) Weight*

Arkose is cheaper, better components and lighter.

Croix De Fer is built like a tank, in a good way, decent components and looks swish.

*With apologies to ahwiles.

Jamie - yes, but... The chainset on the Genesis is better than the Arkose, as are stem, post and bars I think, so it's just the 105 levers and mech.....

no apology needed.

i only butted in as the 'what does it weigh?' questions were detracting from the 'is it any good on singletrack?*' questions.

(*it's bloody great)

Jamie - yes, but... The chainset on the Genesis is better than the Arkose, as are stem, post and bars I think, so it's just the 105 levers and mech.....

Clear as mud, eh? 8)

Here is a handy comparison chart to stare at...click to make bigger.

[url= http://i.imgur.com/CiB5Llw.jp g" target="_blank">http://i.imgur.com/CiB5Llw.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

Note: Croix De Fer geo is from 2013 model, as 2014 data isn't on their website. I assume it is the same...but don't take it as fact.

The chainset on the Genesis is better than the Arkose, [s]as are stem, post and bars I think,[/s] so it's just the 105 levers and mech.....

That chart should beome my wallpaper for next few days of deliberation !

I'm having similar thoughts but finding it difficult to choose as a first time cyclocrosser or ever roadie type.
Torn between the Orange RX9 but am put off that it doesn't have a carbon fork.
The Genesis Vapour the Giant (but this isn't avaliable until end January)
Or the Planet X thing.
Oooh so difficult to decide.

erupton - bear in mind that there are 2 quite different types of bikes here. There are the more race oriented cx ones - Giant, Planet X, Vapour and then there are the more tour/do it all ones like the Croix De Fer. In between there are a bundle too; the Orange is a recent addition, and looks quite race oriented to me, although the fork choice, desptite what the recent mag review says, seems odd as you say. The Pinnacle on paper (and in mag reviews of the 13 model) is top spec , probably due to an 'unbranded inhouse' frame, which probably came from same factory as the branded ones anyway. The only criticism anywhere of the Pinnacle I can find is that some folk find their left heel kicks the rear brake adjuster and winds the pad in occiasionally.

On RRP, the Pinnacle is a better deal that the Genesis also. But, the Genesis has a certain appeal too !

Fair do's I am very unlikely to race more an alternative to the MTB so I can blast around but still want to do a bit of off road stuff.
This was why I was swaying toward the Vapour [url= http://www.genesisbikes.co.uk/bikes/adventure/cyclocross/vapour ]Vapour14[/url]
As sad as this sounds I'm put off that pinnicale purely because of the gash colours on the sticker (sad I know:-) especially as the Vapour is bright blue.

erupton - when I started my cx threads a few days ago the Vapour was top om my initial list, probably for same type of riding as you. I have now discounted it on basis of the very short headtube. The one that fits me (54) has a 10cm headtube, which is 3.5cm less than my Jake the Snake and Giant Road bike. I don't want that race position for the type of riding I will be doing. It is a lovely bike though

Cheers Iainc difficult thing is the lack of bikes to try especially as I've never even sat on one so as a first timer its a bit of a mindboggler 🙂

I have just gone through this process, but went for the 2014 Croix de Fer in the end. Went to see one at Evans, and was very impressed with the build quality and feel of the bike.

Just for info, I am 6ft and went for the 58cm.

Not bothered about the weight - it's no more than my 'lightweight' Spesh Epic FSR, and in any case, I have a skinny carbon summer road bike, so this needed to be completely different. I suspect those from a roadie background will find it heavier than those (like me) from an MTB background.

I felt very insecure this week flying down a hill on the carbon roadie with all the twigs, acorns, conkers etc all over the road - the Croix should be ideal for autumn and winter! 😉

Planet X Uncle John has a nice long headtube, more so than any other cross frame I could find. Fits me better than my pre-disc mount(Mk2?) Kaffenback. Doubles up as a winter trainer and cyclo cross and would do light touring well. For me, not only does it fit better than my Kaffenback, it does more jobs and does them better, Café (and back) winter training posing rides aside (but we don't do these in France anyway) Fitted with cantis because it was cheaper and it's what I had lying around, and decided to stick with them to offer me more flexibility for swapping around road wheels etc.

*still in Az Iain!*

I don't like the new mounting position for the rear disc. The cable exit point is aligned to catch water and crap coming off the disc/wheel, and the cable run creates a low point where any water will collect.
Exit seals will never be perfect, so this design doesn't seem very robust for regular riding in all weathers.
Croix is heavy, but it's a touring /commuting road bike, not a road racing bike.

Mike - interesting feedback, thanks. Just in from poss last road ride of the season on the carbon bike 🙂

I had a look at a 14 Croix De Fer in lbs other day and was impressed, just need to see an Arkose when they land next month now...

mm - you still having fun out there ? 🙂

I built up a Croix de Fer from a 54 frameset a while ago.

It weighs 22.5lbs with

- 105 Groupset
- Stans Iron Cross/Supercomp spokes/Hope 2 Evo hubs/Maxxis Raze tyres
- Use titanium seatpost and an old Flite Gel saddle (not particularly light)
- Look 4x4 pedals
- Genesis 100mm stem and Salsa Cowbell 2 bars
- BB7 brakes
- some gel under the bar tape (adds some weight)

I really like it and the saddle/seatpost combo is quite comfortable for offroad. The slightly flared bars are nice as well.

I like the steel and the alloy cross type bikes I have ridden have felt harsher.

I also have an Equilibrium (56) with 105 groupset, mavic ksyrium equipe wheels and 25mm GP4000 tyres, Deda Zero100 alloy bars and stem and Deda Zero100 carbon seatpost and titanium Charge Spoon saddle.

The Equilibrium weighs 20.5 lbs, so not a lot lighter.

If I had built the CDF first I wouldn't have the Equilibrium.

They are different bikes though - the Equilibrium, at 56, is more of a stable mile muncher for training, the Croix at 54 is a fun offroad blast but I have done rides of about 3 hours on it as well.

High Guys, some Genesis 2014 weights for you...

Croix de Fer 931 (56cm) - 23.14 lbs / 10.84 kg
Croix de Fer (56cm) - 24.10 lbs / 11.18 kg
CdF (56cm) - 25.02 lbs / 11.40 kg
Vapour Disc (56cm) - 22.08 lbs / 10.01 kg

Croix de Fer Frameset - 5.01 lbs / 2.30 kg (56cm) \ Fork - 2.01 lbs / 0.94 kg (Uncut)

Still waiting on the Croix 931 frameset weight.

Hope this helps

Alb, many thanks

Alb - do you know if the 2014 Geometry is unchanged from 2013, as in the charts posted earlier on in the thread ?

Cheers

Iain, sorry to butt in, but I understand the 2014 frame geometry is unchanged from that of 2013. Picked mine up last night - it's really stunning. Off on a ride this afternoon, and will post back a report!

Cheers
Mike.

Mike - glad you did butt in :). what size did you get ? also looking forward to hearing how the ride goes, thanks

Iain, I got a 58cm and it fits me perfectly. I changed the stem to a shorter one, but that's the only modification apart from putting 32c Marathons on instead of the supplied tyres (I wanted mudguards, and the 35c CX tyres were slightly too big).

I've done about 100 miles on it this week, and it is such a lovely bike to ride. Yes, it's heavier than my carbon road bike, but you get used to it. The extra gear at the back (12-30 compared to the 11-28 on the carbon) almost compensates for the additional weight, and means I can get up all the same hills 🙂

Coming from Ultegra on the carbon, I thought the Tiagra groupset would be very clunky, but it's not at all. After a bit of fettling, it's fine. I was thinking about changing to 105 at some point, but I don't think I'll bother now. Yes, there's a difference in the shifting, but again, very quick to get used to.

It feels very safe on the crappy Surrey roads, and I have taken a couple of detours down farm tracks and bridleways which it copes well with.

It's exactly what I wanted from a winter bike. So versatile. No regrets at all.

PS. Geometry and weights now up on the Genesis website.

How about a Charge? The new Plugs look nice, in fact the top one is now the most likely one for me apart from the nasty colour.
I have been looking for something similar. I have a Cotic X with the carbon fork. got it early '11 and done over 10K on it. Not a bad ride but like many modern steel frames its made of gas pipe. Fairly heavy.
As I am spoilt by discs on the road, I am after another similar bike but rather lighter.
Nice to see those weights. How about a Raleigh, something from Zephnat or a BMC?

Mike - great feedback, thanks, how is the fork clearance for offroad ?

Good about groupset, as I also have ultegra on carbon road bike !

Matt - I think my mind is just about made up now 🙂

iainc - if you manage to get a Croix de fer please update this thread. Mine has been on order now for 3 weeks and no sign of it appearing any time soon.

Mike59 - did you order yours ages ago? Or did you see it in a shop that had pre-ordered and got one in stock already?
Info appreciated.

iainc - if you manage to get a Croix de fer please update this thread. Mine has been on order now for 3 weeks and no sign of it appearing any time soon.

Apparently 54cm+ sizes have taken longer than thought to get here. 50/52cm are in stock at the mo in most places.

mccett - my LBS told me a week ago that they are scarce and that their stock order was due in 4-6 weeks. Main dealer so probs top of the list too...

Edit - I am after a 54. Shop has 52 in stock

Edit - I am after a 54. Shop has 52 in stock

We have a 54 in stock if you're near Manchester...
http://www.bikeshak.com/bikes/cyclocross/2014-genesis-croix-de-fer-54cm/

Simon, thanks for info, but sticking loyal to local place in Glasgow 🙂

No worries 🙂

I just kept looking on the Evans website (no other local Genesis dealers), and the stock lists seem to change daily. After a few days, a 58 showed up as being in stock, so I popped down and ordered it on the Friday. I collected it on my way home from work on Monday evening 🙂

Iain, fork clearance is OK for offroad, but I would suggest you forego mudguards and perhaps go down to a 32c tyre? The supplied 35c is fine for clearance without guards, but is semi-slick. Kenda do a 32c Small Block 8 which is very light and looks ideal if you mainly do off road. I may even try that under my guards,.

Mike, thanks for info. I have new 32c small block 8's on my Jake at present so will hang onto them and pop speed kings on for selling it 🙂

Pay Evans 50 quid to get one in for a demo?

Pay Evans 50 quid to get one in for a demo?

Good idea, but I had a good look over a 52 in the shop and I have been through the geometry of the 54 against my road bike and outgoing CX one so know it will fit.

edit - or you mean to get one sooner 🙂 even better idea !! But no, LBS are sorting for me, cheers

Yes, to get one sooner...

I have a 60cm 2014 frame, with the chainstay disc mount. Bought in August. Build will be Kinesis DC37 Forks / 105 group from Merlin / Hope hoops when built. Sadly its still hanging in the garage as stuff has meant not go round to completing the build. Will post up pics when I do.

anyone got any pics of theirs in action yet ?

First ride (with original tyres and before mudguards fitted)

[IMG] [/IMG]

Old Winchester Hill with guards and Marathon tyres

[IMG] [/IMG]

Mike, how is the gear cable adjustment done on the bike? Inline adjusters, or mounted on the downtube stops?

Jamie, there are barrel adjusters - one on each side of the downtube for the front and rear mechs, and an additional one on the rear mech itself.

Cheers for that, Mike. Do they screw into the stops, as in the housing stops are threaded, or just inserted loose?

Doesn't look as though the housing stops are threaded, Jamie. I'll get a close up pic at some point if that's any help?

No rush, but curious whether they have provision to screw in barrel adjusters, or any old inline adjuster would do.

don't think the stops on my 2012 are threaded - got inline barrel adjusters but never fitted them.

pics look great Mike.

Excited 🙂 its arriving next week !

yay, it's here. only ridden up and down street so far 🙂

[img] [/img]

Nice one, Iain. I changed a few things on mine - shorter stem, 32c Marathon tyres, and a black 105 crankset from Ebay as I didn't like the look of the big, silver Tiagra one 😳

Oh, and SKS guards (these were time-consuming to fit, and if you intend to do the same I can give you a few tips to save time!)

Done about 380 miles on it so far. Perfect for these weather/road conditions.

Cheers Mike. I'm going to keep it fairly stock I think. The geometry with the 110stem matches my old CX bike and my road bike. Might drop it a bit though. Will try the stock tyres but have 32c small block 8's to go on when rqd.

I have a set of SKS P45's and a rack to go on when its in touring mode with road tyres (conti 32's). Tips on the guards would be good, cheers 🙂

Nice Iain, I just picked mine up on Thursday, first proper ride will be tomorrow but I've already ditched the brown bar tape for black and got a sdg demo saddle on as I didn't get on with the original just sat in the shop! 8 years of sdg saddles have moulded me into a different shape I think.

I want to fit the sks 45s, I half fitted one and it seems to clear the stock tyres but not sure how much crud clearance it will have when I take a few offroad shortcuts? I like the stock tyres, and am loathe to ditch them just to fit the guards? Any tips appreciated also please Mike59.
Oh... what length stem did you swap it for? Not had a stem this long since 1991!

The genesis blog suggested SKS 45's would go ok with the stock tyres.