[Closed] Cotic Soul 27.5 donor bike...

Good idea! You should get a substantial saving over building up the equivalent Soul from parts.

Issues I can see are -
> Crankset-he 13 is PF30 whereas the Cotic is a conventional 68/73mm threaded. You maybe able to use a Praxis adapter?
> Headset- I think you may need a different one.

The rest should be good to go. Not sure how much you'll be able to sell the 13 frame for though.

Thanks Cokie.

That's exactly the help I was looking for with regards to BB and headset.

I know Cotic can put hope headsets and BB for £150....so maybe that can be an option?

Frame and seat post resell value £150??

How much is a Cotic built up?

And if it's cheaper with a donor, probably better to go for something where the frame has a good name (to sell on), and buy a saleable size.

I think you could easily get £100-150 for the frame with BB and headset. That'll cover the Reverb. Make sure it's a Medium.

[url= http://www.rotorbikeusa.com/products/bsa_bottom_bracket.html ]You may need something like this[/url]
The standard Hope BB isn't compatible with the PF30 crank.

£1500 all in approx br.

I know what you mean with the frame sell on. I'm just not sure what's out there at a cost of £1100 at this spec?

Boardmans used to be good for this but their specs have now been watered down 🙁

Thanks again Cookie.

Is there another way round this instead of using adapters?

I'm hopeless when it comes to BB 🙁

You could sell the PF30 X1 cranks and buy something 'normal'. You may take a hit if you buy like for like but if you're happy to settle for an XT with a N/W ring or similar, you'll be alright.

£104 for Sram X1 GXP crankset at chain reaction.....don't mind paying that....could sell the PF30 crankset with the frame.

What was the issue with the headset Cokie?

They have different headset

[IMG] [/IMG]
> 13 - FSA Orbit C-40-ACB 1.5 Headset (No.42-ACB)

[IMG] [/IMG]
> Cotic - 44mm cup lower, 34mm traditional standard upper

Hi there

I agree this sounds like a good idea.

Will the steerer tube on the fork be long enough? Will the hoses on the brakes? Especially the rear.

Apologies if this sounds negative, just trying to think of potential gotchas!

Halfords are normally generous with headset spacers. There is also the option of collecting the bike unbuilt in store. Just check the steerer before you pay.

I wouldn't worry about cables. If the Cotic is the same size as the 13 it'll be fine. Again, with the generous steerer you get slightly longer cables/hoses anyway.

Thanks again Cokie, think I will let Cotic put their hope headset on....£75 sound ok for that?

Hayd that's a very good shout about the steerer. Will contact Cotic and ask them, and shall see if I can get the measurements of the 13 delta....forgot all about the steerer length!

No wonder people buy off the shelf lol

Edit. Sounds like a good idea Cokie to measure up first 😉 You done this before haven't you lol

[url= http://www.wiggle.co.uk/hope-pick-and-mix-headsets/ ]Hope Pick 'n Mix headsets are around £56[/url], plus fitting at an LBS of around £10-15. So if you do it yourself you save around £10. I'd pay the £75 to save the hassle and give Si the trade.

Yep happy for Cy to have the trade for fitting the headset 🙂

Just done a comparison on the head tube for the steerer and we are good to go. The Cotic is 10mm shorter than the 13, plus there's around 5 spacers on the 13! Plenty of steerer length 🙂

CRC just put some deals on - this loks like a good spec - http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/lapierre-pro-race-327-hardtail-bike-2014/rp-prod111195

For sake of £400 I'd prefer the better drivetrain, wheels, brakes & newer 130mm forks. Depends what budget the OP has.

[i]£400[/i]

What, like the price of a full XT groupset ? 😆

(It was just an example..)

good wheels? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/vitus-bikes-rapide-275-hardtail-bike-2014/rp-prod107045

I'm in the middle of the same build pretty much.

Medium blue 275 posted today, going via Invisiframe before it gets to me.

My spec is

Hope Hoops/Flow EX
X7 shifters/X9t2 rear /M785 front
XT cassette/KMC chain
SLX M665 crank
SLX M665 brakes/RT76
130mm Revelations
Nanos
Reverb
Thomson 50mm stem/Nuke 760's
SP41 cableset
Dampf front/Nic rear, both Evo SS
Lizard Northshores
Spoon.

I had the spoon and shifters from a 'one ride' bike, the Revs were an EBay bargain - white, fast black stanchions from a shop showroom bike. Tiny nick in one Decal, after a wipe over with IPA for grubby marks, look new and feel/look unridden. Everything else was CRC/Merlin/bikediscount/alltricks.

I'm going with headset from Cotic. Pick and mix cups are about 56, but you need top cap, bolt etc and by the time you have the full thing, you're paying them about a pound to fit it...
Total build all in stands me just under £1500 by the time I pay Lee at Invisiframe. Not saying your plan is bad, but it's not the only way to do it for this money with a mostl new build.

Wheels were an epic bargain, shop in Bridgend doing them about £320...

Damned insomniac posting... SLX bits are current series not 665... 🙂

Whichever way you do it, enjoy!

I'm looking forward to the mandatory 'show us your Soul 275s' thread in the next couple of weeks...

I have decided against the donor bike now, worked out cheaper to do it separately.

@Vinniecup

I live in Swansea and work in Bridgend...what's the name of the shop with the wheels mate?

Also, what size steerer do we need for the forks....I have worked it out as 185mm minimum?

And with the reverb, did you get a 380mm length one?

I have a lad on Pinkbike sourcing me all my gear now.....he had an Internet site for a while, now he just operates through pinkbike and facebook.
He goes by BikeBitz.
And he's smashed all online prices, pay by pay pal also. I think the stuff is direct from Germany, but better than bikesiscount etc.

Here's my kit, 90% is coming from Bikebitz

Reverb
One up components 32t w/n chainring with a 42t on the rear cog (only going 10 speed)
Fulcrum Red Power XL Centrelock 650b
Shimano SM-RT99-L 203mm Centrelock Rotor
Shimano SM-RT99-M 180mm Centrelock Rotor
XT M785 crank 2x10 175mm black
XT M786 GS rear mech
HG95 Chain & XT M771 11-36 cassette
M980 XTR shifter
M785 XT I-spec brakes
Rockshox Black Rebas RL 125mm fast black uppers
Race face 785mm bar, 60mm stem and spacers.
Maxxis high roller and ardent tyres.
Superstar nano pedals
Charge spoon saddle
Stans no tubes kit.
And Hope head set fitted by Cotic.

Will edit in a price for all this:

£1700 total

I could get this lower by going for a cheaper wheel set, used forks etc...still yet to place the order.

I'm also hoping to get a paint defect frame from Cotic to keep the price down a tad, so won't go down the full wrap route, but will helitape the usual suspect areas.

Dai, It's Rush Cycles. They were awesome to deal with. They've sold out of 26ers but have 650 and 29er at £310 a pair. I wanted black/black which they carry for next day delivery, but they were willing to order a set from Hope with a different colour hub if I wanted, for the same price, with whatever delivery turnaround Hope added on top (probably + 1 day) I've already got Stan's on the shelf, a big roll of suitable yellow TESA and a big roll of Gorilla to choose between, so I added a pair of valves and called it quits.

Handy link: http://www.rushcycles.co.uk/m50b0s482p0/Cycle-Wheels-and-Rims/Wheels-Mountain-Bike-Pair

I'm using an XT 11-34 and 26/38 crank - both what I normaly run. I went SLX on the crank as that's what I'm using on my Zesty and it's fine. I've seen the XT cranks wear the paint pretty quick, the finish on the SLX is a bit more durable. Most seem to end up putting SLX rings on when replacements are needed anyway... SLX brakes are as XT less the blingy top cover and the freestroke adjust that doesn't really do much. Again I've got the XT's on the Zesty already... they say XT ... 😉 I plumped for 180/160 RT76's not icetechs as I don't honestly believe I'm ever going to need the extra cooling. I plan to use the Uberbike replacement fin pads in the SLX brakes when needed.

Good call on the Reba, it came down to Rebas or Revs for me, and the deal on the Revs just swung it. I like that I can internally adjust up to 140 if I decide I need later. I was a bit dubious about a sh fork on this build but it cleared so much cash for other bling, and like I say apart from a tiny rotor nick from the bike next to it in the shop (is what it looks like) it's basically nevery been outside. Still leaves a satisfying grease ridge if compressed...

Stack height: depends a little on which frame you get. The headtubes are +/-10mm from 110 Medium (what I got). Hope pick and mix A and H cups (what Cotic are using) are 14mm a piece. The Thomson x4 stem I'm fitting is 40mm stack, thus I could get away with a 175mm steerer (actually adds up to 178 but you don't want it right to the top...) For the Large frame, 185 would be spot on, for Medium you'd be sticking a spacer in.

Reverb: I went for the 125mm lift 420mm option. There's no seat tube restriction and little weight penalty. Also, it's what I've got on the Zesty so I'll be able to swap posts out if I ever need due to service.

Tyres: I largely went Dampf/Nic as I know the combo works. I'm very tempted to try WTB's (Vigilante tough grippy front and Trailboss tough fast rear) - a guy whose opinion I seriously respect is running these on a combination of Santa Cruz's right now and rates them Basque proof. An HR/Ardent combo suggests to me you're looking for similar AM type riding to me rather than a lighter XC build.

Looks like a solid build you have there, the new fork probably accounts for the build cost difference so you must be getting some discount to slip XTR bits in! My SLX brakeset was closer to £65 than the price they are now due to a December offer, if I was buying them now for tenner I'd probably go XT too. Forgot to mention rear skewer stuff; I already had Evo 10mm caps and a BNIB DT RWS knocking about too, so they're going in. 10mm really is a useful move up from QR in my opinion.

I did my shopping in December straight after ordering the frame. They're still releasing them in small batches - mine will be delivered today 🙂 I'm not seeing the powder finish as a defect tbh, I like semimatt/pearl finishes and it pays for the headset. I'm going with a matt tape simply as I want this one to look nice for a while. My Zesty has full on knee rub/heelrub/flying pebble type wear all over the decals but it was one of the older raw alu with deep deep matte black decal finishes so it wears the battle well! There were minor fram differences between the ones that have been refinished and the standard 2015's due to early feedback, but these have been retromodded in the UK, hence the need for refinish. I like this idea too, for irrational reasons...

Look forward to seeing yours built up!

[i]£1700 total[/i]

Is that a better/same spec as Cotic's £2k build?

'Different', arguably 'better'.

Cotic build:

Build Specification.

Full Deore XT 3x10 or 2x10 or 1x10 (using Hope Narrow/wide ring) drivetrain with Shadow Plus clutch mech
Hope T-Rex 40t Range Extender Option (+GBP65)
Deore XT Brakes, 180/160 rotors
X Fusion Sweep - 120 travel, 15mm axle, taper steerer
Hope Hoops Tech XC wheels
Race Face Finishing kit, including:
Race Face Respond bars - 740 x 38 rise,785 x 12 rise or 720 flat options
Ride 60mm x 6 deg stem
Ride 375mm seatpost
Cotic Cromo Rail Saddle
Hope Headset
Maxxis Hi Roller 2 2.3" front, IKON 2.2" rear tyres
Pedals not included

The Cotic spec probably prices up well once you use RRP's not discounted internet parts prices - just like the Jungle prices on full Santa Cruz's do.

Personally, I'd take Thomson stem, Nukeproof bars and Reverb as a definite upgrade over Raceface 'Ride' kit although I've used Ride and it's great for the money. The Nukes I'm using are the blue ltd ed Sam Hill ones (were half price) and I think they'll look great with the blue frame and white fork ontil I scuff them up with a big rocky OTB. Also, I'd rather have Flow EX's on Pro2's than 'Hope XC' as I like a wider rim and I'm prepared to pedal it. If the Cotic saddle is the same on I got stock on my Weekday build X, I never want to see another... I've used some SLX for durability and SRAM shifting because I like it, Dai's specced some XTR shifters and otherwise full XT group, broadly same as me apart from that. The XF forks Cotic are using are getting a great reputation, no better or worse than Revs or Rebas, I'd say.

To be fair, I'm not sure that any bike available as bare frame without prohibitive cost is ever going to price well as a manufacturer's full build against internet parts unless the manufacturer also happens to be the importer for the parts. You do get the ease of someone else putting it all together for you, though. 🙂 Personally I enjoy the build then first rides, but some would rather skip to the riding...

On the same subject'ish. Has anyone received their discounted Cotic yet? I ordered one but didn't hear anything? I think they are massively over subbed on these frames..

BR
JeZ

JeZ, Cotic have been keeping me in the loop, but on an 'information when available' rather than 'update slavishly every week even if no change' basis which is fine with me.

I ordered a blue Medium late December when they first trailed them, paid the day they asked in early Jan, and then there was a holdup of about three weeks due to a minor issue caused in refinishing that QC picked up. Paul was very open to me about it and very apologetic.

It was always the case that these offer bikes were going through in small batches rather than the whole container load in one hit, and they still seem to be taking orders. They're not likely to be giving away 20% on full value stock, and apparently the full value 2015 frames have now arrived.

I was contacted by email on Weds this week telling me mine was now being posted this Thurs to arrive Friday (today) . Mine is going direct to Invisiframe so I'm not certain it's landed yet, but I fully belive it has. If you drop them an email I'm sure they'll be happy to give a ballpark date.

I'm bouncing with excitement at the thought, and part of me can't believe I've deliberately built another week or two into The Big Day, but I'm being mature and grown up about this.

Wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhbhhh! 🙂

[IMG] [/IMG]
Just playing around with builds. The 13 still isn't bad value for Revs and X01.

Would a Bird not make a good donor bike?

£1300 and the frame would sell better than the 13 (the warranty is transferable)

http://shop.birdmtb.com/zero/zero-1.html

Hmm never asked me for payment I think I was a little late in the order in Dec last year....oh well gives me an excuse to buy new one 😉 spec hmm defn not sram.....post later mainly hope though;)

BR
JeZ

I think I'd rather have SLX brakes than the Guides.

And I'd rather have Hope hubs.

What I'm saying is… the donor bike idea might save money, but I'd rather make my own choice when it comes to a build, even if it means some lower end Deore and SLX kit paired with fixable Hope spinning bits.

Jez, payment was only asked for in the week the frame was supposed to be happening (Monday for Thursday post iirc).

They spotted the problem caused in refinishing while going over, and that put about a three week delay in.

If you've got an order number, you've probably got a frame at some point in the next few weeks...

SRAM is an acquired taste, I'll grant. It works for me and that's all that matters 🙂 I like the shifter operation and don't really care that the actual mech operation feels a little more agricultural after silky shimano smoothness...

SRAM I had a problem on two bikes with the derailleur with weak springs...they make great cassettes though!! Anyway hope you're right about the frame 😉 I'm riding an 853 rock lobster so hope it can match that!!!

JeZ

🙂

I'm sitting being taunted by a stack of CRC, Bike Discount and Hope boxes on top of my bookcase...

Right then, my final build is now sorted!

I had to compromise on my initial build as I only had a £1500 budget, and coming in at £1700 was just to much.

So here's my list, and prices:

Cotic Soul 27.5 medium frame £350 (paint defect)
Hope headset fitted £75.
Shimano MT35 with centerlocks £95
RT86's centerlocks rotor 180 - £22
" " 203 - £25.
Raceface narrow wide cranks 32t £85
M786 GS or SGS rear mech - £36
HG95 Chain & M771 11-36 cassette - £40
SLX 10 speed i spec shifter - £17
M785 XT I-spec brakes - £95
Reverb 31.6 right hand 380 125 - £155
RS Reba RL (fast black) 650b 120mm fork - £260
Schwalbe Hans Dampf 27.7 x 2.25 Trailstar - £27
Schwalbe Racing Ralph 27.5 x 2.25 Pacestar - £24
Superstar extender 40t - £30
Charge spoon saddle - £20
Superstar Nanos £35
Stans no tube kit £40
Race face Chester 740 riser bar £26.50
Race face stem 60mm 6degree £18.50
Hope spacers - £7
Shimano 2m gear casing - £3.60
Race face grips - £15

Cost £1501

And I even considered a fully build bird zero at this price but I'm hoping to get a little kick out of building this up, and cherish it that little bit more.
But I think I will struggle on certain parts as I haven't got nowhere near enough the right amount of tools for the job, so will have to get the help of my local LBS is bottom bracket, head steerer cut, bleeding brakes, setting up gears etc....hell I think I will just put the wheels, seatpost and handlebars on......the LBS can do the rest lol

I must admit to having had sneaking last minute thoughts about a Bird this evening...

I was originally going with MT35's as I was originally aiming for a grand with more bits carried over.

BB - yep, you will need a tool, but you'll use it plenty more. Steerer cut, meh. Measure carefully at least twice, wrap tape for cut line then hacksaw. Brake bleeding on the new Shimanos is awkward but rewarding. Learning to set up gears may save you a long walk sometime. Some decent videos in PB tech Tuesdays if you need...

Enjoy! There needs to be a pictures thread in a couple of weeks... 🙂

The Bird is definitely a better spec if £1500 is your budget.
You could always ask Ben@Bird to send it to you unbuilt. He could trim the steerer and fit the headset/bb and trim/bleed the brakes. Then you can put it together like lego. It'll be a good experience!

Bird Zero 1 option.

12.2kg / 26.8lbs (Medium frame, no pedals, reverb, 1x10)
Equipment Model Year 2014
Frame Warranty Bird Lifetime Transferrable (Please see here for further information)
Frame Bird Zero 6061 T6 Aluminium
Forks X fusion Sweep RL2 black 140mm
Headset Cane Creek 40 series, tapered, low stack semi-integrated
Rear Axle Shimano AX65 eThru 142/12mm
Wheelset RaceFace Turbine 27.5, tubeless
Front Tyre WTB vigilante 2.3
Rear Tyre WTB trail boss 2.25
1x10 Option: Chainset RaceFace Turbine with 30t Narrow Wide
1x10 Option: Bottom Bracket RaceFace XC 73mm threaded
1x10 Option: Rear Mech Shimano Zee Shadow+ FR
Gear Shifter(s) Shimano XT iSpec B
Cassette Shimano XT 11-36
Chain Shimano HG75 10 speed
Front Brake Shimano XT
Front Disc Hayes Lightweight 180mm
Rear Brake Shimano XT
Rear Disc Hayes Lightweight 160mm
Handlebar RaceFace Turbine, black
Grips RaceFace Half Nelson or Charge Griddle
Stem RaceFace Turbine, black
Seat Post reverb stealth
Seat Clamp Hope QR 34.9 Ø black
Saddle (Mens) Charge Scoop, black/black
Pedals

Total £1565 hmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Does a hans dampf fit in a Reba and leave enough mud clearance? I don't know but it might be worth checking.

Yes it does. I've got a full fat 26er Dampf in a set of Revs on a 23mm rim right now...

Yes, but a Rev has more clearance than a reba does it not?

[i]Yes, but a Rev has more clearance than a reba does it not? [/i]

Does in 26, not sure of 27(5)

Would Canyon not be the best bang for the buck? Plus someone will surely buy the frame? Whereas the Halfrauds frame might not be an easy sell?

Think canyon only do 29ers now in the hardtail?

Haven't looked at full suss ones though....