[Closed] Could there be a UK Tour Divide equivalent?

Could there be a UK Tour Divide equivalent?
No, in the same way that Blackpool ain't Las Vegas.

I don't see why not, I've had a few fun nights out in Blackpool in my student days too 😆

Maybe take a small entry fee for publicity, a few signs perhaps and alerting facilities en-route so they can make a bit of a fuss if they want some extra business. Like making sure the riders can smell cooking sausages and bacon from a burger van early in the morning, for instance 🙂

so like a transwales or transcotland then ?

No, nothing like a Trans Wales. That's a stage race.

I'm keen. If you just sort out the route...

I'm going to say that the wrt is the nearest thing we've got at present ... although it's still a million miles away.

In both you'll be expected to

• Be self sufficent
• Navigate yourself
• Sleep under the stars (at some point)

You'll also get nothing for coming back first 😉

No.

Yeah a bit like the WRT but end to end.

The route should not be a problem, lots of talk about this kind of thing online. Only thing is there's no waymarked route so you'd need maps or some other means of allowing foreigners to find their way.

Otherwise we'd need the largest order of course tape ever placed.

allowing foreigners

i'm out.

For anything to be like the TD I think you need the element of "vastness". I'm sure we could come up with various fun routes but the closest you're gonna get in the UK is the Highlands & it just isn't vast enough. Besides, how are you going to replicate the feeling of danger-sleeping in grizzly country whilst smelling of pizza and chicken nuggets?

It would not be a substitute or even much like the TD, anyone knows this isn't the Rockies.

But it might still be a larf...

wouldnt be the same type of course but the idea of doing it self supported and all starting at the same time would be good.

I thought you were planning on doing the tour divide with panniers molgrips? Wouldn't anything in the UK just feel incredibly lame in comparision?

I suppose you could do all the big long distance off road routes with linking sections... Plymouth to porlock, then sarn helen mtb route, then pennine bridleway, West Highland way and then remote tracks to Cape Wrath.....

sounds fun.

I'd be up for it (if I could get a pass).

Wouldn't anything in the UK just feel incredibly lame in comparision?

Just because something's bigger elsewhere doesn't mean you can't do stuff at home. Alpine riding is immense but you still ride locally, don't you?

I was kind of thinking of marketing it to foreigners - would be a cool way to see the various parts of the UK from a different perspective.

molgrips - Member

I was kind of thinking of marketing it to foreigners - would be a cool way to see the various parts of the UK from a different perspective.

Marketing? You really don't understand the Divide.

I think something more like the Colorado Trail Race would better suit the UK. More technical, less distance covered per day. It's something that I would like to work on next year when I won't be racing so much.

Marketing? You really don't understand the Divide.

Yes I do. Are you sure you do? Is it the same for everyone? Does everyone do it for the same reasons?

This would not be the divide replicated. Obviously it could not be.

This would be something else along similar lines but modified to make it work. People know about the divide through word of mouth, I believe the experience would could be made better if people had heard of it and knew what was going on. I would not want to wait 10 years to see if word of mouth made it popular or not.

Btw I should say 'publicising' rather than marketing. Ie making sure people know about it. Lots of people doing a recognised event would make it slightly different to just doing the route on your own.

Only thing is there's no waymarked route

is the divide marked?

I was under the impression it was not.

I think an end to end 'official' route would be good but i think it would be a very different experience to the TD.

I think it is marked... Or at least the GDR was and the long distance Great Divide path is marked.

i think it would be a very different experience to the TD

Of course, it's inevitable. Different country = different event. You'd hardly need to carry any food or water, you could probably get away without a tent even by staying in B&Bs or even hotels.

More options though. You could have it like the WRT so that you simply have to collect checkpoints along the way, to add an element of route planning.. hmm...

smells a bit like audaxing to me ....

allowing foreigners

philconsequence - Member
i'm out.

marketing it to foreigners

You don't learn do you.

I'm out too.

What's wrong with foreigners?

I think that it's a not a bad idea. Another idea would be a off road European stage race. Say four-five routes each about 300-500 km so that overnighters were required. Self sufficient. Routes could change every year so different countries were involved. Ideally gap between routes are not too big. Maybe check point style, you choose which order to do routes in?

molgrips - Member
What's wrong with foreigners?

Don't get me started.

Another idea would be a off road European stage race

Oh yes.. top stuff. Setting it up would be a fairly heavy operation though.

No, you don't understand it, molgrips. The GDMBR is not way-marked, it is mapped. It changes every year as they try to improve the quality of the riding, switching road for off-road and boring off-road for singletrack.

Given that I've ridden the race, know most of the original racers, and I'm in regular contact with the organiser of the Tour Divide, I think I do know what it's about.

I like the idea of a more 'local' route with a mass start...

I think as soon as you start marketing or publicising extensively then you run into issues.. too many people on the trails, people signing up and not being prepared etc. (quite a nice debate starting on Bikepacking.net about the future of the TD race)

What about looking beyond the UK .. must be European versions of this forum.. stitch a gps route through to maybe southern france from a start here in UK.. publish a start time and place.. away you go.. alot of the trekking trails in France .. e.g GR5 would make excellent riding but wouldn't support alot of traffic.

Grenzstein Trophy is in its 3rd or 4th year... I had no idea it existed and found it by chance... off to do it this year...

... low volume of riders and big miles is the appeal in these events..

silly mol 😆

i've got nothing against people born in places that i wasn't born in, i dont even know what the tour divide is!

Paul hit the nail on the head. Marketing is the enemy of that kind of racing unless you have a gigantic pile of cash to spend on logistics, permits, and insurance.

'Tis true, once the numbers start to increase then the emphasis changes and before long you've got a stage race on your hands ... Trans whatever.

There'll be around 90 riders on this years WRT. If they were all going the same way it would be too many and certain elements would be lost.
If you were to try and keep numbers down on a uk TD style event, then it might become elitist and obviously small numbers would mean you'll be hosting it for the love 😉

Scottish Divide:
[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-13072554 ]BBC SCOTLAND[/url]

There'll be around 90 riders on this years WRT

edit - Scottish Divide looks really cool. /goes off to have a look at the maps of Wales...

Never thought about it like that ... I can say however, that it's the most popular 3 day, bikepacking event held in Wales at the end of May, in the WORLD! 😀

EDIT: Don't bother, I've already got a "Welsh Divide" route underway ... seeing as there is a physical mountain divide running N to S for a great part of it.

I was thinking about the scotland watershed one. Might involved rather more hikabike than some routes:-) 745 miles?

@ Molgrips

It would not be a substitute or even much like the TD, anyone knows this isn't the Rockies.

So why ask 'Could there be a UK Tour Divide equivalent'?

Another idea would be a off road European stage race.

What about the grenzsteintrophy?

I am googleing right now!

I think I do know what it's about

Isn't it about different things for different people?

When I go and do it, will I be wrong?

What is it 'about' for you?

And why be anti-publicity? Is www.tourdivide.org not publicity?

So why ask 'Could there be a UK Tour Divide equivalent'?

Long unsupported race the length of a country....?

'Tis true, once the numbers start to increase then the emphasis changes and before long you've got a stage race on your hands ... Trans whatever

A stage race is fundamentally different though, because each stage has a start and stop and a common end each day. And they are usually supported.

Molgrips you're right, a TD type event and a stage race are very different ... which is what I said. It would be pretty easy for a TD type event to morph into a stage race as the pressures increased, eg rider numbers, insurance, revenue, sponsers, etc.

I don't believe UK could have a race like the TD. For instance

a) TD is 2,750 miles not far off 3 x LEJOG and not through bear country.
b) You could organise a route over say the Sarn Helen route or similar, or a Tour of the Highlands. If it was free the event would be over-run with us lot as it would take a week tops.
c) As the TD is 3 weeks commitment as a minimum it straight away reduces the people who can attend when you add on a few days before and after to get home you are looking close to a month's commitment for most riders.

I agree with Aidan when he said he would prefer less riders in the TD. Personally I would prefer to line up with say ~30 riders like a fw years ago then 80+ expected in 2011. This is not some sort of elitism for me more being on my own - I get fed up of people after a few days. Likely to be a lot more pressure on facilities.

If you go for an over night ride this weekend through mid Wales you are likely to be on your own. If an event was put through you would have riders and tents round every turn.

WRT is a nice balance. Last year despite 50 or so riders I was on my own after about 45 minutes and remained like that until meeting IanB in a bothy hours later. The next day I saw one rider all day until the finish.

Of course the UK is not big enough for a replica of the TDR. There won't be bears either and there won't be any 14,000ft peaks in the area. That's not the point. A UK equivalent would be much more UK-like - it could not avoid it.

If I were organising it there would be no sponsorship or anything, it would be along those lines ie turn up and ride at your own risk. An off-road LEJOG could be 1,200 miles of tougher trails than the TDR although some road would be unavoidable. Given how many pepole enter Polarises, I don't think such an event would be over-subscribed at all. Plenty of trail for people to spread out onto.

WRT is great, just not long enough 🙂

Btw if you want to do the TD with fewer riders, you can ride the route at any time of the year, can't you?

Defining the TD by the fact that it goes the full length of a country just misses the point though - that's like equating the Isle of Man End to End to the Divide. With all due respect you really need to think through what you're saying.

WRT is great, just not long enough

WRT is a nice balance. Last year despite 50 or so riders I was on my own after about 45 minutes and remained like that until meeting IanB in a bothy hours later. The next day I saw one rider all day until the finish.

Have you thought about actually doing it?

Yes, but it's a weekend away from the fam, which has been historically difficult. Obviously a month away for a bigger undertaking is different.