[Closed] Correct etiquette?

I see no harm in sitting on the back, but sprinting off to get caught a minute later and 'muscle in' makes you sound like a bit of a tool!

Ride your normal ride. It's up to the group to stay back, come past or what ever. Jumping in is a bit shit though. Sit on the back to check the pace and then if you're up for it, let who ever is at the back know you can group ride and check it's OK to rotate. The word would go up and down the pack to let everybody know and anybody not keen could pull out and drop back.

Someone will be along in a minute to tell you "you are awzum" and that you have "won a whole internetz"

But I'm too polite for that 😆

were you on a mtb with supertacky tyres ?

I think a 'mind if I join you for a bit' keeps things legal.

Good point. Maybe next time a polite 'mind if I join you' would be the way to go. The reason I sprinted off was that the guy I was following turned around shouted something at his mate who must have caught up and must have been sitting on my wheel, but he just looked straight through me as if I didn't exist. I felt he was a little offish so that is why I thought 'better get off and do my own thing'

They must have then regrouped and put the power down to catch me up.

I never seem to get roadie etiquette right!
I caught up with a group of 4 guys in full kit, shaved legs, etc. the other evening. Tagged on the back of them, and made sure they knew I was there. No real acknowledgment was given apart from a grunt.
However, they were trundling along at about 17-18mph, and my average for the ride was about 20, so I went to the front and pulled away. About 2 miles later they caught up with and passed me, and then soon slowed down again. My route took me off to the left soon afterwards, but my cheery goodbye was ignored.
Were they annoyed that I pulled away? Or maybe they were doing slower/faster sections? Could have been more polite anyway!

Btw, I wasn't in baggies (all black, non-team Lycra if you must know), but I do have quite hairy legs, and was using mtb shoes and pedals 😈

You should have asked if you can join them. They can then tell you what group riding formation (if any) they are doing, and ask if you are competent to ride in a group.

If not, I'd tell you to sit on the back.

Did you shaved your legs? If not SIT on the back 😛

I believe that the correct response is now to attack off the front whilst shouting 'Wiggins attacks again" 😀

should have blasted past shouting strava

I've had this before, and I'm a member of a road club. Very much depends on the individuals. Very elitist and unfriendly a lot are roadies. I was sworn at and generally harassed for coming past (they sped up to catch me back).

Apparently the etiquette is to sit on the back or if you are going to come past, make sure 100% that you can drop them, but it's real hard to drop an organised group over any reasonable distance.

Very elitist and unfriendly a lot are roadies.

I get this impression a lot. A lot of them seem really angry / miserable when they ride (including some close friends who compete in amateur races). I don't understand why because surely intense exercise releases a load of endorphins and should actually make you feel great?

I can't stop smiling after a 30 miler over the North Yorks Moors on a sunny day.

Have you tried asking on a roadie forum?

I don't think it's just a "roadie thing", I find most clubs with a predominantly male content that involve specialist (and usually expensive) kit can project a seemingly unfriendly attitude to non members.

Ooh, go on then (hijack!), what's a reasonable distance to have to drive behind a group before they might think about pulling over to let me by; 60mph limit singletrack road, group of about 20 riding 2 abreast at around 20mph, absolutely loads of places to pull in to the side? I ask because I thought 6 miles was a bit much when out last Sunday. I hung quite a way behind them (a serious amount of wobbling going on), but they knew I was there and gave no acknowledgement other than occasionally looking back at me.

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You rang?

@warpcow that's just antisocial riding that will inevitably antagonise drivers. We have a couple who do that on our rides for no sensible reason.

As for the OP, why not just ride your own ride and ignore the testosterone? Does it matter what they do/did/think when you're out doing your own thing?

[quote=boblo ]@warpcow that's just antisocial riding that will inevitably antagonise drivers. We have a couple who do that on our rides for no sensible reason.

Thought so, just wasn't sure whether it was worth contacting the club to point it out. Even my wife noted that they were asking for trouble, and thought I was being too reasonable.

Have you tried asking on a roadie forum?

Ahem, some might argue that he already has.

what's a reasonable distance to have to drive behind a group before they might think about pulling over to let me by

On the other hand, is it a bit unreasonable to expect 20 people to interrupt their journey just to let one or two people continue theirs faster?

I often bump into the Dulwich Dyno's or Fareham Wheelers lot when I'm hacking, you know what I do?

Turn off sharpish or slow down and take a swig/scratch my balls/reset my Garmin..

Some roadies are out to pace up, no need to mix it with them since they're invariably in training mode. Small groups <3 and you normally get a cheery "Hi" but large groups >7 and tapping out and I steer well clear, whether I can drop them or not it's not the point. They're out to pace up, leave em' alone I say.

Yesterday I was out hacking the CX on the Downs taking in a loop over to QECP and back and bumped into a small group of roadies, got a cheery "Hi, cool, look a crosser on the downs!! Respect dude, crack on" to which I replied, "Cheers lads, have a great day"

This tends to be the way things happen in the Downs, a cheery "Hi" or nod..

[quote=chakaping ]Have you tried asking on a roadie forum?
Ahem, some might argue that he already has.
what's a reasonable distance to have to drive behind a group before they might think about pulling over to let me by
On the other hand, is it a bit unreasonable to expect 20 people to interrupt their journey just to let one or two people continue theirs faster?

That's why I asked about a reasonable distance, because at some point, I believe holding other road-users up for 15-or-so minutes for the sake of not pulling over for less than 1 minute simply becomes impolite.

Thought so, just wasn't sure whether it was worth contacting the club to point it out.

I would. I'm sure they will appeciate your feedback.

My club has grown rapidly over the last few years and as such the standard of riding has gone downhill. Clubs shouldn't be riding in groups of 20 riders and they know that.

Agree with that, regularly see a couple of clubs around here in big groups and riding badly. Got mixed up in a bunch over winter, sat on the back, but quickly sat up and let them get on with it, as I didn't want to be associated with them, riding like a bunch of idiots and antagonising car drivers.

I'd add another option:
d) see what they were doing and fit in with it, probably asking if it was ok first.
Think about it. They're doing their thing, probably organised after a fashion, why would they appreciate someone coming in and 'seeing what they were made of' or otherwise interfering?
Transpose the situation to a kickabout in a local park. It's a public place so you've every right to be there, but would you just run into to the middle of the game? Even without kicking the ball, would you start marking people and making runs?

How long should you wait to overtake in a car?
Really easy. When you can safely. You don't expect a tractor to pull over do you? In fact I would suggest that in a rural area where tractors are on the road they should have priority.
Of course its nice if people let others by but in no way can it be considered an obligation or even the courteous thing to do. Singling out helps no one as the line become twice as long.
As for working with an unknown bunch its as easy. If you catch them then keep going, saying hello as you pass. If they catch you just let them by. Joining a group without asking is rude, like crashing a party.

I think it comes down to group sizes, I've joined in with small groups of two's and three's before and had no real issues, it normally helps up my pace a bit, hanging on the back, or coming forwards to do a stint, nod and a smile and a "Don't mind if I tag on for a bit do you?" is normally OK

But ten rider plus groups do seem to be a bit of a different thing, I think in some cases they are at or over the "Critical mass" and the organisation is going to pot already, some riders are in semi-race mode other's are working a bit harder just to keep up, one or two more bodies joining in might just upset things further, so there's probably a bit of hostility, especially from ride leaders, as it potentially knacker's their chances of organisation for another couple of miles...

Not a Club rider myself, I just ride with a couple of mates, but I do notice the happier looking groups at our cafe stop, tend to arrive in smaller groups of maybe five or six, and then ten minutes later the other bunch from their club turns up, also generally smiling and chatty, But if a group of twelve or fifteen rider's all roll in together the majority seem a bit stoney faced and miserable...

I don't know why more clubs don't simply split their groups up a bit more especially now many of them seem to have grown, perhaps very few want the responsibility of "Leading" a small bunch? or perhaps they just like feeling part of a big chaingang?
But on UK roads it is much easier to work in a smaller group TBH...

"You don't expect a tractor to pull over do you? In fact I would suggest that in a rural area where tractors are on the road they should have priority."
" but in no way can it be considered an obligation or even the courteous thing to do."

You are Trolling right, tell me you are...............

[quote=mattsccm ]How long should you wait to overtake in a car?
Really easy. When you can safely. You don't expect a tractor to pull over do you? In fact I would suggest that in a rural area where tractors are on the road they should have priority.
Of course its nice if people let others by but in no way can it be considered an obligation or even the courteous thing to do. Singling out helps no one as the line become twice as long.

I didn't pass, because it wasn't safe, but there was often room enough for someone to force their way past had they been so inclined. The OED says that [i]nice[/i] and [i]courteous[/i] are synonyms.

6-7 is a good little group size to ride with, I'm not a fan of bigger groups personally, both from a riding POV and for cars getting past.

Last group I caught on a ride were about 6, I figured as I'd caught them I'd go past keeping my pace about the same, they tucked in behind me and a couple came past as I went up the next little hill - they were attacking pretty much every rise. I then sat in, had a chat, drifted to the back, attacked the hills with them, did another turn and we split at the next town with a friendly goodbye. No idea how I caught them up because they were working hard at a decent pace, they may have been stopped or turned onto the road just in front of me.

Saw them the week after at a cafe on a completely different route. More friendly words were exchanged and I got an invite to their regular meeting point. A mix of kit (including a couple of Army CC jerseys) so probably a bunch of mates rather than an official club ride.

a) backed off and gone slowly to allow them to all go past?
b) do as I did and see what they were made off?
c) asked if could stoke the smoothest legs I have ever seen?

I'm glad the kind of cycling I'm into doesn't involve lots of complicated unwritten rules and etiquette that people get all weird and shirty about.

[b]crispycross[/b] - good analogy

It's odd that some people find it hard to be polite and just talk to the other riders? "Hi, it looks like we're heading the same way, mind if I join in for a bit?" It's not that difficult, is it?

I'm glad the kind of cycling I'm into doesn't involve lots of complicated unwritten rules and etiquette that people get all weird and shirty about.

Funny thing is it mainly seems to be MTBers who get weird about it.

Groups I never seem to have a problem with

Individuals can be a bit odd though sometimes. The other week I was overtaken buy someone in full fake team kit, they were doing about 19-20mph, I was only pootling at about 15. So I jumped to catch up as I could do with picking up the pace a bit if I'm to get home before sunset and a tow would be nice. Caught him easily, shouted to let him know I was there, didn't get an inteligable response so took it as a yes, pace picked up a little (now 20-21) which I presumed was just because he was now thinking he was going to get a break as we rotoated, so I waited a minute, overtook to take my turn, and he dissapeared off my wheel!

Maybe he'd just tried to unsucessfully drop me and was now knackered, but it was a bit odd that I'd managed to drop him given the pace he originaly came past.

I'm glad the kind of cycling I'm into doesn't involve lots of complicated unwritten rules and etiquette that people get all weird and shirty about.

These rules are more about safety than etiquette. When a group training ride/chaingang is going full gas there isn't time for polite conversation so you need to trust that everyone knows what they're doing and where they need to be. It can be very dangerous when people get involved that aren't familiar with what's going on.

IMO the OP should had stayed out of the way.

IMO the OP should had stayed out of the way.

chakaping - Member
[i]Have you tried asking on a roadie forum?[/i]

Ahem, some might argue that he already has.

My point exactly... 🙄

By the sounds of it, they caught him up so the responsibility to stay out of the way was theirs.

I mean ease up and let them past rather than trying to sprint off the front - it's only going to end one way.

Maybe he'd just tried to unsucessfully drop me and was now knackered, but it was a bit odd that I'd managed to drop him given the pace he originaly came past.

Maybe he was out for a ride on his own and so wanted to ride on his own. I'd have done the same. I find it very odd when people riding on their own sprint to get on the wheel of someonee who's just overtaken them.

My point exactly...

Your humour is too dry for me, sorry.

I find them funny, they dont own the road nor the space around them so i will cycle where i choose.

I mean ease up and let them past rather than trying to sprint off the front - it's only going to end one way.

chakaping - Member
My point exactly...
Your humour is too dry for me, sorry.

The eye rolling wasn't aimed at you by the way. 🙂

Why should he ease up?

Because he clearly wasn't going to hold their pace and would inevitably be overtaken at some point anyway. The group can only pass safely if he maintains a steady pace. It's far safer to let the group pass as quickly as possible. Sprinting to stay in front of a chaingang is pointless.

Ok they don't have priority, but there's little point in trying to hold them off and generally getting in the way.

I find them funny, they dont own the road nor the space around them so i will cycle where i choose.

Thanks for that. And will you take down three of the bunch as a rider did to our club, writing off two bikes in the process?

Thanks for that. And will you take down three of the bunch as a rider did to our club, writing off two bikes in the process?

Whoa, where did i say i would crash into them? If i'm cycling along i'm not changing my route or speed simply because you don't like my proximity to your procession.
I only get this with road riders anyway, two mountain bikers meet and they get along and have a chat, road riders seem to take things far too seriously.

The cycling etiquette is to be polite (would you just join a group of ramblers or runners?). Ask if you can join the paceline. Most cycling groups might be nervous of someone joining in since they might not be used to bunch riding and hence they might do something unpredictable. If you are catching them up and don't want to join in, just ride past or slow up.