Continuing on from the 29>27.5 debate...which trail destroyer ?

Far from an expert, and to be fair, whatever you buy is only ever going to be temporary…
With the smaller bike, as long as your knees don’t hit the bars when up out of the saddle I’d think you’d be fine.
I normally prefer a larger bike for more gravity riding and happier with a smaller bike for trails. My Fuel Ex was a 17.5, the 17.5 Remedy felt too small, the cockpit being too close, knees hitting the bar when out of the saddle. I opted for the 18.5 or ML, and the extra space when in the steep stuff just feels more reassuring.

Have you tried buying a bike because you like the colour and look off it, instead of worrying about the travel and geometry to much?

Always enjoy your thoughts and ramblings about bike purchases and races.

The sizes aren’t as different as you think because of the stack heights. Work out the hypotenuse of reach and stack for each because that’s really how big a bike feels (when you’re standing) and you’ll see what I mean!

Have you tried buying a bike because you like the colour and look off it, instead of worrying about the travel and geometry to much?

Oh yes, in my KTM phase i bought an Orange Whyte T-130.... To be honest, i've often bought them because of the colours, the G160 was bought because it was lime green too.... the current Trek with the multi blue fade was certainly in the running because of the paint 🙂

I guess the thing for me is that my ridning requirements change, unlike some. Some people do XC all the time, or gravel all the time, or even Enduro all the time...

Last year for me may have been more XCish, then changing to something else,, NExt year the plan is 'more' and with doing 'more' in terms of tech i want/need more in the way of bounce. I completely understand that many on here could get my Trek down harder stuff than i will ever ride... but i'm not them... i'm just me. I want/need a safety blanket. As well as a higher level of destructability.

The sizes aren’t as different as you think because of the stack heights. Work out the hypotenuse of reach and stack for each because that’s really how big a bike feels (when you’re standing) and you’ll see what I mean!

eeeeek, you do it 😀 lol...

I did notice i've got an RM dealer not a million miles away at AW Cycles in Reading who seem to have a Slayer in, but in a Large.. which kinda helps and kinda doesn't... but i am tempted to shoot over tomorrow for a little peek on it.

I'm sure it's been mentioned before but if you like the fuel but want more bounce then why not get a Slash?

Almost got one, but it was an XL and massive.. I'm trying to do the deal currently with 'swapping' rather than selling and putting in a chunk of cash... If the Trek sold, then i'd arguably look at a Slash for sure. It'd be in the top 3-4 on the list.

The Mega was already in the top 3... the RM is a bit of a curve-ball, but i admit i'm liking it.

They RM will be too small after riding the trek.

A mate has had a few Fuel's over the years and has always overbuilt them with longer forks and better rear shocks (DB IL normally), proper tyres too. They are a very capable bike, guessing you are just wanting something closer to the dh bike?

What's the budget?

I think that if you are now used to the trek's 475 reach for most of your riding, then something in that ballpark would also feel right. But you do like smaller bikes too...
I would go the slayer, but in the next size up. Any of those kicking around?

Work out the hypotenuse of reach and stack

eeeeek, you do it 😀 lol…

Here you go. Yes I'm bored....

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599 top tube on that Slayer is stupidly short for a six footer, fine for a DH bike where you're not pedalling, but no way I'd size down like that. Don't just look at reach alone.

If you want a bigger bike that will smooth out the trails with longer travel and more forgiving geometry then a longer slacker bike would work. Pick a long bike with a short seat tube and fit the longest dropper you can.

If you want a smaller more nimble and playful bike pick the smaller one. Then ride it. It will totally depend on what you want out of the bike and what trails you ride.

Personally I like a slacker longer bike with more travel for most things (but currently own a HT with a 63.5 head angle).

Also while I’m fairly indifferent about wheel size a 29er will roll over stuff better.

Whichever you choose you’ll probably have buyer’s remorse for a bit (most do) and think the grass is greener on the other side).

Out of the 2 I would just decide which wheelsize you want and get that one (although the Mega looks like a better size for someone about 5’9-6’ as the Slayer’s reach is quite short for a FS bike, at 5’10/11” I wouldn’t be buying the Slayer).

PS - the Slayer is too small for you

I’m trying to do the deal currently with ‘swapping’ rather than selling and putting in a chunk of cash… If the Trek sold, then i’d arguably look at a Slash for sure. It’d be in the top 3-4 on the list.

Here lies the issue.  Given it's a swap you want it's completely compromising your thought process and limiting you to a very small pool of mostly unsuitable bikes, which will then end up in another swap further down the line.  If you're desperate for a change find the bike you really want, then sell the Trek, take the hit and buy the new one.   May cost more in the short term, but will sure work out cheaper than constantly swapping and tweaking bikes that are never quite right.

PS The slayer is too small for you (have a riding buddy with one, it's a nice bike, but he rides an XL and is probably similar size to you).

Here lies the issue. Given it’s a swap you want it’s completely compromising your thought process and limiting you to a very small pool of mostly unsuitable bikes, which will then end up in another swap further down the line. If you’re desperate for a change find the bike you really want, then sell the Trek, take the hit and buy the new one.

Exactly that. I would almost never entertain a swap. I also wouldn’t pick an old NP Mega or a Slayer. FWIW you can’t really compare the geometry of a DH against something you would actually want to pedal anywhere. They are generally a fair bit smaller.

If you don’t want the Fuel, sell it, then go out & buy a Slash, or whatever you want. There are loads of them for sale most of the time.

Thanks for all the thoughts.

sell it

That is massively easier said than done currently... There's tonnes of bikes that have been on Ebay/Pinkbike for months and months, the market simply isn't there at the moment.

buy a Slash, or whatever you want

OTher than bouncier and slacker, there's no "whatever you want" i don't have a massive desire for bike X over bike Y, i've not ridden most of them, be that a Mega or a Slayer or a Slash even... but i've never been hung up on a particular bike, make or model... I just buy something that takes my fancy, ride it until i change it... the rest kinda takes care of itself. Some bikes i buy and like, some bikes i buy and don't...

We'll see where this next one goes 🙂 I don't worry about it too much either way.... it's all fun experiences.

Literally a new bike a week, do you have riding buddies to run these questions past??

Literally a new bike a week, do you have riding buddies to run these questions past??

Only 14 year old ones 🙂 He looked at the RM and said "No-one would ever ride one of thoses"

To which my reply was, "well apart from Melamed who just won EWS on a RM"..... He didn't have much to reply.

Why do i need to run them by riding buddies ? It's a discussion forum, about MTBs.... (theoretically anyway)

https://geometronbikes.co.uk/demo/

TBH @jimmmy748, i simply don't like the look of them. Even removing the LLS side of things, i just don't like them sorry mate. Irresepctive of how good a bike is, it's going to tick some of the 'want' boxes..

@weeksy because it's like groundhog Day. I used to be like you, buying new stuff relentlessly to improve my riding and make me happy, it did neither. I stopped buying anywhere near as much, I'm less poor, much happier, and still shite at riding

because it’s like groundhog Day. I used to be like you, buying new stuff relentlessly to improve my riding and make me happy, it did neither. I stopped buying anywhere near as much, I’m less poor, much happier, and still shite at ridin

Nice one.

I just buy something that takes my fancy, ride it until i change it… the rest kinda takes care of itself. Some bikes i buy and like, some bikes i buy and don’t…

We’ll see where this next one goes 🙂 I don’t worry about it too much either way…. it’s all fun experiences.

You keep doing this, you ask for people's opinions then when they give you some ,plus some alternatives, you make some statement like the above ,that it doesn't really matter because you don't really care because you'll just swap it again.

so if it doesn't matter, why are you asking people on here? nobody can decide for you,just pick one, ride it and tell us what you think of it. I'd love to hear your thoughts on the bike after you have ridden it, especially given that you have ridden so many bikes recently, I'm less interested in spending time giving you my thoughts and then being told it doesn't matter anyway as you don't care,because it's like changing your socks.

Sorry, don't mean to sound touchy,but you do keep doing the same thing here.

Genuinely just pick a new bike and tell us about it.

Ps I agree with those up there that say swapping is limiting you and potentially consigning you to never finding the right bike.

Genuinely just pick a new bike and tell us about it.

I have.... 🙂

But i've not collected it yet as i'm working. 🙂

so if it doesn’t matter, why are you asking people on here?

I was asking becasue people may have ridden one or both. It was a genuine question, but seems now that irrespective of what i say on here, it seems 'wrong' somehow.. No biggy... i'll move on and go riding 🙂

Sorry, don’t mean to sound touchy,but you do keep doing the same thing here.

Keep doing ? I bought the Trek 9 months ago... it's hardly last Thursday.

Keep doing ?

Keep doing,as in asking what should i do,asking people for thoughts and input, then saying you don't care anyway as it's like changing socks or choosing pasta or pizza, ie endless threads where you don't seem to really want people input.

I have…. 🙂

Nice one, tell us about it,photos too please

Well that's killed the thread then.

Enjoy your day 🙂

I meant that genuinely,please do tell us about it. outside of bike journalists you probably have more experience of different bike than anyone so should be able to give us a balanced view ,independent of bias ,of a lot of bikes.

I am interested,as I'm sure are most others

Almost got one, but it was an XL and massive.. I’m trying to do the deal currently with ‘swapping’ rather than selling and putting in a chunk of cash… If the Trek sold, then i’d arguably look at a Slash for sure. It’d be in the top 3-4 on the list.

3 years ago my missus told me to stop fannying about buying bikes that were available/ reduced/ cheap. She told me to find a big that was awesumz/ brilliant/ suitable and just buy the bloody thing dammit. And stop pissing about.

So I did, and it's bloody marvelous.

As posted by a few people above, forget what's swappable/ available/dealable. Just work out what you want and buy the bloody thing. 🙂

Though even as I write it, I know this won't work for you as you're far more interested in comparing/ fettling/ investigating/adjusting and changing bikes than you are riding them.

So I guess I have to retract what I said. Go for it, swap it for whatever you can find and let us know how it goes.

..keeps everyone amused I guess.:-)

As posted by a few people above, forget what’s swappable/ available/dealable. Just work out what you want and buy the bloody thing. 🙂

Was going to post exactly the same thing!!

I've found brakes that a like, tyres that I prefer, forks and shocks that I like. Taken me a few years to get there, but now its just buying a frame and putting a build kit on.

Though even as I write it, I know this won’t work fir you as you’re far more interested in comparing/ fettling/ investigating/adjusting and changing bikes than you are riding them.

LOL WTF... i ride at least 2-3 times a week outdoors, in various locations from local to woods, just just about any trail place down south and everywhere else. I'd argue i ride more trails in a given month than most who post on the forum. In the last 4 weeks i've ridden Stile Cop, Cannock, FoD (3 times) Surrey Hills, 417 Flyup, Rogate, we've also been to Hopton (but i couldn't ride). Plus local rides, woods, trails, Ridgweway.

However yes, i do like fiddling and messing with bikes too.

I bought the Trek 9 months ago… it’s hardly last Thursday.

One should also take into account the Status, the Status that fell through, and faffing around with DH bikes during that period though 😉

The Status wasn't mine, the DH bikes are not mine. The Status that fell through was before the Trek.

Didn’t say it was, you’ve had plenty of faffing around with it though which may (or may not) have stopped you getting something else by now, and or planted seeds of thought - same with the DH bikes.

Fair enough about the non-Status, thought that was after the Trek rather than 170

Wonder if we should run a sweepstake? Which lasts longer, the new @weeksy bike or the next PM? 🤔🤣🤣 I love reading these threads, along with others' bike musings, always knowing it wouldn't matter what bike I had, I'd still always be shite and scared of rock gardens 😳😂😂😂 (heads off to look at shiny new bikes again)

weeksy

TBH @jimmmy748, i simply don’t like the look of them. Even removing the LLS side of things, i just don’t like them sorry mate. Irresepctive of how good a bike is, it’s going to tick some of the ‘want’ boxes..

Think you'd gain a lot from the demo in terms of the setup that suits you, even if not buying. They're a bike that offer huge confidence which you might benefit from also, I certainly have, fair enough the looks (and geo) aren't for everyone ( I like the look) but function outweighs that.

I find it a bit odd that people get frustrated by weeksy asking questions about bikes and mucking about with bikes on a forum that's otherwise dedicated to aching questions about bikes and mucking about with bikes.

sell it

That is massively easier said than done currently… There’s tonnes of bikes that have been on Ebay/Pinkbike for months and months, the market simply isn’t there at the moment.

Clearly irrelevant now (until next week at least 😉 ) , but this works both ways, accept a lower sale price / push for a lower buy price.  I know my old bike is now going for a chunk lower than i traded it in for a few months back.

TBH @jimmmy748, i simply don’t like the look of them. Even removing the LLS side of things, i just don’t like them sorry mate. Irrespective of how good a bike is, it’s going to tick some of the ‘want’ boxes..

Agree here, the Geometron wasn't on my list for the same reason (and lack of normal bottle mounts), not as fugly as a Whyte though!

Well despite thoughts that it's too small. I'm pretty much inclined to go with the RM Slayer.

I've discussed it with the seller and the deal we could put in place i'm happy with. We're due to do the deal and exchange bikes on Sunday.

But then there's the above video... Along with a lot of fairly negative comments... which has given me somewhat of a pause for thought and a "oh, should i really then".

Regarding the sizing, i went to AW Cycles at lunchtime in Reading and they have a Slayer in a Medium and i sat on it, bounced on it, moved on it, to me it feels absolutely spot on in terms of sizing, despite some thinking it may be small... it may be, but not too small and not small in the context that it worries me.

Small is one thing... broken... that's another.

[url= https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52443508261_5f375181fb_z.jp g" target="_blank">https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52443508261_5f375181fb_z.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/2nUfFUi ]slayer[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/152318156@N08/ ]Steve Weeks[/url], on Flickr

I still think it’s too small. The increased travel and slacker head angle might offset the shorter reach than the trek a bit. But the ett when you’re pedalling on longer days is likely to be cramped. Although as you’re taller and have the seat higher than a lot of people this might partly offset this I guess. Maybe wang on a 50-60mm stem to give you a bit more room sat down. Any longer than that and you might make it handle a bit odd.

The bit on the above broken frame seems to be an outlier from what I can see - a bit of a Google around doesn’t suggest they have lots of these braking. Seems like it might be a unique axle breaking scenario.

Lol I sat on it

To which my reply was, “well apart from Melamed who just won EWS on a RM”….. He didn’t have much to reply

On a medium, at 5'7"

Anyway, this is the proposed bike.... for better.. or worse.... This is the plan today

[url= https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52443783198_506a45de43_b.jp g" target="_blank">https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52443783198_506a45de43_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/2nUh6CA ]p6pb22641367[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/152318156@N08/ ]Steve Weeks[/url], on Flickr

I think you should get a LLS hardtail and send it down the DH.

Nice slayer, that's a bike that will make you smile. Really fun.

weeksy,your threads are always good value,but I sometimes wonder if you are actually the lovechild of Renton and Hora.😉🤣🤣🙃
Nice bike(for now)Happy Friday

You never hear a bad word about a Mega from those that try them.

LOL WTF… i ride at least 2-3 times a week outdoors, in various locations from local to woods, just just about any trail place down south and everywhere else. I’d argue i ride more trails in a given month than most who post on the forum. In the last 4 weeks i’ve ridden Stile Cop, Cannock, FoD (3 times) Surrey Hills, 417 Flyup, Rogate, we’ve also been to Hopton (but i couldn’t ride). Plus local rides, woods, trails, Ridgweway.

Yep agreed. You put me right on this before. 🙂 You do indeed ride loads.

But you like the other bit even more! Go on, admit it 🙂

But you like the other bit even more! Go on, admit it

Not going to argue fella, I love tweaking, doing, testing, trying

Arguably if I put that time in even outside the house learning manuals, wheelies, etc I'd be a better rider. But hey, I am who I am.

Well after reading more reviews and info in going to do as you all suggest and not get this.

It's a chunk of change to throw in for what may not be the right bike. So may be prudent to listen to you lot.

Given it was up for £3k and you were going to give them the Trek and £2k I think that’s prudent given it’s too small.

I was putting in £1000 not £2000.

If it makes you feel better the Trek is a lot better looking than that. A lot

Left field suggestion: can you put an Angleset on the trek,plus increase the travel of the fork by changing the airspringm I don't know the detailed spec of the trek so don't know if that's possible,but if it is it would probably make quite a change to the character of the bike for minimal outlay,and would be reversible if you didn't like it.

Left field suggestion: can you put an Angleset on the trek

I made it 0.5 Deg slacker which you can notice, anything more gets complicated with the knock block headset which is tricky to remove as the fork would smash the frame to bits.

But really I couldn't make it slack enough and long enough travel for it to be something I'd want to try and get down certain things.

I'm going to just go have a few days normality, without driving, riding, anything really.

Well, apart from Zwift riding.

There's still this Mega https://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/3457006/ the guy will straight swap the Trek.

But for now, I've just lost the will to think on it all.

Get the Mega

don’t get the mega

😉

@fasthaggis - 😂😂😂😂😂😂

Buy whichever bikes you fancy. Every bike has a few that break, I’m sure that Pinkbike were just unlucky to b3 5he one# that broke it.

Make sure you check out that area of the frame thoroughly when you go to exchange just in case.

We’re all aware you ride more than most (especially me nowadays), just enjoy it as one day your kid will grow up and you’ll be back to riding alone/with old gits.

Good luck

PS - those Megas were nice and won’t cost you extra. What hav3 you got to lose.

That mega is a honking colour, no way I'd swap that for that nice Trek.

Punt the Trek, take the hit...get what you really want, in a nice colour and preferably one that fits. Job jobbed, life too short.

I think selling the trek frame only and then buying an alloy long travel frame to put all the bits on would be a good approach here. Whack a longer air spring in the 36 and jobs a good un.

Bird Aeris 9 / Transition Spire / Rocket max / Mega 290 / Vitus Sommet (seems bargainous at £1500 at the moment with an X2 etc

Bird Aeris 9

Looks like now is the time to get a secondhand AM9 frame as the new Aeris 9s seem to be getting delivered and people are upgrading.

I think selling the trek frame only and then buying an alloy long travel frame to put all the bits on would be a good approach here. Whack a longer air spring in the 36 and jobs a good un.

Bird Aeris 9 / Transition Spire / Rocket max / Mega 290 / Vitus Sommet (seems bargainous at £1500 at the moment with an X2 etc

As much as i like tinkering that does somewhat restrict things because with the Trek you've got a Dub crankset, so the new one needs DUB, you've also got the seatpost which ideally needs to be the same diameter, then you have the obvious fact that

"Buy what you want" doesn't really work because i'm not really in a position that i know the answer to that question until i try something. The buy what you want was the Bird Aether7, but that didn't work out.... Then it was the G170, which i liked but arguably i like the Trek more. So what i want, i have absolutely no idea... Other than the fact it's a skills compenstator/safety blanket. That's the criteria really. It doesn't need to be an XC beast, it doesn't need to do 40' gaps, but it does ideally need to give me a bit more margin for error/confidence. Of course i need to work on that within myself and my riding too, but with the booked/planned coaching i'm trying to get there with that too.
I just see that next year we'll end up in Dyfi, Fort William, Risca etc.... Plus add in there the Southern/Haibike enduros and whatever other Enduro races we do and if possible i want a 1 bike to rule them all type scenario.

If that's completely impossible, then sure, i have to come to terms with that. But for now i'm still throwing ideas around my brain.

The Mega guy sent me a Whatsapp and he's taken a cash deal on the Mega, so that's now off the table completely. The only thing on the table is sadly an XL Slash, if it were an L, it'd already be in the garage.

Just for some more light entertainment/faceplants, i have considered this.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/125566310044

[img] [/img]

Which is large... that would make a great bike for the tough stuff but would stay alongside the Fuel. But that brings us into a whole other world of crazy as it's then getting too many bikes as we'd have
3 GT Furys
1 Trek Fuel
1 (lads enduro)
1 Liv ebike
1. Raleigh turbo/Belgium

Which considering Mrs Weeksy rode the Liv once this year... is all getting a little insane.

I think a DH bike is always too much unless you ride exclusively at DH venues(and I don't mean just uplift). They're a very specific tool for a specific job and not great apart from that. There are plenty of 180mm travel bikes being made that are still pedalable and reasonably light that have the option of upping the shock pressure to ride more like a trail bike. A DH bike will always be a DH bike.

Interesting that the GT on eBay still has the reflectors, dork disc and original pedals.

it’s then getting too many bikes

Is that even a thing??? 😂😂

I think a DH bike is always too much unless you ride exclusively at DH venues(and I don’t mean just uplift). They’re a very specific tool for a specific job and not great apart from that. There are plenty of 180mm travel bikes being made that are still pedalable and reasonably light that have the option of upping the shock pressure to ride more like a trail bike. A DH bike will always be a DH bike.

That's the RM Slayer then 😃🤣😃🤣😃🤣😃

On the dub front the whole point is the crankset is the same regardless of the bike it’s going on. It’s just the bb itself that changes. So the trek is pressfit but say you went for a frame with a bsa screw in bb then a dub bsa screw in bb should work with your current cranks.

Most seat posts are either 30.9 or 31.6mm so I don’t think that’s much of a drama. All steerers fit a tapered fork and most bikes have a boost rear end (other than the odd few than run stupid super boost like evil or Saracen or pivot).

You’re always fiddling with bikes so I don’t see a frame swap as much of a drama…….

I’m with Joe on this - cranks is simple swap, just change bottom bracket. Droppers are 31.6 or 30.9 and even if you have the former and need the latter, a new brand x dropper is around £100.

I’d add privateer to the frame only options, or the Saracen Ariel

In fact this for £2k frame and forks is insane value and in large…

https://www.saracen.co.uk/collections/enduro/products/ariel-60-elite-frame-kit-sample-unused

Ebay New 161 frame under 1200

Worth a look. Mint.

Did you look at that large slash frame and fork on pinkbike that I mentioned in the other thread? Sounds perfect! Swap the bits over and sell the fuel frame... simple 🙂

I'm not the seller btw! Just sounds exactly the type of bike you're looking for, in your size....

I’d love an excuse to get a bike like this but to be honest my Levo (29” 160/157mm) isn’t far off and and my 160mm 29” hardtail hits a nice spot (although max speed is limited by the rear). And I don’t have enough time visiting gnarly trails.

I’d definitely want a 29” front wheel, 170mm+ forks, ~160mm+ rear travel, enough reach, plenty of stack height too (tall head tube and/or bars) and long chainstays. I think long chainstays make such a difference in making bikes like this easier to ride, there’s much less need to get over the front (which is hard to do if you’re not the most confident rider) and you can just stay centered and carve/drift the turns.

There are loads to choose from but I’ve hardly heard a bad word about the Nukeproof Giga and for a more niche the Banshee Titan ticks all the boxes (if you can get a big enough dropper on it).

Rode a NP Giga a few weeks ago and was not only impressed with how well it handled going fast over rough stuff and taking big hits (pretty much what we expected), but also super impressed with how good it was at pedalling uphill as well. Definitely the kind of bike you sound that you are after. And it fits a water bottle in the frame.

Thanks again for the thoughts fellas. I'm just honestly not fancying a frame swap. I just fancy a nice bike swap, happy to throw money in for right bike too. But nothing seems to be quite working.

The Mega sold, the RockyM dealer went all quiet, I've tried to buy an Alu Slayer which is advertised locally for £1600 but been ignored. There's a fella who wants to trade for a Slash, but it's an XL. However he's not a million miles away and may be worth a visit and a sit.

Other than that, I'm just kinda waiting to see what happens, so it's spotless and hanging up

Thurs is FoD and Sun is Rogate, so it'll be filthy if it doesn't swap before that.

Buy what you want” doesn’t really work because i’m not really in a position that i know the answer to that question until i try something.

OK, buy what we want then 🙂
Me,@kryton57 , @davros all think you should get an Orbea Occam 🙂

OK, buy what we want then

That's a plan!

Honestly if you thought the aether 7 in large was too long (505mm reach from memory) then the XL slash (516mm reach in low - 521mm reach in high) is going to be even longer. Albeit the ratio of chainstays probably works a little better as the aether 7 has short ones and the trek is a bit longer at the back.

Frame swap seems an obviously easier solution in terms of money and getting something more appropriate than all the odd sizes / bikes coming up.

Frame swap

I'm confused. What exactly do you want the bike for? Are you hucking 20m road gaps? Entering rampage?

Me,@kryton57 , @davros all think you should get an Orbea Occam 🙂

Think this is probably the only option you haven't tried yet, so give this a go and it'll keep some people happy.

I’m confused. What exactly do you want the bike for? Are you hucking 20m road gaps? Entering rampage?

Safety mechanism. I'll be racing Enduro next year as well as going to some trail centers. Whilst I'm sure all the Superstars here can get down on an 80mm HT, I cannot.so I want something more capable of saving my backside

I would have thought that the idea of riding a massive heavy bike that picks up speed much faster and is a lot harder to handle would be less than ideal for someone who has massive doubts about their riding competence?

Ebay New 161 frame under 1200

Worth a look. Mint.

Thats what we used to do(when I had leg muscles, lungs that work etc). New frame and hang onto it whatever you previously had.

Too many bikes now are poor kit, which does affect the ride performance. So its to hard to judge what somethings going to ride like. Hence I suppose faffing over .05 of a degree here or there. X millimeter difference.