[Closed] Cotic Rocket

How old are you? 😉

Younger than you 😉

Rode the medium Rocket too this morning!! - very, very nice. Big bike that does feel like a big bike, until you need it to on the downs. It felt very poised indeed and would encourage all to give it a go if you get the chance.

An excellent all-rounder IMHO.

Many thanks to Cy and Paul for setting up the day and especially to Paul for guiding.

That sounds great (have you bought one,am planning a test ride at Dales Bike Centre in a couple weeks. There are enough ups and downs from Reeth to see if it's as good as you say.

Not bought one, out of my budget really, but I wanted to see what it was like, and I'd definitely buy one if one came up second hand. Want to try a Bandit 29, and there might be a Rocket 29 in the pipeline. Cy said it wasn't worth making a short travel Rocket for a couple of reasons. He said it'd only be about 1/4lbs lighter, and I now agree with this, it pedals so well that there'd be no problem riding one all day everyday, really doesn't feel like a 150mm bike until you need the extra travel, when it's there to bail you out.

really doesn't feel like a 150mm bike until you need the extra travel, when it's there to bail you out.

Which other 150mm bikes have you ridden for comparison? Just wondering.

Scott Genius is the only 150 I've ridden properly off road. I guess what I mean is that it feels like it has less travel than my Specialized, until the extra travel is needed. Seems to hold itself up in the travel well, rather than feeling spongy and energy sapping.

Cool, I developed a hate/hate relationship with a Giant Reign due to its utter blandness and general plushness which I hated. I kind of like full suspension bikes that pedal like hardtails but are still active, hence the Ml7 and the Pace.

Recycler, what does this mean. I don't quite get what you're saying unless you mean it feels big until it goes downhill when it feels less big?

Big bike that does feel like a big bike, until you need it to on the downs.

I definitely reccomend you try one if you're ever looking for a new full sus. I think Recycler means doesn't rather than does, which is in line with how i feel about it 🙂

Sorry Dog I should have typed better - the bike does NOT feel big until you need it on the downs.
Sorry for the confusion - really enjoyed it.

Sounds ace, I really really really want one 😀 But don't have the money 😐

sambob - Member
Cy said it wasn't worth making a short travel Rocket

Cannot wait got my demo booked at the Dales bike centre on the 21st.

Seems to hold itself up in the travel well

Stop reading MBR, they are idiots.

Druidh - You don't need Cy to make one, simply buy one, fit a shorter shock and fork and you'd have a super low/slack lil pinner!! in all honesty I can't really see you getting on with a bike like that tho.

If you try one Druidh you'll see why, it's very impressive indeed.

GW - I was actually referring to the fact that a few folk on that other Rocket thread seemed to have expressed a preference for a shorter travel version. Like you say - unlikely to be my cup of tea (I'd still like a shot on one though - you never know 🙂 )

I don't read MBR, it's true though.

Ok. pass on my comment, we def need more proper DH geometry shorter travel bikes around even if they are gonna be Cotics 😉

Thanks for posting guys, and so pleased you liked the bikes. Was a fun day.

I am going to look at a bunch of options for the next few FS frames this summer. However, as mentioned above, because the Rocket feels so much fun with 150mm travel I can't really see what shortening it down will bring, but I will be trying it to see if I can figure out where it all fits based on riding rather than hand waving.

I will be trying it to see if I can figure out where it all fits based on riding rather than hand waving.

You have no place here. Mods please escort him from the website.

I did wonder if I'd blow my cover by admitting that [finds ticket and wanders off to cloakroom]

Cy - member

...as mentioned above, because the Rocket feels so much fun with 150mm travel [b]I can't really see what shortening it down will bring[/b], but I will be trying it to see if I can figure out where it all fits based on riding rather than hand waving.

well...

speaking as someone who's a bit slow and mincey:

1) i don't need loads of travel, if i set forks/rears soft enough to use 150mm, it all feels too soft and divey.

(i set the pressure on my 140mm pikes so that it feels good, and it seems i use about 100mm, i'd be happy with shorter forks, but my blue pig wouldn't)

2) you can make the chainstays shorter without the rear wheel rubbing on the seat-tube.

3) shorter forks are (usually) cheaper forks.

4) (a few) people are asking for short-travel bikes without the typical, scary geometry that's usually found on 100mm bikes*.

but, i'm an idiot, feel free to ignore me.

If you're a bit slow and mincey then you don't need a frame as strong (or stiff?) as the Rocket, so aluminium alloy would make more sense to save you carting the weight and cost of 853 around.

Trust me on this, it'd be kinda pointless having a proper slack/low frame to ride slow and mincy too.

[i]save you carting the weight... around.[/i]

I thought that the frame weight was about the same as an Alu one for the same travel?

As for an alu one of vaguely similar strength and stiffness, which wouldn't be a frame for mincing! Something like an Intense SS2 or Alpine 160.

GW - Member

Trust me on this, it'd be kinda pointless having a proper slack/low frame to ride slow and mincy too.

you're right, mincers like me don't need "proper slack/low" but 'steep and high' is a bit scary.

(i need all the help i can get)

there is a middle ground that doesn't seem very well catered for.

eg, short travel, but keeping this:

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as an option.

i'm going to stick my neck out, and suggest that a giant anthem/speccy epic is probably not ideal.

Proper low or slack isn't needed for hucking either

Trust me on this

I'm in the I'd like a 100mm travel bike that doesn't have such a steep HA. I don't need 150mm rear travel, I just want a little more comfort sometimes. I've tried both superlight and anthem x which were great until pointed downwards and then they felt scarey!

Kind of like a full sus Soul would be nice. Ideally 140mm front compatible (like a Soul) so I could run Bos Devilles up front if I wanted...

Slammed saddles rule!

Dragging your brakes in fear down easy singletrack must suck

Dragging your brakes in fear down easy singletrack must suck

Remember, Cy gave people a choice with the original Hemlock of 100mm or 160mm travel.

I bought both rockers but settled on the 100mm both with 36 forks. More than enough travel for my riding style (or lack off).

So I imagine he also has gained a pretty clear idea, commercially speaking, of what people will buy.

"need" has **** all to do with it.

Just had a lecture on this subject from She Who Must Be Obeyed, because I said I was thinking of selling 2 bikes to buy a new one. 'Why' she says, 'Because I have had 'em for 3 years and fancy a change' This apparently does not qualify as a rational answer. Strange we can find shedloads of money to have a new crap kitchen installed by muppets but nothing for toys.

FOG - my SWMBO spat her tea out laughing as she can feel your pain!!!

@FOG - does your wife wear all her clothes and shoes till they fall apart or does she change some each season (ie 4 times a year) and buy something new for a special occasion ?

The thing with the short travel option is that I was right with you guys up until I got the Rocket prototypes. I figured out that the thing I liked about the short travel Hemlock wasn't the lack of travel, it was the punchy, fun feel. By making the rate on the Rocket much more progressive (i.e. less plush and 'wallowy') you get that fun feel AND you have plenty of travel. This is why I'm interested about the shorter travel versions I'll have a go with, but less convinced than I used to be. The ride feel is less about the travel and more about the way the frame/shock is set up. Most companies want their longer travel bikes to feel very soft and 'suspensiony', but having tried them it's not something I particularly like. It might be the most efficient way to make the suspension get you down the hill fast, but it's not as much fun and something you can work with, pop off things, move around a bit.

The key thing is that if you want 'only' 100mm travel, but still want to do fun things, you aren't going to save any weight as a frame needs to be strong for what you do on it, not the amount of travel it has. One of the short options I have coming is literally a Rocket with a different shock mount for a shorter shock. It'll be a few ounces lighter than the Rocket because of the little shock, but still needs that strength. The Soul-ish geo bike is aluminium (where you will save lots of weight) but is limited to 120mm forks because if they were any longer it'd end up getting all heavy and super strong again.

So that's the hand waving. I'll let you know how the riding goes once I've done some of that......

[i]The Soul-ish geo bike is aluminium (where you will save lots of weight) but is limited to 120mm forks[/i]

I think there'd be quite a lot of demand for that, tbh, but I can understand it may not be where you want to take the business.

If the prototype comes up for sale give me a shout 🙂

I think there will be plenty of demand for it as well, as it's a more usual shorter travel bike. I think there's a very strong possibility that one will make production. The one I'm much less sure of now is the short travel version of the Rocket, but we'll see.

cool, thanks for the info.

Yes jam and stu, you will start me on a rant now! She always has a good reason for spending money on clothes and the garden but money spent on bikes is a waste. I told her what an STW sage said-- 'It's cheaper than crack and whores' but she wasn't impressed. I don't smoke, I don't drink much, I don't have anyother expensive vices, you'ld think she would be grateful it was a healthy pastime like cycling that took my interest!
Anyway back to the topic's real focus. I would def. be in the market for 120mm soul-handling FS. I thought about the Rocket but decided it would probably be a bit too full on for my use [anyway she probably wouldn't let me buy one!]

Just to add by tuppenth. I rode one of the pre-production Rockets. Usually ride a Trek Remedy. What struck me was the bikes stiffness but mainly the 'pop'. So easy to get it in the air off any little launches so loads of fun.

Also followed a mate on another pre-production Rocket. He was flicking the back end up and around far more than he usually does on his Alpine.

Get yourselves a test ride!

The thing with the short travel option is that I was right with you guys up until I got the Rocket prototypes

In that case I guess I'd better get my name down for the Cycle World demo rocket for when it arrives then...

I managed to get out on two of the demo rides, rode the small and medium rocket, only problem is I have no idea which would be the better size for me. It was a great day and it was good to meet cy and paul and it was great to ride in the Peaks too will definately visit again

Every one of of my bikes is a triggers broom project to get under the wife radar.....

Yeah, I'd have loved to do one of those demos but it's a 7 hour drive from here...

I am very taken by this bike it sounds exactly what I want, and I think it looks gorgeous!
I have been thinking about how I'd build one up and 2 things are for sure, I'd want a 16" and I'd want a Ti sprung fork for the feel, probably a Marzocchi 44.

With that being said I'd be very interested if there are any plans to sell the frame with a Ti coil rear shock? It seems like the perfect combination and in my mind would make the best bike ever!!

No plans for a ti spring coil option. We can do the frame without shock should you so wish, or we have just sorted out a BOS Stoy for a customer for £1,655. These are special order only as BOS have to build the shocks to order. We could do a similar thing with Fox coils too, but it'd be a similarly high price due to not buying bulk quantities of them. Drop us a line if you want to go through some options. Email's in profile.

I nicked the demo med/orange Rocket when Cy wasn't looking after the demo on Saturday and thrashed it round the Peaks all Sunday and a chunk of Monday. As a diehard airshock-o-phobe, I was really impressed with the Kashima RP23 - really, really supple. I can't see a coil making much difference other than being heavier and having more knobs to allow you to f'ck up the settings quicker... (at 10stone I'd probably benefit from a low volume aircan/more Boostvalve pressure for big DH stuff, but for trail riding, it was really, really good)

Other than that? Stupidly solid frame. Makes my Uzzi look like a noodle. Blown away by the technical climbing ability. No, really - it just rolled up stuff - no front wheel wander, no spitting traction, no daft chain torque issues. It made Hagg Farm boringly easy, House of Pain slabs in middle ring, then up the gully onto the moor just like that...

Downhill/singletrack, exactly as you'd expect a solid 6" travel, slack angled bike to feel. Fast, planted, carvy, poppy when you wanted it to be.

It's 1lb heavier than my BFe and 1.5lb heavier than my SOs Hemlock (most of the difference there is in the wheels and tyres), 4lb lighter than my Uzzi. Not worth worrying about, especially given the solidity.

I was expecting to be a bit not-fussed by it - something akin to my Uzzi, but just with less travel, but actually it's a way better all round trail bike, without giving up much on the DHs.

I rode the proto for a couple of weeks - I'm the guy DeeW was trying to keep up with 😆

I rode all my usual trails and it was a load of fun. I sometimes wonder if I'm just plowing through stuff on the Alpine whereas I was popping off stuff all the time on Rocket.

There were a few sections I thought were overwhelming the Rocket but when I went back on the Alpine it felt pretty much the same.

Can't see the need for a shorter travel version to be honest.

Matt

I emailed the USA distributor (EU Cycle Imports) yesterday for a quote and he said they were still working on pricing.

My wife is pregnant and due first week in July. July 4th of all dates - I'm British, she's American 🙂

The custom here apparently is to give a 'push gift' when the baby is born. Thanks very much I thought, although I was technically thrusting rather than pushing and I would've done it for free too. Anyhow, semantics aside, my 'push' gift will be a Cotic Rocket - medium in orange with a Bos Vip'r. 😉

Roll on July!

I was expecting to be a bit not-fussed by it

Yeah 'cos you're usually really down and non-fussed by Cotics aren't you Jon. How many is it you have now? 😆

That said, your's are the thoughts I am most interested to hear. Oh and the thoughts on the 2012 RP23 are interesting as well. I rode a Nomad with on yesterday and thought it was really very good indeed.

My wife is pregnant and due first week in July. July 4th of all dates - I'm British, she's American

This is ironic because after July 4th you'll BOTH be losing your independence!

Yeah 'cos you're usually really down and non-fussed by Cotics aren't you Jon. How many is it you have now?

A fair few, admittedly. Thing is, I didn't see how it was going to be any better than my Uzzi - was expecting another "winch and plummet" bike, just with a bit less travel. What I *thought* I wanted was something more along the lines of a Yeti ASR5 - light and fast. But the more I think about it, it's never going to be especially fast because I simply can't get away with silly light wheels and tyres for my local trails. The game changer was the way the Rocket simply chewed up what I thought of as hard climbs.

Part of it is that medium Cotics do just fit me *right*. I used my own saddle and seatpost (just plugged straight in, so why faff), but the 60mm stem and low rise 710 bars put me in exactly the same position as my Soda. I rode it for 7 hours solid on Sunday, and although I was knackered at the end of it I didn't have any back, arm or shoulder issues. Didn't need to faff around with travel adjust on the forks either, which is a first for me on a full sus.

Funnily enough, visually, the bike the Rocket most reminded me of was your Nic - the same really low, long front triangle and the dropped stays and a blatantly slack fork.

Just got an email from Cy about buying from the USA.

It will be a pleasure doing business with you 🙂

lol @ geetee - well, I have three stepchildren right now. What extra work could a really small version be? Erm...wait...what have I done?! 🙂

Finally got to ride the rocket at the Dales bike centre. Very impressive bike climbs very well and smooth as snake poo down. Cy has created a brilliant bike. Well done and thanks for passing the bikes round to give us all a chance to ride them. Thanks to everybody at the dales centre Stu and the staff are so very helpful. The weather was good to us and a blast around Fremington edge just made for a complete day.

Also just got back from a Rocket demo at Dales bike centre, very impressed Indeed, the bike go's up and down real well, it actually looks quite good up close too. Big thanks the the Dales team 😀